leopard 4092 1480kv problem

[kfxguy]

1) like stated, the seaking 180's have issues with the Lvc kicking in prematurely. If your worried about running the packs too low then the ose store sells a add on lipo cutoff.

2) for the life of me I cannot figure out why people waste money on leopard motors when a tp power motor is twice as good for the same price. Not trying to dog leopard but tp in my experience has faired much better for the same money. Just my .02

[MadProps]

1)

like stated, the seaking 180's have issues with the Lvc kicking in prematurely. If your worried about running the packs too low then the ose store sells a add on lipo cutoff.

not my batteries....Im using 6 sets of batteries to test
nothing gets hot whatsoever
I bought the seaking 180 as it too is one of those that the majority seem to be using and recommending when searching for upgrade info and I saw no mention of this issue of premature cutout or I would not have made the purchase
so I will continue as you suggest to run without the esc Low voltage cutoff and rely on my own low voltage alarms

2) for the life of me I cannot figure out why people waste money on leopard motors when a tp power motor is twice as good for the same price. Not trying to dog leopard but tp in my experience has faired much better for the same money. Just my .02

as a newbie reading everything on every site to upgrade new boats .....I can tell you that the majority of people are recommending these leopard motors...so us newbs feel everyone else already has experience and we rarely hear people make statements like you did....
same thing applies to the goofy offset rudder bracket that bleeds off speed and sprays water 2 ft in the air till the hull gets up on the pad....read far far too many posts that the offset rudder is better for turning...I didnt feel enough improvement personally to deal with the obvious negatives it produces so it is coming off today

....whats a tp motor...and whats the best esc's on the market...I dont care about the cost ...buying inferior products cost more in the long run...
edit: in all fairness most of my info for upgrades came from another site till I found this forum and I appreciate the knowledge and lack of attitude here

[CraigP]

TP is another motor manufacturer. I run Leopad motors and haven't had issues. I provide the proper water cooling, and do not take the motor over its recommended volts and wattage. It will not handle "being pushed". There are other motors that can push the line much more than a Leopard. Racers like to push lines, that's what they do! Sport boating, not so much. You want a consistent, enjoyable experience. I think you are getting opinions here from both sides of the sport. If you want to race, then get a better motor than Leopard. If you sport boat and like your boat the way it is and have no issues, then you're good!

[CraigP]

One other thing about motors. You have to make sure your running the right voltage. OSE parts site is horrible at putting all the motor specs in the part description! TP makes motors from 16-45V, so putting too much volts on them is a critical mistake. You have to research the motor and get the FULL specs. TP has a site that can give you all the specs.

[MadProps]

I think you are getting opinions here from both sides of the sport. If you want to race, then get a better motor than Leopard. If you sport boat and like your boat the way it is and have no issues, then you're good!

that may very well be a valid point

[CraigP]

A good rule of thumb is the lower kv motors are generally higher voltage, and the higher kv ones are lower voltage. But you still have to check!

[MadProps]

A good rule of thumb is the lower kv motors are generally higher voltage, and the higher kv ones are lower voltage. But you still have to check!

you have been a great help...thanks

[Fluid]

theres realy not much to a brushless motor other than its windings / magnets and bearings so if the motor feels ok to turn by hand it should be ok, the esc is the main commander that works the brushless motor not like the older type brushed motors that mainly relied on battery power to supply rpms, this is why you can,t connect the brushless direct to a battery for power as opposed to a brushed that you can connect battery power and go. i would be trying this motor out with no shaft connected and hold 50% power on for a couple of minutes and see if the mount end of motor gets warm / hot plus any cut outs. as mentioned if you have longer than suitable bolts going into the motor face housing this could be causing an arc of current which will give all sorts of issues. i had this issue with an aero brushless motor where the bolt mountings were too long and just touching the internal windings, the motor was getting warm to hot very quick plus it was cutting out for no reason other than what i just mentioned. check the bolts to be sure.

I am sorry, but there is too much bad information in this post to let it go. I would not want newer boaters to destroy equipment following bad advice.

- there is a lot more to a brushless motor than wire, magnets and bearings. Quality is a huge factor, cheap wire can short out, cheap magnets can demagnetized, cheap bearings can come apart. You cannot tell motor quality or condition by simply turning the shaft.

- running an electric motor without a load for "a couple minutes" will heat up any motor, good or bad. Without load all the electrical energy turns into heat. It tells you nothing and risks motor damage, don't do it.

- the comment about long mounting bolts causing damage is absolutely true, and this happens more often than many believe. Newer boaters may not think about this, with a ruined motor the result.

- the battery voltage still 'supplies the rpms' just as it did for brushed motors. The BL controller just turns that voltage on and off enough to control those rpm. Both the motor and the ESC are a team, if out is out of wack then the team fails.

New boaters come here for advice, as the OP did. We all have to be careful about what we read and the source it comes from. Most posters here are trying to be helpful, but sometimes the information is wrong. No different here than it is anywhere else on the Internet.


To the OP: in spite of its popularity, many T-180s/SK-180s had problems with the LVC. It was easy to fix, just disable the LVC and time your runs. Your evidence points to this as a the most probable cause.


.

[CraigP]

There isn't a lot of difference, in terms of winding, magnetic and bearing quality between high end brushed and brushless. The commutator on the brushed motor provided the electrical sequence switching, where the ESC provides it electronically. But there are power limitations that you can run on a commutator, thus the reason BLDC motors are superior in power capability. I remember some early high performance brushed motors. All sorts of tricks, stronger magnets and tricky slots cut in the rotor to reduce eddy currents, a source of power/heat loss. We've come a long way baby! Fluid your right, we need to keep info factual...

[rol243]

i really dont feel i gave any bad info about these motors atall. lets say the running of a motor at 50 percent not full 100 percent or at very low rpms is rather safe , this is why i did make the mention of run testing at 50 percent. another mention of turning the motor shaft was for testing any binding of internal componants such as a seized bearing or a collapsed / dropped magnet. this is all correct info and certainly would not mislead any new or old r/c modeler.

[MadProps]

i really dont feel i gave any bad info about these motors atall. lets say the running of a motor at 50 percent not full 100 percent or at very low rpms is rather safe , this is why i did make the mention of run testing at 50 percent. another mention of turning the motor shaft was for testing any binding of internal componants such as a seized bearing or a collapsed / dropped magnet. this is all correct info and certainly would not mislead any new or old r/c modeler.

I do not read it as he was speaking directly about you, your advice was good, I am a step by step tester aswell,
thanks

[MadProps]

update to boater guy, the OP's issue
yesterday I turned off the ESC low voltage cutoff and still had the same issue....

today I set the seaking 180A ESC low voltage to 2.8 and it runs on 4s no cut outs as we were both experiencing.....I dont know if my esc isnt turning off, or if I failed to save the change I made...but all is now well with esc voltage cutout set to 2.8volts....

I always run those cheapo $4 low voltage alarms one on each battery because the beeping is audible and I set the alarm to 3.6volts because the alarms really go off at 3.7 volts....so I recall....neither of the alarms ever have gone off when the motor cuts out like we are experiencing and the ESC safety cut out was set to 3.2volts....
so clearly the seaking voltage is far more sensitive as reported above great call man! cheers

set your esc cutoff to 2.8v or off as instructed above you may also see the issue go away

edit: tomorrow I will run the batteries down till the esc actually cuts out and take a voltage reading to confirm how far off the sensitivity really is

[MadProps]

ran the boat today on 4S till the LV alarms went off and kept going till the ESC LVC shut me down
voltage was set to shut down at 2.8v but actually shut down at 3.4v

so I now see that when I had the esc set to 3.2v lvc it actually was shutting down around 3.8-3.9v on saw runs

[CraigP]

Yes! I've had it hit off on me too. My data logger is showing that there is significant volt drop under hard acceleration. I'm doing the same thing. I'm going to bring the boat in if lvc goes off under acceleration. Going to use 2.8V too. A timer is good if you have a handle on your average running amps... I'm going to start to use both. If the timer goes off first, I bring it in. If lvc, I bring it in.

[MadProps]

I am using a timer and lv alarms,
I can also tell you this ....the leopard draws more amps, I didnt experience this till the top end of a 6s saw run prior with the genesis stock sss motor
this issue began when I installed the Leopard motor