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Thread: 1981 Pay-N-Pak Build

  1. #1
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    Default 1981 Pay-N-Pak Build

    I decided I would document this build of an 1/8 Scale Pay-n-Pak hydro. First, a little background. I won this hull in a race Mr. Jim Vaughn put on at least a couple years ago if not more. There is no telling how long the hull sat in his garage before that. I did some research on it when I initially won the boat and it appears it was built by a guy up in the N.E. who has long since passed away. I will try and find the old post that had that information about the boat. So, the boat has never seen the water ever and is at least a couple of decades old. We can say at this point the fiberglass is nice and hard.

    So, the boat is going to be a project to get in working order, but should be fun build. I will be asking a lot of questions this is only my second 1/8 scale to assemble and my first with tail feathers (lots of questions coming about how to anchor all that down).

    She is going to be set up to run 8s with a Neu 1527 1.5y motor. Early this morning I ordered the Motor and all the associated hardware (Thanks OSE), so that should be in later in the week. I did have a Castle 2028 motor I was going to drop in there, but it is really a better 10s motor. As all my projects start, I dug through my parts drawer seeing how I could put this together with out spending much on it. After contemplating it, I decided to get all new hardware for her and do a good job of it.

    Here are some initial pictures. I spent quite a bit of time figuring out the CG and the battery/motor placement. After some thought the only place to really get the batteries up front enough was in the hull. I cut holes up front to slide the batteries in. I hate dealing with difficult to reach batteries, so I built some sliding trays with some pieces of angled aluminium and a bit of fiberglass and wood. The trays will slide out about 2.5 inches and will strap down with a small bit of velcro underneath. That coupled with the tray should keep them in place. When you slide them inward the batteries will be completely in the hull. I am going to wait on epoxying the trays in there until further into the build and re-check the CG.

    I also beefed up and filled in some plywood holes with some 1/8 plywood where the motor will mount. Originally, I was thinking 5" mount with the Castle Motor, but now with the Neu I might just do a floor mount.
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    Last edited by electric; 09-22-2018 at 11:21 AM.

  2. #2
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    So this weekend, will be spent doing some sanding and basically filling in areas etc. I have a few items on my list that also need to be taken care of:
    1. I need a set of 1/8 scale decals for the boat.
    2. Kinda pondering putting Carbon fiber in the interior of the boat to give it a nice finished look. I have done this before on several boats, but this one looks challenging because of the arc of the hull and also the many holes on the sidewalls. If you have worked with this stuff it can be a challenge to cut cleanly. It's been awhile since I bought carbon fiber, any suggestions on where to get a roll of it? Still not sure I am going to do it.
    Some more pics to get it all started. I made the exhaust about a year ago and it's just been waiting for the boat to be built. LOL

    More pics, and the othe 8th scale I built that is probably going to be cruising around the course in the Dallas Nats next month. That boat is unique as well. It's a fiberglass Dumas Hull. Has a lot of lift in it so I run it with an air dam underneath. Just ran it last week in heavy chop and it did ok going about 55mph. Not going to win any races, but fun to watch it go!
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    Last edited by electric; 09-22-2018 at 11:31 AM.

  3. #3
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    Have you weighed the bare hull? And 1/8 so 45”? Ish. I ask as I also have one here and also thought 2028 but then also have the 1527. Going 2028 it was gonna get on the heavy side. I hear under 16lbs is best.

    Shawn

    BTW: good to see another old big hydro going on the bench.

  4. #4
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    I have not weighed or measured it, but I will do so and let you know. It "feels" pretty light compared to my shovel nose. I initially ran the shovel nose with a 2028, 10s and it ran great, then I switched over to a lighter motor similar to the Neu (8s) because of the requirements for the Nationals in Dallas next month. Either way it works fine, just changed out the props. The additional weight is actually welcomed as these boats tend to want to take off and fly anyway.

    So, today was a lot of sanding (first round) and also boxing in the front of the boat to strengthen it a bit and also just make it look better.

    I have some issues to resolve. One, the glass is not soaked all the way through with resin in this one spot and also a lot of "nicks" that need to be filled in. This along with the normal pin holes and other issues that need to be smoothed out.
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    Last edited by electric; 09-22-2018 at 07:10 PM.

  5. #5
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    A few more pics...
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    Nice progression.

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    Oh no! Somebody forgot the spar.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tetefroid View Post
    Oh no! Somebody forgot the spar.
    Spar? What's missing?

    Are you talking about the pole that goes from the hull to the sponsons? This is interesting. There are two different pictures of the 81 Pay-n-pak. One with the pole and another with a wing. Perhaps some modifications was made to the boat in 81? All the pics come from the Hydroplane museum website. All three below are labeled 81 pay-n-pak.
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    Last edited by electric; 09-27-2018 at 07:30 AM.

  9. #9
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    In every one of those pictures there is a spar, just two of those pictures the spar is covered by the airfoil.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tetefroid View Post
    In every one of those pictures there is a spar, just two of those pictures the spar is covered by the airfoil.
    Agree, I was just confirming that "spar" was the pole in the picture. I am going to get an aluminum tube put in for sure. Thanks for the call out.

    The progress continues. It may not look like it, but there has been a LOT of epoxy, fiberglass, bondo, and beefing up going on. Sand, apply, Sand Apply..etc. I am ready to put on the first coat of primer to figure out what little things I have missed. Hopefully, with good weather and time I will do that tomorrow.

    Nothing beats a box of stuff from OSE! Shout out to the maker of this motor mount. This quick release mount is nice. One Bolt at the top and then unclamp and pull out. Will put on the water jacket later.

    I am going to start roughing in the drive line, rudder, turn fin etc. to get all my holes drilled before I paint the boat. The stickers have all been ordered as well.
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  11. #11
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    hmmm.. Looks like I got too big of a strut. I could cut it down, but might just buy another..
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  12. #12
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    If your building it as a scale boat, the strut will be going down thru the bottom inside the transom anyway. Cut the top off the strut and if for some reason such as broken or bent strut. You can loosen the brackets and let the strut slide down and out thru the bottom of the hull.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by leonard feeback View Post
    If your building it as a scale boat, the strut will be going down thru the bottom inside the transom anyway. Cut the top off the strut and if for some reason such as broken or bent strut. You can loosen the brackets and let the strut slide down and out thru the bottom of the hull.
    Yes sir, I just had it on the outside to gauge the depth it would be at when set up. I pondered it a bit yesterday evening and while I could cut it to size, I think I am going to put it in the parts drawer for the next project and I ordered another one that is a better fit.

    So, getting staged up for the 1st round of Primer. Respirator, Acetone, Primer, filters, mixing cups, etc. You want to ensure you have everything you will need right in front of you once you get rolling. I have pole in my backyard that years ago was for the kids. It makes a perfect platform to hang a boat off and paint. Just some coat hanger wire and a few cuts and the pieces will be hanging.

    Luckily, my wife's father was a master woodworker and she grew up around never ending projects and a couple of homes built from scratch. So, she is used to the noise and mess and really does not complain much. I used to primer inside my workshop in the garage with a pretty elaborate homemade filtration and painting booth. The primer has a stink to it that is pretty intolerable compared to the other paints, so I prefer to do this part outside. Going to be a two step process meaning I will prime it, fill in some more holes and things I missed, sand it and primer it one last time.

    Waiting for mid-day for some lower humidity and warmer temps. There is some rain in the forecast so I will hope for the best. Texas weather.
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    Last edited by electric; 09-28-2018 at 09:07 AM.

  14. #14
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    All right! Got the first coat of primer on. As expected I found quite a few areas of pinholes that need some work, but all part of the process. Painting for me can sometimes go smoothly and sometimes it is a battle. Today was very smooth with the exception of I went to plug in the air hose to the gun and discovered I must have taken the quick release piece off the gun some time ago. Quick rush back into the garage to find one to screw on to the gun so I could get started. Luckily, I actually have a drawer of these brass attachments so it was not too bad.

    I think I am going to fill in those wood inserts I put in the hull on the sides where I was going to mount the motor at first. Make it look a bit nicer. I am still pondering putting in some black carbon fiber at least on the floor of the hull and maybe up a 1/2" inch on the side. Really no reason to, but it would look pretty nice.

    So, that is it for today. I have a busy weekend planned so not much will happen unless I get some time on Sunday afternoon.
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  15. #15
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    Looking good Jim!

    I do have question and favor. I’m needing get a motor mount for my new 8th scale. I was going to ask if you could see if that HET motor you have would fit in this motor mount?

  16. #16
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    So, long pause because of the Nationals race in Dallas. Started working on the pay-n-pak again today. First I did a lot of pin hole and imperfections work with the putty. I will be doing another round of sanding and another primer layer in the near future.

    I started working on the tail feathers tonight. Decided to use break away nylon screws just about everywhere. If I blow it over I don’t see it keeping together. Rather have it come apart than break.

    Still have to mount the horizontal stabilizer. Have not quite decided how to go about that yet.

    After I get the tail feathers done I will set up the rudder, motor and turn fin.

    The decals are inbound so good news there.


  17. #17
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    Moving along. Got the rudder installed, the support bars in place, but not mounted yet. Also got the drive line roughed in. Checking the CG with all the equipment and everything looks good.

    Only thing left is to thread the metal for the turn fin and then back to the paint prep work. Starting to come together a bit. I mounted the tail fin assembly with all breakaway nylon bolts. Not sure if that is the way to go, or to put in real bolts maybe on the cross wires where they mount to the hull and the rest break away. If this thing flips I pretty much don's see the tail feathers surviving very well. Anybody recommend anything on this topic?
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    Last edited by electric; 11-17-2018 at 08:45 AM.

  18. #18
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    I just started following this, you have a wonderful build going. There's something about these older hydros, they look good on the water.

    Thought for you, will the tail fin assembly float? Be gone after it breaks away if not.

    Your motor, esc and battery setup is really well done.

    Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

  19. #19
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    Default 1981 Pay-N-Pak Build

    Quote Originally Posted by sammyha View Post
    I just started following this, you have a wonderful build going. There's something about these older hydros, they look good on the water.

    Thought for you, will the tail fin assembly float? Be gone after it breaks away if not.

    Your motor, esc and battery setup is really well done.

    Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk
    I am not sure if the tail will float. Going test that out in the tub. Not sure what I can do to improve that situation. Best I think is to try and seal up the edges where the screw holes are. Not enough room to do much else.

    Maybe I will hard anchor the cross wires to the hull, do they do not add weight to the assembly if it comes off.


    I have an old slo-mo-shun shovel nose I run now and I agree they have a cool “look” going across the water. I ran it in the Dallas Nationals a month ago and a couple of people came up to me and told me the same thing. Not the fastest on the water, but fun to run!

  20. #20
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    It's a slow steady process. Taking a leisurely pace building this boat for sure with the holidays etc. So, not much too see here, but a lot of filling and sanding going on and another layer of primer. Still found a few spots that showed up that I want to take care of, but getting pretty darn close to putting down the color, stickers and clear. I placed the stickers out on the hull and did some trimming of those to get ready, but found I was missing the cowling decal! Crud. This will be a delay for sure, but I will wait for them. I got some nice decals for the fins, but pretty sure they will not look good trying to lay them over the leading edge of the tail (the orange and black part of the tail). Probably, I will need to make another trip to the paint store to see if they can color match some paint to the decal.

    I tell you, painting with auto paint is an expensive process. I bought, ppg primer, white paint, clear and a few other small items and it was 200 dollars. Buying the orange paint I am discussing will surely cost an extra 50 to 75 dollars. The interesting thing is I am having an auto shop paint a brand new Q-hydro for me as we speak and they are telling me 200 dollars?!? Which seems very low to me, but it gives me some idea how much cheaper they get the paint for than me. The typical paint shop prices I have heard around this areas is more like 300 to 400 dollars for a boat. So all over the the board with pricing. I would have them paint this boat for me, but it involves not only painting, but getting the stickers down before the clear. Not sure if they are up to doing that.

    At any rate, here is where we are at this point.
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    Last edited by electric; 01-06-2019 at 10:44 AM.

  21. #21
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    About painting... So, my best clear coating has come out ok, my worst has been awful. I have been hanging my boats from a coat hanger and spraying them this way. We have another guy in our club who does beautiful work and he is telling me he uses a big rotisserie essentially so he can rotate the boat and have it always laying horizontal rather than vertical like I have. Seems like a pretty big thing as far as allowing you to lay down a nice coat of clear and not have it run on you. Interested in how others deal with this and is it still possible to get a nice clear job vertically. I am contemplating building some type of "rig" to clear the boat horizontally.

  22. #22
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    Looking good...

  23. #23
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    So, slowly, but surely, the boat is coming along. This is the fun part. Just picked it up from the painters and it's starting to look like a Pay-N-Pak hydro! I just stuck the fins on for a quick set of pictures. Now the re-assembly begins, but a major hurtle(paint job) is behind me. The painter forgot to apply the Pay-N-Pak small letters on the turn fins, which is not a big deal. I will just apply those over the clear and it should not pop out much at all. The funny thing is he missed that, but managed to get the leading edge of the turn fins (orange stripe) done. This was tough to do because there were two decals for each turn fin and you have to bring the sticker around the front to make it one solid leading edge turn fin stripe. He did a great job on that.
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  24. #24
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    One of my favorite hulls..!! Looks awesome...!!!!

  25. #25
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    Just to add to the history of this boat. 4 years ago when I got this boat I asked around and found who the builder was and rough idea of when it was built.

    Internationalswaters posts when I asked back in 2014:

    Crazy that was my boat from 2005. It was bought off of ebay and the deck was all one piece no cut out for the engine well. I had to make the engine rails and lip to hold cowling. I was told it was made by Troy Mcintyre who was from Washington State. It has been at least 15 years or more in the making, but this boat will get to the water.
    https://www.muellersfuneralhomes.com...s_redirected=1

  26. #26
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    I love the story behind this project! Stay with it, it has to happen...

    Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

  27. #27
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    Here it is. Just about ready for it's first maiden run. I have a few very small things to do, but it is basically complete! Will try and get some shots of it in the water to wrap it up! Only took 7 months! LOL
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  28. #28
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    Sweet! Very nice job, way too go! I would love to see video of it after you get it trimmed and running good.

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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammyha View Post
    Sweet! Very nice job, way too go! I would love to see video of it after you get it trimmed and running good.

    Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk
    Will get a video of it when I get it out running.

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