America, what have you done?

[Dr. Jet]

You poor demented consumer of left-wing extremist media propaganda (NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, NPR, AP, Reuters, BBC, New York Times, LA Times, San Diego Union-Tribune, just to name a few Left-wing extremist, Neo-Marxist "news" organizations). I truly feel sorry for you. How can you read the words of our Founding Fathers and still maintain your socialist position? You confirm my signature tag line.

[RCprince]

If you follow your history at all most great empires have a rise and fall not lasting much past 200 years , greed and corruption at the highest levels is what brings it to its knee's and its eventual destruction , my mother once told me the USA is running a scary parallel to the roman empire

I am in no way saying we are better off , I see both our nations walking down the same path of financial destruction

Here in Canada we have our embarrassments also , East hates the West , the West hates the East , the rest of Canada hates Quebec , Quebec always wanting to separate , like what a flippen clown show.................

"the sun never sets on the British Empire." Hmmm. everything has a living cycle, and the ones who find the most difficulty understanding this are those who choose not to read. Man lives and dies and so shall everything he creates, be governed by those rules.

[RCprince]

You poor demented consumer of left-wing extremist media propaganda (NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, NPR, AP, Reuters, BBC, New York Times, LA Times, San Diego Union-Tribune, just to name a few Left-wing extremist, Neo-Marxist "news" organizations). I truly feel sorry for you. How can you read the words of our Founding Fathers and still maintain your socialist position? You confirm my signature tag line.

Don't forget Foxnews, There is no News network that feeds the people the truth, they are all in cahoots, allowing you to believe there is a middle ground, while they are encircling the wagons for their own personal lust for money and ratings, they'll sell you Jesus is in the Mohave, if they could capture sweep week( look at the code words people).


"Liberalism is a mental disorder " Actually without liberalism there is no conservatism and so forth. What did the English church think of our founding father non conforming ways. Freedom at its very essence is liberalism, But freedom without conservatism is anarchy. Maybe we should bring back, burning at the stake or hanging. likewise was it not capitalism that got us to the Great Depression via the Banking System pillaging this country, and during, while the Rich bankers bought up all the foreclosed farms. However, were it not for the Socialistic policies FDR implement, the unfortunate would have been at an impasse. Likewise Capitalism without a Symbiosis relationship with Socialism will only benefit one segment of the population, The Capitalist( those who capitalize on the misfortune or ignorance of others:ie banks).

Maybe we should take a second look at Hitler's thinking when it comes to selective birth, that way there would be no more handicaps or less desirable being born, where we would have to foot their bills. I can understands the thinking of those who call themselves capitalist, But they have a tendency of throwing the baby out with the bath water.
There is no absolutism in human behavior, that is a mental disorder my friend and unnatural. Those who think they are free are those who cease to fight any longer, and in their complacency they so willingly acquiesce to the same powers that seek to imprison them.

"Money is a new form of slavery, and distinguishable from the old simply by the fact that it is impersonal -- that there is no human relation between master and slave." - Leo Tolstoy

[Darin Jordan]

Guys... it doesn't really matter at this point... The Spedulous bill has bee passed by the Senate... it's only a matter of time before it gets passed by the House.

I said at the time that the rebate checks that Bush sent us awhile back were the dumbest things ever... NOTHING will compare to what is about to be enacted.

This will go down in history as one of the single worst things EVER to come out of Washington.

God help our Kids....

[Dr. Jet]

Don't forget foxnews, There is no News network that feeds the people the truth, they are all in cahoots, allowing you to believe there is a middle ground, while they are encircle the wagons for their own personal lust for money and ratings, they'll sell you Jesus is in the Mohave, if they could capture sweep week( look at the code words people).

I wouldn't call FoxNews Left-Wing extremist. Left-Wing is sufficient.

[Darin Jordan]

Left-Wing is sufficient.

They do lean left, but the mechanisms that measure such things rate them at about 40% Left to 40% Right on most of their coverage and news they deliver.

[Dr. Jet]

Guys... it doesn't really matter at this point... The Spedulous bill has bee passed by the Senate... it's only a matter of time before it gets passed by the House.

I said at the time that the rebate checks that Bush sent us awhile back were the dumbest things ever... NOTHING will compare to what is about to be enacted.

This will go down in history as one of the single worst things EVER to come out of Washington.

God help our Kids....

Nobody is talking about the Socialized Medicine part of this pork bill. That is one of the worst parts about this bill.


Were screwed, my kids are screwed, and my grandkids are screwed.



Below is the text of an article and commentary by Betsy McCaughey that sheds some ligh on the healthcare provisions of the pork bill:



Feb. 9 (Bloomberg) -- Republican Senators are questioning whether President Barack Obama’s stimulus bill contains the right mix of tax breaks and cash infusions to jump-start the economy.

Tragically, no one from either party is objecting to the health provisions slipped in without discussion. These provisions reflect the handiwork of Tom Daschle, until recently the nominee to head the Health and Human Services Department.

Senators should read these provisions and vote against them because they are dangerous to your health. (Page numbers refer to H.R. 1 EH, pdf version).

The bill’s health rules will affect “every individual in the United States” (445, 454, 479). Your medical treatments will be tracked electronically by a federal system. Having electronic medical records at your fingertips, easily transferred to a hospital, is beneficial. It will help avoid duplicate tests and errors.

But the bill goes further. One new bureaucracy, the National Coordinator of Health Information Technology, will monitor treatments to make sure your doctor is doing what the federal government deems appropriate and cost effective. The goal is to reduce costs and “guide” your doctor’s decisions (442, 446). These provisions in the stimulus bill are virtually identical to what Daschle prescribed in his 2008 book, “Critical: What We Can Do About the Health-Care Crisis.” According to Daschle, doctors have to give up autonomy and “learn to operate less like solo practitioners.”

Keeping doctors informed of the newest medical findings is important, but enforcing uniformity goes too far.

New Penalties

Hospitals and doctors that are not “meaningful users” of the new system will face penalties. “Meaningful user” isn’t defined in the bill. That will be left to the HHS secretary, who will be empowered to impose “more stringent measures of meaningful use over time” (511, 518, 540-541)

What penalties will deter your doctor from going beyond the electronically delivered protocols when your condition is atypical or you need an experimental treatment? The vagueness is intentional. In his book, Daschle proposed an appointed body with vast powers to make the “tough” decisions elected politicians won’t make.

The stimulus bill does that, and calls it the Federal Coordinating Council for Comparative Effectiveness Research (190-192). The goal, Daschle’s book explained, is to slow the development and use of new medications and technologies because they are driving up costs. He praises Europeans for being more willing to accept “hopeless diagnoses” and “forgo experimental treatments,” and he chastises Americans for expecting too much from the health-care system.

Elderly Hardest Hit

Daschle says health-care reform “will not be pain free.” Seniors should be more accepting of the conditions that come with age instead of treating them. That means the elderly will bear the brunt.

Medicare now pays for treatments deemed safe and effective. The stimulus bill would change that and apply a cost- effectiveness standard set by the Federal Council (464).

The Federal Council is modeled after a U.K. board discussed in Daschle’s book. This board approves or rejects treatments using a formula that divides the cost of the treatment by the number of years the patient is likely to benefit. Treatments for younger patients are more often approved than treatments for diseases that affect the elderly, such as osteoporosis.

In 2006, a U.K. health board decreed that elderly patients with macular degeneration had to wait until they went blind in one eye before they could get a costly new drug to save the other eye. It took almost three years of public protests before the board reversed its decision.

Hidden Provisions

If the Obama administration’s economic stimulus bill passes the Senate in its current form, seniors in the U.S. will face similar rationing. Defenders of the system say that individuals benefit in younger years and sacrifice later.

The stimulus bill will affect every part of health care, from medical and nursing education, to how patients are treated and how much hospitals get paid. The bill allocates more funding for this bureaucracy than for the Army, Navy, Marines, and Air Force combined (90-92, 174-177, 181).

Hiding health legislation in a stimulus bill is intentional. Daschle supported the Clinton administration’s health-care overhaul in 1994, and attributed its failure to debate and delay. A year ago, Daschle wrote that the next president should act quickly before critics mount an opposition. “If that means attaching a health-care plan to the federal budget, so be it,” he said. “The issue is too important to be stalled by Senate protocol.”

More Scrutiny Needed

On Friday, President Obama called it “inexcusable and irresponsible” for senators to delay passing the stimulus bill. In truth, this bill needs more scrutiny.

The health-care industry is the largest employer in the U.S. It produces almost 17 percent of the nation’s gross domestic product. Yet the bill treats health care the way European governments do: as a cost problem instead of a growth industry. Imagine limiting growth and innovation in the electronics or auto industry during this downturn. This stimulus is dangerous to your health and the economy.

(Betsy McCaughey is former lieutenant governor of New York and is an adjunct senior fellow at the Hudson Institute. The opinions expressed are her own.)

To contact the writer of this column: Betsy McCaughey at Betsymross@aol.com

[Darin Jordan]

Were screwed, my kids are screwed, and my grandkids are screwed.

Not just yours and mine, Doc... All the righties are going to be crying in their soup as soon as the impact of this hits them and they actually realize what they have done...

Remember... they are the first to curse the military for going into a country... then the first to scream when we don't... They don't really know what they want, and I don't think they have much of a clue about what they are going to now be getting.

Oh yah... by the way... DOW is currently down -386 points on the news... Perfect... I suppose that's Bush's fault too???

[egneg]

You could alway do a hostile takeover if you don't like the company that employs you. I think it was Thomas Jefferson that said there should be a revolt ever 20 years or so. I think we are overdue.

To arms! To arms! It's time to throw that tea into the harbor!!

Actually I was thinking more along the lines of the era from 1968 - 1972. It has been 40 or so years but the young folks pretty much let the government know how they felt then. Now we are a bit older and closing in on retirement (what a joke) with very little left of our investments for retirement.

It is time for the formation of the "GREY PANTHERS"!!!

We must rally together and let Washington know that we are mad as hell and we are not going to take it any longer!

[Flying Scotsman]

The Gray Panthers...I love it Chuck

Douggie

[RCprince]

Oh yah... by the way... DOW is currently down -386 points on the news... Perfect... I suppose that's Bush's fault too???

your a boater, you should know better, WAKE: 1. The visible track of turbulence left by something moving through water.

2. A track, course, or condition left behind something that has passed

[Darin Jordan]

your a boater, you should know better, WAKE: 1. The visible track of turbulence left by something moving through water.

2. A track, course, or condition left behind something that has passed

That's funny... Wave energy is usually gone the next time I come around for a lap...

I still love the way that people are COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that it's the crash of the mortgage industry, and the cheats there, that really caused this mess... And the hands involved in making that happen are the ones at the reigns right now...

Ignorance is bliss, obviously...

[egneg]

Sorry Douggie I corrected the spelling.

[Flying Scotsman]

There was no need, as I thought it fitted the bill.
A great movement, I think. Oh Damn there go the bowels again!

Douggie

[RCprince]

That's funny... Wave energy is usually gone the next time I come around for a lap...

I still love the way that people are COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that it's the crash of the mortgage industry, and the cheats there, that really caused this mess... And the hands involved in making that happen are the ones at the reigns right now...

Ignorance is bliss, obviously...

No one is, But you keep putting Bush and Obama in this... , Who's Right, Who's Left, Who Democrat, Who's Republican, Who's Liberal, Who's Conservative, Who's Christian, Who's Non Christian. Non of that Crap matters, I've shown you guys this pre election discussion and you keep coming back to same crap, over and over and over again....like a car stuck in the mud, you try first gear, if that doesn't work, then your try second, if not then you run through that same gauntlet again instead of get out of the car and seeking help. Our Political system is shot, there are no longer check and balances, because the check and balances lie in the people who are overwhelmed with BS everyday by an information system(The Media) that is owned and operated By the same people who own and operate YOU ( Foreign Bankers) Presidential powers are nothing in comparison to these Capitalistic Banks, the Banking System is a Global Regime. Their Method of operation is loan sharking, For every 1 dollar they have on the books, they are allowed to loan 9. Wall Street needs to be seized for Creating, Harboring and Abetting Domestic Terrorist.

But you know what, it's all Futile , because we live in houses we can't afford, we drives cars we can't afford(which loose about 20 percent it's value the first day you take ownership what a great investment) we live off of other peoples money(credit) I hope the capitalist don't see that, they might call that a socialistic statement, living off of other peoples money. We live to please others, " Neighbor, my Son went to YALE and we ate Biscuits and drank water to get him there, But the funny thing is, after all that time and money spend he still can't get a job, But hey he's a Yale grad. We need the realize we are all in this together, when one fail we all fail.

[ghostofpf1]

You confirm my signature tag line.

Aye and you confirm my suspicions regarding your dubious mentality with every post

Steve

[egneg]

No one is, But you keep putting Bush and Obama in this... , Who's Right, Who's Left, Who Democrat, Who's Republican, Who's Liberal, Who's Conservative, Who's Christian, Who's Non Christian. Non of that Crap matters, I've shown you guys this pre election discussion and you keep coming back to same crap, over and over and over again....like a car stuck in the mud, you try first gear, if that doesn't work, then your try second, if not then you run through that same gauntlet again instead of get out of the car and seeking help. Our Political system is shot, there are no longer check and balances, because the check and balances lie in the people who are overwhelmed with BS everyday by an information system(The Media) that is owned and operated By the same people who own and operate YOU ( Foreign Bankers) Presidential powers are nothing in comparison to these Capitalistic Banks, the Banking System is a Global Regime. Their Method of operation is loan sharking, For every 1 dollar they have on the books, they are allowed to loan 9. Wall Street needs to be seized for Creating, Harboring and Abetting Domestic Terrorist.

But you know what, it's all Futile , because we live in houses we can't afford, we drives cars we can't afford(which loose about 20 percent it's value the first day you take ownership what a great investment) we live off of other peoples money(credit) I hope the capitalist don't see that, they might call that a socialistic statement, living off of other peoples money. We live to please others, " Neighbor, my Son went to YALE and we ate Biscuits and drank water to get him there, But the funny thing is, after all that time and money spend he still can't get a job, But hey he's a Yale grad. We need the realize we are all in this together, when one fail we all fail.

You are talking about the Melliniam generation. Instant gratification is all that matters. The older generation (baby boomers) have worked very hard for the money they earned just to see it wiped out because of these politically correct a-holes. I am fed up with all the crap that is being spewed by politicians regardless of what party affiliations they fall under. They all lie and say what ever is required to get elected. I feel the federal government should be abolished as I think we would all be better off with out it.

[RCprince]

And this is the writing that was inscribed: MENE, MENE, TEKEL, and PARSIN. This is the interpretation of the matter: MENE, God has numbered the days of your kingdom and brought it to an end; TEKEL, you have been weighed on the scales and found wanting; PERES, your kingdom is divided and given to the Medes and Persians

[RCprince]

[Bill-SOCAL]

See all those years of Republican fiscal policy finally took hold and resulted in a surplus while Clinton was in office. Then his disastrous policies caused a huge loss and decline that we are still trying to dig out of today.

We'll be seeing the Bush uptick pretty soon, which Obama will ride out until he leaves office and things go to he!! when the next Republican comes into office and has to cope with the damage that Obama will do squandering away the Bush surplus.

See, it's a cyclic thing.

[Dr. Jet]

Interesting graph. Let's see. Congress controls the budget. Liberals controlled Congress for the past 50 years or so with one exception: the 104th and 105th Congress of 1994 through 2000. Where does that fit in that graph? What is the trend during those years? Hmmmm..........

Bill: What's wrong? You are proving my point that fiscal conservatism is good for the country. Are you feeling OK? Are you shaking off that mental disorder?

[AndyKunz]

your a boater, you should know better, WAKE: 1. The visible track of turbulence left by something moving through water.

2. A track, course, or condition left behind something that has passed

I suggest the falling DOW is more of a BOW WAVE. If you've ever near a REAL boat that is in displacement mode, you definitely now what THAT is!

Andy

[RCprince]

My Solution, Bring all the troops home from abroad, give Guantanamo back to Cuba, Lock down our boarders, kick all the non documented out and the documented and illegal criminals out( we have enough of our own citizen criminals), all the non working illegals out, fortify or Nukes and say F the world take care of your own sh**! Remove all politicians, ALL leave non standing... and start anew.

[Dr. Jet]

With a newer topic.

Seems the (Very Left-Wing) New York Times predicted the Fannie Mae fallout back in 1999. Seems like the Clinton Administration was pushing them to make subprime loans available to those who couldn't afford them.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...5AC0A96F958260

"One of the methods used by statists to destroy capitalism consists in establishing controls that tie a given industry hand and foot, making it unable to solve its problems, then declaring that freedom has failed and stronger controls are necessary."
—Ayn Rand, 1975

These words were written more than 30 years ago, but they apply exactly to today’s financial crisis. Today’s problems are the result of a government-controlled financial and housing system that rewarded irrational behavior and punished responsible behavior. Yet they are being blamed on “the free market”—with more controls offered as the solution.

[egneg]

When I was in college back in the late 70's my economics professor could not stress enough that there is "no free lunch". Everything comes at a cost ... the only variables are WHO pays and WHEN.

[Dr. Jet]

... the only variables are WHO pays and WHEN.

Well, it looks like WHO is going to be you and I; and WHEN is going to be now.

[egneg]

Dr. Jet it has always been you and I ... the silent majority. The politicians are immune, the corporations have lobbyists, the rich have tax shelters, and the welfare folks just sit back and collect. We the hard working middle class pay for all the malarkey that these folks initiate.

[Dr. Jet]

Dr. Jet it has always been you and I ... the silent majority. The politicians are immune, the corporations have lobbyists, the rich have tax shelters, and the welfare folks just sit back and collect. We the hard working middle class pay for all the malarkey that these folks initiate.

I'm tired of being silent! Let's dress up as Indians and start throwing that tea overboard.

[sjslhill]

When I went to Wales, all they talked about was racism in America, all the time the Scotts, Welsh and Britts were all talking trash behind each others back. It was funny to listen to.

Mexico is re-taking over America, that's the real news.

[RCprince]

When I went to Wales, all they talked about was racism in America, all the time the Scotts, Welsh and Britts were all talking trash behind each others back. It was funny to listen to.

Mexico is taking over America, that's the real news.

Mexicans taking over America? actually the Mexicans once had claim to America as Indians and then before them Eskimos then before them as Asians (actually Mongolian and Russian Asians, because India is also in Asia) before them all via the Bering Straits. Seems like it's coming full circle to me.