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Thread: 1/10 scale motor options... so now what?

  1. #61

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    Paul you guys can't possibly use a ESC restriction successfully. And with 3656 motors? That will never work, right fellas??
    This guy in Ga. preached that for years and was beat up pretty good for it. The "motor is the fuse" mentality took over and is exactly what eventually brought us to the motor party. Go ahead guys, say it isn't so...

    Paul, you owe me an apology for dragging me back into this discussion..
    TOY BOAT RACER
    IMPBA Dist.13 Director
    IMPBA National Records Director 2009-2019
    IMPBA 19887CD
    NAMBA 1169

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Smock View Post
    Paul you guys can't possibly use a ESC restriction successfully. And with 3656 motors? That will never work, right fellas??
    This guy in Ga. preached that for years and was beat up pretty good for it. The "motor is the fuse" mentality took over and is exactly what eventually brought us to the motor party. Go ahead guys, say it isn't so...

    Paul, you owe me an apology for dragging me back into this discussion..
    Ahhhh Doug ya know it's not the same without you.

    Something else I forgot to mention earlier............

    A non boater friend of mine asked me the other day what was new and how the boating stuff was going. Told him a little about this current "discussion" about limits and lengths and how we are so close yet so far at the same time. Said biggest thing was the talk of lengths, how some said 56mm and some of us want to go to 60mm to significantly up the choices. He stopped me and said from "what to what?" I said 56 to 60mm. He replied "So a 4mm difference. You guys are hung up on a touch over 1/8th of an inch?"

    Ummmm....

    1/8th of an inch.
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

  3. #63

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    Sorry for dragging ,you back in mate.

    As an industrial electrician, I would maintain that the motor/prop is the load & the ESC is akin to a fuse. As I'm sure most people would. And as I'm sure you did.

    But yes the restricted ESC works well for us. We can get two races out of one single 5000mah 4s pack with the setup described in my previous post.

    Below is a typical Restricted Sports Hydro race for a bit of a comparison.
    Most of the boats are Whip 30's or the GP 310. Even the Insane 30 has raced in this class. The yellow boat is an H&M Lifter I think
    Sure. The speeds are a bit slower than you guys. But that's the idea. The racing can be extremely close, & bags of fun.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qo_dILHJeu0

  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by don ferrette View Post
    Ahhhh Doug ya know it's not the same without you.

    Something else I forgot to mention earlier............

    A non boater friend of mine asked me the other day what was new and how the boating stuff was going. Told him a little about this current "discussion" about limits and lengths and how we are so close yet so far at the same time. Said biggest thing was the talk of lengths, how some said 56mm and some of us want to go to 60mm to significantly up the choices. He stopped me and said from "what to what?" I said 56 to 60mm. He replied "So a 4mm difference. You guys are hung up on a touch over 1/8th of an inch?"

    Ummmm....

    1/8th of an inch.
    Did you tell your friend that 62mm is too long? So in reality it’s a 1/16” that makes the difference between the right direction vs the wrong direction.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by longballlumber View Post
    Did you tell your friend that 62mm is too long? So in reality it’s a 1/16” that makes the difference between the right direction vs the wrong direction.
    LOL!! Nah at that point I'm standing thinking in my head are we really duking it out over 1/8th of an inch?
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

  6. #66

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    So.......how do you verify that a 45 amp speedo is truly a 45 amp speedo? Sticker? Good plan. Oh! I know! How about manufacturers rating?!?! Cuz that worked so well with the AQ motors. Two motors with the same stampings with different windings. But sure why not? We can trust manufacturers of the lowest end esc to build them all exactly the same. If yer not hearing the note of sarcasm it's cuz its tough to convey in text form. You guys are too smart for this.

    Gas motors and nitro motors are both dimensionaly limited. There's only so much I can do to a .67 nitro motor before it fails. Am I insane here or do they have unlimited power? Why does a limit on a electric motor size freak people out? Please. Somebody explain the apprehension to me because I do NOT understand it.
    glue sniffer

  7. #67

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    Just having fun with it now Terry. Paul knows that won't work. Don't tell the guys they are failing Paul. Oh wait, never mind!

    I'm not suggesting you go there Terry. That ship has sailed..

    Not freaked out BTW. It still is what it is.
    TOY BOAT RACER
    IMPBA Dist.13 Director
    IMPBA National Records Director 2009-2019
    IMPBA 19887CD
    NAMBA 1169

  8. #68

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    Hey I have an idea. Limit the Battery. Say 3000mah limit per 1 heat. Not hard to tech battery. If there is a question of how many mah
    someone used just take the pack and charge it. if it goes past 3000mah. You are disqualified. Efficiency is the key. Big motor big amps. This scenario would limit the amps used in a race. A guy could run a Neu 1521 or a Lehner if they wanted. They are limited to 3000mah per race. That's about 120 average amps per race. If that's to High then drop it to 2500. That's 100 amps average. If you want an easy way to control power limit the fuel. Heck make it 2000mah. 80 amps average. Don't give me crap that guys need the weight. Just add it then. Not in batteries though. And don't give me crap about "c" ratings. A 2000mah pack with a 70c rating should be good for 140 amps.

  9. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by photohoward1 View Post
    Hey I have an idea. Limit the Battery. Say 3000mah limit per 1 heat. Not hard to tech battery. If there is a question of how many mah
    someone used just take the pack and charge it. if it goes past 3000mah. You are disqualified. Efficiency is the key. Big motor big amps. This scenario would limit the amps used in a race. A guy could run a Neu 1521 or a Lehner if they wanted. They are limited to 3000mah per race. That's about 120 average amps per race. If that's to High then drop it to 2500. That's 100 amps average. If you want an easy way to control power limit the fuel. Heck make it 2000mah. 80 amps average. Don't give me crap that guys need the weight. Just add it then. Not in batteries though. And don't give me crap about "c" ratings. A 2000mah pack with a 70c rating should be good for 140 amps.
    Oh hell no. That opens a bigger can of worms than the idea of ESC ratings. What if you jump the start and have to do and extra lap. Or the water's real rough. Or you pick a leaf or something that you can still keep running but creates extra drag. Who's mah checker or charger are ya gonna use? Is it accurate? Geez people WHY is this being made to be so frikkin' complicated?? Like Terry says why does a simple limit on a electric motor size freak people out? What if, what if, what if all these what if scenarios. ENOUGH ALREADY!!!! KISS principle fellas keep it simple and EASY to understand. You measure the motor diameter and length, it's either legal or it's not. END OF STORY!! No lists, no meters, no gray area. You over complicate stuff like this and then wonder why no newbies wanna try it. SMH.......
    Last edited by don ferrette; 12-16-2018 at 02:49 PM.
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by photohoward1 View Post
    Hey I have an idea. Limit the Battery. Say 3000mah limit per 1 heat. Not hard to tech battery. If there is a question of how many mah
    someone used just take the pack and charge it. if it goes past 3000mah. You are disqualified. Efficiency is the key. Big motor big amps. This scenario would limit the amps used in a race. A guy could run a Neu 1521 or a Lehner if they wanted. They are limited to 3000mah per race. That's about 120 average amps per race. If that's to High then drop it to 2500. That's 100 amps average. If you want an easy way to control power limit the fuel. Heck make it 2000mah. 80 amps average. Don't give me crap that guys need the weight. Just add it then. Not in batteries though. And don't give me crap about "c" ratings. A 2000mah pack with a 70c rating should be good for 140 amps.
    Threw you guys a similar idea in post #39. Howard is right in this respect, limit the available fuel, limit the max potential speed vs runtime. It also means no limits on the motor, run what ever you want, you still have to balance the package to finish a race! If you run 5000mah packs there is only so much power (fuel) available for use. Sure there are always those who will use 95% of available charge, but in that lies the real problem, those who will always want to push the absolute limits, even to the point of cheating to win. Win what? A model boat race of course! Gets you back to standing there wondering why so much debate over 1/8".
    NZMPBA 2013, 2016 Open Electric Champion. NZMPBA 2016 P Offshore Champion.
    2016 SUHA Q Sport Hydro Hi Points Champion.
    BOPMPBC Open Mono, Open Electric Champion.

  11. #71

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    I guess I'm just glad that all the guys here are honest. We don't need to worry about people using other than what the rules say.
    A plastic $20.00 trophy is all we are playing for. If someone want's to cheat to win that, then "I pity the fool"

  12. #72

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    Ya know Don is right. Make it simple. Make it a P class...
    TOY BOAT RACER
    IMPBA Dist.13 Director
    IMPBA National Records Director 2009-2019
    IMPBA 19887CD
    NAMBA 1169

  13. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Smock View Post
    Ya know Don is right. Make it simple. Make it a P class...
    Funny and not funny at the same time..............
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

  14. #74

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    Why are we doomed to keep doing the same stupid stuff over and over..........

    This is just like when we (IMPBA) moved to eliminate the LS and XLS engine divisions in the gas classes. Just like now there were a few very vocal doomsdayers who kept coming up with all these what ifs and nightmare possible scenarios. My favorite was how someone was gonna show up with some super duper custom mega dollar billet monster motor and all the Zenoah racers were gonna get their butts handed to them. Well cooler and smarter heads prevailed and it got passed. Guess what? Turned out to be one of the best things to happen for the gas classes. And those doomsday scenarios?? Nada. Zip. Zilch. Zero. The same guys winning before kept on winning. The best prepared best driven boats still prevailed and the good 'ol affordable Zenoah is still to this day the most winning gas motor ever.

    Smart thing here is to set a dimensional limit, pull the pin on a one year trial and see how it plays out. KISS principle.....

    I know what I'm going to do in penning the motor limitations for the 1/10 scale rules for D12 and mark my words, we're gonna have FUN running it.
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

  15. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by don ferrette View Post

    I know what I'm going to do in penning the motor limitations for the 1/10 scale rules for D12 and mark my words, we're gonna have FUN running it.
    Go for it!
    This class and the others should be managed at the club/ District level anyway. Tony I need that suit!!
    TOY BOAT RACER
    IMPBA Dist.13 Director
    IMPBA National Records Director 2009-2019
    IMPBA 19887CD
    NAMBA 1169

  16. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Smock View Post
    Go for it!
    This class and the others should be managed at the club/ District level anyway. Tony I need that suit!!
    Hope this attachment works! xXvIkTu08XQLC.jpg

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

  17. #77

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    Curious, which direction will you be running in D12?

  18. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by longballlumber View Post
    Curious, which direction will you be running in D12?
    Mike virtually all (one said either way is fine) that have given me feedback and looking to run this class want clockwise so that is going to be how we go.... for now. I have told all who are building or getting ready to put a turn fin backing plate on BOTH sides so if this goes organization wide we will be ready for either way with a few simple changes.
    Giant Power Team Driver
    - IMPBA Hydro Technical Director - IMPBA District 12 Scale Director -

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