IMPBA, NAMBA, FE Rules Etcetera

[T.S.Davis]

We saw that same pair of 2D characters lurking around the outhouses at the 2010 nationals.

[HTVboats]

The good news is there is a rule book already with all the classes N P Q S T. Maybe rather than consentrating on spec/limited rules for beginers that will soon face very experienced racers who know props and setup, FE can promote the product they already have. Yes it is a cheap way into racing but not everyone comes from toys"R"us. One thing to consider is where FE is really going. Do you stay with 1/4 mile courses which are great for boats under 50mph or go to 1/3 mile courses which are better suited for 40 + mph equipment and increase your chances to add classes and race with existing IC races. P spec/limited will do both but maybe that is the dividing line? There could be some great racing in P and Q that does not need a $600 ESC and motor to compete. Or does the small course just eliminate expensive builds where they can't stretch their legs? I really enjoy the power I have found just above spec. I also have resigned myself to the fact I may not be able to race FE more than a couple times a year.
One thing I would not like to see is making every boat hull style imaginable into a spec class. Use two or three popular hulls only. Then guide people to other power options. You don't need spec/limited monohydrotunnelcatsporthydroscalecrackerskiffs. Gas has done that already. They fill a class then start another with the same powerplant. As I started out with, N P Q S T are there in both rule books and as Doug pointed out the only difference is 10000mah's which could be dealt with fairly easy. At the NAMBA nats here all we had to do was tech a battery if you placed. Not rocket science. If you wanted a real challenge limit a class like P to say either 5000ma maximun or battery by weight maximun. So may grams to be determined?? You can then take a big motor and prop back to last 6 laps or a smaller motor propped up. Either way your need for a big$$$ ESC goes down.
Mic

[jaike5]

John , the only thing you did is fragment our small FE group . 3 or 4 guys with you, 3 or 4 with NLMBC 3 or 4 just don't come out any more. We all should have stayed in NLMBC and had a really strong club. I know NLMBC is not perfect but its a lot better than whats going on now. What is your race schedule this year I will make as many of them as I can, I work every other weekend, Thurs, evening works good too, not to crazy about the last boat (usually yours.....LOL) being able to cut bouys. Cheers Jay.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I want Everyone to calm the heck down. The FE department of IMPBA is being run quite well by Chris, and Doug.
We haven't had any controversy on the boards about anything in a while and I'd like to see it stay that way. Don't complain publicly like this.
I know for a fact that if you got at either chairman in a PM the issue would be addressed in due time.

RC model boat sales are on the uprise thanks to our major companies AQ, PB, Venom/Atomik as well as HK but for some reason race attendance is down.
-Let's keep it positive gents

Post things that make our sport look inviting.

Sincerely Bill Oxidean

[photohoward1]

Sorry I started this....Maybe :) I think there is one unhappy person in this whole thread. We know who! Wink, Wink! Ray calm down. I just wanted an FE clarification not a Lynching.

I can't believe I agree with Bill. Listen to him he is right.

Ray if you have a complaint with your club take it private!

[T.S.Davis]

I'm happy. See me smiling?

[Doby]

John , the only thing you did is fragment our small FE group . 3 or 4 guys with you, 3 or 4 with NLMBC 3 or 4 just don't come out any more. We all should have stayed in NLMBC and had a really strong club. I know NLMBC is not perfect but its a lot better than whats going on now. What is your race schedule this year I will make as many of them as I can, I work every other weekend, Thurs, evening works good too, not to crazy about the last boat (usually yours.....LOL) being able to cut bouys. Cheers Jay.

Sigh...no-one held a gun to anyone's head to leave NLMBC last year....Our club did nothing but provide an option at a more or less centrally located pond. I'm looking forward to seeing NLMBC's schedule for FE races this year. Also, they seem to be more orientated to gas/nitro as was evident. Just about every delay at their events was blamed on FE guys for one reason or another.

Besides, people always have excuses, remember MMM and the WWK site? The waters to rough, the winds from the wrong direction, the sun is in my eyes, its too cloudy, we can't see the marker bouys....... FE is suffering from general lack or participation in what is probably the most populated area of Canada. Changing the current rules isn't going to change any of that.

Its just not that popular.

The Michigan guys have the right idea...by a SV27 and race it as is. From store to pond.

I suppose IMPBA and NAMBA could adapt a Hobby King only class.

[DPeterson]

Keeping some facts straight.

P-Limited was never initiated to be a beginners class. These classes were the extension of the brushed 700 LSH, LSO and OPC classes that we have been run for many years prior. Most all us that got into P-Limited and stayed with the classes have been running the open N2, P and Q classes again for many years prior. After the allowance of 2P and the increase in costs to run the open motor classes the majority of racers gravitated towards the P-limited. The RTR boats and classes are for the beginners.

National rules for the most part are for National events. In order to host a Nationals and entice racers to spend time and money to travel to such an event there needs to be universal rules. IMPBA does not host an FE Nationals so their need for national rules is low to nil. There are IMPBA clubs that hosts races with the desire to attract the traveling racers and therefore these clubs have adopted many of the NAMBA P-Limited rules that have proven to work.

Then there is the smoke a motor per heat statements. My guess is this was an isolated incident at best. Never seen it myself. Been running these UL1 motors since the beginning. I smoked 2 of them. Both due to running a backup esc in the middle of a race with the wrong settings. I run all mine hard and I only see where they get tired at the end of the race season - exactly the same as when we ran the brushed 700's. Want to discuss smoking equipment lets discuss the learning curve after we allowed the 2P Lipo configurations.

Good Day

[Darin Jordan]

Keeping some facts straight.

+1 to Mr. Peterson.... Two Thumbs up!

[T.S.Davis]

When we ran brushed motors in LSO I went to one race where I was baking a motor every heat. Didn't mean too. It was hotter out than I had anticipated. Finish each heat and opened the lid to find a smoldering mess. The motors were cheap. That was a long time ago. Since then, I've not seen it done.

Maybe I stated in incorrectly. How about the limited classes are designed to be simple for a new......er guy to get in on the fun without needing a degree in physics. That being said, the veteran guys need to race the classes too. Hence the compromise on the ESC. The problem I have, is when the vets just annihilate the new guys. Over and over. What good is that? Teach them something. Make them faster. Teach them to whip your behind. It's not always about the W. Make them want more than spec has to offer. Make them want to build a Q Sport or some other such nonsense. That's my take at least.

Doug, you might be alone in your thinking that the speckies aren't for less experienced racers. Maybe in the beginning they weren't but LiPo were gigantic pricey then. Should check with Dave on the beginner aspect of the LS classes. Not sure what his take is on it these days.

[Doug Smock]

The FE department of IMPBA is being run quite well by Chris, and Doug.


Sincerely Bill Oxidean

Thanks for the kind words Bill. I know what you meant but want to clear this up for everyone else.

Chris Harris is Fast Electrics at the board level, period, he is his own man.

My gig is maintaining the integrity of our Record Trials, the Record Books, and District XIII.

I agree with you that Fast Electrics in the IMPBA are doing fine.
We will continue to do well as long as we have a guy like Chris at the helm, and good ambassadors in the field.

The rest of this is just noise and will fix it self when the ponds thaw.

[egneg]

In D-12 we are constrained by ESC's as well as motors. I would like to see this opened up to any 60 amp ESC.

[D. Newland]

...Doug, you might be alone in your thinking that the speckies aren't for less experienced racers. Maybe in the beginning they weren't but LiPo were gigantic pricey then. Should check with Dave on the beginner aspect of the LS classes. Not sure what his take is on it these days.

I don't think my take on it matters, but I think you're both right.

No matter, really, as it is what it is and I like it.

2003 Nat's. My first. LSH. It was even in the rulebook that it was for "beginners". I raced against Crowe and Twaits, etc, etc. I wouldn't have wanted it any different.

2013 Nat's/any race across North America. P-Ltd is the common denominator for all racers, big and tall. You know you're racing the best if you're involved in the P-Ltd power parameter.

Now, P-Ltd is the best place to also foster new racers. No doubt. That's where the flexibility of local club rules comes into play. You have full power to do whatever you want to get guys on the water. Having P-Ltd in step with some of the best RTR's on the market helps, too.

[photohoward1]

The reason I started this thread was not to start an argument but to ask when the rules will be updated to a current spec. My club is coming along nicely. The guys all started to buy the RTR boats and had a great time. They needed more though. Eventually they saw my stuff and realized that the RTR ESC and Motors were fine...it was the hull that was sub par.
Without knowing it they were already running P spec. It took me a while to convince them that rules and specs existed for FE Racing. (Gas and Nitro Guys). We are having a race at the end of July and I needed the Rule set to be stated correctly. I looked on the IMPBA site and they were a bit, to say the least, confusing. I basically gave the club president the NAMBA specs to use. They work...

Lets not reinvent the wheel. NAMBA rules work for this. My club is an IMBPA club though. LET'S JUST ALL GET LONG!

BTW the angry parties have left the discussion I think....

[Chilli]

Chuck, The original draft of D12 FE rules I wrote up called for open ESC's in the P-Limited classes. The only opposition I got on the entire draft was the use of open ESC's by several voting board members who attend the majority of district races as well as the World Tunnel Championships. They already had P-Limited Tunnels and wanted our rules to mirror the rules that they run at the WTC. It was a small price to pay to get their support for the whole package. The irony of this is the WTC rules were modeled after a set of rules from a NAMBA Club.

PS- Possible meeting this Saturday between ODMBA and VA Beach Parks and Rec ref a pond near the Virginia Beach Amphitheater