MADD CATT -41" fantasim saw build

[Cooper]

Well it's worth the try, I'm going through with the surgery. Attempting to re-solder the lead wire. Everything else looks fine. Will be insulating with some shrink to help prevent a short in case any of the shellack had melted off.

[Cooper]

image.jpgimage.jpg

Ok,

Stop the drinking and driving or I will ship blacky up there to get you focused.
Attachment 105794

Bring it biatch!!!! I've got reinforcements !!! Lol!!

[RaceMechaniX]

If the magnet lead wires are long enough to unbend and get outside the end bell, try that and directly solder the connectors on. Of course insulate the wires through the end bell with shrink tubing either way.

TG

[lenny]

Ok I will ship them both to you than and they can have some fun hanging out with your two,
This is Blacky's brother Slim having a drink at the same time,
Blacky was getting ready for his shower.

pursuit hull 007.jpg

image.jpgimage.jpg
Bring it biatch!!!! I've got reinforcements !!! Lol!!

[ray schrauwen]

I have added silicone fuel tubing to the wires jammed into the endbell so the wires don't bounce or chafe.

If the magnet lead wires are long enough to unbend and get outside the end bell, try that and directly solder the connectors on. Of course insulate the wires through the end bell with shrink tubing either way.

TG

[Cooper]

I have added silicone fuel tubing to the wires jammed into the endbell so the wires don't bounce or chafe.

I don't think the wire is long enough with some alterations to end bell for direct bullet soldering. Good idea on the tubing, I will do that. I think I may try and alter the end bell over winter if I don't move onto lmt's.

[Cooper]

Recent updates I have had a shaft bend causing some unseen failures. I didn't realize the prop shaft was very slightly bent and that resulted in bent flex, melted Teflon, and stuffing tube coming loose. So she has been in dry dock for a bit. I'm just now in the process of replacing stuffing tube and I decided to make the shafts out of hardened steel not stainless as the stainless is pretty soft. And I'm trying a one piece shaft/drive dog. In the length of shaft I'm out of tolerance by .007" After making this set I have a better machineing idea of how to get down to .003+\- the built in drive dog is tight where props have some persuasion to go on. I will be able to have prop and bullet or clinch nuts on complete shaft and balance before flex drive is glued. The best I can come up with for a truer running shaft assembly. Yea, I've had some time lately :). The props will be matched and made to go on one way only. A lot of work but the closest to true I think I can get. I know the weak link seems to be the shaft where it enters the prop hub but the one piece drive dog should bay far make up for that. But the hull has gone airborne about a dozen and half time at 100mph+ and not as much as a scratch. Reinforcing has worked out well. I have been pushing the drive line with props that started life as 465 but altered rake, pitch ending up as 52-57s. Only got to test once at 100+ and that's when I found the bent shaft. But she will be back out soon.

[cugino]

I don't think the wire is long enough with some alterations to end bell for direct bullet soldering. Good idea on the tubing, I will do that. I think I may try and alter the end bell over winter if I don't move onto lmt's.

Hi Cooper,

as you know i am using NEU motor in my HiPerf cat either. After some issues i am quite satisfied with NEU motors. Do you expect any noticable benefits with LMTs over NEU motors? I dont expect noticable benefits LMTs over NEU motors.

[iridebikes247]

perhaps a shorter motor for very high rpm setup? There is a guy running tp 4050L motors and getting 114mph its an hpr c5009. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLVLmKEVAIQ
High rpm and long motors seem to be enemies it seems (of course rotor width becomes a problem too. eg: fat kid on a merry go round makes it way harder on maintenance staff). The lehner 3040 used in most high end 135cm boats is only 80mm long. I could be wrong but am curious your thoughts on this too.

I just got my props back from dasboata they're really nicely done I hope the mhz will make it over 100 mph but i'll probably need to actually buy a gps before I can confirm lol.

[Livewire121]

113mph at night....very brave!

[Cooper]

perhaps a shorter motor for very high rpm setup? There is a guy running tp 4050L motors and getting 114mph its an hpr c5009. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLVLmKEVAIQ

I just got my props back from dasboata they're really nicely done I hope the mhz will make it over 100 mph but i'll probably need to actually buy a gps before I can confirm lol.

High rpm and long motors seem to be enemies it seems (of course rotor width becomes a problem too. eg: fat kid on a merry go round makes it way harder on maintenance staff). The lehner 3040 used in most high end 135cm boats is only 80mm long. I could be wrong but am curious your thoughts on this too.
I think the tp 4050 are 82mm long can. I've been very happy with the neu motors. I don't think the length matters on high rpm setups. BUT, I think a lot has to do with construction. On earlier versions of tp motors I had magnets break/fail. But the problem isn't with magnets but with the wrap. At the time the ones I had were wrapped with carbon tow and lightly epoxied. I was pushing them also but heat and rpm gave into the tow and started to unwrap. The neu motors and I think tp now too use Kevlar ribbon (or tow, width ?) then epoxied or secured somehow? But that make a huge difference in construction for rotors holding up under high stress stuff. For my runnings with this boat , amps and heat have been high but in acceptable range and these neu motors have held up very well. I'm surprised I haven't cooked one sooner. And for high amps, watts, heat, rpms it really was my fault I melted solder joints on lead wires. I normally don't run back to back and for more than 4 high speed long passes. My passes are from radio range to radio range (just shy, I know where it is). But that day I was happy to be testing some new props and didn't let things cool from run one and long session then right away back out and long run. You know just one more pass,,,,,,,,, how many times have I said to myself " if I would have just listened to myself and stopped then",,,,,,,,,, post some video of her going over 100, it's an addictive thrill!!!

[Cooper]

113mph at night....very brave!

He had a filter on the camera , it was super bright ! Lol!!

Yes, very brave soul!!!!!!! I can see running a pretty reliable boat at night but pushing 100+ wow! my luck I would have flipped, sunk, hit shore, or been driving the wrong way,, :)

[Cooper]

Hi Cooper,

as you know i am using NEU motor in my HiPerf cat either. After some issues i am quite satisfied with NEU motors. Do you expect any noticable benefits with LMTs over NEU motors? I dont expect noticable benefits LMTs over NEU motors.

I've been very happy with the neu motors. I am looking into lmt's for another winter build with a different kv range. But I don't have first hand with lmt so I thought about finding out. And I think lmt can out perform neu. Just my opinion as of now from others opinions and experiences.

[Savage Skidoo]

Looking good Cooper , i hope you get the drive line sorted out and back up and running .

[jcald2000]

Lose the Teflon in the drive line, it will twist and lock up your drive line and break thing eventually.

[Chrisg81983]

I never once had a problem with teflon spinning in brass. It makes a much nicer drive train. I spin motors in excess of 45,000 rpm with no problems. If you want you can also make sure inside of brass is clean and degreased then take some shoe goo and put a thin layer on Teflon and slide into the brass. Let this set up for a few hours and you will definitely have no problems. Almost all the people running high speeds with hpr's & mhz's use Teflon. Problem only occur from a few reasons either they use too thick of grease and second the lack of maintenance. The grease makes its way to the outside of the Teflon and makes a slick surface between brass and Teflon causing it to spin with ease.

[Cooper]

I definitely agree with you Chris, I used heavy grease before and had Teflon heat up and spin, melt, and break a flex. I know it was from the grease because it was on a reliable setup that I never had problems. I would rather have to relube more often than have deal with a twisted liner.

[keithbradley]

I use pretty thick grease and have never had a problem...I don't use that much though, so maybe that's the difference.
The fastest boats in the world are running Teflon, no doubt about that. I have one SAW boat that has no liners. My mystic just runs 1/4" tubing, no liner. When I grease the drives on that boat and make a few laps with it then bring it in, the hull is full of smoke (It actually works better with just a thin coat of grease on the shaft, and a little bit of water to mix in). It clearly gets hotter than my boats with Teflon liners. I would definitely recommend Teflon to someone with SAW aspirations.

Cooper if you go Lehner, expect to lower kv by 10-20% for the same RPM (example 1600kv Neu may be similar to 1400kv Lehner in actual RPM). Feel free to email me if you need info on anything when you're ready to order them.
Also, allow 1-2months from when you order to receive motors. The fastest I think I have ever received them is just over a month.

[Cooper]

Good to know, thanks. When I get closer to purchase I'll get some input from ya

[cugino]

Do you anyone know, why Lehner states their motors KV on load, nevertheles all other motor manufacture states motors KV with no load?

Lehner behavior doesnt mean any sense for me. How can be Lehner 100 sure with motor efficiency at different type of load (for ex. low voltage and hi amp or hi voltage and low amp - efficiency will be different at same input power)?

Or I ask another way: at what conditions Lehner states their KV?

[iridebikes247]

Never had an issue with teflon. I think its agreed upon that teflon will not fail in even the highest rpm setups. I have lightly scuffed the outside of the liner then glued into place, removal is easy.

One must pay close attention imo when installing a liner, motor must be well aligned, flex should never come loose, etc. Something tells me Cooper probably already knows this lol. I spun a liner when I first got into FE motor was poorly aligned with flex (bought the boat built so of course it wasn't my fault )

[nata2run]

Do you anyone know, why Lehner states their motors KV on load, nevertheles all other motor manufacture states motors KV with no load?

Lehner behavior doesnt mean any sense for me. How can be Lehner 100 sure with motor efficiency at different type of load (for ex. low voltage and hi amp or hi voltage and low amp - efficiency will be different at same input power)?

Or I ask another way: at what conditions Lehner states their KV?

This could be answered in a very complex way, but it makes perfect sense why they do what they do. They are basically stating the KV of the motor under load at maximum efficiency "the right load within its limits where it performs the best". That way you can calculate for best performance and get an idea of true rpm. True, that load on the motor play a role in how efficient it is, and different loads will produce different results. But electric motors are not intelligent, and will attempt to spin at the rpm they are suppose to at a given volt almost regardless of load (that's why they cook) I believe the Hi-Amp are designed to take a bit more current than the standard, and can be slightly "over powered" my philosophy anyway.

[Rocstar]

Never had an issue with teflon. I think its agreed upon that teflon will not fail in even the highest rpm setups. I have lightly scuffed the outside of the liner then glued into place, removal is easy.

One must pay close attention imo when installing a liner, motor must be well aligned, flex should never come loose, etc. Something tells me Cooper probably already knows this lol. I spun a liner when I first got into FE motor was poorly aligned with flex (bought the boat built so of course it wasn't my fault )

On the flip side, I've never had an issue running "no" Teflon on high RPM setups. While I've never had an issue with using Teflon either.....I'm just throwing it out there.

[stelerzman]

So, what's going on with the MC, Cooper. She's a very impressive boat, great job on the build. Looking forward to more videos

[Cooper]

Hey guys, I took a bit of break, didn't have as much access to water as wanted and got limited time,, but this coming summer will have more videos and more wrecks!! Gonna mess with some more prop work with this hull and push it till something gives :).

[srislash]

Glad to see you back buddy. Mine is going now too(when I get time).

[Local Boy]

Thank you very much Cooper for your time and dedication to this thread... You do beautiful work!

You have covered so many aspects of building and modifying your boat...it is amazing to me ... as I have learned, and continue to learn, so much from you and your experiences....

I particularly enjoy seeing how you evaluate your problems and over come obstacles, while improving upon your design and set up...

Please keep up the good work, as you are providing a huge resource for us newbies, to begin to understand the various dynamics involved with RC Power Boats...

I remain grateful...

Aloha

[Cooper]

Thank you very much Cooper for your time and dedication to this thread... You do beautiful work!

You have covered so many aspects of building and modifying your boat...it is amazing to me ... as I have learned, and continue to learn, so much from you and your experiences....

I particularly enjoy seeing how you evaluate your problems and over come obstacles, while improving upon your design and set up...

Please keep up the good work, as you are providing a huge resource for us newbies, to begin to understand the various dynamics involved with RC Power Boats...

I remain grateful...

Aloha

And its comments like that making it all worth while!! Thank you. I do have to say that I have just passed on the knowledge I have obtained from others. Watching and asking others builds on this forum is a wealth of good useful tips, guides, and lessons learned. And if you can't find it, ask as others are always willing to help. Tips on building are just as good as mistakes made, showing what to do and what not to do :). Thank you!!

[Cooper]

Well after a little time away from the water I'm finally back getting wet!!! Got the MADD Catt out and have some repairs to do on the one drive line, a little too much prop with a little too much throttle netted me a twisted flex. I made my own drive dog/shaft so I would never lose props again. Well I still have the drive line and prop but the flex let loose in the stuffing tube. It's gonna be a **** to get to but I'll fix it!!

The shaft and stinger,

And the problem area, short as possible tube and heavily reinforced, but not enough for a flex to let loose at 50k rpm!!