Scale 50" Apache - Electric - Aeromarine

**bonefisher** · 05-16-2015, 12:38 PM

Happy Saturday everyone. Thought it through and think the 4 5s 5000 batteries is the best choice.

This way I get 10000mah, 10s, and protection on amps. I can always use less throttle but guessing good to have in case I need it after testing.

In regards to prop, I know this is Pandora's box and there is no perfect answer. Again going with scale look and running, opinion from the drive manufacturer and the guy who runs similar and helping the build is the exact prop egneg is running which is a 6717/3. But plan was to order two or three sizes in cheaper materials, test, and then determine.

Would love any thoughts on this one. Feel like I am at least making progress in regards to logistics and groundwork!!

**Make-a-Wake** · 05-16-2015, 02:43 PM

I would not recommend a prop as aggressive as a 6717/3 for testing, that seems huge and you may end up using something not even in that range. For 10s2p I would recommend an x452............maybe x455 for initial testing. If you saw the vid I posted I only ran 6s and an x452 and it may be considered too almost too fast for scale speeds. 10s just sounds like overkill for a 40-50 mph boat, your prop will be on the small side and running partial throttle all the time in a boat is not good for the ESC.

**bonefisher** · 05-16-2015, 03:11 PM

Thanks make a wake. I knew the prop conversation was going to be a test. Just relaying what the folks who make them though. But they were also very clear it will definitely be trial and error. I like the idea of a three bladed prop for scale so that is the only real starting point in my mind. I should have listed that my gut from talking to Steve was to start with a octura 455/3 or 452/3 and work up. Sorry if I didn't mention it.

Have to say prop choice and high voltage wiring are the two areas I am most concerned on ability. But working on it... Thanks in large part to folks on the board!!

I get that 10s may be a bit much, but the guidelines on the out drive says it can eat 20% to 25% of the power off the bat, so figured a little extra speed (even if it is the 50's) isn't a bad thing. But will double check my calculations again before ordering the batteries.

Nothing is ever easy :-)

**Dave102** · 05-16-2015, 05:58 PM

DSCF0744.jpg

This is my 55 inch dumas. I made these drives to look scale but use flex cables. motors are 730kv and just run them 6s. I have run x470 props and everything stays cool and it is plenty fast for a semi scale project. Also runs a long time on a charge. I have smaller props on it here was letting my 5 year old drive it . Ihave not took a video yet.

**bonefisher** · 05-16-2015, 06:08 PM

Nice boat Dave102. Love the hand built drives!!!

**Dave102** · 05-16-2015, 06:16 PM

I got the idea from some old drives a company called
Capricorn boats used to make for gas motors . I first built the boat with gas engines but recently repowered with these electrics. I am not trying for a lot of speed with this one just wanted it to be a little faster and more trouble free than the gas . It worked out pretty well.

**bonefisher** · 05-16-2015, 06:58 PM

Cool!! Beginning to unpack all the boxes now. Will post some photos when I can. Fun stuff!!

**bonefisher** · 05-18-2015, 05:24 PM

Greetings everyone and good Monday to you all!!!! Well, got everything unpacked this weekend and felt like I made some progress (mentally) in regards to the boat (thanks to several people on here helping!)...

Here are some photos of water jacket, motor, ESC, Servo, and Radio box...

**Make-a-Wake** · 05-18-2015, 05:27 PM

If you have never seen a beer can sized motor you have now!

**bonefisher** · 05-18-2015, 05:29 PM

Here are some more parts...

Scale cleats, chalks, fuel filler cap, receiver, and a new radio ;-) - because a new boat needs a new radio right??

**Dave102** · 05-18-2015, 05:42 PM

Great stuff. Very nice . I love unpacking shiny new parts. So much fun. Are you still going to get a arrowshark outdrive?

**bonefisher** · 05-18-2015, 05:55 PM

Dave,

Greetings... the Arrowshark drive is already on the boat!!! Yes, Red M8... photo below...

Still debating 10S vs. 8S... from looking at the amp draw and watts, 8S may be more in line with a 8 - 10 HP motor the drive was designed for... but do not need to determine this one quite yet...

**bonefisher** · 05-18-2015, 06:14 PM

Make-A-Wake... I was SHOCKED at how big the motor was... hysterical... I think it could power a real paddle boat!

**Dave102** · 05-18-2015, 06:58 PM

I'm sorry for some reason I did not realize that was the actual boat you were building. One thing to consider is that the smallest stock octura prop that will fit the drive is a x467. The outdrive has 1/4 shaft. With the motor kv you have and voltage you mention I think it will work fine . But watch your temperatures . Now you could do all sorts of things to get smaller props on if you have to. Run it and see but watch closely at first.

**Dave102** · 05-18-2015, 07:00 PM

I bet that boat will go faster than the gas would have on just 6s

**bonefisher** · 05-18-2015, 09:20 PM

Dave102. Thanks SO much for this tip. Didn't think that part through yet. Maybe this is making the 10s vs 8s easier and maybe that is why the manafacturer thought I was going to end up there. Would rather not have to modify a prop to make it work.

So.... Would 8s and that motor would an x467 be too much?? Interesting. As you mention definitely need to watch the temps. Love any thoughts here. Should I even be thinking 6s?? Don't think so but would love any expert opinions !!

**Spartanator** · 05-18-2015, 10:33 PM

I saw that hull on Ebay, I was VERY tempted..... I want to see this sucker in action!!!!

**bonefisher** · 05-19-2015, 01:01 AM

Spartanator. Many thanks. Yes, I didn't really need another project but too cool to pass up. And been learning high voltage electrical and the like to get it ready which is fun. And I thought 1000 watt gliders were tricky :-)

Now just trying to figure out the prop and voltage situation. Didn't realize the 1/4 inch shaft would necessitate such a large prop and wondering if I can get away with the 8s. Such fun things to figure out :-)

**egneg** · 05-19-2015, 08:24 AM

8S will be lower in rpm than 10S but the motor requires X amount of watts to run. Volts X amps = watts, so 8S will need more amps to run than 10S. This is why no one runs 2S except for maybe some SAW racers.

**Dave102** · 05-19-2015, 09:00 AM

8s on that 780kv motor will be lower rpm's than usually run with electric witch will need a larger prop to put the same load on the motor so I think it will work out. That boat is going to have more power than can be used anyway in my opinion. And you said you wanted scale looks not max performance. Most of the guys here are used to setting things up for maximum speed. I have some experience with these scale types of setups and think it will work this way. There are certainly others with more knowledge than I so listen to what others here have to say also. Larger propellers can sometimes hurt handling but that drive is made for them. You can always call steve back and explain about the drive and see what he thinks. That 6717 you mentioned the other guy running is more pitch than an x467 .

**bonefisher** · 05-19-2015, 03:30 PM

Thanks Dave102... Spoke to Chip as well this morning and he said he mounted / set up the drive as high as possible so almost for surface running as to minimize loading with as little of the prop in the water as possible… and reminded me that the propeller is 7 inches behind the transom on this boat!

Steve is looking at the prop situation / initial set-up as well... but looks like 8S and then start with the smallest 1/4 shaft prop I can find... X467 and also found a ABC 2116-15-60 (3) --- looks like it is 53MM 3 blade for a 1/4 shaft and 1.6 pitch.... thoughts????

Such fun being one of the first to convert one of these... NOT ;-)

**Dave102** · 05-19-2015, 06:41 PM

I'm sure it will work. Can't wait to hear how it runs. I have run gas and nitro for many years. I found when I started running brushless that having enough power is no longer a problem. The problem sometimes now is keeping the boat right side up! Even on only 8s I think you will see well over your 40mph goal. I don't think that abc prop is 1/4 inch better look into it more.

**Dave102** · 05-19-2015, 06:52 PM

Wait looks like the abc does fit 1/4. Interesting....

**Make-a-Wake** · 05-19-2015, 11:07 PM

8s2p will give you more than the speed you indicated you were shooting for, you will get into the 50's with an x467 of that's what you intend to run.

Here's a friends boat, its a 54" Arapaho with a Castle 2028(very similar to your motor) and same kv. He is running 9s2p and an x465 in his third run of this vid. This is a good vid to see his upward prop progression testing temps after each run. He starts with an x455/3 and goes up.

Hopefully this vid will give you some ideas and guidance.

The x465 run starts at 3:35 of the vid. He hit 65 mph with this setup.

**bonefisher** · 05-20-2015, 12:20 PM

Hello Make-A-Wake and thanks for this... super helpful... so my rough calculations is 13% reduction from 9S to 8S... then another 20% loss or so in regards to efficiency because of the drive.. puts me right around high 40's... low 50's? (obviously not an exact science)... I don't mind being in the 50's... as long as temps and the rest stay good... I ordered three props yesterday... a 53MM 1.6 / 3... a X467... a X470... would like to find a 55-59 1.4 with a 1/4 inch shaft to round out the testing, but have not yet...

Feels finally like it is coming together... will begin wiring some stuff this weekend!

**bonefisher** · 05-20-2015, 02:54 PM

Was working with Chip on some further scale touches... here is how the water pickups and custom fish eye navigation lights will look...

**Make-a-Wake** · 05-20-2015, 03:25 PM

That is just too awesome.................those will look great.

**bonefisher** · 05-20-2015, 08:14 PM

Great Prop and Battery News!!! While I have now spent more money in props I may not need, maybe they will come in handy down the road...

So have the following four to try... X467... X470... ABC 2116-15-60 53MM (which may or may not be 1/4" Shaft)... and Dasboata hooked me up with a 6014/3 SS (1/4 shaft of course).... So have what hopes is a good range to test...

And ordered from Giant Power Lipos 4 - 4S 14.8V 4 CELL 5000 MAH 65C-130C MAXIMUM - Bob was super nice to deal with!!!

Now need to put the credit card away...