SonicWake 36 propellor

[Capt'n Crash]

I have a few TFL boats, two Pursuits and a Rocket and all have Seaking ESC's and I can say they have been 100% reliable for me and the LVC kicking in early has not been a problem. As far as I know the 120 amp Dynamite ESC in the Sonicwake is made by the same manufacturer as Seaking and can be programmed with a Seaking program box which is what I used to program my Sonicwake ESC. If you want to upgrade I would suggest the 180 amp Seaking but I don't see any real need for it unless you are going to install a larger 40mm motor.

As far as a dual pickup rudder is concerned it certainly can't hurt but I have not experienced any overheating of any of the components running stock on 6s with the exception of the lower pitch prop I mentioned. I don't have a GPS but I would say I'm running in the high 40's and the boat handles very well.

I see you have been posting over on the RC Groups forum as do I. They are a very knowledgeable bunch as well.
The TFL Pursuit some members have been suggesting would also be a very good choice and in my opinion it will handle better at higher speeds than the Sonicwake will. I like my Sonicwake for what it is but It's no Pursuit in terms of its handling capabilities at speeds over 50mph.

[Panther6834]

So...I ordered, from Steve, the 'OSE upgraded' SonicWake today (already have the tracking number). I'll still be getting the Pursuit, once he had them back in stock (he said approx 8wks, which is partly why I decided to get the SonicWake...I can be running it before the end of the week). It comes with the dual pickup & HD flex cable already installed. Coming from Steve, I'll assume the cable is well-greased, but I'll double-check, just to be certain (for the few RTRs I own...all land vehicles...I always check certain things before I start running them).

To start, I'll be replacing the Rx with a Futaba Rx (which I'll place inside a Traxxas waterproof Rx box), plus I'll only be running 4S...preferably in 2x 2S, but I need confirmation whether two packs will fit, side-by-side, and what the maximum dimensions of each can be. Eventually (ie. after I replace the ESC, probably with a Hobbywing Seaking 180A...again, I could user suggestions/recommendations), I'll run 6S, but I feel 4S is a good place to start.

As for the prop...will be contacting Chris asap, to determine the best options. I'll definitely want a speed increase, but I also want to maintain stability.

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[Capt'n Crash]

Hey Panther great choice ordering from Steve. Pretty much any standard sized 2s pack will fit side by side just make sure it has a c rating of 50 or better and a minimum of 5000 mAh. Personally I use 70 to 90c 3sx2 packs 5400mAh. Just to give you a rough idea on size they are 51/2 " long x 11/2 " wide and 2" high. 4S will give you a pleasure cruise so you can probably prop up a bit for more speed just watch the temps as 4s will draw more amps. I've also seen videos of the boat running stock on 5s and it was quite stable but I love the sound of this boat on 6s power hence I went with a lower pitch prop. I also purchased a 440/3 blade from Doctorprops which I'll be trying out this summer.

Happy Sonicwaking.

[Panther6834]

Hey Panther great choice ordering from Steve. Pretty much any standard sized 2s pack will fit side by side just make sure it has a c rating of 50 or better and a minimum of 5000 mAh. Personally I use 70 to 90c 3sx2 packs 5400mAh. Just to give you a rough idea on size they are 51/2 " long x 11/2 " wide and 2" high. 4S will give you a pleasure cruise so you can probably prop up a bit for more speed just watch the temps as 4s will draw more amps. I've also seen videos of the boat running stock on 5s and it was quite stable but I love the sound of this boat on 6s power hence I went with a lower pitch prop. I also purchased a 440/3 blade from Doctorprops which I'll be trying out this summer.

Happy Sonicwaking.

In post #6, you mention using the Grim Racer 42x55 1.3 pitch. I can't remember if it was you, or someone else, but I do remember someone mentioning using a CNC-4514 from OSE (actually, I think a few mentioned this, in multiple threads, in more than one forum). In the end, I decided to order a couple of the CNC-4514 props from Steve. Some of the things I really like about Steve, and OSE, is excellent customer service, and (super) speedy replies to email. Steve is, most definitely, customer-service driven. As long as I remain in this aspect of RC, and as long as Steve is in business, he has me as my #1 'goto' for boats & boat parts. Additionally, if anyone asks me about RC FEs, and inquires where to go, I will be directing them to Steve, and OSE.


Unfortunately, by experience with Chris, and dasboata, was the exact opposite. Unless requested by others, I will try to refrain from posting the actual PMs...but, in short, he has shown himself to be rude, arrogant, and lacking the decorum to provide good customer service. He may very well be a "professional" where making props is concerned (I can't claim to know, as he chose to be 'negative' towards me, when I inquired), but even Circuit City provided better costumer service. I contacted him about a prop for the SonicWake. He replied back, saying he had a prop, and quoted a price...and that was all he said. I messaged him back, asking for the missing info, as well as a few questions ANYONE new to the hobby might ask (part number, what metal, pitch, how to pay, etc)...and he purposely ignored it. 1-2 days later, I inquired about a reply, and that's when he responded back, with the rude & arrogant reply mentioned. As I said, I won't post specifics (unless requested by others), but I can tell you that his reply was rude enough that I shouldn't have given him a second chance...but, I did. I replied back in as nice a way as possible, explaining how, what I asked, anyone new to the hobby might ask. And, he's ignored that message. Since I've never actually done business with him, I can't say anything to others...but, I will say the probability I'll be purchasing from him is "slim to none".

Steve & OSE, on the other hand...I am MORE than happy to direct my money in your direction. Other businesses could learn a LOT about what outstanding "customer service" truly is.

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[MADRCER]

Unfortunately, by experience with Chris, and dasboata, was the exact opposite. Unless requested by others, I will try to refrain from posting the actual PMs...but, in short, he has shown himself to be rude, arrogant, and lacking the decorum to provide good customer service. He may very well be a "professional" where making props is concerned (I can't claim to know, as he chose to be 'negative' towards me, when I inquired), but even Circuit City provided better costumer service. I contacted him about a prop for the SonicWake. He replied back, saying he had a prop, and quoted a price...and that was all he said. I messaged him back, asking for the missing info, as well as a few questions ANYONE new to the hobby might ask (part number, what metal, pitch, how to pay, etc)...and he purposely ignored it. 1-2 days later, I inquired about a reply, and that's when he responded back, with the rude & arrogant reply mentioned. As I said, I won't post specifics (unless requested by others), but I can tell you that his reply was rude enough that I shouldn't have given him a second chance...but, I did. I replied back in as nice a way as possible, explaining how, what I asked, anyone new to the hobby might ask. And, he's ignored that message. Since I've never actually done business with him, I can't say anything to others...but, I will say the probability I'll be purchasing from him is "slim to none". Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

So you are upset because Chris (BTW Chris is DASBOATA) didn't give you the specs on the prop he offered to sell you when you asked him for a good fast stable prop? Chris don't publicly put out the specs on some of his custom props and here a few reason's why he don't. #1. Because some were developed with my help for my boats and I may have asked him not to give the specs out publicly and for him to just sell them exclusively through dasboata.com under a specific name....#2 Sometimes it takes a lot of time and development to get a prop right for a particular boat and why would someone just give this hard work out for free for others to clone or purchase on their own from someone else or maybe just go and purchase a cnc prop with similar specs on a site like OSE? Prop work is what puts food on the table and pays his bills (aka his livelihood). #3. Imagine all the emails and PM's he gets from people just wanting info and NOT actually planning to buy a prop from him....Betcha it's a lot since proven custom prop guys aren't readily available and not to mention he's one of the best in the business. #4 You might find an overseas website or two that recommend a prop and tell the specs of it and also states "your boat will be the fastest with this prop" but you NEVER see a video of the prop running to backup what the site claims.....I'm not going to put the website on here but I'm sure you can find it if you search around. So why would he want to help his competitors make a dime off him and sell a prop he custom developed for himself or a customer... #5 Ever heard of KFC (Kentucky Fried Chicken)? Do you think people are mad and bash them on forums because they haven't given out the secret 11 herbs and spices of their chicken? Well if they did then they might go out of business, because they would be several more fried chicken restaurant's around selling their recipe that they worked hard and perfected. Anyways hope your cnc props work out for you on your sonicwake.

[Panther6834]

So you are upset because Chris (BTW Chris is DASBOATA) didn't give you the specs on the prop he offered to sell you when you asked him for a good fast stable prop?

Obviously, I know Chris & DASBOATA are one and the same...I clearly stated that. I never asked him to publish any info publicly...I asked about some incredibly basic info, and I asked him via PM. The closest I even got to sing specifics was the diameter & pitch...in other words, info that anyone would normally publicly publish. My other questions were asking nothing more than the metal type (brass, SS, or aluminum), and how I was supposed to order/pay. Now, if that's info that someone wants to hide, how do they expect to have customers? Purposely hiding that type of info would be akin to...say...an ESC manufacturer refusing to provide BEC info, or a servo manufacturer refusing to provide speed & torque into. Without providing that info, they can't sell anything, now can they?

I was also up front that I am new to RC FE, so, obviously, it's not as if I was attempting to collect info to make my own, or have someone else make them. As a matter of fact, even after his rude reply, in my reply, I even told him I was actually interested in 2 props. He didn't "lose" a customer...he "pushed" a customer away. I understand he's a friend of yours, and that's all good. I've asked for info, so as to help me learn, you have provided some of that info, and I truly am greatly appreciative for that. As for Chris, if he wants customers, there IS certain info that NEEDS to be given out. There's no need, or reason, to purposely avoid providing info such as the type of metal a particular order is made of, or the diameter/pitch...again, that's info topical found on any site selling the same type of product.

I'm not trying to put him down. More than a few people (yourself, included) have stated about the quality of his work, and I believe that, which is exactly why I turned to him for the props before every checking with anyone else. I was 100% intending to purchase from him, even after his reply. But, when he chose to purposely ignore my reply to his reply, that's why I made the decision to go elsewhere. In regards to outing me away, maybe he can reverse the 'damage' he's caused...but, doing so would require additional effort on his part.. effort I'm not certain he's willing to make. One thing anyone in a customer service-related business mega to always remember is, just as the word of excellent CS can travel to others, so can poor CS. Don't take this as any sort of threat...I promise it's not...but, in taking with other locals, of they've had problems, others do eventually find out. I'm not here to cause problems. Quite the opposite. I'm here to learn, to have fun, and, once I've Haines some knowledge, to help others. Lastly, I'm not "upset" at his actions...more like "irritated".

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[Panther6834]

Finally got her in the water for her "maiden voyages". For right now, the only batteries I have (for the boat) are 2 pair of PowerHobby 2S 5200mAh 50C, and 1 pair of Spektrum 2S 5000mAh 50C (which are packed away, but I'll try to find them today), but I do plan on getting more, & better, packs. I'm strongly considering some SMC 6200mAh packs, but, if anyone can suggest/recommend some others, that'd be fantastic.

Using the PowerHobby packs, she got up to 31.4mph on the first run, and 31.7mph on the second (both, obviously, on 4S). I don't know if that's good, bad, or average. Anyone who can, please, let me know, is greatly appreciate it. Granted, she's still stock...haven't installed the CNC-4514 prop (yet)...with the only 'upgrades' (installed by Steve prior to shipping) being the OSE dual-pickup rudder & OSE HD flex cable). I forgot to bring my temp gun with me, but everything (ESC, motor, & batteries) was only lightly warm, so I wasn't worried.

~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place [emoji1690]

[Capt'n Crash]

Happy to hear your finally on the water with your Sonicwake. Like I said in an earlier post 4s will get you a pleasure cruise. You'll notice a big difference in speed with 6s batteries.

I purchased 2x3s SMC Premium Spec 90c 5400 mAh batteries for mine and so far after running them all last summer they have held up just fine. I think they are offering a version 2 now which are supposed to be even better.
Other batteries I have used in my boats are Thunder Power and Gens Ace and they have all held up very well too. I don't know much about the newer graphene lipos but some members swear by them.

[Panther6834]

Happy to hear your finally on the water with your Sonicwake. Like I said in an earlier post 4s will get you a pleasure cruise. You'll notice a big difference in speed with 6s batteries.

I purchased 2x3s SMC Premium Spec 90c 5400 mAh batteries for mine and so far after running them all last summer they have held up just fine. I think they are offering a version 2 now which are supposed to be even better.

Other batteries I have used in my boats are Thunder Power and Gens Ace and they have all held up very well too. I don't know much about the newer graphene lipos but some members swear by them.

Thanks for the info...can definitely use it. I still plan on getting some more 2S packs...probably 6600mAh, but possibly 8000mAh (additionally weight is negligible, 303g for 6500mAh, 351g for 8000mAh, & 309g for the 5000mAh Graphene), but won't decide how many until I get the boat back in the water, this time with the 4514 prop. If it's a 'great' improvement, I might order more 2S than 3S packs...and, if it's only a 'moderate' improvement, I might order more 3S than 2S.

Looking over SMC's current 3S offerings (that aren't too low/high in mAh), they are:
1) True Spec DV 6500mAh 75C (120A, 455g)
2) True Spec DV w/G10 plates 7200mAh 75C (Amos not listed, 454g)
3) True Spec Premium V2 5000mAh 90C (97A, 330g)
4) True Spec Extreme Graphene V2 6400mAh 150C (Amps & weight not listed, dimensions also not listed)

The 'Premium' is what I run in my off-road race vehicles, and I typically avoid the 'Extreme' (no warranty). For the SonicWake, I was actually considering the 3S DV 6500mAh...slightly higher in capacity (longer runtime) than the 5000mAh packs, but considerable less than the 7200mAh & larger packs that would allow too much heat to be generated. I realize that the 6500mAh packs weight more than the 5000mAh packs (by 27.5%...330g vs 455g), but, with a power output increase of 50%, I would assume that the power-to-weight ratio should still keep the handling characteristics of the boat approx the same, without causing to much of a great increase. Also, since the boat would be moving faster, more water would be passed through the water lines, increasing the cooling efficiency, this countering the slight temp increase caused by the longer running time.

~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place [emoji1690]

[Panther6834]

Well...got the SonicWake in the water for her 3rd & 4th runs, this time on the CNC-4514 prop from OSE. On the first 2 runs (stock prop), if I remember correctly, she hit 31.3mph & 31.7mph. With the 4514 prop, I didn't quite break 35mph, but I did get closer - 33.7mph & 34.4mph (all runs still on 4S, with nothing else changed). Not sure if that's an average, above average, or below average improvement. Anyone who knows (stock vs 4514), can you let me know? Thinking the next thing I'll do is start adjusting the prop angle. Is down by 1mm a good start, or should I start with a greater, or lesser, adjustment?

~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place [emoji1690]

[Capt'n Crash]

Propping up to the CNC-4514 should give you a bit more speed on 4s but it might be too much prop on 6s.
I've seen several videos of guys getting good speed and stability running stock on 5s.
I would advise against trying to adjust the strut/prop angle as it's for all intents and purposes not adjustable on this boat unless you remove the stuffing tube and bend it by heating it up with a torch.

[Panther6834]

Propping up to the CNC-4514 should give you a bit more speed on 4s but it might be too much prop on 6s.
I've seen several videos of guys getting good speed and stability running stock on 5s.
I would advise against trying to adjust the strut/prop angle as it's for all intents and purposes not adjustable on this boat unless you remove the stuffing tube and bend it by heating it up with a torch.

Thanks for the info on the prop/speed, as well as the heads-up on adjusting the strut. I thought I had read in someone's thread (can't remember if it was in the OSE, or RC Groups, forum) that they were starting to "play around" with adjusting the angle, which is why I thought it was adjustable....if it is, great, and if it isn't, that's ok, too. I'll take a look after my wife wakes up (during remodeling, the bed is my (temporary) "workshop"). After all, the SonicWake is my first boat, I'm a 'baby' in the FE world, and I'm still "crawling". The 'good' news is, I'm definitely learning...not only how to "handle" an FE, but also in understanding about various FE parts, such as the props.

Speaking of which - I'm running the 4514 for now (I never measured the stock prop, but I know it's smaller...probably 43mm dia.), and I'm wondering something. On 4S, would the SonicWake still handle well running a 4515, or (maybe even) a 4516? Although I still haven't installed them (yet), I do have the adjustable trim tabs from Boat Bitz. I'm assuming, if I were to go with a higher pitch, the adjustable trim tabs (by lowering them by maybe 1mm?) should help to stabilize the boat, right? I'd really appreciate some 'insight' on 1.4 vs 1.5 vs 1.6 pitch, at least in regards to the SonicWake (primarily on 4S, but also on 6S (see below)).

Moving up to the 6S questions, first, would a 42mm be the best starting point (on the SonicWake, obviously)? Or, would that be "overkill", meaning I should start with a 40mm? Second, on the pitch, should I stick with 1.4? Or, would it be 'safe' (ie. will the boat still be stable) to go with a 1.5? Remember, again, that I'll be installing the adjustable trim tabs. I'm assuming...and, probably, correctly so...that a 1.6 on 6S, in the SonicWake, would spell "virtually-guaranteed disaster", thus I won't inquire on that PROPosition.

Last question(s)...at least for this post...and, they're in regards to CNC vs balanced & sharpened props, and specific to the SonicWake. For more powerful boats (ie. racing), I'm going to make an uneducated assumption that balanced & sharpened props are, essentially, the "only way to go". However, for something such as the SonicWake, where do things stand? For 4S, I'll probably stick with CNC, as it's more about enjoying myself (and getting away from the wife for a couple/few hours). But, for 6S, are balanced & sharpened props truly a better way to go? Or, should I just stick with CNC props? While part of why I'm asking is due to cost (balanced & sharpened costs 2.5-3x the price of CNC), I'm also asking because I truly want to understand (not just "know", but "understand") the advantages & disadvantages of each...especially in comparison to each other.

When it comes time to get my second FE (I'm 95% it'll be a TFL Pursuit), I'm fairly certain I'll be going with balanced & sharpened...but, even with that boat, I'm uncertain, at least until I truly understand each type. It doesn't matter (much), yet, as that's a 'question' for another day, in a different thread (although, I am already researching the different Pursuit variants/options).

~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place [emoji1690]

[Capt'n Crash]

The stock prop is 44mm 1.6 pitch whereas the 4514 is very similar to the stock prop but 45mm with 2.52 pitch. For comparison I'm happy with a 42mm 1.3 pitch prop on 6s. The larger diameter higher pitch 4515 prop you are using is probably fine for 4s although I don't usually use CNC props so I'm not overly familiar with them other than they don't generally require much if anything in the way of sharpening and balancing. In theory a higher pitch prop will move the boat farther along than a lower pitch prop given the same rpm.

Most of my props are stainless steel or a beryllium alloy which can be very toxic to work on so I prefer to let a professional do the work of balancing and sharpening. Stainless steel props like Doctorprops are safe to work on but are very difficult to modify. They are generally stronger than the material CNC props are made of as well so they don't break or bend as eisily. I also prefer a prop with some tongue as opposed to one that has been detongued for the Sonicwake as it helps the boat get on plane faster with less initial cavitation.

At some point down the road if you start doing the prop work yourself you will come to understand how much time effort and knowledge it takes to do it properly and safely. IMHO a properly race prepped prop done by a pro is the only way to go and if done properly well worth the additional cost.

The TFL Pursuit would be an excellent choice for a next boat.

Hope this helps.

[Panther6834]

The stock prop is 42mm 1.6 pitch whereas the 4514 is very similar to the stock prop but 45mm with 2.52 pitch. For comparison I'm happy with a 42mm 1.3 pitch prop on 6s. The larger diameter higher pitch 4515 prop you are using is probably fine for 4s although I don't usually use CNC props so I'm not overly familiar with them other than they don't generally require much if anything in the way of sharpening and balancing. In theory a higher pitch prop will move the boat farther along than a lower pitch prop given the same rpm.

Most of my props are stainless steel or a beryllium alloy which can be very toxic to work on so I prefer to let a professional do the work of balancing and sharpening. Stainless steel props like Doctorprops are safe to work on but are very difficult to modify. They are generally stronger than the material CNC props are made of as well so they don't break or bend as eisily. I also prefer a prop with some tongue as opposed to one that has been detongued for the Sonicwake as it helps the boat get on plane faster with less initial cavitation.

At some point down the road if you start doing the prop work yourself you will come to understand how much time effort and knowledge it takes to do it properly and safely. IMHO a properly race prepped prop done by a pro is the only way to go and if done properly well worth the additional cost.

The TFL Pursuit would be an excellent choice for a next boat.

Hope this helps.

Thanks...and, yes, it helps...it REALLY helps. When I start going the balanced & sharpened route (be it in 3 days, or 3 months), I don't plan on doing the sharpening/balancing myself. I don't really have the time, or patience...plus, as a professional chauffeur, once work picks back up, I'll have even less 'available' time. As for the material of most CNC props, I get what you're saying. For 4S, I'm guessing 4515 should still be ok...maybe even 4516 (or 4416, if there's such a size)? On 4S, I'd like her a lil faster, but don't want to cause instability.

Regarding 6S, and SS vs beryllium alloys (such as the commonly-used beryllium copper, & beryllium-copper-titanium), how does strength & weight play into things? I can see "stronger" being a good thing, but guessing too much weight would be 'bad'. I wouldn't want something 'weak' (such as an aluminum CNC prop, especially if it's 6061...though, 7075 is stronger). I don't mind paying more for quality products...but, if quality & longevity aren't at least 3x greater than a 7075 CNC prop (based on the balanced & sharpened props costing 2.5-3x the price), I'm not entirely certain I can justify the cost for SonicWake props (again, for the Pursuit, definitely balanced & sharpened). In "best bang for the buck" terms, I'd say it's 60-40 preference to the 'best bang' side...but, the 'for the buck' side does still matter, just to a slightly lesser extent.

I've been looking over the balanced & sharpened props Steve carries - Octura, GrimRacer, & Prather. From what I can tell, the Prather props are all SS, the GrimRacer props appear to be a beryllium alloy of copper & titanium, and the Octura props are a beryllium alloy of unknown composition. In order of quality & strength, how would you place these three? Also, in order of weight (lowest to highest), how do these place? Obviously, I'm learning about diameter & pitch...but, at the same time, I'm having difficulty finding info (at least for these three) on quality, strength, weight, & expected longevity. Any info you, or anyone else, can provide on these points should help me in narrowing down my final choices.

~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place [emoji1690]

[Capt'n Crash]

I have ordered almost all of my sharpened and balanced props from Steve and they have all been excellent in terms of the quality of workmanship. They are not only balanced and sharpened but thinned. Then to top it off the blades are given a very fine texture to disrupt the flow of water over them. Octura and GrimRacer props all need a lot of work to be balanced and sharpened properly unless you order the ones that come balanced and sharpened. I would say Octura and Prather props are the most commonly used and the difference in weight between them is negligible. As far as I know GrimRacer props are mainly used on Aquacraft boats so not quite as common but good quality. If you don't hit anything they will all last a very very long time.

As far as I know the stainless steel props are the strongest but also the most difficult to modify. Doctorprops makes some of the best of this type on the market but shipping from the Ukraine takes several weeks.

If you're not racing competitively or trying to set a world speed record then CNC props are probably the most cost effective for you while you experiment with different setups.