H&M Hydro Performance?

[10gauge]

Can anyone comment on the performance and stability of the following hydros above 65-70mph:

1. H&M Lobster Hydro (31in)
2. H&M Sport 21 Hydro (31in)
3. H&M Xzess II Evo 2002 Hydro (28in)

I'd like to get a few boats done this winter, and I am trying to decide on a hydro for either a 1521/1Y, 6S or 1515/1Y, 4S setup. I want to build a larger and faster hydro than the DF22 Vortex.

Thanks

[Xzessperated]

Can anyone comment on the performance and stability of the following hydros above 65-70mph:

1. H&M Lobster Hydro (31in)
2. H&M Sport 21 Hydro (31in)
3. H&M Xzess II Evo 2002 Hydro (28in)

I'd like to get a few boats done this winter, and I am trying to decide on a hydro for either a 1521/1Y, 6S or 1515/1Y, 4S setup. I want to build a larger and faster hydro than the DF22 Vortex.

Thanks

I have a H&M Xzess II Evo and I have had it to 75mph. At 65 to 70 it is quite stable. If you PM andym on this forum he has a great video of his in a small pond that will show you the handlng at speed. I have to go to work or I would search for the video link for you. Ask him for the link

[andym]

I can not say about the first two but 70mph is SAW speeds with any of these, I know from experiance that 65mph is achievable with the XS2. Do a search on it and you will find what I mean. You could PM xzessperated ( Paddy ) he has two of them both very fast. The xs2 will do 65 with a Feigao xl motor a good esc and nice prop.

[egneg]

Paddy, Andy ... I have never seen a better passing of the buck!

[andym]

Sorry Paddy you beat me to the punch here is the link, please remember this was it's trial run. On later runs the hop is gone and the steering rate slowed somewhat. It also got alot faster.http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=e5EHpaUmqns

[andym]

I must say that after watching that old video I miss that boat, a small package and when done properly has a great wow factor.

[andym]

Hey Chuck me and the Padster praticed that, worked like a treat, Just goes to show that you do not need great minds to think alike!

[andym]

Sorry for hijacking the post 10gauge the Dentist

[10gauge]

Andym and Paddy, thanks for the advice and link. What a great run guys!

It's great if a Feigao XL motor can push 65mph. I've got an 8XL I start off with on 4S.
I don't have good pictures of these hulls, but it seems space is going to be tight for a 4S/5000 Lipo pack. Where did you have the COG?

[andym]

With the XS2 you cut the rear carbon boom were it goes through the tub and make brackets to fix both sides of boom to inside of hull. Then there is lots of room for 4s and even 5s. I ran mine with a hydra 240 supended from the tub roof over the packs and my CoG was approx 11/2" behind the sponson and in a line through the middle of the turn fin. The best turn fin I found after trying quite a few was the small size Taipan turn fin. With a 8xl I would start with a detounged S&b x645 and hold on. I know people will say start smaller but with a 7xl an x642 will go race distance easily. There is not much drag when set up properly and you could go up to a 47mm prop if you just wnet flat out for 5 laps and stoped.
Paddy should chime in with some pics of what I mean. Hope this helps.

[Xzessperated]

Andym and Paddy, thanks for the advice and link. What a great run guys!

It's great if a Feigao XL motor can push 65mph. I've got an 8XL I start off with on 4S.
I don't have good pictures of these hulls, but it seems space is going to be tight for a 4S/5000 Lipo pack. Where did you have the COG?

If you modify an Xzess 2 you can get a 6s pack in it. I have run 6s on a 1515 1.5y motor for about 12 months now. I would not recommend that setup for oval racing though. I only have my gps to race so I just do a few laps and let it cool and then send it out again. That is the setup I used to run 75mph.
For COG lay the boat upside down and place a ruler an the back of the sponsons and draw a line on the main hull while holding the ruler in this position. Then measure back 1 1/2 inches (towards the transom) and that is a good starting point. Then adjust your weight to suit the speed. The faster you go the more you move the weight forward. I had several blow overs until I got my COG correct but it is a strong hull and I have never had any damage. Andy and I went about solving the blow over issue in different ways. I put fishing sinkers in the nose and Andy made air dams out of soft drink bottles and glued them on the sponson spreaders. I now own Andys old boat and I like his way better because you end up with a lighter boat.
I can post pictures of the battery mod and air dams if you want.
I hope this helps.

[andym]

*!***!***!***!** Paddy we have done it again, it must like when woman have there monthly cycle at the same time, SCARRY

[Xzessperated]

LOL. Why do we keep positng almost ther same thing at the same time Andy? Maybe we are becoming twins.

[Xzessperated]

*!***!***!***!** Paddy we have done it again, it must like when woman have there monthly cycle at the same time, SCARRY

You might be a woman Andy but I am all man and have my pictures on AdultFriendFinder to prove it.

[andym]

Paddy I went looking for that photo, found it in the men seeking men section! Now I realy have to wonder about you.

[10gauge]

... Hey you two, it must be the Australian connection?!
Paddy & Andym, if you have pictures, that would be great. I agree, H&M hulls are gernerally very light and strong. Thanks for the COG starting point.

Someone mentioned that at speeds above 50mph the Lobster and XzessII hydros are twitchy unless it's on very smooth water since the sponsons are mechanically attached to the hull and are inflexible at absorbing any chop. How smooth was the water for you to hit 75mph? These are fantastic speeds...

[10gauge]

It seems that the H&M Lobster may have more room at the front. But it is less sleek compared to the XzessII. As far as the XzessIII goes, you can't mount any HW on the transom, unless you epoxy an adjoining connector... That will surely break off after the first flip over!

I think that the H&M Lobster and XzessII are the way to go. Are you guys using Speedmaster HW?

[andym]

Yes I read that on RRR and in my opinion it is bull*!***!***!***!**. The sponsons are held with carbon booms through glass tubes. Yes the body goes over these but only for the looks. The xs2 has quite a bit of flex in this area and I have run it very fast on what could only desrcribed as poor water conditions. When set up well they skim over the lumps and ride flat and true. As a matter of interest my Whiplash sport 20 can not run as well on chop at slightly lower speeds.
I started with the Solinger hydro set up and then changed to a mix of Fullers rudder and speedmaster strut. The solinger was nice to look at but the rudder floged out on the pin very quickly. The adjustment verticaly that I could get on the Fullers rudder was a big help in setting the hull up well.

[10gauge]

That's reassuring to know! If the XzessII is doing comparatively well against a proven sport hydro like the Whiplash, then that's saying a lot. I am looking forward to building one of these real soon. Thanks for sharing your experience with this rigger.

[andym]

Not a problem and I think Paddy will chip in with some pics soon, hopefuly of the rigger and not himself!

[Xzessperated]

At 75mph I never run on anything more than a slight ripple. You never know when a breeze coming from the wrong direction will pick the nose of the boat up at that speed and you are entering into a speed area that can break boats if they hit the water the wrong way.
I also read that comment on RRR and I can not agree with it. These little hulls handle well if setup right.

[Xzessperated]

I will do some pics at work tonight and post them tomorrow

[10gauge]

And thank you too, Paddy. It's great to hear that you guys are doing warp 2 with these setups.

On the FDM site, it appears that the XzessII has those internal rods you mentioned which may allow better flexure in the sponsons. The Lobster Hydro doesn't flex around any rods, it's a bonded epoxy attachment.

I'd love to see some pictures, whenever you get the chance... Great food for thought here, guys!...

[Ub Hauled]

I own a Lobster, she's getting big, I may cook her soon...
LOL
just kidding, my Lobster is not completely ready for water yet, I need a little more
painting (window & turbine) and a good clear over it... I have a 1521/1D that will find
home there, the problem will be fitting the cells in it. I think it'll be 3s1p for now.

[10gauge]

Lobster bake?... I'll be there! :)
Ub, that 1521/1D is a monster of a motor on amps. What are the dimensions up front? I am wondering if a 4S1P/5000/25C can fit on these hydros?...

[Xzessperated]

Here are the pictures of the mod that lets you run up to a 6s battery in an Xs2. The battery will also slide almost to the nose with this mod so it gives you much more control over COG.



You can see Andy has cut the front CF boom and is holding it in place with some strong ply that is glued to the main hull



The next thing Andy has done is to cut out a section of soft drink bottle in the shape of an air dams and double sided taped them to the sponson spreaders.





I have purchased this hull off Andy and have driven it at 65mph and there is no sign of blow over with these air dams added. In my first Xs2 I added 3 fishing sinkers in the nose of the boat to do the same thing.
If you need more pics of anything to do with Xs2 or Xs3 let me know. Only too happy to help.

[10gauge]

Fantastic photos Paddy! This really helps demystify the whole process. By the way, how did you end up with the strut end in terms of height, angle? Did you find it necessary to mount it centerline or slightly to the right to correct for any propwalk? If it's not much trouble, do have a photo of the rear of the hydro?

I am thinking of using 0.150 flex and ultimately a 1515/1Y and 4S/5000/25C in 1P. It's nice to see that there is some versatility for space in dialing in the right COG.

Thanks again.

[Xzessperated]

Fantastic photos Paddy! This really helps demystify the whole process. By the way, how did you end up with the strut end in terms of height, angle? Did you find it necessary to mount it centerline or slightly to the right to correct for any propwalk? If it's not much trouble, do have a photo of the rear of the hydro?

I am thinking of using 0.150 flex and ultimately a 1515/1Y and 4S/5000/25C in 1P. It's nice to see that there is some versatility for space in dialing in the right COG.

Thanks again.

COG is important in all boats but at these speed it is very important to stop blow overs and damage to the hull.

I got a picture of the transom side on but forgot to take one end on. I will do that later. The bottom of the strut is 20mm below the bottom of the hull. It is best to start at 0 degrees for angle. You might play with the angle but I think you will return to somewhere near 0 degrees. As you can see there is nothing trick about the hardware.

[ksm2001]

Like the pop bottle spoilers to keep the nose down will definitely try that in the spring, thanks Andy and Paddy. 10 gauge here is an inside shot of how I set mine up, just some more info for you. I took the Rx pack out the back due to the cg and am using a ubec or can put it up front to add some weight but like the idea of the pop bottle, cool.

Ken

[andym]

You can see from the pic of the yelow one that the rudder is kicked out at the bottom by a few degree's. You will find that this induces some lift to help with blow overs and also puts downward pressure on the inside sponson during a turn, this helps keeping it planted and the turn fin hooked up so as to turn well. Ksm2001 I would run my motor a bit further forward than you have, what is the CoG like?