stuffing tube with or without teflon liner?

[Doug Smock]

Chilli those guys only have about a hundred years of experience between them. Eventually they'll figure it out.

[flraptor07]

Chilli those guys only have about a hundred years of experience between them. Eventually they'll figure it out.

So Doug, are you liner or no liner?

[Doug Smock]

No sir, no liners since 06 or so.

[keithbradley]

It ain't the IMPBA record books. We've run with four of the six guys that hold current records over 100 mph in Liz City and I don't know any that use teflon. .

Correct. I did not base my assessment on something I read in a book, or 4 or 6 guys that you've seen run at your pond. I am sure it's quite possible that the majority of the people you run with don't run Teflon liners. I feel comfortable assuming that many boat clubs/groups are probably the same. I think even as far as this forum is concerned, it's quite possible that the majority of people here don't run liners. However, I still stand by my statement that the majority (that means more than 50%, not all...)of 100mph+ boats ARE running Teflon liners (across the WORLD, not at any particular club or in any particular organization). That doesn't mean you or anyone else is wrong for running with or without them, and I definitely didn't intend to imply so.

I understand how you might see four out of six guys doing something and assume that you can apply that model to the masses, but consider that as I type this, I'm looking up at a shelf with NINE 100mph+ boats, all with Teflon liners. Of the SIX FE boats I've seen run over 100mph at the Flint events, FIVE of them had Teflon liners (and the one that didn't was one of mine). I couldn't even begin to count how many 100mph+ boats I've built with Teflon. I know a number of friends who have built multiple 100mph+ boats with Teflon liners, inside and outside the US. I can site boats all across the US, in Germany, France, Austria, Australia, New Zealand, Trinidad, Bermuda, Virgin Islands, Jamaica, Sweden, Norway, Kuwait, etc., etc., etc...all running Teflon at speeds over 100mph.
So, you can understand why I might not agree that "you won't see any SAW guys or serious racers running Teflon.", right?
Also, please understand that I consider the person that made that comment a good guy and someone I feel comfortable having a civil, constructive conversation with. I wasn't out to start an argument, just bring some awareness that obviously wasn't already in this thread. I said that I think if anything, he had it backward...that's my 2c.

[monojeff]

Conversation and debate on this is like what fuel to use for gas boats.
One of those questions people always feel strongly about for whatever reason.
I'm with Keith on this I personally know many world class racers and saw record holders who will tell you they personally run teflon liners on most if not all of their setups without issues.

[Doug Smock]

That's right Jeff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNTxr2NJHa0

And at the end of the day we're back where we started.

It boils down to personal preference Zack.

Run what works for you.

[DPeterson]

I'll weigh in even with the risk of having my chain yanked.

I run teflon in all mine. Because I run very short drive lines and ball bearing struts. Might be why I have never lost a bearing. Teflon iliminates the risk of fine brass dust getting in my bearings.

With that being said I don't run anything larger than 4S. My P-mono with the .187 flex has given me some teflon issues. Got to grease it after every two runs or I am in trouble. Not sure I would be comfortable running teflon in larger set ups.

Doug

[grsboats]

From 1980 to 2002 teflon (all nitro boats)...since that no more teflon in all my nitro/gas/Fe boats but have seen lot of fast guys here still use them. Gill

[Chilli]

Keith, Truthfully, the reason for my earlier post was that I perceived your response to flraptor07 in post 22 as a bit condescending. Many of us frequent this board multiple times a week and most of us have read the threads that Jay took the time to list on Teflon tubing. Based on those kind enough to share their experience and preference on our board (as well as IW and JRCBD), I think it was a safe assumption that the majority of those a bit more dedicated to the hobby in the US go without Teflon. This doesn't mean it's better or worst and you have the records to prove it. The reason I brought up the IMPBA record holders is because I like to back up my assumptions with at least a little bit of fact. I understand it's only a fraction of the boating community, but I know what these guys run it's more documented data than I've seen anyone else produce. That being said, you obviously have a larger collaboration of boaters international at your disposal and that's a great asset. Most of us are stuck getting our info from this ragtag group on OSE.


Jeff, Coleman and Amsoil Sabre. Shaken, not stirred...

[iridebikes247]

I've run with and without teflon. I might add though, that the teflon I run in my setups is some pretty thick stuff from mtc, modelbaupirate, mhz, and also gundert. This stuff is pretty serious, and I think if people out there got a hold of it (those that don't run teflon), they would be pretty amazed at how much tougher it feels than whats offered on ose, kintec, etc.

Not all teflon is the same.

http://keithbradleyboats.com/product/teflon-liners-for-316-flex-tubes/

Just looked it up, found you can get the heavier weight teflon in the U.S., 3/16". I STRONGLY suggest anyone building a new boat buys the matching stuffing tube for their 3/16" boats.

Anyway to the OP, you got a pretty powerful and capable setup you're building, clearly there is no "wrong," way but if you can, I would pick up thicker teflon I think once you do a side by side comparison you'll be surprised.

[kfxguy]

Well after reading this thread and some of the links, ive come to the conclusion I must be doing it wrong. I have the proboat grease gun and the aeromarine stuffing tube seal....I pump grease in till it flows out. Guess if the notion that it introduces more drag and heat that way, I might go even faster. Guess I'll try some synthetic gear oil with a little graphite power mixed in...

[kfxguy]

I've run with and without teflon. I might add though, that the teflon I run in my setups is some pretty thick stuff from mtc, modelbaupirate, mhz, and also gundert. This stuff is pretty serious, and I think if people out there got a hold of it (those that don't run teflon), they would be pretty amazed at how much tougher it feels than whats offered on ose, kintec, etc.

Not all teflon is the same.

http://keithbradleyboats.com/product/teflon-liners-for-316-flex-tubes/

Just looked it up, found you can get the heavier weight teflon in the U.S., 3/16". I STRONGLY suggest anyone building a new boat buys the matching stuffing tube for their 3/16" boats.

Anyway to the OP, you got a pretty powerful and capable setup you're building, clearly there is no "wrong," way but if you can, I would pick up thicker teflon I think once you do a side by side comparison you'll be surprised.

I had already started doing something like this. My first go round was a mistake...let me elaborate:
I ordered some thick teflon (9/32 od and 3/16 id). Well the fit with a 3/16 cable is too tight. So I had to rethink this. Ends up that a 5mm id and 8mm od is the ticket (I think....wont know till I try it...parts on order). 5mm is .196 and the cable is .187 so i think that .010ish would be a good clearance.

[keithbradley]

Keith, Truthfully, the reason for my earlier post was that I perceived your response to flraptor07 in post 22 as a bit condescending.

I don't understand...you thought my post was condescending, so you made your own condescending post? What an odd response. When someone posts something that is factually incorrect, disagreeing is not condescending, it's just accurate. Saying that you wont find any SAW boats and serious racers using Teflon is wrong, period. Just because you aren't aware of the truth doesn't mean it's not the truth. I don't care if you run Teflon or not, but that doesn't change the fact that more of the world's fastest boats are running Teflon than not. I'll give you another example...
I would also say that more of the fastest cats in the world are HPR than any other hull manufacturer. Are the majority of guys here running HPR? No, I think far less than 1%. Are most of the guys at your pond running HPR? No, I'll make an educated guess and say that none of them are. When someone wants to build a fast boat are you, Chilli, recommending HPR hulls? Probably not, because it's not what you're familiar with. HOWEVER, if someone makes a post that says "I don't think any of the fast guys are running HPR", I'm going to tell them that they're wrong. Not because I'm condescending, but because their post was simply inaccurate.

I think it was a safe assumption that the majority of those a bit more dedicated to the hobby in the US go without Teflon.

What does that mean, and why are there so many qualifiers in that sentence? More dedicated than what? I'm not sure if I'm misinterpreting what you are trying to say here, or if you're baiting me into being "condescending".

My suggestion is for those that want to build the best boats they can, find out WHY people who don't run Teflon made their decision, find out what the top boat builders in the world use and why they do it. Find people who are doing what you want to do and ask them how they do it. Then, try it for yourself. Don't assume that everyone or anyone is smarter than you and just follow them blindly. There is a lot of value in knowing what other people have experienced, but there is likely even more in questioning why, and finding out for yourself.

You will find in this hobby that there are a whole lot of people that just do what is popular in certain groups, and consider a lot of how they do things as gospel simply because so many other people are doing it. There are others that don't do things "just because", and insist on finding out the truth for themselves. The second group is the group that breaks away from mediocrity, while the first is "the majority". I'm personally more interested in what the second group is doing than the first, but it's the first group that is usually the loudest.

I'm not saying that people who don't run Teflon are all mediocre, and I'm not saying that doing one or the other is going to launch you into the stratosphere of model boating. I AM saying that if you want to reach a higher level, look into things a little further and then make a decision that best suits your needs.

[flraptor07]

Last I knew many and most didn't mean all, I did go back and add the m to any only because I screwed up when I first posted but most was there originally.

[pistol18]

Always many good points here on OSE and it helps us sport boaters learn and improve our boats, so thank you for that.

On a side note, this statement is awesome and maybe you can pm me a picture when you have a chance!
"as I type this, I'm looking up at a shelf with NINE 100mph+ boats"

I'm not trying to subliminally say anything other than that is pretty damn cool.
As I type this, I'm looking at a messy desk that needs to be cleaned! LOL