Neu 1415 1Y, to trim the wires, or not to trim

[robstercraws]

I just received my Neu 1415 and the wires seem to be rather long. Well longer that I’ve seen in a hull. I know that the shorter the wires creates less heat and more efficiency i Before I go and shoot my self in the foot, I wanted to see if there is an issue with trimming the length. I know there are other posts about people having problems getting the solder to flow and adhere to the wires but it’s regarting a different brand of motor. Thanks for any info you all may have.

[T.S.Davis]

Same problem on a Neu. The windings are coated.

[CraigP]

Trimming the wires shouldn’t be a problem. They should be trimmed to equal length. Note that some insulation covering on some motors may not be solderable removed. In this case, some have applied heat for too long a period trying to burn the insulation off. This can break down the epoxies that hold the wire around the stator. If the insulation doesn’t burn off with about 5 seconds of applying heat, you may have to mechanically remove the insulation by scraping each wire strand. So it’s pretty easy to get in for more than you bargained for...

[T.S.Davis]

I've done it with a Neu. It's about as bad as any. Used a dremel sanding brush. PIA.

There is a correct way to do it but it must be a gaurded secret as I've asked multiple times.

I sorta got a guy to explain it but it was very late at night at a race and there was allegedly many adult beverages consumed in the hours preceding the event. There was some sort of lye concoction with a kiln and a some nuclear fusion. A may be miss remembering that last bit. Did I mention it was late?

[robstercraws]

Sounds like a good time! I’ve heard caustic soda works. It’s used to remove anodizing and should do the trick. But I’m asking myself if it’s even needed as I’ve yet to run the boat. If the temps are too much then I guess I’ll have to buy it should be ok with my setup.

[Speed3]

That little extra length of wire wouldn't make a big difference in resistance.

I cannot seeing it making much of a difference.

But if you do trim them.

Equal length is something I would consider.

And you can scrap of the insulation with a sharp knife on each strand of wire for soldering purposes.

[ray schrauwen]

Sounds about right. Might have been me. Lye and table salt but it's very dangerous.

I'm just stupid that way.

I've done it with a Neu. It's about as bad as any. Used a dremel sanding brush. PIA.

There is a correct way to do it but it must be a gaurded secret as I've asked multiple times.

I sorta got a guy to explain it but it was very late at night at a race and there was allegedly many adult beverages consumed in the hours preceding the event. There was some sort of lye concoction with a kiln and a some nuclear fusion. A may be miss remembering that last bit. Did I mention it was late?

[robstercraws]

Speed, your the last person I would take advise from. Thanks anyways.

[CraigP]

Actually, Speed’s advice in this regard is pretty good. I use a xacto knife, hold the blade edge down and scrape up to avoid nicking the wire. You can keep the new exposed wire pretty short. Some also use 80 grit sandpaper, I use it to do a final clean to get off what the blade left. Just takes a little time. Be sure not to be too aggressive and shave the copper down!

[Fluid]

That little extra length of wire wouldn't make a big difference in resistance. I cannot seeing it making much of a difference.
But if you do trim them. Equal length is something I would consider. And you can scrap of the insulation with a sharp knife on each strand of wire for soldering purposes.

Any "extra length" on the motor wires can be made up by shortening the ESC wires, lots easier, same result. I would never shorten winding wires, too much work, too much chance of increasing resistance between the wires and connectors. To each his own.

Equal length matters not with motor wires. If it did, Castle would design their ESCs differently - but they don't. In the photo below, notice that the three motor wires are significantly different in length - about 2" of difference between the outer wires. Yet, somehow we set SAW records running Castle controllers to over 40,000 rpm - and the motor works. Sometimes common sense, doesn't make it.

Castle WC.JPG

[donhuff]

Terry,

It's not a secret, it's just that nobody wants to do it. Like was said above, it aint a real safe thing to do.
The coating on most of the cheap motors wire is very low temp, and is the main reason for the failure of these motors. I use, and so do the HIGH quality motors, 200C wire, and it is insulated with what they call Polyamide. The cheap motors say they use enamel, I think they use finger nail polish!

The mix I told you about is 3 parts lye and 1 part table salt. Not sure that the salt is needed as I have done it with straight lye and gotten the same results.

You'll need a strong vessel to hold this stuff, I took a 2.5" diameter piece of steel rod, and bored a well in it to make a cup. The steel holds heat well and can hold up to the lye. Put the mixture in there and put a propane/mapp torch to the outside of the cup. It will take a while for this stuff to melt and get liquid. IT IS VERY HOT in the liquid stage, not sure how hot but do NOT wear sandals when you do this. Ask me how I know!

Now with the mixture liquid, dip in your bundle of wire. It should boil immediately and spill all over the place. The melted coatings fumes MIGHT ignite, don't let that scare you as the flames aren't to big. When you pull the wires out of the mix, dunk them immediately in water to stop the reaction and to get the mix off cause if you let it cool it will be hard to get off. When you pull the wires out of the water, you will be amazed at how clean and bright they are, with not one speck of insulation left on them. Now, don't let them sit around for to long as there is still something going on with the chemicals and the shiny copper will dull and eventually turn blue with a thick coating of corrosion on them. 10 - 15 minutes is all it take for this to get started. Flux and apply solder and all is good.

[CraigP]

I’m with a Fluid on this. It’s not worth the effort and putting the motor at risk. The motor wires carry an AC current and that type of current is affected to a lesser degree to tiny resistance differences. The battery leads carry a high DC current with an AC ripple on top. Everything on the DC side should be balanced, at least that’s what I strive to do.

The chemical removal sounds very dangerous, but I’m ignorant on that approach. Jay has the most experience, I’d follow his play.....

[ray schrauwen]

I used a 2" cast iron end cap and i ground out the sharp bits. Mine was 4 to 1 I think?? Saw it on the tube as .....always

In would also tape up the whole motor because there can be splatter that could get inside endbell or in my case take off some black anodized coating. Clean off after with water, etc...

Terry,

It's not a secret, it's just that nobody wants to do it. Like was said above, it aint a real safe thing to do.
The coating on most of the cheap motors wire is very low temp, and is the main reason for the failure of these motors. I use, and so do the HIGH quality motors, 200C wire, and it is insulated with what they call Polyamide. The cheap motors say they use enamel, I think they use finger nail polish!

The mix I told you about is 3 parts lye and 1 part table salt. Not sure that the salt is needed as I have done it with straight lye and gotten the same results.

You'll need a strong vessel to hold this stuff, I took a 2.5" diameter piece of steel rod, and bored a well in it to make a cup. The steel holds heat well and can hold up to the lye. Put the mixture in there and put a propane/mapp torch to the outside of the cup. It will take a while for this stuff to melt and get liquid. IT IS VERY HOT in the liquid stage, not sure how hot but do NOT wear sandals when you do this. Ask me how I know!

Now with the mixture liquid, dip in your bundle of wire. It should boil immediately and spill all over the place. The melted coatings fumes MIGHT ignite, don't let that scare you as the flames aren't to big. When you pull the wires out of the mix, dunk them immediately in water to stop the reaction and to get the mix off cause if you let it cool it will be hard to get off. When you pull the wires out of the water, you will be amazed at how clean and bright they are, with not one speck of insulation left on them. Now, don't let them sit around for to long as there is still something going on with the chemicals and the shiny copper will dull and eventually turn blue with a thick coating of corrosion on them. 10 - 15 minutes is all it take for this to get started. Flux and apply solder and all is good.

[donhuff]

Yes Ray, a pipe cap should work fine.
The mix I heard about also came from you tube, and the guy in the video was doing it on his stove top in the house! He must be a lot neater than I get that stuff everywhere, and it makes a mess. That mix might have been 4 to 1, but like I said, I don't think it really matters as straight lye will do it to.
And your right about it removing anodizing. In the past, I have used a mix of lye and cold water to remove anodize. Just paint it on with a brush, wait a minute, then rinse it and the anodize is gone.

[ray schrauwen]

Nice tip for removing anodizing, thanks.

I've done it twice. Once on a toasted 4092 tp that someone tried to cut and clean wires and once on a 4070 that might be toast until I can test it.

Now that I have experience, I could do a new motor if i .wanted