Castle Hydra Firmware

[Flying Scotsman]

Geez guys...I was at a show with no internet connection. I'm not leaving you hanging, I'm not running away, not going to ignore you...I was busy. I'm here now, ask away.

Darin...thank you for answering some questions while I was gone...it is appreciated. :)

I will talk with the engineers about the high timing voiding warranty situation. We'll see what they say...not my decision.

Castle is very sorry for any frustration this debacle may have caused any of you. We knew some people would be upset but chose to just put it out there. We could have just fixed it, released 1.05/06, and not said another word. But that's not the way we do business...if we mess up we admit to it. So our apologies gents.

Thank you Joe for your concern. I know we all mistakes but how did those wrong timing values get by engineering QC. No stone throwing ...just asking and thanks for your honesty.

Douggie

[Darin Jordan]

Thank you Joe for your concern. I know we all mistakes but how did those wrong timing values get by engineering QC. No stone throwing ...just asking and thanks for your honesty.

Douggie

Honestly Douggie, and with all due respect, I don't see how this is any of our business... It's a privately run company that will (and SHOULD) handle it's internal affairs internally... I'm sure they want to fix their processes to prevent this in the future... They've fixed the current issue and put it out there for us to use... that's the part that matters, and is our business...

Hopefully they come up with a fix for the "plug-in and pop" problem with the HV series as well...

[Joe Ford]

I test some of the software features...the ones that don't require an EE degree...cutoff voltages, etc. Engineering does the rest...timing, PWM, current limiting. Unfortunately, engineering didn't realize the error until recently and are not sure how the timing values changed from the previous version. You can rest assured it won't happen again.

[Flying Scotsman]

True Darin, but it worries me. As I have had to explain to customers that their $300,000 equipment is not working, due to bad servo engineering. Sales guys hate product problems and the customer stating we are going to sue you for lost production.

Douggie

[Joe Ford]

From the engineering dept. If 16.25 degrees was working for you, we will cover you under warranty with v1.04 on high timing.

[AntronX]

Hi Joe, thank you for visiting this forum and answering questions. We are lucky to have an American based company with real tech support like this. I am about to get my 6th Castle controller, and I never had one fail on it's own.

[tylerm]

Tyler I for one would like to see a Etti cap bank on a CC esc. I think they are the week link and a bank like that can only help. Please give it a go and report on the cap temps without the bank and with the bank. Go on take one for the team mate, it wont hurt a bit!!

Yea except for the wallet, stupid NZ dollar lol. $24.95 US= $44.70 NZ.
Ironic though, chinky insurance on a US made product
Won't make a big difference for me, i'm only running a 9XL(although i still can cook things with it) and just stuffed the bearings. Will have to do an order for a cap bank and some bearings.
I get paid on thursday so we'll see how i look then.
Props to Joe for coming on here though, great to have someone from castle to answer questions.
Tyler.

[Steven Vaccaro]

Joe thanks for stepping up and telling the truth. I have dealt with many software companies in the past that have always denied there were problems with a product they supported, then all of a sudden after a software update the problem disappeared!

As far as warranties go, there have been very few claims made by my customers that Castle has not covered. You wont find a better company out there that backs their products the way Castle Creations does.

[TRUCKPULL]

Right on Steven.


Larry

[Boatman]

After taking allot of time and reading this over again, I think my money is with Castle ESC's. My setups may need changing but for that heard set warranty, how can you go wrong. Thanks for the Explanation and if you ever need someone to test new equipment let me know!

Gentlemen...the following is what Castle's engineering department has found regarding the Hydra software versions. We spent quite a bit of time to test this.

"Timing on version 1.03 does not operate as intended. Normal timing is approximately 16 degrees. I would consider this too high for optimum performance on most motors. If the timing was changed via Castle Link the result would be as follows:

Low: 16.25 degrees
Normal: 16.25 degrees
Race: 10.75 degrees
Extreme: 16.25 degrees

If the timing was changed via stick programming and power was not removed directly after Motor Timing was set (in other words the user continued to set another setting such as Cutoff Voltage), then the timing was always set to 16.25 degrees.

If the user unplugged the unit directly after Motor Timing was set, then the user would get the same timing values as Castle Link would set. (16.25,16.25,10.75,16.25)

This obviously was not correct and was fixed in version 1.04. In version 1.04 the timing values are consistent if programmed via Castle Link or stick programming. The values are as follows:

Low: 4.75 degrees
Norm: 9 degrees
High: 12.75 degrees
Highest: 16.25 degrees

I also tested the units on the bench to determine if there were any other issues that may have resulted in excess heat. I ran a controller to steady state temperature using the version 1.03 firmware on default timing. Then repeated the test with version 1.04. As expected, the timing was different between the two. Also, the temperature and current measurements were consistent with timing.

The test running 1.03 firmware had a current draw of approximately 3 amps higher than 1.04. The steady state temperature of the 1.03 firmware test was approximately 3-4 degrees higher (as a result of the increased current).

There are two known 'issues' with the Hydra software.

Known issue 1: When updating from version 1.03 to 1.04 you MUST recalibrate. Failure to do so will cause the controller to not reach FULL THROTTLE (as indicated by the LED not going to a steady ON).

Known issue 2: When stick programming voltage cutoff on either version 1.03 or 1.04 the programming options are 4, 5, 6, 7.2, 9, 12. However, in the instructions, they are listed as 4,5,6,9,12 (7.2 was removed when the instructions were written for the Hydra line).

The customers who are using v1.04, and feel it has caused their boats to slow down and temps to increase are probably split into two camps.

1) Those who forgot to recalibrate their unit after updating. These guys would likely see a very dramatic decrease in speed as a result of not reaching full throttle. They also would probably see an increase in temperature because they were consistently running at 90% throttle.

2) Those who calibrated their unit and noticed a decrease in top end. This was probably accompanied by lower ESC and motor temperatures. This was caused by the timing being 'fixed'. You can see the numbers above, and if the user sets their timing to 'Highest' on v1.04, the unit should run exactly as it did using the v1.03 firmware."

Sorry it took so long to get this data guys...we needed to make sure the results were 100% correct.

[Joe Ford]

You guys who are running the new firmware experiencing any issues? Let me know...just like to get updates. No way for me to test...all the ponds are frozen.

[Ub Hauled]

Joe, with the Hydra 120 I am experiencing no issues with the new SW and FW.

[properchopper]

what's the bottom line ?

I'm hoping those of you with sharper minds could bottom line the whole shebang for my poor terminally bewildered brain. Here's what I'm running :

Hydra 240, V1.3, set to "normal", 4S2P, Neu 1515 1Y. 33 " DF mono.Runs perfectly, temps for 1 mile racing are just fine. [ A while ago, I programmed V 1.4 with the set of problems that were expected. Back to V 1.3 as above]

Same as above, 8XL, 26 " cat.

Should I change to V 1.4 with the new settings now disclosed or just leave things put ? What would I gain by changing/updating ? That's what I really want to know !

I hate to admit that I'm just a little puzzled , but maybe someone could untangle this for me.

[D. Newland]

Joe-I've updated all my CC controllers to 1.04, but have only had 1 on the water. LV 240 running a Neu 1515 1Y. It ran fine and looked every bit as good as 1.03, but I did not get specific temp readings. All I know is nothing was warm.

However, I did stumble a bit on the radio re-calibration. Once I got that down, the ESC would hit full throttle.

Tony-IMO if you keep the 1Y motor and you're currently happy with your amp draw, speed and temps, you may be fine as is. But, if you go to a D motor or some other setup that requires less timing, you'll need 1.04. If you update, just go through the instruction book again about re-calibration of the radio.

I updated. Because I'm anal.

[Ub Hauled]

Tony, get the latest "Link application" and install Firmware 1.04...
after that RECALIBRATE THE ESC WITH THE Tx again (like the first time you use it: Full throttle and hold, then Full break, etc, etc...)
That's all it takes.