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Thread: 1/8 hydro on a budget possible?

  1. #1
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    Default 1/8 hydro on a budget possible?

    OK I know budget and big boats don't go together.
    But how would you power a 1/8 scale hydro that wouldn't be raced, just would like a nice running fun boat. If possible would like an 8s setup, could use existing 4s packs to keep costs down a bit.
    Been eying Mikes framing kits since he started doing them and have wanted a 1/8 since the 80's! Would do a modern hull, no idea which one yet, too many choices!
    Not even sure the build will happen, depends on how much it snows this winter! Might have to build it over a couple of winters.
    Read about plenty of high dollar racing setups but where I'm located racing it won't happen, I'd have the only one for a few hundred miles in any direction!
    Think I've got enough of a handle on the electric stuff now to step up to a HV setup successfully, and well it's gotta be a hydro!
    cheers
    If my boats upside down then who owns the one I thought I was driving the last two laps?

  2. #2
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    all depends on your version of "budget"

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    Keep a close eye on the swap shop, I try to get as much of the stuff I need there. You may want to check out JBD or RCG for large scale hardware.
    IMPBA 20481S D-12

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    Pretty much just looking for something less pricey than a honkin' Castle motor, Was thinking one of the big leopards?
    I don't do ultra cheap budget builds, buy cheap buy twice! But I don't think I can justify a Neu or Castle for a non racing scale fun boat. Thinking the next step down so to speak.
    Just want a nice runner, not concerned with getting every last ounce of speed out of this boat.
    If I'm just dreaming about a cheaper motor alternative I'll just extend the build to a couple of winters and do it right. Been waiting for 20 years another won't make much difference! Not the greatest time to own a construction company! LOL
    I always check the swap, bought a lot of stuff from some great people on here, I would buy used if the right motor was available at the right time. Gotta plan before I buy though. HV is brand new territory, got about a dozen various 4s setups from OPC tunnels to 1/10 scale shovelnose and everything in between.
    Cheers
    If my boats upside down then who owns the one I thought I was driving the last two laps?

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    We've tried to do that with a setup that compares with an 11 cc nitro engine. The first try used a Scorpion HK 4035 - 800 Kv, a Castle ICE 200 lite ESC with added water cooling, and two Gens Ace 5300 4S packs in series. Brian Buaas was able to drive that setup to a NAMBA Electric Scale and T Sport Hydro two lap record. Scorpion's price increase takes that out of the low cost range and the boat now runs a Neu with 4 - 5000 mah 4S packs. We are looking at some less expensive motors again, though. The prop is one key. Bigger props run faster but take more power which means more expensive components.

    Lohring Miller

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    There was an initiative about 5 years ago to somehow have a "Super Saver Class" for the 1/8th scale boats, but it went nowhere. At the time costs were still high and reliability stunk. With modern components/pricing it should be more achievable, but there is still the question of cost versus reliability. On a sport boat only run a couple times a month it is less of an issue, but on a racer which may put in over 6 hard racing heats a month....






    .
    ERROR 403 - This is not the page you are looking for


  7. #7
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    You won't go wrong with Mikes framing kits. The one I got was a dream to assemble, & the price, even with freight all the way out here to the Land of Oz, was pretty cheap I thought.
    As for a cheap 8s motor. This range of 56 series motors at HOR Racing looks interesting. Perhaps the 5684 1000kv 6 pole would work well for only $94.00. Check out the other sizes & Kv ratings.

    http://www.horracing.com/index.php?c...bdofncf066j3q1

    A good HV ESC is always going to be the most expensive part of the build. I'll leave the recommendations for that to others with experience with them.

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    Well 60$ difference in price between a 5698 Leo and a 1527 isn't really enough to worry about in the scheme of things. Only an extra hour of work to make up the difference in price.
    Might as well do it right and do it once. It it was over a hundred in difference I might try something else, 60$ isn't enough to worry about.
    LOL didn't even bother asking about a budget HV esc I know that will be the most expensive piece of the puzzle.
    Thanks for the help, kinda gave me the answer I figured I'd get. Wish it was going to be a racer, maybe after I build one some of the guys around here might jump on the bandwagon.
    Now to start saving! Cheers!
    If my boats upside down then who owns the one I thought I was driving the last two laps?

  9. #9
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    The issue with scale boats is always where to put the money. To make it great looking costs a bunch. To make it great running costs a bunch. To do both costs a TON!

    Probably didn't help, but I'm sure you have already been struggling with this tradeoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by siberianhusky View Post
    Well 60$ difference in price between a 5698 Leo and a 1527 isn't really enough to worry about in the scheme of things!
    Then why not splurge the extra $$ and get a Neu 1530 , Steve sells them here now!!!!! 20 bucks more.
    NEED PARALLEL CONNECTORS?? QUALITY 5.5MM, 8MM, 8 AND 10 AWG, GET THEM HERE: https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...est!&highlight=

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    LOL making it look good is the easy part, paying for it all is hard. Have an almost complete shop 10 steps from my back door, metal, wood, stone, welding, painting, pretty much got it covered. My other hobby is repairing/restoring vintage stringed instruments, just about ready to put the top back on a 125 year old Neopolitan bowl back mandolin that got dropped and shattered the back. Been working on that one for over a year now. My business is masonry restoration, century homes, churches etc.
    M-A-W do I have the feeling you want to see a rocket? I'm trying to fight the urge as it is! I already have a 4s NEU/Whiplash combo to build this winter. LOL originally planned a UL-1 combo, that idea didn't last very long. This one is supposed to be a fun relaxing boat. When I want my knees to shake I'll run a rigger!
    On a side note, just missed a muskrat with my Motley Crew yesterday, thought it was a stick or something until I realized it was moving across the pond into the path of the boat. Just got it turned in time. Castle powered Motley at full tilt and a muskrat would have been ugly. Saw it out of the corner of my eye just as I was coming out of the turn onto the front straight. It swam out of cattails onto the front straight. Was focused on the boat, I was the only one running at the time so I wasn't really looking out for other stuff on the water and no spotter. John had a heron take a strafing run at his JAE later in the morning. Swooped down just a few feet above the boat and followed it for the length of the back straight. Boating in the great white north.
    Cheers
    If my boats upside down then who owns the one I thought I was driving the last two laps?

  12. #12
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    If you can find a scorpion 4035/1070 kv or something similar to it (2500-3000 watts) this relatively inexpensive motor (or at least they used to be) and one of the budget 200amp HV speedos you will have a very fast and reliable combo as long as your build is relatively light. We have one guy in our club running this setup and his boat is fast and runs great. I also ran the same motor and cell combo w a 180HV speedo in a 43" mono and it ran great.
    We call ourselves the "Q"

  13. #13
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    I got the 1/8 scale bug about 5 yrs ago. Went top shelf on everything. When I was done and added up the costs the wife said, "You probably could have built a full size unlimited for a few buck more". This got me thinking. How to cut costs on a simple, reliable pond runner, still have fun with it, without taking out another mortgage on the house.
    First build was a '94 Miss U.S. I used Newton plans but cut all plywood dimensions 50%. Used Speedmaster .21 hardware, Leo 4072 2200kv, SF 200A ESC, 4s 5000mAH 30C Batteries, X 445 prop.
    It worked. Speeds were in the high 40s- low 50s, Temps were 115-120 on both motor and esc.
    It,s been 3 yrs now and I play a couple of time a week. I'm still running all original equip without a problem. This year I picked up a Zippy 4S 8000mAh battery to extend the run times.
    With that success I also built a '88 Miller High Life with the same results.
    I tried to attatch some pix but my pc is giving me problems. Pix of the boats are in my gallery.
    Rich

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    Forgot to add: Weight come in at 11lbs. 4oz.

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    The reality is if you want to do an 1/8 scale you can do it with top components for not a rediculous amt of $$ you just have to search. First if you're not too particular where your boat comes from you can buy a Nitro boat for conversion, there are so may of these around. I bought my Miss Maddison Hamms Bear for about $400 with all the nitro gear in it. You can take all the nitro gear out and sell that for $100 or more depending on what shape it's in. Next find a used Neu 1527/1.5Y (new they are $275) you can prob find one for around $150-$200. Then I personally wouldnt skimp on a speedo, I would use a hydra ice 2 HV200 ($300) but therer are plenty of $200 hv speedos that would work. You would prob spend $100 on motor mount water cooler flex shaft etc..and other extra stuff. You can now get a good set of 40-65c batteries for $110-175. So for less than or around $1000 you can get a good fast reliable scale boat. Now how much time and $$$ you wanna spend dressing it up and making it look like a 10!!! thats up to you. BTW I have raced my Hamms Bear for 5 seasons now with a 1527/1.5Y and the same Hydra HV240 (no water cooling on it) I have won 3 regional points titles and a national champioship with it. and have had ZERO maintainence!!!!
    We call ourselves the "Q"

  16. #16
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    Which boat is 11lbs?? the 1/8 scale or your 4 cell 1/16 scale boats???
    We call ourselves the "Q"

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    The 1/8 scale, I have no 1/16 boats, my smallest scratch built hull is 36"
    Rich

  18. #18
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    ok just figured if you took 1/8 plans and cut them down to 50% they would be 1/16 scale,
    We call ourselves the "Q"

  19. #19
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    Don't want to jack this thread but what is a reasonable 1/8 scale weight? Thinking less batteries and motor etc.

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    terry you saw my coors light run and it is 13-1/2 lbs and that is on the lighter side it was also underpropped by almost 2 sizes!!!!, my hamms bear weighs 18+ on 10s1p and 20+ on 2P (I don't need to run it on 2P anymore) His 11lb 4oz boats is very light (if that includes batteries)? Terry If you're looking to do a scale boat please call me!!!!!!!!
    We call ourselves the "Q"

  21. #21
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    By reducing 50% I meant the thickness of the plywood. Where it called for 1/4" I used 1/8. For 1/8 I used 1/16. After reading my original post I see that I didn't make that really clear. Sorry.
    Rich

  22. #22
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    11lb 4 oz is RTR. Again It's not meant for racing. It's an inexpensive scale that I enjoy running.
    It is light, hence the smaller motor, esc. Nearing 50 mph she will start to fly.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmikepags View Post
    terry you saw my coors light run and it is 13-1/2 lbs and that is on the lighter side it was also underpropped by almost 2 sizes!!!!, my hamms bear weighs 18+ on 10s1p and 20+ on 2P (I don't need to run it on 2P anymore) His 11lb 4oz boats is very light (if that includes batteries)? Terry If you're looking to do a scale boat please call me!!!!!!!!
    Mike, I'll buzz ya on my way home. Been watching a guys twin wings for about 4 years now. Think I got him talked into selling me one for a killer deal.

  24. #24
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    hey circus no biggie, light is good!!!!
    Terry which twin wing? the bud by H&M?
    We call ourselves the "Q"

  25. #25
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    No it's an actual scale hull from a guy that makes them locally here in MI. Guys work is awsome. It's bagged carbon/kelvar with honeycomb in the sponsons at the stress points. Done up like the T PLus. It's master hull roster number 92102.5. I've seen it's younger sister race multiple times as the Circus. Runs really well. I think on FE it will be sick. The hull is currently assembled for nitro but I don't see that as an issue. I was conerned about the weight though. Stilll looking at that.

    Jack'd! Sorry.

    My 2 cents on budget scale.....it is more reasonable than it once was but these scale boats are such a commitment that I wouldn't want to risk an equipment failure. If you've done it right you've likely dropped a lot of time and effort into making a "scale" boat. For most of the guys that do scale it's a love affair. The boats matter to them. It's not a slap it together deal. Say I throw a big Leapord in a scale. It will push it sure but for how many laps? Is it going to eventually puke it's rear bearing on me and take a speedo and cells with it? Maybe. Maybe not. Is it worth the risk? In scale boat I don't think it is.

    In fairness, I'm anti-budget when it comes to high performance. We have classes for the budget minded peeps. Not everybody needs to race the beasties. I don't own a T mono because I can't bring myself to scrimp on it. My budget wont allow me to do it the way I want. Cheap and high performance just don't go together. At least in my head they don't.

  26. #26
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    I hear you on that one read the very first line of the post. I spare no expense on my other boats, and this one it would be all about the boat not so much performance, come to the conclusion that there isn't enough of a savings in one of these to bother going cheap. Heck I won't even bother with turnigy batteries or any of the TFL hardware, not up to the same level at all as Speedmaster!
    Won't go with the Newton plans although I do love scratch building, Mike has put a lot of effort into redesigning his boats to work properly with todays power.
    I modded the sponsons of my Newton Pay n Pak and 1/10 Wahoo to bring them more in line with more modern designs. The PnP is now dialed in and runs great. But I was wondering if my changes would work during the entire build! Didn't want to sink that time and money into a pig.
    This build is strictly going to be for me, nobody to race a 1/8 against even if I wanted to, was really wondering if it was possible to trim a few hundred off the price tag but that won't happen, not enough of a price difference between leopard and the high end motors now to bother with a leopard IMO, even in the smaller stuff I'll spring for a 1515 before a leopard if its a full P build. I was impressed with my first Leopard until I got my first Castle. Exact same setup no changes the boat was faster and ran much cooler.
    Looks like it will be a top shelf build and if it takes me a couple winters with the other builds I have planned so be it.
    Probably won't be as overboard as my Wahoo build, that one even has functional wet sponson with scale drains, lol look in the sponson ends and you can even see fake fuel tanks! Sheeted the inside of the sponsons with mahogany so you wouldn't see ply on the insides! sponsondetail1.JPG
    If my boats upside down then who owns the one I thought I was driving the last two laps?

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by siberianhusky View Post
    look in the sponson ends and you can even see fake fuel tanks! Sheeted the inside of the sponsons with mahogany so you wouldn't see ply on the insides! sponsondetail1.JPG
    See that's what I'm talking about. That's a love affair. Nobody is looking in there to check your work.....................but you'd know. You don't sheet with mahogany because you have to. That's the kind of detail that takes a scale from race boat to .....holy smokes check that out! To lose it or damage it because you went with some cheapo piece in the build is IMO ludacris.

    You're in Ontario. Bring one of your scales down for the Michigan Cup next summer. Dates still pending.

  28. #28
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    My nitro Executone weighed 14.9 pounds. The latest electric version weighs 18.3 pounds. the difference is the "fuel"; a full tank of nitro weighs 1.2 pounds, the batteries weigh 4.9 pounds. It still flies, though.

    First NAMBA Nats 2012.jpg
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    Lohring Miller

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluid View Post
    There was an initiative about 5 years ago to somehow have a "Super Saver Class" for the 1/8th scale boats, but it went nowhere. At the time costs were still high and reliability stunk. With modern components/pricing it should be more achievable, but there is still the question of cost versus reliability. On a sport boat only run a couple times a month it is less of an issue, but on a racer which may put in over 6 hard racing heats a month....
    .
    http://www.rumrunnerracing.com/fefor...ht=super+saver
    2008 NAMBA P-Mono & P-Offshore Nat'l 2-Lap Record Holder; '15 P-Cat, P-Ltd Cat 2-Lap
    2009/2010 NAMBA P-Sport Hydro Nat'l 2-Lap Record Holder, '13 SCSTA P-Ltd Cat High Points
    '11 NAMBA [P-Ltd] : Mono, Offshore, OPC, Sport Hydro; '06 LSO, '12,'13,'14 P Ltd Cat /Mono

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