CF Cloth?

[keithbradley]

Well as much as I appreciate seeing your work Tony, I must admit you have me more interested with the dog now...I think it's the twerking that got me.

[iridebikes247]

Uh oh....lol. For once I think I'm disagreeing with chopper on here. sometimes people go way too heavy with the epoxy and this gives the illusion of strength on the bench when you press down on the hull, nope it will crack under stress. the added epoxy itself does very very little for strength but gives the illusion of strength because it increases stiffness. I have added CF inlays to two non carbon hulls and shed a few tears in the process of wrapping every single inch of the deck and floor. With hatches bolted on I stand on top of the hulls, not the sidewalls but one foot in the middle of the deck. They sag quite a bit under weight but make no cracking sounds, therefore no air has entered.

These hulls would have blown out if just fiberglass. Adding an inlay after scuffing a hull for a good mechanical bond won't quite be the same as having a good chemical bond when all materials are still in the mold but you can get close. There are quite a few tricks to working with CF, its easily done if you use a very small amount of epoxy and everything is clean/sharp. A LOT of cheap hulls have come out in the past few years and some have cool lines and nicely designed bottoms, so inlay expertise with CF really pays dividends for us now. FG cloth with pigment can really dress up a hull too if thats all one is after but lets say this, i never store my boats with the hatch on now. I only want to look at the cf.

[Wetter]

[QUOTE=iridebikes247;533149] sometimes people go way too heavy with the epoxy and this gives the illusion of strength on the bench when you press down on the hull,

ok so what appropriate thickness of epoxy? skim thin or cover of material thickness?

[Cooper]

[QUOTE=Wetter;533200]

sometimes people go way too heavy with the epoxy and this gives the illusion of strength on the bench when you press down on the hull,

ok so what appropriate thickness of epoxy? skim thin or cover of material thickness?

As little epoxy as possible. The cloth needs to be completely wetted, any excess resin can be rolled/squeegeed off/out. It would be better and way stronger to have two layers of cloth, opposite weave directions, than one with a thick layer of epoxy(resin) The main developmental concept of using carbon fiber weave was to be able to strengthen irregular shapes with minimal weight as possible. The epoxy, like Keith said, will chemically bond and encapsulate the fibers to substrate. There really is a lot of reasons why so many types of epoxies/resins are out there. All different applications. Rule of thumb, longer setting will have a better bond. And like tony said, fiberglass is still some strong stuff. I like the look of cf and for my purposes in reinforcing I try to minimize every ounce wherever I can. Not as much weight difference in glass verses carbon but when a 1/4" layer of resin is used it's just added weight. It will be a slight bit stronger but still be brittle and excessive weight.

[Cooper]

And those guys have mad skills laying that stuff!!! Yea, you know ya do :) !!!

[Wetter]

so what resin or epoxy should be used then?
appreciate all this feed back.
Kieth when would your tutorial be out?
and Cooper did you ever finish your stingers you manufactured? (can't seem to find that build site that you were posted in).
Thax again.
(CF would make an interesting suit)

[Mgivens]

I would listen to the other guys before me...but, I LOVE west systems 105 epoxy with the 206 hardner! Great stuff, a real pleasure to work with. I think you will enjoy and be more successful with an inlay if you use a real quality epoxy like west systems

[wayne middlemiss]

vinylester would be my choice for cf layups

[Savage Skidoo]

I use the West systems , Ive tried other's on the market , they don't even come close .

IMGA0208.jpg

[T.S.Davis]

I use the West systems , Ive tried other's on the market , they don't even come close .

Yep. Me too. I'm sure there are other epoxies that are just as good but once a club mate turned me onto West I quit looking. To save a few bucks? Nah, just give me the stuff that works and I don't have to worry about. Plus, many of the marine stores in my area have it on the shelf. Easy breezy lemon squeezy.

Not for strength but to soak into ply I really like the special clear hardener too.

[Wetter]

I have the West System 650 G/flex on hand from other lil' projects.
and the marine store i purchase from should have the west systems 105 epoxy with the 206 hardner (thanx Mgivens).
so like i am in no rush on this and still have a few things to read about. preparing on expanding my hobby space also.
it's either down size or stuff goes to storage.
anyways Thanx for the fish
ps T.S.Davis "Nah, just give me the stuff that works and I don't have to worry about." Ain't that the truth!

[iridebikes247]

IMG_20130819_111321_632.jpg. This is an older boat using 105 and 207.

[iridebikes247]

IMG_20130819_111321_632.jpg

[Apophis]

I'll be doing a tutorial shorty on how to properly do a CF inlay.

[RandyatBBY]

Uh oh....lol. For once I think I'm disagreeing with chopper on here. sometimes people go way too heavy with the epoxy and this gives the illusion of strength on the bench when you press down on the hull, nope it will crack under stress. the added epoxy itself does very very little for strength but gives the illusion of strength because it increases stiffness. I have added CF inlays to two non carbon hulls and shed a few tears in the process of wrapping every single inch of the deck and floor. With hatches bolted on I stand on top of the hulls, not the sidewalls but one foot in the middle of the deck. They sag quite a bit under weight but make no cracking sounds, therefore no air has entered.

These hulls would have blown out if just fiberglass. Adding an inlay after scuffing a hull for a good mechanical bond won't quite be the same as having a good chemical bond when all materials are still in the mold but you can get close. There are quite a few tricks to working with CF, its easily done if you use a very small amount of epoxy and everything is clean/sharp. A LOT of cheap hulls have come out in the past few years and some have cool lines and nicely designed bottoms, so inlay expertise with CF really pays dividends for us now. FG cloth with pigment can really dress up a hull too if thats all one is after but lets say this, i never store my boats with the hatch on now. I only want to look at the cf.

This is a good thread and some info that I will use, Just goes to show that you are never too old to learn some thing new on a old subject. I have always felt from that I have read and tested that adding CF to FG always make it more strong and ridged. I was un-happy with the last inlay I did on the edges this will help.