Motor/ESC/Battery Combination for 46" Mono (WH Enforcer) - Thoughts???

[Pennstater]

I recently picked up a 46" Warehouse Hobbies Enforcer from another member here. It had been converted to FE but I didn't buy it with the motor or the ESC. The original owner provided details on what he ran in it, but indicated it was a bit overkill for the hull.

With that said, I started running some numbers with components I am more familiar with (and can afford). I used the FE Boar Calculator at http://www.radiocontrolinfo.com/rci-fe-boat-calc/ and came up with the following (I was targeting mid-40 MPH, low current, high voltage (8S2P - 4, 5000mah 4S packs - a pair each wired in parallel (to get 10,000mah) and then those pairs wired in series (to get 29.6v)) components...

FE_Capture.JPG

I'm looking for thoughts on this combination as well as if there might be better combinations that say produce longer run times, lower current, increase speed (just a bit), etc. The boat already has a surface drive, trim tabs, turn fins, stuffing tub, 1/4 scale servo, rudder, and water pickups.

Thank you for your time.

[Fluid]

There is little to be done to increase the efficiency of the setup. A better motor (Castle 2028) would increase the efficiency a little, but nothing dramatic. Faster speed and longer run time don't go together unless you run higher capacity packs. With what you propose, a larger prop will speed things up, usually at the expense of run time. A smaller prop will increase run time but be slower.

Running 10S with a lower-Kv motor can give longer run times at the same power level, or higher speeds with the same run time. Again, it depends on how you prop it.

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[Pennstater]

Thanks for the reply Fluid. I'll keep playing with the numbers. I was thinking of staying with 8S as I already have some 4S packs. The thought of buying four 5S packs is a bit daunting due to the initial cost (but I do like going to 10S from a runtime perspective (with other adjustments of course)).

I primarily wanted to make sure that my initial configuration wasn't way off - models can only provide an idea of performance; real life experience is the gold standard. Anyone with experience running these bigger boats, please chime in. Thanks!!!

[iridebikes247]

The motor you've picked is pretty good. As Fluid said a better motor like the 2028 Extreme would help a little bit but, I've run the 5692 730kv on 12s in a mystic 138 a few years back.

If shooting for 40 mph then the 8s setup should be fine, you can always buy 2 6s packs down the road to pair with your 4s for 10s runs. I'd pickup an Octura 457 first, OSE sells sharpened and balanced Octuras. My only rec. is a stronger esc. I think you would be way better off with a swordfish 240. I have had swordfish 240s/300s for 3+ years and they're still running strong.

[Todd Fleury]

that esc will for sure produce smoke if you plan to run that. There is no way a Seaking 130A will be able to handle the amps.

[Fluid]

Actually if all he is looking for is 40 mph the SK-130HV should handle it okay. That is almost 4000 watts (over 5 horsepower) after all. But I would prefer at least 180 amps for some headroom, the OP may decide that 40 mph isn't fast enough.

I ran my Titan mono on 8S1P/5000 with a low Kv motor, did mid/high 40s pulling 55 amps. The OP's boat is much larger, but you don't need massive amps to go 40 mph.

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[Lone-Wolf]

Last winter I electrified my 46" Enforcer hull and I was very happy with how it turned out. I went with a TP5670 720Kv motor and a Swordfish 300 esc powering a 3 blade X457. On 10S2P my best speed was right at 60mph, 12S2P I hit 70mph!!...at one point I did a speed run with 14S2P and hit 75mph and she blew off the water...I of course do not recommend running 14S ;-) Never GPS'd 8S2P but I would estimate a solid 50mph, in that big hull you could probably even do 8S4P for tons of runtime. Originally I just wanted to see it plane and get over 40mph so again I was really pleased with results. Heat is not an issue on any cell count and runtimes are about 6 minutes. Hope this helps and good luck, looking forward to seeing how she goes when complete.

[Pennstater]

Thanks all for the replies. These are definitely great things to consider. Love the R/C hobby... figuring things out and soliciting opinions.

@Lone-wolf: thanks for adding your real world experience with this hull.

I like to stick with high voltage, low amp setups... easier on the electronics (IMHO). I'll look into the Swordfish ESCs; I was hoping to stick with SeaKing as I already have one in my 40" on 8s1p and I already have the programming box.

All of these questions can be answered... no problem there. My biggest issue... lack of hobby funds. It may be a while before this boat sees the water, but until then, please keep the suggestions and real world experiences coming. Thanks again all.

[Pennstater]

On the swap shop, someone is selling a Toro Beast x528 780Kv motor with motor mount for 5" rails for a decent price (also includes the water cooling jacket - $150). I researched this motor a bit and was wondering how it would compare to a Castle 2028 (extreme) or a Leopard 5692 (or a 56110)? Specs for the x528 are max in 39v, max in 193a, max 30k rpm, 780Kv, 56mm dia., 112mm Len. (I got these off the net). Remember, I am not looking to set speed records. I think the x528 would be good for 10s max with the max in voltage of 39v. The x528/motor mount/cooling jacket I think is a good buy cost wise. A motor mount by itself is about $50-$60 and a water jacket is probably another $20. I just have questions about the x528 (I have read some decent reviews but most people say there is something better (like the 2028 or a Lehner or a Neu) but I think these folks are looking for max speed). Thoughts???

[Pennstater]

Any thoughts on the Toro Beast x528? Would likely run 10s2p max. Consider $150 for motor/mount/cooling jacket versus $150-$200 for a Castle Extreme (a little less for a Leopard), $60 for a mount here on OSE, and about $20 or so for a cooling jacket ($230-$280 total).

[Fluid]

I have no experience with that motor, but it is reasonably close to the Castle's specs. But many Chinese motors' spec sheets have little to do with reality. This motor can be bought new for $170. It may be a great motor/jacket/mount combo, or it may be very inefficient or poorly built. All I can say is that the Castle motor is a proven high performer. Others may have actual experience.


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[Pennstater]

It's been a while so I thought I would post an update. Not much has happened to the boat itself as I am still in the parts acquisition phase. I picked up a Swordfish 240+ from Steve V late last year. And just a few days ago I purchased a 2028 Extreme (it should be here today). I still need the motor mount, cooling "can", and some more batteries (and electrical wire/connectors) before getting anything in the boat.

It looks like the Zippy 5000mah 40C 4S packs I purchased back in October last year are no longer available; they are now 45C (and I can't find 6S 40C's either). I know it's not advisable to mix packs with different C ratings, so I'm not sure what to do. To be able to run xS2P anything starts getting expensive. Thoughts?

Does anyone have experience with Turnigy's "Graphene" lipo's?

Thanks

[Fluid]

If you are willing to sacrifice some speed and run time you could run 1P, preferably with the highest capacity cells you can afford. 5000 mAh minimum, 6000+ mAh would be better. Most of my 6s and 10S race boats run 1P with 6000 or 6500 mAh packs, but then I only need less than three minutes of run time.

No personal experience with those Turnigy packs.

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[Pennstater]

Thanks Fluid. I'd sacrifice some speed for longer run times. I mostly "bash" so it's usually just me running alone. I also run in salt water so I'd rather have the run time to offset the tear down and clean time (cleaning these model boats reminds me of all the time I used to spend cleaning full size boats after a day on the water).

Any recommendations on the C rating? The 2028 Extreme is 800kv. The boat came with an x452 prop (not sure if that is a "good" size only that the previous owner ran with it (unsure of motor, but similar cell count/configuration)). Looking to run 8S2P or 10S2P. 40C to 50C sounds about right.

[Fluid]

I'd suggest 40C minimum. With a speed requirement of ~40 mph, running 8S may be the best compromise. The x452 is on the small side for that hull but it may work even though efficiency will be relatively low.

I can't estimate the run time because I don't know what the amp draw will be. So much depends on how the particular hull behaves at speed and how it is driven. Assuming an average of 100 amps, safe run time with 5000 mAh 1P packs will be around 2.5 minutes at full throttle. 6500 mAh packs will give over three minutes, while a 10,000 mAh 2P setup will be around five.



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