Radio problems (airtronics MT4)

[webdesaster]

Hello everybody,

I got some radio issues on my airtronics MT4. Hopefully ou can give me some information on that problem, so let me explain:

When I finished my boat, I bought a Spektrum DX3C transmitter with its receiver, I put that in my boat and on the lake, I realised that I lost connection with the boat on less then 100ft. So I relocated the antenna outside the hull, and went testing: the range was bit better but not that what I expected. At that moment I was using a 4 cell 2000mAh NIMH battery pack on the receiver.
After talking to some people I sold my Spektrum and got an Airtronics MT4. With this transmitter the range was way better, but I still lost connection at moments. I changed the receivers battery pack to 1600mAh 5 cell NIMH, but still lost connection. I noticed also that I forgot to turn on the failsafe on the transmitter, and after cogitating about that problem, I realised that if I had really lost connection due to too much distance, the boat should have continued at the same speed without putting the ESC's to neutral position. But in my case the boat stopped, and I had to approach the boat to reconnection. The servo I use is a Savox 1251MG, and my boat is a SAW catamaran which goes at about 95 mph.

So the question I'm asking is, is the connection loss due to high distance (and what can I do to improve it? I'm expecting a range of >500 meters) or is the servo consuming so much power that the receiver is switching off?

Sorry for my bad english^^ I'm not a native english speaker

Thanks, Claude

[gsbuickman]

Welcome to OSE ,

What hull are you running ?. How about some pics of your setup ?. I'm going to guess and say that you're running a gas boat ?, if so have you talked to the gas monkeys here ?
http://www.insaneboats.com

With our fast electrics, we generally time our runs for 4-5 minutes, then pull the boats in and check the temperatures & batteries before making another run. If your running a tank of fuel that lasts for let's say, 12-15 minutes, its very plausible your Rx battery runs out b4 your tank. Your lucky to get 5 minutes off a 1600mah NiMH with a high draw servo. After a run how much power is left in the battery ?....

[Luck as a Constant]

He runs electric

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Luck as a Constant]

If you bothered to read any of his other posts youde have noticed he's running an H&m electric setup.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gsbuickman]

If you bothered to read any of his other posts youde have noticed he's running an H&m electric setup.

:tnhc


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well pardon me all too hell

I am going off the fact that hes running a failsafe & has run 2 different rx packs. When was the last time you ran an esc that didn't have a bec ?. Even both of the astroflight hydro brushed esc's i have kicking around have bec's in them. Who knows, maybe your mistaken.


Sent from my iPhone using Tap

[Luck as a Constant]

I wasn't trying to be mean, just suggesting checking out his other thread with his boat in there. Sorry dude.

i was going off the fact that he said his esc's went back to neutral. i don't know any gas guys who use esc's
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[photohoward1]

Most guys that run 6s and above can not use BEC. All my big boats 6S and above I run a LIFo Battery. BTW Almost no Gas boats run 95mph. But hey we all make mistakes?

[ls1fst98]

I realised that if I had really lost connection due to too much distance, the boat should have continued at the same speed without putting the ESC's to neutral position.

seems to me its electric, he could be speaking of failsafe built into the rx? but without pics of the setup . but hes wanting to run 500+meters..thats over a 1/4 mile away...seems a bit far to me. but i know in my car esc if it loses signal it stop until it picks up signal again, not like a servo that will hold at last known position.

[webdesaster]

sorry, it has been a while since I presented my boat to the forum :)

https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...732#post522732

according to the manual of the Tx and Rx, the failsafe is programmed in the Tx an natively the Rx doesn't have any failsafe. I don't know if the T180A have this feature of putting the ESC back to neutral when loosing signal.
Another thing I tested: a friend of mine has a FSTG3B and we put the Rx in the hull without relocating the antenna outside the hull: I got more range with that Tx then with mine...

[tlandauer]

sorry, it has been a while since I presented my boat to the forum :)

https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...732#post522732

according to the manual of the Tx and Rx, the failsafe is programmed in the Tx an natively the Rx doesn't have any failsafe. I don't know if the T180A have this feature of putting the ESC back to neutral when loosing signal.
Another thing I tested: a friend of mine has a FSTG3B and we put the Rx in the hull without relocating the antenna outside the hull: I got more range with that Tx then with mine...

This is true: FlySkyGT3B has proven ( in my case) to have the longest range. Compared to Tactic and Spektrum ( both MR200 and MR3000). But you will start another long debate about cheap radio vs. Known brand radio . I have always maintained that on the GT3B you do have a rough servo action, the resolution is low and Latency is slow, those are plain facts. Others would say that the radio had failed on them, I have no reason to NOT believe them, in my case it worked everytime. But I would not put that radio in a $2000 boat. Human nature, I like to think I get what I paid for, whether it is true or not in this case.
You can verify if you have proper fail-safe programed or not by running the throttle ( part throttle for only a few seconds) and switch off your tansmitter, the motors should stop right away. While I don't recommand bench testing/running the motor, this is one way to make sure you have the fail-safe on. Don't forget to disconnect your flex cable from your motor's collet when doing so.

[gsbuickman]

It seems like there is not a 100% guaranteed boat radio out there, cause everyone has had a problem with every radio at 1 point in time or another. Each location is different I guess. The top 5 radios you'll see here are probably spekky, futaba, airtronics, tactic & flysky.

If you want to try flysky, go with the fs-gt3 (dsss) or the green fs-gt3c. The orange model has a power button issue solved on the green model. I don't reccomend the gt3b even though a lot of people like it. It has a faulty firmware so the epa & trims don't work.

www.overkillrc.com sells the b model with flashed firmware if you want to look.....

At the moment I am running the airtronics m11 w/ a spekky module, and the tower hobbies 2.4, but I have used a lil' of everything .

Btw, have you seen the Airtronics MX-V ?. Its just under $100 & comes with a marine reciever.

http://www.amain.com/product_info.ph...proof-Receiver

At this price with all the features. Its the best rx/tx you can buy for just under $100. I'd take it over a flysky any day .....

[webdesaster]

I don't want to start a debate which radio is better, I just want to try to resolve my problem... Well I ordered a life rx battery pack in order to try out what happens. I also will try your failsafe test ;-)
In my eyes it is just strange that I loos connection with the boat not so far away. Yesterday I lost it at about 150 meters...

[tlandauer]

I was joking about the debate ( it happened so many times that I think by now people are tired of the topic ). I love your boat! I ask only to satisfy my own curiosity: In the picture you were using a MR200? Was that the receiver giving you trouble? You should have been ok with one antenna running outside ( per Spektrum 's recommendation= longer one out and the shorter one horizontal inside).
I am no expert on these radios but because I was part of the "debate", I read that as long as the user follows the instruction on these marine receivers, there should be no issue. I am not saying that you did something wrong, I am just curious as to which receiver you were referring to in post #1.

[webdesaster]

I used to have a mr200 now I changed to the airtronics mt4 with a rx461 receiver, but still got the same issue

[gsbuickman]

Airtronics RX-371W
This is an Airtronics RX-371W 3-Channel 2.4G FHSS-2 Waterproof Receiver. The new RX-371W is a small lightweight receiver that is compatible with all Airtronics 2.4G FHSS-2 frequency modulation surface transmitters. This receiver is waterproof and works equally well in cars, trucks and boats, and is a great way to go if you don't need more than three channels. The receiver has a nominal input voltage up to 7.4 volts, so you can power the receiver with a 2S LiPo battery and use high-voltage servos.

http://www.airtronics.net/index.php/...-fh-2-3ch.hump

[gsbuickman]

I just reread your original post that your looking for a range of 500 meter's (1500'), or more than a 1/4 mile (1320'). Has anyone here actually had a boat out that far w/o an issue .?.

I doubt my airtronics M11 could do it, not to mention I wouldn't be able to see a boat out that far anyway. How long are the saw track runs on average ?.....

[ls1fst98]

That's what I was saying. 1600ft is quite a long way to see a boat. I don't even run my monster trucks that far away and they are easier to see

[Fluid]

I just reread your original post that your looking for a range of 500 metered (1500'), or more than a 1/4 mile (1320'). Has anyone here actually had a boat out that far w/o an issue .?......

I have tested my SAW boats out to 1000 feet with my Spektrum DX3R PRO and have full control - never tried further. Most SAW lakes don't let you get further than 1000 feet away from the boat if you are positioned in the middle by the lights...some are much less. BTW 500 meters is 1650 feet, hard to see even a big boat well at that distance. The big, fast cats at Legg can be difficult to control at 1000 feet due to poor vision, not radio issues.


.

[ls1fst98]

I think op is just reaching max radio range.

[Rocstar]

I have tested my SAW boats out to 1000 feet with my Spektrum DX3R PRO and have full control - never tried further.

+1 (but with a DX4S)

[webdesaster]

Well maybe 500 meter is a bit too much, but I did some tests today: depending on the location I loos connection between 120 and 150 meter. In my eyes, there could me more range I think 250 meters would be great.

[nx94z28]

I'm running the same tx/rx setup (MT4 w/461) and a savox servo. Were you able to fix the problem? I'm having the same issues even at close range.

[Silver954]

This is interesting I also have an mt4 that came with rx-461 and have a range problem in the boat. First I used the
rx-371w and everything was great no problems. Then I switched receivers and wanted to use the temp. sensor on the motor so had to put the rx-461. The data only works when the boat is around me which is still useful, but the signal cuts out with in good visual distance. When I raise the radio above my head it works again. This is at two different locations so it's not interference. I didn't have this problem in the rc truck with the rx-461 so it seems it's somehow related to the boat. I was going to email airtronics and see what they say about it.

[NativePaul]

Airtronics/Sanwa are not very popular with the FE boat crowd here so I have no idea what their pros and cons are.

Spektrum had an issue with the RXs minimum voltage being rather high, so digital servos could pull the bec/rx battery voltage down low enough to switch the RX off, which combined with a very long reboot time on their older RXs was quite a problem. To get around this many companies sell "glitch buster" capacitors that plug into a spare channel on a RX and help to stabilise the voltage. I have no idea if Airtronics/Sanwa have a similarly high voltage floor, but most glitch buster caps are cheap enough to be worth a go.

Installation can effect range to a great extent, to maximise range get both aerials out of the hull as high as possible, and vertical, space them apart in width as much as is possible so you always have 1 on your side of the roostertail.

Water absorbs radio waves, whereas the ground reflects them, so the range being shorter on water than on land is perfectly normal for ALL radios. Having said that some radios do have a longer range than others, and that also translates to longer range over water.

I would normally say that my preferred brand is one that you never see this sort of post about, but in this case I have no idea how mine would perform at that range, even at our SAWs lake we can't get more than 200m away, and >90% of my boating is roundy round within 100m.

[Silver954]

This is the response I got from Airtronics.

Customer Service:
Hi,
We would recommend checking that the top part of the antenna is out-side of the hull without any obstructions.
Thank you,
Airtronics Service


Me: Yes the antenna is out of the hull, sticking out vertical at about 2-1/2 inches in an antenna tube.

Customer Service:
Hi,
The RX-471W should provide the best range for a boat.
Thank you,
Airtronics Service


At that point I told them I am not interested in buying another receiver and they should add the information about their product that some of the receivers don't work well over water.

[dasboata]

I had a brand new MT 4 I lost my gas boat 2 times I had sent it back to airtronic they gave me a new radio I was never happy with the range I then went to Flysky,for a few years but crashed our 90 MPH GTP,,, So now I am back to futaba Fast I like it the best out of all of them