Spartan, tear it down to build it up

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  • GeoVW72
    Senior Member
    • Jun 2010
    • 258

    #1

    Spartan, tear it down to build it up

    Well half the lake thawed out, cold water should help right?
    ambient temp was 38*f

    Run #1: stock packs off peak; yawn, too slow, ran for 5 min then brought in to change to 4s
    esc: 50*f motor: 65*f

    Run #2: 2x 2s 5400 40c orion revo packs; good fun, safe for the system, no leaks
    esc: 55* motor: 70*

    Run #3: 2x 3s 4700 45c orion revo packs; never topped them off after they were in my revo for 7min. Fast as it should be, pic was after run, jacket clearly leaking.
    esc: 70* motor: 123*


    Youtube Vid

    Run #4: 2x 3s Brick; Fast, everything seemed fine then...

    Youtube Vid

    Villain is a friend's, shortly used as the rescue craft.
    esc: 70* motor: 215*
    receiver thermal had kicked in, not that it meant much.

    Not sure how the spartan ever did what they say it should.

    Dissection:
    Motor was locked tight, easy to see why;




    My theory on the stuffing tube liner seems bunk at this point. Sheen was still on the outside of the liner, Inside was matte, no true damage or deformation though. Oil is inadequate for 6s operation.

    Jacket leaks horridly as we all know. One thing that I noted was the water seemed to pulse slightly on the outlet. I'm not sure that the fault lies in the rudder, more the outlet. Least my rudder had the pick-up running to the front of the blade, not through. I think the design of the jacket is wrong, requiring the water to flow completely around the motor causes too much restriction and I question weather the jacket is ballooning or forced cross flow is occurring to cause the stream to pulse.

    One other thing I noted was an uneven wear pattern on the front of the shaft stub.




    The cable also looked like it had a small kink, not enough to cause concern though. Chucked the shaft stub in a drill and ran over the whole thing with polishing compound.

    Synopsis:
    Why did I do this; to prove that this boat has a snowball's chance in hell of working on 6s under the best of conditions. I like experiencing failures first hand because I am in control of the variables. The only way I see this boat doing 50+ for 20min stock is down one long ski slope.

    My recommendation to anyone looking to run a spartan on 6s right now
    (4s seems fine enough to me until traxxas produces the fix);
    Find some good marine grease; Aquacraft, Pro Boat
    Attempt to find a better cooling jacket preferably a can and o-ring type
    Get larger line(3ft will do or Pro boat), drill out the transom(~1/4" for larger line) and drill out the outlet(1/8" seems doable)

    Currently working on the modifications, stay tuned

    Tear it down to build it up
    Team Boca Bearings

    S&G Design
  • JPriami
    N4FOX
    • Aug 2010
    • 1675

    #2
    Traxxas just removed this. I was reading it. Then poof gone.
    Land, Sea & Air, A true RC Addict.

    Comment

    • GeoVW72
      Senior Member
      • Jun 2010
      • 258

      #3
      Yep, that's why it's here as well, don't really see how I'm bashing their product
      Team Boca Bearings

      S&G Design

      Comment

      • wilsta67
        Senior Member
        • Feb 2011
        • 203

        #4
        Originally posted by GeoVW72
        Yep, that's why it's here as well, don't really see how I'm bashing their product
        haha good one! traxxas just dont want to admit they have designed a lemon

        Comment

        • kjohnsiii
          Senior Member
          • Oct 2010
          • 116

          #5
          Is there a OSE water jacket that will fit the spartan motor?

          Comment

          • Brushless55
            Creator
            • Oct 2008
            • 9488

            #6
            "The only way I see this boat doing 50+ for 20min stock is down one long ski slope."

            That is Awesome!

            Originally posted by JPriami
            Traxxas just removed this. I was reading it. Then poof gone.
            And again the modtrolls take lame action


            Originally posted by wilsta67
            haha good one! traxxas just dont want to admit they have designed a lemon


            I have really lost a lot of respect for Traxxas
            to me it seems money is much more important than anything else to them
            .NAMBA20...Caterpillar UL-1, P-Spec OM29, P-Mono DF33, P-Spec JAE, Aussie 33" Hydro-LSH, Sprintcat CC2028 on 8s, PT SS45 Q Hydro, PS295 UL-1 power, OSE Brothers Outlaw QMono 4-sale, Rio 51z CC2028 on 8s

            Comment

            • Brushless55
              Creator
              • Oct 2008
              • 9488

              #7
              put this up on RCU
              Lots of viewers there
              .NAMBA20...Caterpillar UL-1, P-Spec OM29, P-Mono DF33, P-Spec JAE, Aussie 33" Hydro-LSH, Sprintcat CC2028 on 8s, PT SS45 Q Hydro, PS295 UL-1 power, OSE Brothers Outlaw QMono 4-sale, Rio 51z CC2028 on 8s

              Comment

              • GeoVW72
                Senior Member
                • Jun 2010
                • 258

                #8
                Originally posted by kjohnsiii
                Is there a OSE water jacket that will fit the spartan motor?
                anything for a 540 or 36mm motor, people bought up most of the longer xl s. not sure length is really critical, but it can't hurt
                Team Boca Bearings

                S&G Design

                Comment

                • kjohnsiii
                  Senior Member
                  • Oct 2010
                  • 116

                  #9
                  Thanks.

                  Comment

                  • shctexas
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2011
                    • 156

                    #10
                    Thats exactly what happened to mine; hence, my renaming the boat Albatross.

                    Comment

                    • Make-a-Wake
                      FE Rules!
                      • Nov 2009
                      • 5557

                      #11
                      How about the "Spruce Goose"................Howard Hughes failed attempt at a huge waterplane.............
                      NEED PARALLEL CONNECTORS?? QUALITY 5.5MM, 8MM, 8 AND 10 AWG, GET THEM HERE: http://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...est!&highlight=

                      Comment

                      • GeoVW72
                        Senior Member
                        • Jun 2010
                        • 258

                        #12
                        Hmm...Lucky golden poo maybe

                        I think if traxxas had their way the boats would be in a dump next to the atari E.T. cartridges. Notice how we have to look for their "award". The product has had so many stumbling blocks; esc, name lawsuit, motor. I think that they're looking at one big RED number and waiting to be pulled into black before they put out more into the fix.
                        They're shutting up and waiting until people buy it then they'll advertise it again with the fix
                        The weather's been bad so I've been looking into what I can on the bench; there may be some truth in the rumor that the motors were produced to the wrong spec.
                        looking around 1700kv and we all know how bad 1600kv looks.


                        Traxxas...I know you're out there, just because it's not on your forum doesn't mean it doesn't exist
                        Team Boca Bearings

                        S&G Design

                        Comment

                        • Brushless55
                          Creator
                          • Oct 2008
                          • 9488

                          #13
                          Originally posted by GeoVW72
                          Hmm...Lucky golden poo maybe

                          I think if traxxas had their way the boats would be in a dump next to the atari E.T. cartridges. Notice how we have to look for their "award". The product has had so many stumbling blocks; esc, name lawsuit, motor. I think that they're looking at one big RED number and waiting to be pulled into black before they put out more into the fix.
                          They're shutting up and waiting until people buy it then they'll advertise it again with the fix
                          The weather's been bad so I've been looking into what I can on the bench; there may be some truth in the rumor that the motors were produced to the wrong spec.
                          looking around 1700kv and we all know how bad 1600kv looks.


                          Traxxas...I know you're out there, just because it's not on your forum doesn't mean it doesn't exist
                          .NAMBA20...Caterpillar UL-1, P-Spec OM29, P-Mono DF33, P-Spec JAE, Aussie 33" Hydro-LSH, Sprintcat CC2028 on 8s, PT SS45 Q Hydro, PS295 UL-1 power, OSE Brothers Outlaw QMono 4-sale, Rio 51z CC2028 on 8s

                          Comment

                          • GeoVW72
                            Senior Member
                            • Jun 2010
                            • 258

                            #14
                            Spartan V1.1

                            dead motor is on it's way to traxxas
                            got some mods done




                            outlet drilled out to 1/8"
                            OSE 55mm jacket
                            large line
                            drilled the transom out to 1/4", more than enough for large line, added bulkhead fitting
                            lubed with proboat grease
                            strut was shifted back and set level

                            ambient temp was around 50*f

                            Run #1: 2x 2s
                            esc: 60* motor: 98*

                            Run #2 2x 3s Youtube Vid
                            esc: 70* motor: 158*

                            attempted a third run, receiver had an over temp signal on first plug in, rearmed and it was fine. arming tones were weaker, this motor may be on it's way out as well. dead packs

                            went through it at the shop and noticed some of the things that JPriami had going on with his stuffing tube. No discoloration, just black "shavings"

                            Cleaned it with motor spray, shop towel, and drill


                            Not sure I'm doing the bench kv calculations right
                            running the eagle tree in live mode with a brushless rpm sensor:
                            13,950rpm 5A 16.1v(4s) = 866kv
                            20,950rpm 6A 24.1v(6s) = 850kv
                            if it's off by a factor of 2 = 1700kv apparently
                            Last edited by GeoVW72; 03-02-2011, 03:06 AM. Reason: vid links
                            Team Boca Bearings

                            S&G Design

                            Comment

                            • GeoVW72
                              Senior Member
                              • Jun 2010
                              • 258

                              #15
                              Spartan V1.11

                              more tweaks


                              mounted the rudder onto the other side of the bracket to increase depth of the pick-up.
                              traxxas 2075 servo to hold better
                              loosened the strut mounts and pushed it up and to the right(can only be done just slightly) added one degree of positive on the strut to air out the prop
                              with JPriami's issues and what I've seen of the stock liner, installed an octura liner



                              cleaning the cable out also helps, not sure where the gunk keeps coming from. any chance the assembly lube is still stuck in there

                              ambient 35*f

                              Run #1: 2x 2s
                              esc: 50* motor: 85*

                              Run #2: 2x 3s
                              esc: 60* motor: 135*

                              Octura liner works great so far , greased liberally, still had the sheen on the interior bore with zero signs of wear, where as the traxxas has shown obvious wear throughout.
                              Handling was changed with the rudder mounted differently, hooks hard when turning left, but throw was also changed. easy mod, so I leave it to personal preference. more flow isn't a bad thing though
                              Team Boca Bearings

                              S&G Design

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