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Thread: P1 kos 35" offset rudder.

  1. #1
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    Default P1 kos 35" offset rudder.

    Hi,
    Has anybody tried making the rudder offset on the p1 kos 35"?
    And if so, Does it help the boat a lot or not ? https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...-Offset-Rudder
    I am doing some mods to run the boat on 4s2p 25c to 35c 5800mah on each side of the motor,
    With stock motor,esc, and hardware and a x640 prop.
    I will also add some turns fins to,
    I have not ran the boat yet, So am not sure how well they run with stock rudder setup inline.

    Thanks for any help or info.

    Lenny D
    Last edited by lenny; 02-13-2012 at 04:17 PM.

  2. #2
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    Hi Lenny,
    I plan to run for the second time tomorrow if everything goes well. My first run was cut short by a bad coupler, I didn't notice any major issues with handling, both right and left turns are within my expectation , I know each person has different expectation. I don't race so I have no need to up grade. One thing I did notice is that the transom is not flat, it curves and it would be hard for me to put an offset rudder. I ran 3s with a X642, it was very smooth, the prop bites right away. The stock 3 blade prop was just awful. I plan to run a X640 tomorrow. I will pit a Seaking 120A ESC and then run 4s. I am a bit concerned about the stock ESC dealing with 4s. That is just me... ofcourse.

  3. #3
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    The stock esc is really a 60amp seaking and should good to 6s,
    But 5s I think would be tops, And the stock motor will handle 4s.
    That stock motor on 5s would not last to long, So I hear.
    The rudder I was thinking of this, But on the right side.lol
    https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...-Offset-Rudder
    Last edited by lenny; 02-19-2012 at 01:09 PM.

  4. #4
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    How where your temps with the x642 and what cells c & mah where using ?
    And how much run time did you get ?

    I am just about rtr to,
    Just need one bolt and thumb nut to make my water proof hatch seal,
    And test for leaks wednesday I think.

    TTYL.

  5. #5
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    My Temp was all good, the longest run I made w/o opening the hatch to check was about 5 min. The ESC's temp was 110* and the motor a bit warmer, 129* . ( wish a bit lower but this was running full tilt) I used Sky Lipo 5000 mAh, 40 C, 3s. I got at least 7 min.+ with 33% Capacity left after checking the battery with Hyperion EOS Sentry. The batt. temp was 90*
    I had wanted to connect two of these batteries in a parallel way to increase runtime, alas, the ESC won't arm for some reason, I posted a question in the "Battery&Chargers" thread but have yet to receice any advice.

  6. #6
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    I hear the outrunners motors can run at 200 f and be ok,
    But with a water cooled motor mount the temps should be better and help the motor to.

    I did not see any post for help there,

    When you tried to arm, Was your tx on ?
    You may need to rebind tx to rx and calibrate the throttle and reset your esc again.

  7. #7
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    Thanks, I posted under " Charger, Battery talk, info and question", title is " Need Help to Understand Deans Parallel Plug", Yes, I binded the Rx and Tx, the ESC arms as soon as I plug in with the regular way, i.e. one single battery. I don't even have to do this, but the fact that it is not working really bugs me, but I thinik maybe this is too silly, nobody gives a hoot so therfore no answer. well, it is good to hear that these out runners can sustain a higher temp.
    Last edited by tlandauer; 02-14-2012 at 02:58 PM.

  8. #8
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    OK, I GPS'ed 3s with x642, it is only 29mph, then with 4s , running with x640, speed picked up to 41 mph!, that is a 12 mile jump. I used the stock ESC, temp was good, 90* ESC, motor was same, these are 2 min. runs. The stinger is in neg. setting----- the bottom of the bracket is lined up with 4+ hence the stinger is pointing down.

  9. #9
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    Was it running wet ?
    I think the setup likes the amps from the 4s cells,
    Temps are good with the x640 on 4s, Try the x642 and check temps.
    The deans you should ditch, And go with 5.5 bullets,
    It may give better power and run cooler to.
    I was going to start at 0 at the stinger and see what it does,
    Same with trim tabs.

  10. #10
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    Hi, it is not running wet, infact I had to lower it to get rid of the poiposing. Didn't have time to try x642, will do next time.
    Thanks for your advice, I am actually using 5.5 mm plug on 4s configuration. Its when I was running with 3s , my battery already has Deans. I made an adaptor so I can use Deans. There is correct voltage coming out on all sides of the plugs.anyway, now that I am running 4s, I will not use Deans. By the way, my trim tab is set at neutral .

  11. #11
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    It was windy today, but I wanted to try the x642, it worked very well, I don't think the difference is really that noticeable , the hull does have chine walk, I ajusted a bit the stinger, but all in all because of the windy situation I can't tell too much. The ESC stayed cool, upper 90* , motor is warmer than x640, like 120*, these are 3 min. runs.
    Did you by any chance try your P1 yet?
    Best, Tim

  12. #12
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    Hi Tim,
    No I did not run yet, Tomorrow for sure I will test.
    Did you put turn fins on your boat yet ?
    I hear this boat likes choppy water, Is that what you where running in today with the winds ?
    You said chine walk, Do you mean like a death wobble at top speed ?
    If so, May be trim tabs down some would help.
    But you will lose some speed to,
    But it will handle better and should not flip to easy like that.

  13. #13
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    Hi Lenny,
    The seller had installed turn fins and I assume they are the micro sized ones from OSE, they work really well for turns, no spin out! Yes, the wind was strong, medium chops, the boat could handle that w/o problem. My chine walk happens at top speed just as you said, the front of the boat reminds me of a Cobra snake. However, she doesn't come close to flipping, I also noticed the rudder bracket is not mounted 100% perpendicular to the V bottom, these being RTRs, production variance. So the in-line rudder is creating some sort of disturbance, IMO. Your idea of an off-set rudder will help. BTY, same thing on my Miss Geico, with the Kintec off-set, the boat tracks as if on rails, the stock one has chine walk even on that Cat hull, at least mine.---This is another topic.
    Have a great time tomorrow!

  14. #14
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    Ran today,
    Not running bad, But I think I will need some turn fins.
    I reversed the stock trim tap turn fin to see if that would help any,
    But I do not think it did,
    The stock turn fin trim tab is adding to much drag I think.
    I may try it with out them and see what happens with temps speed.
    But with the 3s cell back some I think it help with the turns and did not slide out much.
    Windy and some chop but looked like it was running good at top speed on 4s2p and ran once on 3s with cell back some.
    4 minute on 4s2p with a x640 prop, Temps where a little high at first and I moved cells back some.
    Temps, 95 f cells, 160 f esc caps and 135 f esc, 175 f motor.
    No gps today, Just testing the setup,
    All and all I think it ran a little wet today but stable at top speeds and fun.

  15. #15
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    Sounds pretty good to me!
    Do you have the newer version Turnfin/tabs, I bought the new P1 a month or so ago- never ran but meanwhile I got a used one here and have been running the used one instead! I was curious as to how they worked, I was thinking reversing them as well.
    Did you modify your battery placement? Remember you saying placing them on both sides of the motor.
    Good that you don't have chine walk, I am going to ajust the tabs per your suggestions.

  16. #16
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    Well, I watched the boat very carefully and thought maybe it was running a bit wet still, ajusted the stinger up a bit, got rid of the chine. I was really happy 'till i noticed she was kind of slow, decided to bring her in, about 3 ft. before me she stopped dead, I can see inside the hatch was filled with smoke. After carefully observing that it was not a slow fire , I opened the hatch, man, smells bad, but it was not the ESC!! rather the loose silicone cooling tube had bounced around and somehow got caught with the out-runner. Now my motor is damaged, do you know other than Venom who has these motors? They are out of stock and God knows when they will have them, these motor has a "collar" for the motor mount to clamp.

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    Last edited by lenny; 02-19-2012 at 11:02 AM.

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    Last edited by lenny; 04-04-2012 at 08:34 PM.

  19. #19
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    Hear are some motors that will fit the stock motor mount if you do not want to change it yet,
    Better then venom and cheaper to.
    Link,https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...lacement-motor

  20. #20
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    Add turn fins mod,
    These look nice to.
    Link,
    https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...182#post245182

  21. #21
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    Thanks for the links, I am waiting from Fightercat for some answer/advice, looks like he is out of the 2200Kv version, these motors look good, and is half the prize. meanwhile I soldered the plugs and put in the 120A ESC. I have those turn fins, not in red but in natural silver color. I have no intention to push the boat to exceed 50 mph and therefore I didn't observe any torque roll tendency. I like your idea of modding the battery position, I might consider doing that later .
    As an aside, the fried motor still works, but you shoud see how it looks inside: as if been thru a nuclear attack. The windings are blobs!! lol...

  22. #22
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    Did you take the motor apart ?
    If so,
    May be with a heat gun and tweezers you could get the stuff off and still use it.
    I think my temps were high because the x640 prop that came with the boat was not S & B,
    I looked good at it today.lol
    I will try two good S & B props tomorrow, A s215 and a m440.

  23. #23
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    No, I didn't think about. That is at least a fun idea, had to work, may be later in the week. Sears, of all place, carries the motor, price a bit high.didn't have time to do more research.
    Have fun tomorrow!

  24. #24
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    No dice, I took it apart after coming home. The blob on the windings is the burned lacquer on the copper wire. It only looks like a blob but will flake off when touched. Boy, the motor still turns, but I am not going to connect it again to electricity ever again, it is a very nice paper weight now on my desk! lol...
    BTW, the quality inside the motor looks quite good, the magnets are still firmly epoxied to the casing of the rotor. All epoxy survived the heat, no discoloration. bearings are still good.

  25. #25
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    Hi Tom,
    Do you know what your timing is set at on your old boat with bad motor ?
    If not, May be you can hook the program card to the esc and see what it is set at.

    The weather has bin to windy to run hear so I started modding some things again.
    I added turn fins and modded the stock trim tabs / turn fin combo to just wider trim tabs,
    It amazing what a hammer can do,
    Next came making the stock rudder offset to the right,
    And I will test higher timing setting on the esc and motor to see if they will run cooler or not,
    Also made a seal for the hatch to lay on and one bolt and thumb nut to hold the hatch down.
    I should try to reinforce the hatch to at some time, It just not to strong.
    Now I just need to sink it and look for leak,
    I will post some pictures of what I did so far.

    I will test everything tomorrow.
    Last edited by lenny; 02-21-2012 at 09:15 PM.

  26. #26
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    HI Lenny,
    I will check tomorrow, got to leave for work, Jamespl wrote on your other thread that Venom told him the timing is set at 11 deg. For your info, my motor was very warm, but my ESC was no where near your temp. I will see what the 60A ESC is set at. My 120A is set 15deg. But I have not run it yet.
    Can't wait to see your mods!

  27. #27
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    Well I checked the 60A ESC that came with the boat, it is set at 15 deg. I wouldn't know if the previous owner has ajusted any of the settings. I decided the take the motor from my other NIB P1 and give it a run with the 120A ESC I put in a few days ago. The motor seemed to be more eager to rev up. Accel. from stop is stronger---there is no doubt about that.
    Don't know if it is because of the ESC or the newer motor.
    Temps were similar, with motor being on the warm side like 139-149 deg. Front of motor being the hottest at 160 deg., where the motor clamp is, pointing the temp gun into the windings the temp is lower:i.e. 139-149 deg. . ESC was never above 110 deg--not even at the cap side. Batt. were at 90deg. ( Gens Ace 5300mAh, 2s1p 30c from HobbyPartz)
    x642prop
    ESC set at 15 deg.
    Last edited by tlandauer; 02-22-2012 at 06:03 PM.

  28. #28
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    Good to hear your back and running,
    What speeds are you getting with 3s1p ?
    When you ran your old motor before the tubing problem, Were you using the Gens ace cells than ?

  29. #29
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    Thanks,
    yes, I was using the same batteries. I am actually running on 4s. I didn't check the speed, last GPS reading was 41mph, 3s was 29mph. Today was similar. I thought it might have been a bit faster because there was a hint of chine walk again, I raised the stinger a little, now almost 0 deg. (neutral). It was by and large gone.
    Post some pic when you have a chance, dying to see your mods.

  30. #30
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    Ok,
    I was thinking the gens, kicked motor up.
    My temps are down, I think it was the bad prop.
    I try that again and see if they go back up.
    Ran good today, And tried it on 3s1p 5 packs and best GPS 29.5 mph with a x442.
    I forgot my new x642 prop, That will be next to try.
    I put pack in center of boat all the way to back with the gps.
    It drives great with the offset rudder, I move the turn fins up just about out of the water.
    But that did not change how great it drives with the rudder offset.
    Hears some pictures and videos,P1 35 KOS 004.jpgP1 35 KOS 005.jpgP1 35 KOS 006.jpgP1 35 KOS 007.jpgP1 35 KOS 008.jpg

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