NAMBA P-Ltd Motor discussion

[Shooter]

Saw my name in a few posts. Figured I'd share....

Been running my original UL-1 motor for at least 2, maybe 3 years? (same motor I was using for the endbell heat sink thread, etc...). I beat the snot out of this motor (estimated 80-100 six lap sprints). I finally blew it up a few weeks ago. I replaced it with a brand new motor and 6 runs later....POOF!!!

Some notable differences.

1. The old motor is a darker gold color (see photo)
2. The new motor has '2030' stamped on the endbell
3. The new motor has the wires adjacent as opposed to the triangle configuration on the original (see photo)

Is it possible that we need to break a new motor in?? (i.e. run a few times with a 42x55 prior to hitting her with the H5's and 645's???). I know for a fact that I did this with my original motor.

[Grimracer]

[ron1950]

ok so how much does the esc have to do with burning these motors up? if I use a t120 and someone else uses a aq 60a esc if I run it hard will I burn the motor up and the guy with 60a esc burn up the esc? or am I way off here?

[Darin Jordan]

Here it is fellas. http://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...-David-Newland

Really good stuff David! I put a sticky on it.
Thanks for taking the time to put it together.

I agree. Nicely done, David.

I really didn't read anything in there that I don't agree with.

I don't think that most racers realize how much time they are wasting chasing MPH. Dick Crow always used to tell me that he'd much rather give up some straight line speed in order to get around the corners faster. You have 12-corners in a race... 70ft in diameter (35ft radius), which is 220ft IF you are glued to the pins. 220ft, under the increased loads of cornering. 220ft at generally a slower speed than you can achieve in the straights.

1-2mph in the straights is NOTHING to give up if you can carry another 1-2mph through the turns.

And, frankly, from what I've seen, most racers don't NEED more speed to be competitive. They need to learn to hold their lanes, drive more smoothly, and race smart.

Just repeating a bunch of what David said. He's one of the best out there, and when you see his stuff run, you'll realize that he's speaking from experience.

[T.S.Davis]

According to all of my data logs, my AQ2030 powered P-LTD OPC Lynx tunnel draws 85-90A, with maximum spikes up around 110A.

........and here is why the spec is broken and we will not ever have another motor added to the list.

This is Darin normal setup right? Let's go with his lower average of 85 amps.

85x14.8 = 1258 watts continues. The 2030 isn't rated for that. It's not on the Tower spec sheet anymore. It does say 50 amps max.

Darin is averaging 170% of the rated amperage.

So is the motor under rated? Probably. That makes good business sense. Nice cushion to protect them.

Trouble is, we the people wrote the under rating into our rule book.

So a new manufacturer looking to get in the game has to put out a motor rated at 52.5 amps. If it's an honest rating the motor won't compete.

Not sure I've ever seen Proboat ratings in print.

[Darin Jordan]

........and here is why the spec is broken and we will not ever have another motor added to the list.

This is Darin normal setup right? Let's go with his lower average of 85 amps.

85x14.8 = 1258 watts continues. The 2030 isn't rated for that. It's not on the Tower spec sheet anymore. It does say 50 amps max.

Darin is averaging 170% of the rated amperage.

So is the motor under rated? Probably. That makes good business sense. Nice cushion to protect them.

Trouble is, we the people wrote the under rating into our rule book.

So a new manufacturer looking to get in the game has to put out a motor rated at 52.5 amps. If it's an honest rating the motor won't compete.

Not sure I've ever seen Proboat ratings in print.

Terry,

I don't really give much credence to posted ratings. They are marketing, or insurance/return-policy BS.

Let's forget amps... Let's talk Temps... My Lynx, using both the ICE Data Logging and lots and lots and lots of proper testing, NEVER comes in with a motor that is over 105-degrees... Usually it's 95-100...

The P-Ltd spec isn't "broken". It is what it is. I've burned up a few motors, both PB and AQ, but, as I've stated, they were all MY fault for finding that limit.

There WILL be more RTR power systems coming down the pike. I think the plan should be to make it as clear as possible wherever we may have influence to get the Mfgr's to put together packages that fit the "spec". Then, make it as easy as possible to get those power systems included on the approved motor list, or use the rest of the P-Limited power system rule to get the CD's to include them.

There is NO WAY you can convince me that, if another theory on motor selection is made, that people WON'T push those motors to the limit as well. The length-limits do help protect against that to some degree, but let's face it... people are STILL putting 1527+ sized motors into their <34" hulls and thinking they are putting together a sensible race package.

As long as there are racers, there will be broken parts. It's almost a Law, where racing is concerned.

[T.S.Davis]

Darin, it doesn't matter what makes sense.

The book tells us what the parameters for additional motors is. If a new motor comes along, that source will have to lie about their motor to compete with the 2030.

That was my point.

[LuckyDuc]

It will be difficult for a manufacturer to fudge the Mass and KV numbers. Rated amps and MSRP are a different story as you pointed out.
mass: 5% increase over AQU 2030 @212g = 222.6g
mass: 5% increase over Himax HB3630-1500 @ 225g = 236.25g
KV: 5% increase over "2030kv" is 2131.5

I don't think that we need an increase in mass or kv in any new RTR motor offering FWIW. Just more options to pick from when QC and supply issues present themselves. Having an alternative choice is important.

[Grimracer]

David N...

IF' AquaCraft was to update the 2030 for more durability would it have to be re-certified (if that's the process) for NAMBA Spec class racing.

Thanks in advance.

Grim

[Darin Jordan]

David N...

IF' AquaCraft was to update the 2030 for more durability would it have to be re-certified (if that's the process) for NAMBA Spec class racing.

Thanks in advance.

Grim

Grim.... per the existing rules:

(b) Any generational change of an approved motor, or a motor that
is used in a Ready To Run (RTR) offering from a manufacturer
that produces over 100 units of said offering, as long as there is
no more than a 5% increase in any of the following
manufacturers specifications as compared to any single
approved motor: Kv, maximum constant amperage rating,
mass, and MSRP.

[Luck as a Constant]

NAMBA P-Ltd Motor discussion

The rule book must look like the Declaration of Independence.

My head hurts from trying to read thru this thread.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Grimracer]

simple.. very good.. enjoy the updated motors!

Grim

[PatrickM]

What improvements are being made and how will we be able to differentiate "updated" motors from the previous iterations?

[Brushless55]

Terry,

I don't really give much credence to posted ratings. They are marketing, or insurance/return-policy BS.

Let's forget amps... Let's talk Temps... My Lynx, using both the ICE Data Logging and lots and lots and lots of proper testing, NEVER comes in with a motor that is over 105-degrees... Usually it's 95-100...

The P-Ltd spec isn't "broken". It is what it is. I've burned up a few motors, both PB and AQ, but, as I've stated, they were all MY fault for finding that limit.

There WILL be more RTR power systems coming down the pike. I think the plan should be to make it as clear as possible wherever we may have influence to get the Mfgr's to put together packages that fit the "spec". Then, make it as easy as possible to get those power systems included on the approved motor list, or use the rest of the P-Limited power system rule to get the CD's to include them.

There is NO WAY you can convince me that, if another theory on motor selection is made, that people WON'T push those motors to the limit as well. The length-limits do help protect against that to some degree, but let's face it... people are STILL putting 1527+ sized motors into their <34" hulls and thinking they are putting together a sensible race package.

As long as there are racers, there will be broken parts. It's almost a Law, where racing is concerned.

Agreed...
these P Spec motors get pushed beyond what they were made for..

[darryl whitman]

I like the idea Darin , so if u limited to can size 3670, kv size 1500kv to 2200kv , and esc 's to 120 amp.an batteries
4s at 4.2v per cell , with a 100.00$ motor claim, I feel this would keep it fun an fair, on a budget boat class racing.