** New Zelos 48 Brushless Large Scale Cat From Pro Boat**

[Rafael_Lopez]

Oh, my bad! I get my Zelos mixed up, sorry.

Yes, the Zelos 48 ESC will work on 7s with auto detect. It will detect 4-8s.

[98Corvette]

OSE8 connector with red housing or Castle 6.5 polarized green connectors are what I'm considering...

[Rafael_Lopez]

Anything larger than the stock 5mm bullets will work just fine. Looks like you are on the right track, though I've never used either connectors. But I'm sure they will both be up to the duty.

[Rafael_Lopez]

Some round and round practice with the Zelos 36 on a NAMBA course. I was able to hold full throttle through the turns, only letting off enter in the turn to let the boat settle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7RNM8sjKtk

[IRON-PAWW]

I just picked this boat (Zelos 48) up locally. Extremely Nice!

At the Moment I have some 6S 5500mah Revolectrix silver label Lipo's to put in it. So - If I put on the larger of the props that came with it, that will be better for 6S running?

I take it the boat will perform much better at 8S with a prop to suit?

What 6S props could I try? Seeing as I only have 6S batts at the moment. I have a bag of props on my shelf and Just wondering what I could shoot for. I'll see if anything I have might fit the bill. Got a load of Octura stuff (m445, M545) etc etc and then a load of CNC stuff.

EDIT:
Props I found I had.

Octura X646/3
Octura M447
Octura M445
Octura M545

CNC 4814 - seems to be the closest match to the bigger prop that comes in the box

[Rafael_Lopez]

The larger prop is for 6s. This is noted in the manual. If you want to look at the manual on line, it is available on the product site under resources, or manuals and support.

The boat comes with a 48 and a 52mm prop, both are 1.4 pitch. The boat comes stock with the smaller prop because most people will run 8s on it. With lower voltage, the amperage decreases, which means you can prop it higher. The props you listed are too small, considering the props the boat comes with. The 646/s may be a good choice for 8s, though I haven't tried it though. I've tried a detongued 450/3 and its too much prop on 8s. The boat prop walks horribly.

If you end up propping too high, the boat will let you know. It will start to prop walk horribly, whipping the back end side to side as it's running.

Hope that helps! :)

[IRON-PAWW]

Thanks Rafael. That sure does help. I did actually find the info on the props in the manual when I sat down to read every section properly. Is there instructions on programming the ESC with a transmitter? Looked through what I have and can't see it.

My 52mm prop came a little rough, with some lumps and bumps on it. Luck of the draw I guess but working on props has always been decidedly hit and miss for me. Will try working on it and see where I end up. Might just see if I can get a CNC prop for it too just in the beginning.

Just so I know what path will be better to go down for me getting extra gear for this boat. Does it ultimately perform better on 8S? Or - with correct prop choice, there's not much difference between 8S and 6S?

I'll need a few extra LiPo's to go with what I've got either way.

So if I'm looking at 6S initially - can I go any more aggressive than that 52mm 1.4 pitch? Or not recommended? Just thought if I'm ordering props anyway....

Cheers muchly for your help.

[IRON-PAWW]

All right! So Rafael won't be drawn on how you should run the boat beyond the included 48mm prop on 8S and the included 52mm prop on 6S. Fair enough. Beyond that you make your own decisions on how to prop the boat, and then Rc boating community discusses what they find right here.

So I bought this boat because it is frequently too windy where I live to get a decent run with my smaller electrics. The 36in Ariane I run does well but beyond that it can be tough going for my small 30-ish inch hulls. Plus - my local RC boating club is filled with much larger gas powered boats which fairly tear up the water and can power through the windy conditions. So - the truth is that electrics are generally sneered at in my neck of the woods. Most people here regard them as small, unpowerful boats that gotta get out of the way when the gassers arrive.

I aim to change all that.

I've looked at larger hulls for some time. But the honest truth is that most require pretty serious work before they even get near the water - unless you have the hull built for you at reasonable expense. The skill and time required to build such boats is something I just do not have. Maybe when I retire it'll be different, but until then.....

So when news of the Zelos hit I was pretty interested. When I pulled this boat out of the box, all I had to do was attach the rudder. Done. Well...... mostly, there were a few things. The boat could have been run there and then - with the right battery pack connectors. But ain't it always the case that your connectors never fit the boat you just bought. So I also spent time soldering 5.5mm bullets onto the ESC. In fact I made a wiring harness that will allow me to run 2 packs in parallel. You buy a boat like this - the soldering iron comes out -we all know it.

That done I immediately went out and ordered CNC replacement props for the ones included in the with the boat. I'll be looking into 6S first as I have some Revolectrix 70c 5500mah 6S packs that I currently don't use. Seemed a shame. So I've gotten a 5214 (straight replacement) and a 5314 (bit bigger) to test with initially. Will report back after this weekend.

Now - second thing. The cooling loop on my boat was hooked up backwards. That is - the motor line went to the top of the motor first, then exited from the lower fitting. Big no no as we all know. So watch for that if you get this boat. Even then - as you will see in the 2nd pic below - the fittings aren't aligned for maximum cooling benefit. The higher fitting on the jacket should be at the highest possible point - but it isn't. So yeah - watch that.

My loopback hose on the ESC was badly kinked. So I had to swap it out with some spare I had.

The Zelos has one water pickup through the rudder - and one under-hull pickup. Admit I am skeptical of the under-hull pickup but time will soon tell.

Overwhelmingly though - I am struck by the build quality out of the box with this boat. How many times have you bought an off the shelf ARTR boat and grimaced at some shoddy glassing job, or something out of alignment, or something that broke in transit, or a hatch that doesn't quite fit...... You all know the list. This is a different story. It's the first out of the box hull that I truly feel can go straight on the water. No mods necessary. No strengthening necessary. No cheapa$$ part swapout necessary. One look reveals the hull is rock solid and factory strengthened. Rap your knuckles against it. Solid thud. Is good.

The hardware is good quality. Many off the shelf boats have hardware that rattles like a poorly-made turn of the century horseless carriage that went across the Sahara six times. Read - a rudder that either isn't true or just rattles big time on it's hinges. Not here. The hardware on the Zelos looks several grades above that. The steering servo even just appears up to the job, also clearly several grades above the stuff I have used before. Proof will be in the pudding though.

Fit and finish is really next level - at least for me it is. You can just see that the hull has been well made. The right amount of glue where there is glue. Hardware that sits in proper alignment and is good quality gear. Good solid and clean glasswork. Properly fitting hatch. You really get a sense that the boat has been designed properly - and then that tight controls have been put in place through the manufacturing process.

The only part of the design that gives me pause is the hatch fastening system. Why couldn't we have screws at the front as well as the rear? One decent flip that hits the hatch just right and it'll be off, or so it appears to me. As it is I'll be taping the hatch - especially at the front.

Will run the boat on 6S for a while and see what I can get out of it.

Rant over

[Rafael_Lopez]

Thanks Rafael. That sure does help. I did actually find the info on the props in the manual when I sat down to read every section properly. Is there instructions on programming the ESC with a transmitter? Looked through what I have and can't see it.

My 52mm prop came a little rough, with some lumps and bumps on it. Luck of the draw I guess but working on props has always been decidedly hit and miss for me. Will try working on it and see where I end up. Might just see if I can get a CNC prop for it too just in the beginning.

Just so I know what path will be better to go down for me getting extra gear for this boat. Does it ultimately perform better on 8S? Or - with correct prop choice, there's not much difference between 8S and 6S?

I'll need a few extra LiPo's to go with what I've got either way.

So if I'm looking at 6S initially - can I go any more aggressive than that 52mm 1.4 pitch? Or not recommended? Just thought if I'm ordering props anyway....

Cheers muchly for your help.

Iron Paw, forgive me for not answering this sooner. I probably got an email alert regrading your post and must have lost track of it. I wasn't purposely ignoring your post.

Does it perform better on 8s, well its faster, which I'm sure you can imagine. I saw speeds between 45-48mph with the large prop on 6s, and between 50-58mph with the small prop on 8s; props all stock unbalanced and un sharpened. If I remember right amp draw at 8s is around 115-125 amps with the small prop. Amp draw with the large prop on 6s was about 100 amps. Being that it comes with a 160amp ESC you can see how 6s allows you more room to play with props of different diameter and pitch. The drawback on 6s, that that the packs get warmer. I found that the boat ran best on 6s with with either 2, 6s packs on either side in parallel or 4, 3s packs total. 2, 3s packs in the boat, at least the ones I was testing with, seemed to get warmer than I like though they didn't puff; nearing 130*.

You will find that stock, on either voltage, the electronics run very cool for a boat that size. It is a rather efficient system and the boat is very light. There is about 5mm of adjustment in the strut which will allow you to adjust some negative angle if the nose rides too light and the bounce bothers you, on flat water. The boat really shines and runs very smooth in rough water. I usually just leave the strut level and run my packs as far forward as I can get them.

You also have the option of 3 blade props. 50mm and smaller should fit the boat well. I find that 3 blade props on a cat tend to give them the lift they sometimes lack and makes them ride very smooth over calm water. a 450/3 is too much for 8s, but works well with 6s. Remember that you can also raise the timing on the ESC if you want an inexpensive way to get a bit more RPM. The default setting is 7.5*. You can go as high as 15*, as long as your packs can handle it. M series props will help with some prop walk if the prop is too large and relief cutting should help as well.

I don't find your last post as a rant. Its actually a very well written observation, from a customers perspective.

If you need anything else in specific, its sometimes better to PM me. I make myself very available on the net, via forums and Facebook, and I get a lot of customer contact. Sometimes things get by me and I forget to reply; I don't ignore people on purpose. Hope you understand.

[gfmarlin88]

I'm in the process of deciding which new summer toy I'll be purchasing; zelos 48 or zelos 36. A few things that steer me away from 48 that I'd appreciate some feedback on would be the small front pin to hold on the giant canopy vs 2 lock screws like being used on the 36's canopy. I'm curious as to why every video I watch the 48 is bouncing during wide open operation vs straight, smooth travel across the water as the 36 zelos and my 36 voracity perform.

[Rafael_Lopez]

Sorry, double post.

[Rafael_Lopez]

I'm in the process of deciding which new summer toy I'll be purchasing; zelos 48 or zelos 36. A few things that steer me away from 48 that I'd appreciate some feedback on would be the small front pin to hold on the giant canopy vs 2 lock screws like being used on the 36's canopy. I'm curious as to why every video I watch the 48 is bouncing during wide open operation vs straight, smooth travel across the water as the 36 zelos and my 36 voracity perform.

As to the pin and locks, regardless of the canopy retention system in any of our boats, we always reccomend you use tape to help keep the hatch in place, especially during a crash. We are one of very few RTR companies to offer locks on a fiberglass boat. Most others rely only on tape. The latch system adds extra security, but even I don't rely just on the locks, with no tape, on any of our boats. Tape is part of the completion guide found on the Pro Boat website for every one of our FG boats. Our tape is equivalent to electrical tape because it provides great grip and doesn't tend to damage the finish. Always tape your hatch.

On the twin, regardless of having 4 locks, we still reccomd using tape around the hatch opening. Crashes can be brutal over 60.

Why does one run flatter than the other? The Zelos Twin's power to weight ratio is more balanced, especially with 4 packs in it. The 48, for its size, is very light, even with 4 packs. The hull is larger and wider and can pack more air in the tunnel. This combination causes it to bounce, under certain conditions. From my testing, I've found that it tends to bounce more on calm water where the air under the tunnel can't escape. Choppy water allows the air to escape out the side and release some of the air that causes the lift. Adding some negative angle to the strut can help, as well a battery placement. Mine only bounces when I run across my own wake on calm water. But thI bounce is kinds of a trade off for how the boat corners. A narrower hull would run smoother, but we all know they can't turn on power, the way our boats can. I've found that the bounce is something most people overlook, or don't even pay attention to, once they drive the boat and see how well it handles in the turns. Look at 1:1 offshore racing videos. Even real race boats have a little bounce.

The twin can bounce too, if the CG is too far back. This is how you know to move your packs forward, or add 1-1.5mm of negative angle in to the struts to lift the transom. The bouncing is all tuning, IMO. If your Pro Boat cat is bouncing, it's telling you the CG is off or it needs more negative strut angle.

A prop can all help with bounce. 3 blade props tend to have more lift which smoothes out the boats ride attitude.

Why doesn't the Voracity bounce? Because of the lack of the tunnel. A badly set up V will porpoise instead, when something is off.

Hope that helps.

[gfmarlin88]

Thanks for the quick response! In your opinion, with me already having the deep v 36, which boat would be a better contrast and more enjoyable for pond/river running. Already have 4 3s packs for the voracity. Seems like id have to buy 4 more for a few runs in the 36 twin or buy a couple 4s and have 2 sets of 3s to run in the 48.

[Rafael_Lopez]

If you already have 3s packs, I'd suggest to get the 36 twin. This way you can use all your batteries between the 2 and not have to buy 4 cell packs for the 48.

[Xtremespeed]

I would really like to have the Zelos 36. All the info you have provided looks awesome. I already have a BJ29 and a HK Flowmaster so I hated to buy something so similar. It was between the Voracity and the Zelos 48 to add some variety. My new Zelos 48 will be here tomorrow. Can't wait.

[IRON-PAWW]

Ok - well I never ended up running 6S. Was damn hot here 40C (104 Farenheit) on the day I planned that run so the club meet was canned. In the meantime I got a few extra 4S batts allowing me to run 8S.

Boat ran pretty well and I got a Max of 80.2 Km/h (49.8 Mph). I got a fair bit of bounce though which I think slowed me a bit. That was with 2 x 4S 5000mah batts each side. Batts on each side hooked up in series then each bank hooked in parallel to make 8S overall. Batts pushed as far forward on the battery trays as I could get them. Water was pretty glassy for that run - this pic is in a different location.

Not all that happy with the water throughput on the under-hull pickup. Although temps were good (no temp gun sorry) I think I'd like to get a little better flow before I start pushing the boat more.

Ran it with a Cnc 4814 prop.

[Rafael_Lopez]

Something is off if you only got 48 on 8s. Drop your strut as low as it will go and try and add some negative angle to lift the transom and calm the bounce. I've never seen speeds that low on 8s. The slowest I've got on 8s was 53 with some very weak packs.

[IRON-PAWW]

Thanks Rafael. Trust me to be the slowest on the planet.

I'll do some adjustments and see where I end up. Wish I had a video, but it did seem unsettled with any real speed. Mainly the bounce issue though. No real heat in any of the components or wiring so I'm pretty happy with that for now. I might just teardrop the under-hull pickup some - just to see if I can get a little more water flow there as well.

It is my first boat of this size and first cat hull boat to speak of. Zonda 41inch just never ran well - noob issues I'm sure. So I will check some vids of the boat running and get myself tuned in to how they run and appear in the water etc etc. If I can settle it and push a bit more of a straight line run I should do better.

got that Octura 646/3 and another Cnc 46mm 3 blade prop that I could try too.

Will look at the strut adjustment as well.

[Rafael_Lopez]

In regards to the under hull pick up, you can get a bit more water through the line if you take a hobby knife and clean the paint off the water inlet. Tear drop the leading edge so the water channels up the inlet easier.

[IRON-PAWW]

Ok well I was able to drop the strut down around 5mm. Seemed it was all the way up. Will test and report back.

But something I noticed. Look at pic 3 - you will see the driveline actually sits lower than the strut itself. Will that have any effect?

And then - what angle should that strut be? Horizontal with the hull I assume? Pic is a bit deceiving, but I got it pretty much horizontal again.

Water pickup: I did clean a little paint out of there - but there wasn't a heck of a lot to clean out. Roger that on the tear drop channel - will do that next.


Before



After


Driveline


Under Hull Pickup

[IRON-PAWW]

So - with the above changes and a sharpened rudder I got 86.1km/h (53.5 mph)........ At least I reached Rafael's 'weak lipo' mark. lol.

Breeze was a tad stiff - and I did the speed runs *with* the wind. But not completely ideal conditions. Nonetheless - the boat wasn't bothered by the chop seemingly at all.

I did feel that with an extra 25-30m of run space I might have tagged a better speed - but I was heading for the rocks as it was.

The bounce the boat had in the first run was gone with the strut adjustments. It was a *Lot* more settled on the water at speed, making me feel better about pushing the speed runs as much as I could.

This is with a cnc 4814 prop and Newish lipos still being run in. All temps just warm after about 5 minutes. So there's headroom yet.

Might try the stock prop next or the 646/3.

[Rafael_Lopez]

Iron Paw, is that how your stuffing tube came out of the box? That's a real nasty bend. The tube is supposed to have a gradual bend in it. I've never seen one like that before. That's not how the vendor bends the tubes.

[IRON-PAWW]

Yes Rafael. That's how it came out of the box. I haven't touched it at all. Can you show me how it's meant to be?

Do you think that is fixable - or needs replacing?

[Rafael_Lopez]

[Rafael_Lopez]

Let me reach out to the vendor and show them your stuffing tube and see what happened there. I can't imagine how that's possible, but I'll do some digging.

[IRON-PAWW]

Yeesh...... Ok I see what you mean. I think we found the 'something off'.

Let me know if you need some more pictures - am happy to post them up or email to you if needed.

Really appreciate your help. Thanks man.

[Rafael_Lopez]

Yes, I knew something didn't sound right with your boat. That bend will definitely kill performance. Did you buy from local hobby shop? If so, head back or reach out to them and tell them your boat has a defect. Show them my picture to prove how it should be. Unfortunately because you are out of the country there is little I can do from my end, but I know the distributor and they are very helpful. Please keep me posted via private message.

[Xtremespeed]

Rafael. Something's not quite right with mine also. I've only ran it twice. The first time I ran it, when I opened the hatch there was what seemed like a little steam inside the hull. There were some drops of water so I figured that's where the steam came from. Ran it the second time and there was a lot of steam this time. Turns out it wasn't steam at all. The teflon liner disintegrated and the flex cable was grimding the edge of the stuffing tube and discolored the sealant around the tube some. Obviously it got real hot. I'm not sure what could have caused this. My only guess is the motor wasn't aligned properly, but with the teflon liner sticking out of the stuffing tube slightly it seems like it would be difficult to tell. It was easy to see after because the liner wasn't there to keep the flex cable centered in the stuffing tube. I greased the flex cable both times and my stuffing tube doesn't look to be bent wrong like IRON-PAWW's. Do I replace the teflon liner, make sure the motor is centered properly and try again, or is there something else at play here I should be looking for? Will the ground edge of the stuffing tube cause further problems? Your help would be greatly appreciated.

[IRON-PAWW]

It might be you have a bad collet. Connect the flex into it and tighten some. Slowly spin the prop with your hand. As you spin, watch the flex very closely right where it exits the collet. There should be *zero* wobble - or sideways movement there. If you do have wobble there then it's a problem. Sometimes bad collets can cause it.

Or if you're getting slippage at the collet when you run then the flex will heat red hot quicksmart and could melt the teflon. Collet has to be nice & tight.

Just ideas to check for.

[Xtremespeed]

Thanks for the suggestions. I will look at the collet better this evening. I'm positive it wasn't slipping but maybe there is some wobble I missed. I don't think so, but it's definitely worth another look.