House health bill makes private medical insurance illegal

[RCprince]

So He'll kill your Grand parents and sent you kids off to mandatory volunteer corps. How can anyone takes these people seriously...where is George Carlin when you need him?

[Bill-SOCAL]

That was a classic Beck piece. He contradicted himself a whole 46 seconds later!!! None of their fans seem to ever fact check them and when people on the left point out their glaring hypocrisy then we are the ones called out as being bitter or whatever.

16 months ago Beck labeled US health care as a nightmare, today it is the best in the world. Limbaugh says all drug users need to go to jail and the ACLU are Satan's minions on Earth. Until he gets nailed as a drug addict and the ACLU comes to his rescue. And their fans cannot get enough of them. Worse, they cite them as if they are serious sources.

[Bill-SOCAL]

This is an interesting article. I know, he's an E-Vile Libberul, but he does have a Nobel Prize in Economics and speaks in complete sentences

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/17/op...nytimesopinion

Oh, and in case nobody wants to expose themselves to the New York Times and a Nobel Laureate, here is his summary statement:

At this point, all that stands in the way of universal health care in America are the greed of the medical-industrial complex, the lies of the right-wing propaganda machine, and the gullibility of voters who believe those lies.

[domwilson]

Maybe someone in this country will read this and get a grip on reality. These guys have been caught in so many lies and yet there are a large number of goobers that still believe them.

[AndyKunz]

At this point, all that stands in the way of universal health care in America are the greed of the medical-industrial complex, the lies of the right-wing propaganda machine, and the gullibility of voters who believe those lies.

Is he referring to the gullible voters who elected the current administration? If so, why were the right-wing propagandists trying to get these clowns elected? Why weren't they trying to get their own people elected?

Are the gullible voters who elected Obama et al the same people who are now protesting his health-(un)care plan at the town hall meetings?

Seems this guy is more than a little confused.

To help clear up some of the confusion, try this 1934 political cartoon link.

Andy

[domwilson]

Is he referring to the gullible voters who elected the current administration? If so, why were the right-wing propagandists trying to get these clowns elected? Why weren't they trying to get their own people elected?

Are the gullible voters who elected Obama et al the same people who are now protesting his health-(un)care plan at the town hall meetings?

Seems this guy is more than a little confused.

To help clear up some of the confusion, try this 1934 political cartoon link.

Andy

My guess is that they were trying to regroup and separate themselves from the mess that Bush/Cheney created. Remember when so many Republicans were trying to distance themselves from his administration?

[Darin Jordan]

How's that "Cash for Clunkers" Government run program going?? WHAT, you mean only a handful of claims have been processed by the Government at this point? WHAT? Dealers are sitting on HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of $$$ worth of unpaid claims?? HUH??? REALLY?? You mean EVERY claim has to be approved by a member of the Government?? How many of those are there??? Oh, the government appointed 200 employees to administer the program?? Wow... Yah... that program is working GREAT!!

I think we should let them run Healthcare as well....



THANK GOD that cooler heads seem to be prevailing...


And give me a break, guys... for EVERY liberal journalist/expert out there writing a scathing article putting down the right and clammering about all the lies and propganda and "misinformation" out there... there is an equally qualified expert on the right that can refute every point... and can put out an equally scathing article with an equally potent set of points...

NONE of it answers the simple question that Steven asked weeks ago... HOW are they going to pay for ANY of this and NOT raise taxes or increase the deficit??

They can't answer that, which is obvious by their current propoganda tactics...

OH, and by the way... the 12-million worth of advertising being pushed by the Whitehouse right now in support of the current "Reform"... anyone want to guess who is paying for that??? BIG DRUG COMPANIES! But, what??? I thought they were evil??? Why isn't anyone questioning WHY the big insurance and drug companies are now suddenly onboard with this "reform"???

[domwilson]

I thought healthcare reform was a no brainer and that so many would be behind it. America has always been on the cutting edge of innovation, except TV programming, but sadly, I must say...

[Darin Jordan]

I thought healthcare reform was a no brainer and that so many would be behind it. America has always been on the cutting edge of innovation, except TV programming, but sadly, I must say...

This just shows that you and many others have bought into their propoganda...

Listen to what you just said... "I thought healthcare reform was a no brainer..."....

IT IS! NO ONE IS QUESTIONING that the healtcare system needs REFORM... that part isn't being argued by the majority. I know that's what the WH is trying to make you think, but that's NOT THE CASE.

What IS being argued is their METHOD of going about it and what the actual "reform" consists of. The Government taking OVER healtcare is the plan that's embattled right now... NOT trying to get reform itself, but the TYPE of reform they are trying to push...

Cooler heads are prevailing, and the idea of Government over-reaching it's Constitutional allowances by taking over the entire industry is getting put to bed. Hopefully for good... Now maybe they can get down to talking about things that would ACTUALLY make a positive difference in the system...

[domwilson]

From what I have been reading is that the government wasn't trying to take over healthcare, but was trying to spur some much needed competition and ethics by offering an alternative plan. Free market wasn't/isn't working. But there are so many politicians in the back pockets of insurance companies that we may never have reform or the truth.

[domwilson]

Cooler heads are prevailing, and the idea of Government over-reaching it's Constitutional allowances by taking over the entire industry is getting put to bed. Hopefully for good... Now maybe they can get down to talking about things that would ACTUALLY make a positive difference in the system...

Funny thing you said this. I couldn't find anything in the constitution preventing this.
And as stated earlier, the government was not trying to take over the system, but was offering an alternative. So who is really being influenced by the propaganda?

[Darin Jordan]

But there are so many politicians in the back pockets of insurance companies that we may never have reform or the truth.

And this would certainly NOT change with the "reform" they were proposing... Just how corrupt do you think the Government option would become if those administering it had these same entities in their pockets???

The Government's job is to make laws that help ENHANCE the free market... to protect consumers, to promote business and growth... You can't tell me that the free market doesn't work, and in the same breath tell me that those making the laws governing that market are colluding and corrupting that said market... Where is the problem REALLY?

What we need here is GOVERNMENT reform... something that was promised over and over again by this current administration, as well as by the opponent, during the campaign... And they have "reformed" it, for sure... reformed it right into a Chicago-Style political machine... I'm PRETTY sure that's not what people were "Hoping" the "change" would be... but then, he never really defined WHAT they should "Hope" for, nor which direction the "change" would be, so I guess you get what you pay for...

[AndyKunz]

Funny thing you said this. I couldn't find anything in the constitution preventing this.

The Federal government hasn't been following the Constitution since 1865.

It's the 10th Amendment. Read all about it http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

A little more, with explanation: http://law.suite101.com/article.cfm/...s_constitution

They really have to stretch to be able to claim the authority.

Andy

[domwilson]

The Federal government hasn't been following the Constitution since 1865.

It's the 10th Amendment. Read all about it http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

A little more, with explanation: http://law.suite101.com/article.cfm/...s_constitution

They really have to stretch to be able to claim the authority.

Andy

Did you read this?

"The Necessary and Proper Clause
The constitutional grant of authority that could allow the government’s authority to be exercised in areas well beyond limited constitutional grants was the Constitution’s Necessary and Proper clause, found at Article I, Sec. 8, clause 18:

“The Congress shall have Power *** To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by the Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.”

The Tenth Amendment Becomes Superfluous
In determining that the Tenth Amendment contained no express limitation provision and that the Congress had the authority to make “necessary and proper” laws to execute the enumerated powers Marshall set the stage for making the Tenth Amendment a superfluous part of the Constitution."

[domwilson]

The Government's job is to make laws that help ENHANCE the free market... to protect consumers, to promote business and growth... You can't tell me that the free market doesn't work, and in the same breath tell me that those making the laws governing that market are colluding and corrupting that said market... Where is the problem REALLY?

In general, free market does work. But it hasn't/doesn't work in this case. Healthcare should not be reduced to a commodity. And yes there is collusion between big companies and politicians. What do you think some of the lobbyist do? Finally, the government's job is to govern the people. To protect the people from the people. Economics and Politics are two separate topics. The problem is reducing the value of life to dollars and cents.

[sailr]

Confused? YOU are the one that's confused! He is referring to the right wing idealogues that you voted for...not the current administration! Just how much more crap can you righties make up trying to excuse the egregious behavior of the GOP? Give it up. Your party is dieing. After 2010 there won't be enough of them to write a Leave The Room Slip to go take a crap!

Is he referring to the gullible voters who elected the current administration? If so, why were the right-wing propagandists trying to get these clowns elected? Why weren't they trying to get their own people elected?

Are the gullible voters who elected Obama et al the same people who are now protesting his health-(un)care plan at the town hall meetings?

Seems this guy is more than a little confused.

To help clear up some of the confusion, try this 1934 political cartoon link.

Andy

[sailr]

It should also be the government's job to protect the people from crooks, liars and thieves...eg, the insurance industry and the financial industry! Deregulation that the right wing favors ... in other word free markets, has proven immeasurably that it doesn't work. The people get the shaft and the rich and their cronies in congress get the bucks. It is beyond me how anyone who is sitting here on the outside of government can't see how bad things are because of the GOP and yet still support their miserably failed policies!

In the case of health care, the industry has been allowed to trample on the people until we are all bloodied! Reduce them to a commodity? Hell yes and regulate the hell of it!

You are delusional if you think economics and politics are two separate topics!

In general, free market does work. But it hasn't/doesn't work in this case. Healthcare should not be reduced to a commodity. And yes there is collusion between big companies and politicians. What do you think some of the lobbyist do? Finally, the government's job is to govern the people. To protect the people from the people. Economics and Politics are two separate topics. The problem is reducing the value of life to dollars and cents.

[domwilson]

It should also be the government's job to protect the people from crooks, liars and thieves...eg, the insurance industry and the financial industry! Deregulation that the right wing favors ... in other word free markets, has proven immeasurably that it doesn't work. The people get the shaft and the rich and their cronies in congress get the bucks. It is beyond me how anyone who is sitting here on the outside of government can't see how bad things are because of the GOP and yet still support their miserably failed policies!

In the case of health care, the industry has been allowed to trample on the people until we are all bloodied! Reduce them to a commodity? Hell yes and regulate the hell of it!

You are delusional if you think economics and politics are two separate topics!

They are two separate topics. One drives the other. However, the powers that be, have interchangeably used both to further their own personal agendas. Big business should not govern the people. We are being converted from a nation of "free spirits" to consumerist slaves. "To protect the people from the people" I think would cover liars, crooks and thieves.

[domwilson]

Interesting.... http://newt.org/tabid/102/articleTyp...-Regroups.aspx

[AndyKunz]

Confused? YOU are the one that's confused! He is referring to the right wing idealogues that you voted for...not the current administration! Just how much more crap can you righties make up trying to excuse the egregious behavior of the GOP? Give it up. Your party is dieing. After 2010 there won't be enough of them to write a Leave The Room Slip to go take a crap!

To whom were you directing that?

I don't have a party. I'm independent. Not even a Libertarian (although they have some great ideas). Some here apparently equate "Republican" with "Conservative" or "Right wing" (vs. Democrat = Wrong Wing), but that's not the case. There are Conservative Democrats and Liberal Republicans. Look at Christy Whitman - she was as Democrat in principle as Jim McGreevy and Jon Corzine.

Please, if you're going to make stereotypes, at least make sure they have some basis in fact first.

I think you're way underestimating the Republicans, though. They might be fewer in numbers when you look at registrations, but why do they keep electing such a large percentage? Is it perhaps because there are Party Democrats and Thinking Democrats, and the Thinking type realizes that sometimes he has to cross Party Lines to get the better candidate?!?!?

Andy