Perfect Pass Launch Control

[mmars89]

Hello FE boaters,

Has anyone tried the Perfect Pass launch control module for speed runs? It seems to be quite popular amongst the car speed run crowd. Thoughts?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmyIdEzfCtM

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...fcfa1505a2d826


Thanks

[Panther6834]

The reason is used in cars is to control/eliminate "wheel spin" when accelerating to "full throttle" from a standstill. Boats don't deal with this 'problem'.


~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

[mmars89]

The reason is used in cars is to control/eliminate "wheel spin" when accelerating to "full throttle" from a standstill. Boats don't deal with this 'problem'.


~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

Yes it is definitely much more needed in cars, I understand that. However, it appears to really smooth out the throttle signal, eliminating any unintentional blips or abrupt "steps" caused by lack of finger control. My thoughts were that this may be beneficial in powerful SAW boats. I know I have caused the odd crash by applying throttle too quickly or not linearly enough, causing the boat to become unsettled.

And yes I know many consider this a cheating device and will say to learn better throttle control, I don't disagree with that, but I'm not looking to get into that discussion. I'm just curious if anyone has tried it and what the results were.

Thanks

[Panther6834]

I can't say weather, or not, it would be considered "cheating" in SAW. But, in regards to speedrun cars, it's definitely not "cheating", is the only thing that matters (and, Guinness world records agrees) is "top speed".


~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

[mmars89]

I can't say weather, or not, it would be considered "cheating" in SAW. But, in regards to speedrun cars, it's definitely not "cheating", is the only thing that matters (and, Guinness world records agrees) is "top speed".


~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

Yeah that makes sense, it looks like almost all the speed run car guys use it. I don't know anything about that world, or specific SAW rules for that matter. I don't compete.

And sorry, I didn't intend that comment to be aimed at you directly, was just more of a general statement to beat someone else from replying "learn better throttle control" ha. Should have put that comment in the original post.


Thanks

[vvviivvv]

It probably has its uses, if you spent enough time you could have it so you just pin the throttle on a saw pass and the perfect pass ramps up for you enough to be flat out during the traps.

I know on my 7pxr i can alter the throttle curves, which is basically the same thing... sure other high end rx's can do the same

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/17...r.html?page=84

[mmars89]

It probably has its uses, if you spent enough time you could have it so you just pin the throttle on a saw pass and the perfect pass ramps up for you enough to be flat out during the traps.

I know on my 7pxr i can alter the throttle curves, which is basically the same thing... sure other high end rx's can do the same

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/17...r.html?page=84

I agree, that is exactly what I was thinking. It looks like that is what the car guys do, make sure it's lined up and pin it. Can adjust the pot to set acceleration ramp time to your desired level.

That 7pxr looks awesome. I need to upgrade my radio in a bad way, I am still running the first radio I started out with, the Flysky FS-GT3B. It's been great for it's price, but yes, time for an upgrade. $2k boat, $39 radio lol. It has fairly limited settings, and they do not seem to be as effective as the higher end radios. I was thinking about the Futaba 4PM. It looks to me like it has similar functions as the 7pxr, through its THR (Throttle Speed) and TH ACC (Throttle Acceleration) settings. This would definitely help, however, these functions (on any radio) don't appear to be able to achieve the same "automatic" throttle ramp that the Perfect Pass module can do, correct me if I am wrong.

Either way, I think a better radio is my first step. But I am curious to try the perfect pass module at some point.

Ps. I am a big fan of your builds, beautiful stuff my friend!

Thanks

[Bande1]

my $70 radiolink does this built in on top of throttle exponential. It also out performs my Airtronics in range. I prefer it over my Futaba for my planes as well.



they also have telemetry capable receivers for $22 so you can display your battery voltage on the radio. as well it has active FPI where your head not only can control the camera gimble it can control the throttle and steering servo and turn the boat, car, etc by moving your head up/down or left/right. pretty neat radios for the money. They do feel a tad cheap though in your hand. and I hate the antenna that just sticks out and will be easy to break.

[mmars89]

my $70 radiolink does this built in on top of throttle exponential. It also out performs my Airtronics in range. I prefer it over my Futaba for my planes as well.

they also have telemetry capable receivers for $22 so you can display your battery voltage on the radio. as well it has active FPI where your head not only can control the camera gimble it can control the throttle and steering servo and turn the boat, car, etc by moving your head up/down or left/right. pretty neat radios for the money. They do feel a tad cheap though in your hand. and I hate the antenna that just sticks out and will be easy to break.

I did not know about this radio. Looks awesome for the price point, I will check it out. Oh man I would have epic crashes controlling something with my head lol, that's pretty dang cool though. Thanks for sharing. Are those throttle delay functions the same as the THR (Throttle Speed) and TH ACC (Throttle Acceleration) functions on the Futaba 4PM? That's what it looks like to me anyway. I have seen a few radios with similar functions. But like the RC Explained guy says in that video, the limiting factor is the time delay; 2 seconds from 0-100% throttle is still too aggressive for the speed run cars. I know I have to drag out my acceleration time longer than that with my twin cat to avoid unsettling the boat. I'm guessing this is why the Perfect Pass module has a place in the market, it can really drag that out to what looks like 5-6 seconds or so, and probably more if used in conjunction with the radios built in features (not that you would want that long of a ramp time). If I had to guess, I probably average around a 3-4 second ramp time for a nice smooth and planted acceleration with my explorer in particular.

Thanks

[Bande1]

I did not know about this radio. Looks awesome for the price point, I will check it out. Oh man I would have epic crashes controlling something with my head lol, that's pretty dang cool though. Thanks for sharing. Are those throttle delay functions the same as the THR (Throttle Speed) and TH ACC (Throttle Acceleration) functions on the Futaba 4PM? That's what it looks like to me anyway. I have seen a few radios with similar functions. But like the RC Explained guy says in that video, the limiting factor is the time delay; 2 seconds from 0-100% throttle is still too aggressive for the speed run cars. I know I have to drag out my acceleration time longer than that with my twin cat to avoid unsettling the boat. I'm guessing this is why the Perfect Pass module has a place in the market, it can really drag that out to what looks like 5-6 seconds or so, and probably more if used in conjunction with the radios built in features (not that you would want that long of a ramp time). If I had to guess, I probably average around a 3-4 second ramp time for a nice smooth and planted acceleration with my explorer in particular.

Thanks

im having the same problem with my single cat with a 56mm motor. I simply cannot apply power slow enough. I have the throttle speed on 10/100. Im thinking my -80 throttle exponents are making the top of the ramp-in too aggressive. Just turn exponent off entirely and make it linear with throttle speed on 0-5 or so. The thing literally spun off the top layer of a new 1/4 flex shaft.

[mmars89]

im having the same problem with my single cat with a 56mm motor. I simply cannot apply power slow enough. I have the throttle speed on 10/100. Im thinking my -80 throttle exponents are making the top of the ramp-in too aggressive. Just turn exponent off entirely and make it linear with throttle speed on 0-5 or so. The thing literally spun off the top layer of a new 1/4 flex shaft.

I just read your torque steer thread, that's pretty crazy to strip a 1/4" flex like that, talk about torque! A slowed throttle ramp may help but that sounds like a pretty severe issue. Strange. My issue is that I sometimes struggle to ease the power on and will get some bow lift which leads to porpoising. Sometimes I can catch it quick and correct it, other times it ruins my pass because I run out of room to correct and go, and other times I get impatient and hit it hard which sometimes works and sometimes results in crash ha ha. I do still have some issues with throttle cutting in and out periodically as I'm trying to accelerate (assumed radio/receiver issue), which I have not been able to completely resolve. I've tried just about everything I can think of, other than a different radio. I started another thread about it a while back.

[Bande1]

I just read your torque steer thread, that's pretty crazy to strip a 1/4" flex like that, talk about torque! A slowed throttle ramp may help but that sounds like a pretty severe issue. Strange. My issue is that I sometimes struggle to ease the power on and will get some bow lift which leads to porpoising. Sometimes I can catch it quick and correct it, other times it ruins my pass because I run out of room to correct and go, and other times I get impatient and hit it hard which sometimes works and sometimes results in crash ha ha. I do still have some issues with throttle cutting in and out periodically as I'm trying to accelerate (assumed radio/receiver issue), which I have not been able to completely resolve. I've tried just about everything I can think of, other than a different radio. I started another thread about it a while back.

thats a classic symptom of LVC...low voltage cutting. I cant recommend enough to go get a hyperion emeter2 system for like $50 and you will see everything going on with voltage and amps drawn.

[mmars89]

thats a classic symptom of LVC...low voltage cutting. I cant recommend enough to go get a hyperion emeter2 system for like $50 and you will see everything going on with voltage and amps drawn.

That's the first thing I thought as well and that's what everyone on the forum said, it makes total sense, but I don't think it is LVC. This problem has occurred with 3 different brands of ESC's (all with LVC disabled), different batteries, 6s, 12s, big props, small props, different motors (high KV, low KV, Y wind, D wind), you name it. The common theme is dual ESC's with the Flysky radio/receiver in the explorer hull. I've swapped all the different combinations of ESC's, motors and receivers between boats and the problem always stays with the explorer. Every combination works totally fine in my single drive boats, even when pushing them hard with big props and LVC enabled at 3.4v/cell. The only ESC's I have with data logging are my swordfish 240's and they all show steady throttle signals. Voltages are definitely getting pulled down below where they should be when I prop up (junk batteries as we have discussed). I've seen as low as 3.23v/cell on 12s (38.8v), but I had LVC set to 4s 2.5v/cell (10v), which is as close as you can get to disabling it on the Swordfish 240's. However, it still happens with my little baby X442's, with the lowest voltage seen at around 3.6v/cell at wide open throttle.

The problem is much less severe in the explorer now with the Seaking 180's and Leo 4074 2200kv motors on 6s, but it still does it a bit. It seems to happen more in one direction verses the other. Also gets better the higher I am above the water. If I try to run from the dock it's quite bad, but if I'm up on the bank about 10 feet above the water it gets much better. So that leads me to think it's a radio thing, some sort of weird frequency interference or something?? It's a head scratcher. About the only thing I haven't tried yet is a different radio and/or higher end batteries, that's next.

I'm not ruling out a low voltage issue, despite LVC being disabled. Those Zeee batteries are junk, voltage is definitely getting pulled down a lot. Will be interesting to see if these new SMC's have any effect.

Here's a video of when it was at it's worst, with the swordfish 240's, Leo 4082 1000kv motors on 12s, (LVC basically disabled; set to 4s 3.0V (12v)).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRgmXNl4rtw

Any other ideas, I'm all ears! But we are getting off the thread topic here, and I can't seem to find my other thread about this issue, it must have been deleted. I'll start another one if the new batteries and/or radio doesn't solve it.