Swordfish Pro+ 220 Running Hot

[rickwess]

I bought from pre drilled circuit board from circuit city to make mounting the caps easy. I am using the same series parallel setup you are. The only stuff I could get had trace on one side, a quick trip on the belt sander eliminated that. With a little trimming they will be perfect to hold the caps to connect directly to the wire. Some heat shrink to finish it off. I can do a mock up and take a couple pictures if you like.

Sayal has the circuit board without traces.

I've built a few a these now. This time I put some 1/8" plywood at the base before I covered it in heat shrink. This should make it easier velco to the hull.

2014-06-05 11_57_39-IMG_20140604_205309 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_10-IMG_20140604_205347 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_28-IMG_20140605_113247 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_45-IMG_20140605_114140 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_59_52-IMG_20140605_114154 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

[M3Man03]

I use this stuff instead of any pad:

41D3Lbl2oqL.jpg

http://www.amazon.com/Arctic-Alumina...=thermal+epoxy

Then you don't need to find any way of securing it. The thinner the better for heat transfer.

[rickwess]

I use this stuff instead of any pad:

http://www.amazon.com/Arctic-Alumina...=thermal+epoxy

Then you don't need to find any way of securing it. The thinner the better for heat transfer.

That would be better for a CPU, but the application here is much different. Take a look at the pic of the ESC and tell me how the paste would work.

2014-06-03 15_44_58-DSC_0978 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

[M3Man03]

I actually just re-did mine and think I found a perfect solution.

I took 1/2" aluminum angle, cut 2 pieces to the length of the MOSFETs, applied thermal epoxy to them and the cooling brass tube so they were facing down. 1 side of the angle touched the MOSFETs and one side attached to the brass cooling tube.

Then I put the original aluminum plate across both of the sides, epoxied to it.

I should have taken some pictures during, but I didn't. Turns out to a REAL nice package and gives cooling to the other side of the MOSFETs as well rather than just the plate to equalize the temperature.

Here's 2 pics of the finished product. The black stuff is liquid electrical tape for waterproofing.

Swordfish.jpg
Swordfish2.jpg

[ray schrauwen]

Nice Job!

Sayal has the circuit board without traces.

I've built a few a these now. This time I put some 1/8" plywood at the base before I covered it in heat shrink. This should make it easier velco to the hull.

2014-06-05 11_57_39-IMG_20140604_205309 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_10-IMG_20140604_205347 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_28-IMG_20140605_113247 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_58_45-IMG_20140605_114140 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-05 11_59_52-IMG_20140605_114154 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

[rickwess]

Nice Job!

Thanks Ray.

I actually just re-did mine and think I found a perfect solution.

I took 1/2" aluminum angle, cut 2 pieces to the length of the MOSFETs, applied thermal epoxy to them and the cooling brass tube so they were facing down. 1 side of the angle touched the MOSFETs and one side attached to the brass cooling tube.

Then I put the original aluminum plate across both of the sides, epoxied to it.

I should have taken some pictures during, but I didn't. Turns out to a REAL nice package and gives cooling to the other side of the MOSFETs as well rather than just the plate to equalize the temperature.

I like it. I was wondering how to avoid the motor wire solders and the two pieces of angle do that. I already have the 1/2" x 1/2" x 1/16" thick aluminum angle and just ordered the thermal adhesive.

I'm sure my heat issue was prop related, but since I had the ESC open anyway, it might as well put it back together better than it was originally. I'll post pics of the steps, but for now it's off to Orlando for a conference.

[srislash]

Thanks Ray.





I like it. I was wondering how to avoid the motor wire solders and the two pieces of angle do that. I already have the 1/2" x 1/2" x 1/16" thick aluminum angle and just ordered the thermal adhesive.

I'm sure my heat issue was prop related, but since I had the ESC open anyway, it might as well put it back together better than it was originally. I'll post picks of the steps, but for now it's off to Orlando for a conference.

Nothing wrong with overbuilding. You guys have me thinking.

[ray schrauwen]

Where di you buy the thermal epoxy from? Canada or USA?

Thanks Ray.





I like it. I was wondering how to avoid the motor wire solders and the two pieces of angle do that. I already have the 1/2" x 1/2" x 1/16" thick aluminum angle and just ordered the thermal adhesive.

I'm sure my heat issue was prop related, but since I had the ESC open anyway, it might as well put it back together better than it was originally. I'll post pics of the steps, but for now it's off to Orlando for a conference.

[ray schrauwen]

Did you keep the original cooling tubes too or did you remove them or not use them?
Hard to tell from pictures.

I actually just re-did mine and think I found a perfect solution.

I took 1/2" aluminum angle, cut 2 pieces to the length of the MOSFETs, applied thermal epoxy to them and the cooling brass tube so they were facing down. 1 side of the angle touched the MOSFETs and one side attached to the brass cooling tube.

Then I put the original aluminum plate across both of the sides, epoxied to it.

I should have taken some pictures during, but I didn't. Turns out to a REAL nice package and gives cooling to the other side of the MOSFETs as well rather than just the plate to equalize the temperature.

Here's 2 pics of the finished product. The black stuff is liquid electrical tape for waterproofing.

Swordfish.jpg
Swordfish2.jpg

[oscarel]

I actually just re-did mine and think I found a perfect solution.

I took 1/2" aluminum angle, cut 2 pieces to the length of the MOSFETs, applied thermal epoxy to them and the cooling brass tube so they were facing down. 1 side of the angle touched the MOSFETs and one side attached to the brass cooling tube.

Then I put the original aluminum plate across both of the sides, epoxied to it.

I should have taken some pictures during, but I didn't. Turns out to a REAL nice package and gives cooling to the other side of the MOSFETs as well rather than just the plate to equalize the temperature.

Here's 2 pics of the finished product. The black stuff is liquid electrical tape for waterproofing.

Swordfish.jpg
Swordfish2.jpg

I have 2 castle air controllers I just did this with. One was done with aluminum and the other with copper. Good results with the aluminum and will test the copper this week. Per this chart copper has twice the thermal transfer ability. ONLINEMETALS has good prices and was local and thermal epoxy http://www.ebay.com/itm/221378467457...84.m1439.l2649

[rickwess]

Where di you buy the thermal epoxy from? Canada or USA?

Canada
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product...-013-_-Product

[rickwess]

Did y0u keep the original cooling tubes too or did you remove them or not use them?
Hard to tell from pictures.

Hi Ray. I took some pics before I left for the conference. I don't have the adhesive yet, but this is how it will look.

I used Plasti-Dip to insulate the exposed battery and motor wire solder joints. Then I did a slight grind on the cooling tubes to get a flat spot. The tubes are shaped like a hex on the outside and a corner was where the angle would attached to.

2014-06-07 16_11_11-IMG_20140607_160714 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg


The angles go on first then the original plate on top of those.
2014-06-07 16_11_36-IMG_20140607_160751 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-07 16_11_54-IMG_20140607_160815 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

[ray schrauwen]

Awesome, thanks!

[ray schrauwen]

I used to be able to get plasti-dip at Canadian Tire but, a search came up almost blank..? My old clear stuff is coagulating.

[rickwess]

I used to be able to get plasti-dip at Canadian Tire but, a search came up almost blank..? My old clear stuff is coagulating.

You can buy Plasti-Dip at Home Hardware. Also, most paint stores carry Xylene which can be used to thin out the out stuff that is turning into gel.

[M3Man03]

Did you keep the original cooling tubes too or did you remove them or not use them?
Hard to tell from pictures.

Kept the original. The alumn angle is thermal epoxied to the brass cooling tubes.

[M3Man03]

Hi Ray. I took some pics before I left for the conference. I don't have the adhesive yet, but this is how it will look.

I used Plasti-Dip to insulate the exposed battery and motor wire solder joints. Then I did a slight grind on the cooling tubes to get a flat spot. The tubes are shaped like a hex on the outside and a corner was where the angle would attached to.

2014-06-07 16_11_11-IMG_20140607_160714 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg


The angles go on first then the original plate on top of those.
2014-06-07 16_11_36-IMG_20140607_160751 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

2014-06-07 16_11_54-IMG_20140607_160815 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

Yep this is exactly what mine looked like.

I've since attached a heatsink along the top of it as well to provide extra cooling when the water isn't flowing.

[M3Man03]

Where di you buy the thermal epoxy from? Canada or USA?

I posted a link to some on Amazon above.

Look for stuff that they use to secure CPU's that is epoxy, not just thermal paste.

[rickwess]

Ran the hydro this morning. I flipped it in a corner at the 50sec mark, paddled out to flip it over a ran it a bit longer. It looks like the ESC cooling mod is working wonders. Temps look to be plateauing at just over 50C at the FETs.

That's 15C cooler than before the mod despite my erratic throttle. Being at the end of a bay, it gets crowded with swim rafts and trampolines during the summer months. Need to find a dock further down the lake.


2014-07-06 10_28_49-2014-7-6_1.dat - Hifei.jpg

[ray schrauwen]

Sounds good Rick! I ran the SF200 Pro 8S esc in my Whip 40 for 4 test runs until I almost melted it down. After that I switched to the 240 and got a 3rd place in Michigan.

I now have the esc apart and have all the goodies to modify it. Got the thermal epoxy, thanks for the link... I've got an abundance of water cooled heatsink material thank to Doby.

I cut a piece the right size, cut out a center section for the center motor wire and then I'll epoxy it down today and heat shrink.

Any idea of how long this epoxy needs to cure??

I'm surprised it survived the 4 runs and on the last run one motor lead desoldered, finished the heat though!!

I have to scrape DP270 off the top of the 8 FETs though so the epoxy has better contact area.

After it's done I'll brutalize it again but, in the 40" mono on 6S2P as it has dual cooling and the Whip 40 doesn't yet.

I actually thermalled the 200 8S after 4.5 laps on my first run with a 55mm prop... second run esc came back at at least 150Degrees F. so these ain't crappy esc's if I can beat the snot out of it that bad.

Next up to try in a smaller boat is the SF220 pro.... I think I'll modify it first....

Thanks for the cool thread, literally!!

[rickwess]

Glad I could be of help. Being an Engineer I can't leave enough alone and since I had the ESC apart anyway to dry it out, I figured why not try to improve the cooling.

I'm also impressed with the robustness of these ESCs. I've submerged one while powered up and this one in the hydro has been wet many times. It's taken me a while to figure out how to tape up the IB FE30 to stop the water from coming in.

The thermal epoxy is very much like JB Quick. You get less than 5 mins of working time and it looks to fully cure after couple of hours. I'd wait overnight before you run it, but you can start prepping it after 30mins.

Before I used heat shrink, I wrapped the ESC tight with electrical tape. That way the wires are bound nicely. If you have the ESC side of your water lines connected at the capacitor end, you'll be able to tape all the up can get the receiver wire as well as the caps nice and tight. In my case, if I have to remove the ESC, I'll just disconnect them from the motor. Oh ya, my cooling lines run a little different than most. I found it allowed me to use less water line and make them easier to hide.

Rudder----ESC----Motor----ESC----Outlet

2014-07-06 11_28_18-DSC_0037 - Windows Photo Viewer.jpg

[rickwess]

If you thermaled it at 150F, then for sure the FETs were quite a bit hotter. When my data logger showed max temp at 65C (150F), my thermal gun was only reading about 120F a the ESC body and caps. Thermal shutdown on these ESCs are 100C so there is still lots of headroom.

[ray schrauwen]

The thing is it thermalled like it was supposed to unlike a few other esc's I've run that just detonate.

The FE30 is odd, my buddy has two and both always end up wet inside. My boats run dry except my PTSS which recently developed a small 1 ounce leak per 7 laps of running. I know where it's coming from.

Glad the epoxy is fast cure... Thanks again buddy.

[rickwess]

I've run my FE30 dry 3 times in a row now. I think I have the taping mastered. The water comes in at the front where the two inside radii of the hatch are. I find that if I first tape parallel to that inside radius and have the tape long enough that it wraps under the sponson, it stays dry.

While I was experimenting with tape, i found that if I stuff 2 shop towels (paper towel kind) just under the front of the hatch opening, they absorb the water before it has a chance to slosh around.

Back to the ESC, I'm glad more people are liking it. It means Steve will keep stocking them. When I find time to work on the 54" Scarab, I'll definitely get a SF.

[rickwess]

Here's the run on IB Mono - much heavier than the FE30. I was running a conservative m445. You can see that I brought it in twice to check for temps. Looks to be peaking at 68C at the FETs. That's only 7C cooler than the runs before the cooling mod.

I'm still not comfortable with how fast the temp drops as I'm bringing it in to check for temps. It's like I'm getting better water flow when it's going slower. Can prop wash cause that at higher RPMs? The drive dog is lined up with the leading edge of the rudder.

2014-07-12 10_29_06-Greenshot.jpg

[ray schrauwen]

Do you use a cap bank? I just received a couple so I'll add that. I was able to add a water cooled plate on top. I'll up load pics later. That Arctic silver is slick, loving it! Most of my heat from the last race in MI came from a crushed stuffing tube from previous race. Right now I can't even put the flex cable in there!! I almost wore through the brass! Lots of repairs today and maybe test tomorrow...

[rickwess]

I use a cap bank on the mono but not the hydro. See post #61 for the one I made.

[Engelkefarm]

Im having same issues i think the swordfish are just crap

[rickwess]

Im having same issues i think the swordfish are just crap

That's not my conclusion at all. I'm a boat NOOB and think I've abused them pretty well. So far they have held up.

[crashland]

my rigger was running hot on auto timing, super hot at zero, but ran great at meduim timing neu 1415 4100kv 3 cells