N1 Mono Questions

[Steven Vaccaro]

I've never run Namba N1 mono, so I'm looking for what people are running for bl motors? The rules state roar approved bl motors. Below are the 8 motors approved for the roar stock class. Does anyone have an experience with these?



StockAssociated/Reedy LRP Vector X11 Stockspec 17.5T 38.5 February 15, 2008
StockHacker Brushless USA Hacker E40 - 17.5T 33.0 July 28, 2008
StockLosi Losi Xcelorin 17.5 LOSAB9406 32.5 February 29, 2008
StockNovak Novak 3417SS 17.5 Pro 36.5 February 15, 2008
StockOrion Orion Vortex 2008 Stock 17.5 31.5 October 17, 2008
StockSchumacher USA Speed Passion SPF175 Ultra Sportsman Stock 34.5 May 8, 2008
StockTekin Tekin Reline 17.5T Type-S P/N 2251 33.0 July 24, 2008
StockTrinity Trinity TRI 10220 17.5T (red timing plate) 34.0 May 20, 2008

[Darin Jordan]

Steven,

I can't go into detail right now... but when I get a few minutes, I can answer a LOT of your questions concerning these... For now, I can tell you that to run one of these motors, you are going to have to run a setup that might NOT be considered anywhere near typical N1...

To give you an example... the current N1 Mono NAMBA 2-Lap record was set using the Hacker E40 17.5 in a 22" custom build WildThing Mono, spinning a 1750 Octura prop... That's not a typo... a 50mm prop! These motors only have about 17,000RPM free revving on 2S... which equates to around 15,000 or less under load... You need to make a hull that can handle a BIG pitch prop, because you'll basically be driving using a tug-boat motor.

By contract... my 2007 hull was a Maus Microbullet, using a Trinity Monster-Stock, that turned around 32,000 on the bench, and around 23,000 or so under load, spinning an X435 prop....

[Steven Vaccaro]

I remember that from our previous emails. I was hoping things may have changed.



What speed in the straights should I be shooting for? These boats are for my sons. They will be running Toys-Port Ozons. Narrow beam with a rear pad. I don't think they will handle a large diameter prop. Did you get to try any of the 1.8 pitch props offered by ABC?

[Darin Jordan]

Steven,

I have a lot more I can tell you... when I get home and get a few free minutes, I'll give you some details to work with...

Might even have a pic or two to help you out...

[Himalaya]

Looks like most BL motors you listed are designed for cars, with sensored rotor detection. They may work in boats but might be hard to get water cooled because of the segment structure(front and rear endbells) and finned can. Also the sensor does nothing profittable for marine use.

[Darin Jordan]

Looks like most BL motors you listed are designed for cars, with sensored rotor detection. They may work in boats but might be hard to get water cooled because of the segment structure(front and rear endbells) and finned can. Also the sensor does nothing profittable for marine use.

All of these can be run without sensors... I run mine using a Barracuda 80 ESC and I use a standard 36mm water-cooling jacket...

When I have a few minutes (going through some "stuff" right now), I'll post more info and some pictures of my setups...

[Himalaya]

That's correct Darin, all sensored brushless motors can be used as the sensors ignored.

In this kind of applications I would suggest to carefully limit your prop's size/pitch cause car BL motors generally have thin rotors for a "smooth throttle feel", the gap between the rotor and the stator can be as large as a few mm. Thus they are lack in torque and can be easily over proped. As an example the Novak rotor dia. is 12.3mm, compared with a Neu or Medusa having 18mm or 19mm dia. rotors.
Furthermore, 2 pole vs. 4 pole, the torque diffs are well known.

[Steven Vaccaro]

How do I figure out if this motor is roar legal?

http://shop.graupner.de/webuerp/servlet/AI?ARTN=97153&SessionCheck=4711&language=en

[Darin Jordan]

How do I figure out if this motor is roar legal?

http://shop.graupner.de/webuerp/serv...11&language=en

Steven,

ROAR has an approved motor list for brushed motors:

http://www.roarracing.com/approvals/smotor.php

I don't think the "Pinnacle Brilliant" is legal, or approved... only the Pinnacle God.



Here is the "Stock" and "Rebuildable Stock" List:

Rebuildable Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo Reedy Rebuildable July 19, 1999
Rebuildable Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo 'MVP' rebuildable Stock # 298-001 February 23, 2001
Rebuildable Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo StockStar April 4, 2008
Rebuildable Stock GM Racing Pinnacle Gold Rebuildable Stock #GM9682 December 24, 1999
Rebuildable Stock Peak/Orion Orion Chrome stock rebuildable w/ machined arm October 1, 2000
Rebuildable Stock Peak/Orion Orion 'CORE' TOP27, Black Can,Gray Endbell,.300 comm, l/d br. February 17, 2003
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic Paradox July 19, 1999
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic TM82B P2K Paradox 2k December 24, 1999
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic Green Machine 3 December 22, 2000
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic TM 90 P2PK rebuildable stock October 22, 2001
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic TB-01 Monster Horespower November 22, 2002
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic Ep1111 Epic27, SatinBronzeCan,4x5ldn br., .300comm June 4, 2004
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic Ep1112 Epic27, SatinBronzeCan,4x5ldn br., .300comm June 4, 2004
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic CO27 (TRI12001/TRI12002) Blue Can,4x5 Ldn Br.,.300 Com February 27, 2006
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic EpicX-EP1166 Blk can 2flats, laydn br. .3 com June 1, 2006
Rebuildable Stock Trinity Epic Trinity Mystery Stock July 1, 2008
Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo Tru Stock R91 March 1, 1993
Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo Mach 1R91 October 1, 1993
Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo Sonic R91 October 1, 1993
Stock Associated/Reedy Reedy #300-001 R96 Stock July 1, 1996
Stock Associated/Reedy Yokomo Rage 24 degree w l/d brushes R96 January 22, 1999
Stock GM Racing GM9678 Purple Bull Stock w/ l/d br.+ full lng arm R96 September 1, 1997
Stock GM Racing GM9677 Purple Bull Stock w/ slotted arm ROAR 96 January 1, 1998
Stock GM Racing Pinnacle 24 degree Stock #GM9680 R96 January 30, 1999
Stock Hobbico Kyosho # KYOG2040 Sport Rcg R96Stock September 1, 1996
Stock Hobbico Kyosho # KYOG2700 Ion Storm R96 Stock September 1, 1996
Stock Maxtec Maxtec Aftershock Stock R96 January 1, 1999
Stock Nomad Int'l Nexxus - Vented red can & endbell, slot arm, uprt brush R91 August 1, 1995
Stock PTI/CAM Sagami Vortex VOR-0001 LD brush, Blue endbell R91 November 1, 1996
Stock Race Prep Orange Can R91 March 1, 1993
Stock Race Prep Race Prep Race Prep#RP-244 Hack Attack R91, R96 June 1, 1996
Stock Trinity Equalizer R91 March 1, 1993
Stock Trinity Epic Green Machine R91 March 1, 1993
Stock Trinity Epic Slot Mach.II Laydn Br. - Laydown Brush, Silver Can R91 October 1, 1993
Stock Trinity Epic Green Machine II R91 May 1, 1994
Stock Trinity Midnight R 96 November 1, 1995
Stock Trinity Epic TM56/56A Silver can, Blk endbell,laydn br R96 January 1, 1997
Stock Trinity TM56/TM56A X-Star R96 March 1, 1997
Stock Trinity TM64 Midnight 2 Stock ROAR 98 January 1, 1998
Stock Trinity Epic Epic 5-degree Stock Motor OEM#TM80B August 16, 1999

[Steven Vaccaro]

Thanks Darin. Is Namba using stock or rebuild able?

[Darin Jordan]

Thanks Darin. Is Namba using stock or rebuild able?

They are both considered "ROAR Stock"... Either is legal...

The best motors that I've used are the Trinity Monster-Stock, custom prepped by, well... ME

I think I'll have some time tomorrow to sit down and get you some info. I'm pretty sure I can hook you up with a really good brushed setup that will make your kids VERY happy!

[D. Newland]

Steve-I have to ask- Why do you think N-1 power is the way to go for your kids to sport run?

Pull an 8L off the shelf, run it on 2S lipos or 6 NiMH with an X435 prop and a cheap brushless ESC. Why even mess with a brushed motor??

My boys are currently 10, but for the past few years they have had no problems running de-tuned P Offshore setups.

5 minutes of runtime. Very conservative setup and still get low 30's. One is a NS-3 with a 10XL and X442 and the other is a BBY Patriot with a 9XL and X438. 4S1P 5000 packs. An SV package works just as good, but I'm using ESC's and motors from my drawer. An old Hacker 77, 70, Castle 80, etc.

[Steven Vaccaro]

They have never run a coarse and I was attempting to put something together for them that they can race/run IF I go to the nats this year. I was going to set up a small coarse in a local pond for them to test on.

[Darin Jordan]

They have never run a coarse and I was attempting to put something together for them that they can race/run IF I go to the nats this year. I was going to set up a small coarse in a local pond for them to test on.

Steven,

I'm actually firmly in David's camp on this one... Tommy used to run an N1-Mono, but with lots of help from Dad... I got him an SV27, and he can run the course all by himself with that. It's setup the same way I'd run it, and he does just fine with it.

If you put that power system into a good hull... Then just be conservative with the Prop... I think you'll find it's actually easier for them to do well with... You don't have to run it so loose and you won't have to worry about them burning things up.

You might even consider getting them one of the FASTech setups... It's pretty m uch ready to go out of the box...

[D. Newland]

I hear ya, Steve.

I'll give one more opinion, FWIW. Build something for them that they will enjoy and forget about meeting any NAMBA class. Then, if you do make plans to attend the Nat's, lobby the Michigan guys to run a Kids are Boaters Too class where anything is allowed (within reason and with CD's approval). Your kids will have a better time just running the buoys with other kids Vs running N-1 mono with me, Douggie and Darin trying to run lane 1/2 with N-1 monos.

You'll be less stressed, too. Trust me on this one. One of the most stressful boating situations I've been in was letting my boys run Open Water at a Nitro event so they could get familiar with their boats...I waited for a "slow" spot during Open Water, but it quickly turned into 5 or 6 boats running the course and it wasn't the best situation, even though my boys ran the course pretty darn good.

I hope to see you in Michigan, too. Heck, you're the Title Sponsor, so you better show up!