Mbcofnsw " a outboard sport "

[rcboatmanwithkids2880]

Hi Guy's ,

Currently i am putting together an Outboard Tunnel , to be set up with " EA SPORT " racing specifications with the MBCOFNSW.COM . Just wondering if anybody knows of motors etc that are legal in that that class & any other requirements ??

Currently i have a Feigao 8xl & Octura X642 & T120 ESC sitting on the back of my tunnel boat , & wondering if this set up is legal ....


All the best in F/E boating ,

Brad

[obrien]

looks like that would be a nitro class. If they have rules like NAMBA does here, then that would be a stock .21 nitro class or a stock appearing .21 class. Your motor should be faster than a stock 21, but I am not sure if that esc will handle it. I can't remeber what the KV rating is for that motor. What size hull are you using?

[rcboatmanwithkids2880]

looks like that would be a nitro class. If they have rules like NAMBA does here, then that would be a stock .21 nitro class or a stock appearing .21 class. Your motor should be faster than a stock 21, but I am not sure if that esc will handle it. I can't remeber what the KV rating is for that motor. What size hull are you using?

Hi Obrien ,

No , we race under the Australian Model Powerboat Association " AMPBA " rules . The boat i am preparing is 32" electric 4S not nitro , would like to hear from a forum member that is also a MBCOFNSW member .

Brad

[nobbiworld]

Brad, The only limit under the EA rules is the Battery. Must be 4s1p and weight under 600grams. The motor you use is up to you. There is no special outboard class, you will run up against inboard cats as well. The 1515 1y neu is a popular motor. Steve AMPBA284

[Scott T]

Brad, have you posted this on the AMPBA or International Waters forums? Might get a response from a MBCofNSW member there. It sounds like a club modification of the EA rules.

Cheers,
Scott

[rcboatmanwithkids2880]

Hi Guy's ,

Thanks for the response , just thought there would be as many Ozzy's that have knowledge of the class that are forum members . As there is an " EA " & " EA Sport " class for outboard powered tunnels with MBCOFNSW , was thinking that " Sport " meant that a generic motor such as Feigao could only be used . At the moment i am living in Broken Hill far western N.S.W over 1,200 k's from MBCOFNSW base in Sydney so i am just using a local lake at the moment & trying to build using class specs ...

All the best in F/E R/C Boating ,

Brad

[shannon87]

hi brad i currently attend the events there in penrith i have only seen one guy that has electric they all run nitro tunnels and gas boats it would be nice to see someone shake up the nitro boys but as scott stated you may be better to send ann email to one of the guys on their website just be warned they can be a little unfriendly to a new guy at times i wish i coul,d help you more but im still a little new myself and the guy that runs the electrics uses only those neu motors if thats any help hope it all works out for ya

[rcboatmanwithkids2880]

Hi Shannon ,

If there is a level of elitism within a club , sport , hobby interest becomes less attractive to somebody keen on being involved with a pursuit & member base will decline over time . It would be in their interest if such body considered developing their club with an avenue for those who want to stay at a novice level due to financial & or time ( family ) constraints ....

Sorry to hear about the state of MBCOFNSW Shannon ,

All the best in F/E R/C Boating ,

Brad

[JCAustralia]

Try speaking to Brian at:

http://www.xcellproducts.com.au/index.html

He is a great guy and may be President or Treasury of the club, can't remember. He also own a hobby shop which is a big plus.

Cheers

JC

[rc_hydro]

Hi,
I'm the VP of the MBCofNSW. Any talk of us being nitro / gas only is a load of BS. In fact we were one of the first AMPBA clubs to adapt FE into our major race meetings. We have plenty of FE boats in our club - it's a matter of whether they actually turn up to race meetings. It's hard to race them if only 1 turns up, but we still accomodate them somehow if they wish to run. I'm not sure who Shannon87 is refering to, but the majority of our members are keen to help out new members. If you have questions, ask around - get a few points of contact and you are bound to be pointed in the right direction.

Now to your questions;

EA sport refers to 4S Sport hydroplanes and is not a control class - that is realistic looking hydro's that are not outriggers governed by the rules for EA - it's all in the AMPBA rule book. Nue motors are very common.

A O/B "sport" is "stock" 3.5cc O/B's - a nitro class. The MBCof NSW has a lot of O/B tunnels that turn up to race often, and this season we have had enough to race "Stock" and "mod" separately.

Our current AMPBA rule book does not differentiate O/B tunnels from inboards in FE.

P Spec O/B Tunnel. Now this is not an official AMPBA class, but several clubs have adopted it at club level. It's basically a control class using Aquacraft and Blackjack motors on 4S powered O/B tunnels - typically converted ex-nitro boats. The idea to keep it cheap and fun, by using motors that are kind on ESC's and Batteries. We raced it at the Carribean Masters in Melbourne and the Winter Spec in Sydney last year and it's close, fun racing. Basically we are sticking with an unwritten rule amongst some of the active AMPBA members around the country interested in making this O/B class by using "production Spec" motors - in other words Aquacraft UL-1 and SV27 motors or the Proboat motors that are cheap and kinder on budget ESC's. I'd be happy with you running a feigao if you already owned it and weren't much faster as a result of it, as would anybody else. We'd prefer you use the same motors as the rest, but when a class is in it's infancy it would seem silly to exclude on that basis. The Aquacraft UL-1 motor is probably the most common. Grimracer 42x55 prop seems to be the most common prop. 4s 5000mah cheapy packs are common.

The MBCofNSW are actively trying to encourage P-Spec O/B tunnel but it is early days. The club president also has one ready to race. Mine is close to completion and I know of some others in the build too. If you have any q's, feel free to contact me.

Also, there are several AMPBA clubs closer to Broken Hill than MBCofNSW - Adelaide, Finley, Yarrawonga / Mulwala.

Tim.

P.S go the Tigers!

[shannon87]

hi tim i apoligize if i came across that way i just meant it would be good to see electric battle the nitro boats but as you mentioned its a matter of those members turnin up and myself only being new it just seemed like a fuel dominated event and in order for myself to get more involved and not feel embarresed by runnin a basic f/e im in the process of byin a gas hydro off a member.

And to brad its not that the ampba is in a bad state its just i have mainly seen all fuel powered boats and one full tilt f/e so only ownin a basic f/e if you could call it that i felt a litlle left out coz i know my boat wouldnt be competative and it would only do about 18 mph lol.

And not many people approached me but once again i apologize if i came across the wrong way.

Also tim this new stock classtype of boat that you have devised sounds exactly what i need and would be interested as i like outboard tunnels or any outboard powered boats its not that i dont like inboards its just o/b boats are different and the gas hydro does seem pretty daunting but then again so does nitro lol even lipo's i guess im kinda buggered haha how much are we talkin about to buy one of these kinda boats you are settin up .

[rc_hydro]

Hi Shannon,
No worries. It's all good.

Everyone has to start somewhere. Our club caters to racing, and some people are a little guarded with race stuff - but you get that in any form of racing. I guarantee you there are more people in the club that are helpful, just some are unsure about this new fangled FE stuff

What a lot of people who are new to organised r/c boat racing don't realise (and FE in particular) is that the AMPBA and many of the affiliated clubs started way back, when the only power type was nitro 2 stroke engines. it was much later when gas (petrol) became more common, and FE was very much excluded in regular competitions until about 4 or 5 years ago. It's going thru the same growth within AMPBA clubs now that gas went thru in the mid 90's. (yes - I have been around since then!) Nitro and petrol racers account for the lions share of AMPBA memberships, but the times are a changin'.

One way to increase cross-interaction from the nitro guys into FE is to make a cheap, easy class that they can use existing hulls with - and "P spec O/B tunnel" fits that bill really well. Unfortunately the AMPBA rules didn't cater too well to this, so we've adopted it unofficially.

Ultimately P spec O/B tunnel is a class within an official class - which is EA tunnel. Now if Joe Bloggs wants to race a trick inboard tunnel with a Neu and a Schultz - he'd have a clear advantage over a cheap motor powered O/B. So we are trying to make our own little niche' before changing the rules officially.

The F/E vs Nitro argument happens from time to time, but it's apples and oranges. Yes, an FE set-up can go very fast, but it doesn't have the same challenges. Truth is, the guys and girls who are tunnel addicts like myself want to race both classes at the same event. Fastest heat time at 2010 Winter Spec for A O/B was 1 second slower than for EA tunnel - thats pretty damn close when you are talking 1min 34 for a heat time.

Our club has practice days and race days. If you are concerned your boat is too slow to race, come out on a practice day and have a run. Ask questions of similar type boat runners and get a feel for it. Chances are someone might suggest some changes or to offer the loan of a prop etc to help you out. BTW, many, many times I have seen what I call internet speeds completely de-bunked in the presence of a radar gun. And quite often it's not the fastest boat that wins in oval heat racing. My 40mph 3.5 sport tunnel won the A O/B tunnel class in the club championship, despite there being a few boats I have clocked at over 50mph in the same class.......... it's not all about top end speed, but about going around turns, not incurring penalties and getting the starts.

At the end of the day - this is a hobby - and as such it should be fun and interesting. I am all for helping newbies enjoy this hobby of ours. So if I can be of any assistance, just ask!

Cheers,
Tim

[shannon87]

hi tim cheers for all the info i understand about them bein guarded its jus to a newbie is daunting lol and i try to get to the practice and race days in penrith as often as i can as its closest to me.
But i agree with you about how to get more interaction between nitro and electric by using existing hulls and converting them and such but as you said people who can buy 300 dollar plus electric motors and speedos do have a clear advantage.

I mean that guy who had that f/e cat said it was around if not more then a gas cat and i know they can be way off the charts in price obviously coz there race machines.

But for someone like myself who hasnt got a race budget it kinda leaves me out of the loop and i have loved and been into this hobby as long as i can remember but due to prices my family and my limited knowledge i was given bad advice and brought one of those aquacraft rio ep's.

But now i have to spend money to get it up to scratch it has the potential to do 35-40 mph with mad brushless power but you have to reinforce the hull and such so which is why im just gettin a mild setup for bashing as it would cost an apparent fortune to be competative and relaible hence why i was goin to buy the gas hydro.

Even that would catch me out as i dont know how to tune the engine and keep it maintained or the funds if i busted some major components hence why i want to go down the road of the class your suggesting racing on an entry level budget.

As i said if you guys have a rtr f/e tunnel it would be awesome or mono i would prefer o/b power as im into that and its somethin different i mean i like the gas idea and speed and realism but i would prefer to start with electric due to budget which now is a possibilty with this unnofficial class.

There is nothin wrong with the hydro that george pap built but i would prefer somethin thats more suited to my taste and skill level such as an electric f/e tunnel mono and as i said if you got a good boat to go or could set somethin up that would be awesome. P.s sorry about the long message

[rcboatmanwithkids2880]

Hi,
I'm the VP of the MBCofNSW. Any talk of us being nitro / gas only is a load of BS. In fact we were one of the first AMPBA clubs to adapt FE into our major race meetings. We have plenty of FE boats in our club - it's a matter of whether they actually turn up to race meetings. It's hard to race them if only 1 turns up, but we still accomodate them somehow if they wish to run. I'm not sure who Shannon87 is refering to, but the majority of our members are keen to help out new members. If you have questions, ask around - get a few points of contact and you are bound to be pointed in the right direction.

Now to your questions;

EA sport refers to 4S Sport hydroplanes and is not a control class - that is realistic looking hydro's that are not outriggers governed by the rules for EA - it's all in the AMPBA rule book. Nue motors are very common.

A O/B "sport" is "stock" 3.5cc O/B's - a nitro class. The MBCof NSW has a lot of O/B tunnels that turn up to race often, and this season we have had enough to race "Stock" and "mod" separately.

Our current AMPBA rule book does not differentiate O/B tunnels from inboards in FE.

P Spec O/B Tunnel. Now this is not an official AMPBA class, but several clubs have adopted it at club level. It's basically a control class using Aquacraft and Blackjack motors on 4S powered O/B tunnels - typically converted ex-nitro boats. The idea to keep it cheap and fun, by using motors that are kind on ESC's and Batteries. We raced it at the Carribean Masters in Melbourne and the Winter Spec in Sydney last year and it's close, fun racing. Basically we are sticking with an unwritten rule amongst some of the active AMPBA members around the country interested in making this O/B class by using "production Spec" motors - in other words Aquacraft UL-1 and SV27 motors or the Proboat motors that are cheap and kinder on budget ESC's. I'd be happy with you running a feigao if you already owned it and weren't much faster as a result of it, as would anybody else. We'd prefer you use the same motors as the rest, but when a class is in it's infancy it would seem silly to exclude on that basis. The Aquacraft UL-1 motor is probably the most common. Grimracer 42x55 prop seems to be the most common prop. 4s 5000mah cheapy packs are common.

The MBCofNSW are actively trying to encourage P-Spec O/B tunnel but it is early days. The club president also has one ready to race. Mine is close to completion and I know of some others in the build too. If you have any q's, feel free to contact me.

Also, there are several AMPBA clubs closer to Broken Hill than MBCofNSW - Adelaide, Finley, Yarrawonga / Mulwala.

Tim.

P.S go the Tigers!

Hi Gentlemen ,

There are lot of good things that have been stated in this thread , for my part i need to apoligise if i have stated something neglible . At the moment i do live in Broken Hill , though i am still a Penrith man at heart . If i lived in Penrith i would be taking full adtvantage of all that the MBCOFNSW has to offer with its beautiful facility , though i will be returning to Penrith within the next few years after my commitments here are complete & look forward to becoming a member then . If i lived in Adelaide i would be a member there , though to any of the clubs you have mentioned they are still around 5 hours away at minimum .

The problem that a person faces in a perculier situation such as mine , having an interest ( passion ) for F/E R/C Boating that is not available at a time in your life is that there is a lack of clarification in what information is available Online if you wanted to set up a raceboat that is legal to use in certain classes ( AMBPA Rulebook Handbook which is dated 2007 . ) Maybe communication needs to be considered with greater importance by all bodies involved in Oz such as in the U.S ??

All the best to all who enjoy our great hobby ,

Oh Yeah , & GO THE TIGE'S IN 2011 !!

Brad

[rc_hydro]

2010 revised AMPBA rule book can be found at this link. http://www.ampba.asn.au/pdf/Ampba%20...02-11-2010.pdf

Unfortunately - our rules do not cater to an economy F/E class. However most clubs will find a way to accomodate whatever turns up. If anything, we have too many classes with too little participation and merging classes is common. They are scored separately though.

Just remember to compare apples to apples before becoming disgruntled or dissapointed. An RTR is not likely to compete straight up with a big $$ race boat.

Shannon, I assume you are refering to G. Mason's twin inboard 5S cat. Yes, he has a lot of money invested in that. 2 motors, 2 ESC's, 2 props, 2 lipo's etc. Petrol boats are not difficult to tune once someone points you in the right direction, but there's more to tuning than just a carb setting. They can get quite expensive also - the only thing cheap about them is the fuel itself.

There's an old saying "speed costs money, how fast do you want to go". Add racing, and someone always pushes the limit via the chequebook. Hydro's are fast, but don't like to turn left too much and I'd suggest to you that it's probably not as user friendly for a newbie to racing. Mono's or tunnels are better until you have more experience / confidence. I don't mean to scare you off, just trying to give you all the facts I can think of at the time. If you are looking at buying something new, and like outboards and are budget and race orientated, then the ProBoat Stiletto would be well worth a look as it's almost RTR. If I didn't already have my tunnel hull and parts I'd have bought one by now! THey are a great deal and would be extremely competitive with what we run as P-Spec within EA.