DF36 cuts out at distance?????

[kevinpratt823]

My DF 36" Explorer cuts out at both ends of the 200yd loop I run at the pond. The thing is, my UL-1 for example, with it's antennas inside the hull, has no issues at all(same tx), niether did my Stiletto. I even took the rx out of the UL-1 and put it in the DF36 and it still cut out. The antenna comes up through the hull a good 8".I have a Castle Hydra Ice 240/6s,traxxas waterproof servo, Spektrum MR200, DX3c, and I'm using the internal BEC, set at 6.0v. I have tried running it with a cap plugged into the rx as well, I am going to try an external BEC, or maybe even a seperate rx pack, could this be the weak link? The internal BEC is supposed to be good for 5 amps.
The ESC is in front of the Leo 4082/1600kv motor, so the wire runs right along next to it to the rx in the back, possibly interference?

LVC is at 3v/cell, and data logging shows nothing out of the ordinary. This happens right off the bat with fully charged packs and low temps also, and I tried running the same distance to a turn right in front of me with no problems. TX batts were also replaced, to no avail.

[BHChieftain]

To clarify-- once it cuts out, if you reduce the distance does everyting work ok again?
Note that the layout inside of the hull can have an impact on range. I read an article somewhere a long time ago that talked about what types of layout conditions to avoid-- I forget the specifics but it had things like ensuring the power wires did not cross over the RX wires, and to try to keep the RX and antenna as far away from the ESC as possible.

Also, is your DF36 a carbon fiber hull? That could make a big difference as well. The MR200 (and MR3000) has 2 antenna leads-- they should be placed perpendicular to each other. Usually one goes up thru the antenna tube outside the hull, and the other is taped along the top of the hull on the inside, but if the hull is CF it kills the inside lead. I have a shovelnose hydro with a CF hull with an MR200 and I run one of the leads taped down flat agains the hull on the outside instead of the inside.

Chief

[kevinpratt823]

To clarify-- once it cuts out, if you reduce the distance does everyting work ok again?
Note that the layout inside of the hull can have an impact on range. I read an article somewhere a long time ago that talked about what types of layout conditions to avoid-- I forget the specifics but it had things like ensuring the power wires did not cross over the RX wires, and to try to keep the RX and antenna as far away from the ESC as possible.

Also, is your DF36 a carbon fiber hull? That could make a big difference as well. The MR200 (and MR3000) has 2 antenna leads-- they should be placed perpendicular to each other. Usually one goes up thru the antenna tube outside the hull, and the other is taped along the top of the hull on the inside, but if the hull is CF it kills the inside lead. I have a shovelnose hydro with a CF hull with an MR200 and I run one of the leads taped down flat agains the hull on the outside instead of the inside.

Chief

It's hard to tell, Chief, as it cuts out very intermittently, kind of like a stutter, bumping the motor on and off through the turn area. It doesn't really just stop until I walk over closer, you know? The Rx is as far as possible from esc, no carbon fiber. The esc sits directly in front of the motor, and he wire runs along side the motor to the back, I'll post a pic later. I soldered on a 10amp Castle BEC at the esc, hopefully I'll get a chance to try that later. I will also try taping the short antenna in the hull, it was just laying there. Thanks for the reply, I'll update when I find out a bit more. The pond has appeared to have dead spots in those 2 areas at times, but right now I'm only experiencing it with this boat..........

[ray schrauwen]

Does the rx wire of esc have a ferrite choke on it? They are cheap and may help.

A layout pic will be nice to see.

[kevinpratt823]

Does the rx wire of esc have a ferrite choke on it? They are cheap and may help.

A layout pic will be nice to see.

It has the choke(donut?) right at the esc. I'll post a pic tonight, guys are all here running cars on my track:)

[kevinpratt823]

SAM_0095.jpg
Here is the layout, after I added the BEC, and put mu rx in a balloon and slipped it into the floatation in the back left, previously it was on the velcro right next to where it is now. The long antenna exits up just outside the pic, in the center, the donut for the esc/rx wire is right at the esc, under where the motor wires pass over. If I spin the esc around, I would want to shorten the motor wires, and also would have to relocate the antenna.

[ray schrauwen]

Why don't you try a short run with the internal Castle BEC?

Aside from that, what BEC is it? It's wires look all aver the place and your BEC may be the source of the problem. Can you twist all the BEC wires together? Not input with output, just twist the + & - of each side together and possibly add a ferrite ring/choke to the BEC output wire also.

[kevinpratt823]

Why don't you try a short run with the internal Castle BEC?

Aside from that, what BEC is it? It's wires look all aver the place and your BEC may be the source of the problem. Can you twist all the BEC wires together? Not input with output, just twist the + & - of each side together and possibly add a ferrite ring/choke to the BEC output wire also.

It is a castle 10amp BEC. I just added it yesterday to see if it helps with this problem, so it was kind of a quick install, I haven't even had a chance to try it yet this way. You're right though, if I leave it in, I will neaten it up, but I'm not sure a choke would do much being it's not a signal wire, just a 6v supply.

I had been running entirely off the internal BEC when the problems were occurring, so I figured I'd give this a shot. If nothing else, at least it'll take a couple amps off the 200amp load the esc is carrying.

[Fluid]

There is nothing obvious with your install which would cause the range issue, let's try the more likely causes. Put fresh batteries in your transmitter to eliminate that cause. Try another receiver to eliminate that cause. Lastly, re-set the ESC/BEC voltage to 5.5 volts. I remember reading once of an issue with receiver power brownouts when setting the BEC output too high.



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[egneg]

The MR200 has known problems and Spectrum came out with a booster that goes between the RX and power source to solve this problem. It was a couple of years ago when Doug Smock and Paul were at a D12 race and were using the MR200 with little success and after the race they posted about it and Darin Jordan said they needed to get this booster.

http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SPMCP

[kevinpratt823]

There is nothing obvious with your install which would cause the range issue, let's try the more likely causes. Put fresh batteries in your transmitter to eliminate that cause. Try another receiver to eliminate that cause. Lastly, re-set the ESC/BEC voltage to 5.5 volts. I remember reading once of an issue with receiver power brownouts when setting the BEC output too high.

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I have tried the likely causes(post #1), new tx batts, even the rx from my UL-1(which works fine in that boat), I will play with BEC voltages and see if it helps.........
Never seen that spektrum booster, but it sounds like it INCREASES the voltage. I know Spektrums had a hard time with brownouts when combined with some Savox servos in the cars, and required you to run a BEC.......but I think those servos draw a lot more.

[Fluid]

I run the internal BEC in my ICE200LV with a Spektrum MR-3000 without problems, BEC voltage set at 5.5 volts powering a digital rudder servo. Does the logging say it is a loss of signal to the receiver? What is the error message?




.

[kevinpratt823]

[QUOTE=Fluid;465268]I run the internal BEC in my ICE200LV with a Spektrum MR-3000 without problems, BEC voltage set at 5.5 volts powering a digital rudder servo. Does the logging say it is a loss of signal to the receiver? What is the error message?

No error messages in the logging, Fluid(and thanks for your attention to my issue), perhaps it's not a signal issue? Just ran 2 sets of packs, with external BEC, same issues. I am beginning to wonder if I have a bad esc or something....... not sure what else to make of it. My ext BEC was set at 6.2v, I guess maybe I'll try 5.5, and maybe some other things tomorrow. Nap time soon, then off to work for the night

This ESC was just sent to me as a replacement of one I had that stopped responding in another boat, It appeared to be brand new..........

[egneg]

For 10 bucks I would try the booster.

[kevinpratt823]

For 10 bucks I would try the booster.

I intend to, thanks for he heads up, and the link. I'll get it for all 5 of my MR200 most likely, now I have to find who sells them so I can get 'em quick.........

edit:just ordered 2 from an ebay store I deal with for car stuff a lot.