Blueprinting UL-1 Motor Wires

[ray schrauwen]

Yep, the problem is that most everyone was running 445's, 545's, H5's, and I even heard of an H7!!! Tough crowd last weekend!! lol!!

I've been running this do-hickey for some time now and haven't burnt up any wires. No mods to the motor itself. Motor is as-manufactured. Just slips over the end bell.

BTW Ray - You've got yourself one heck of a great lady to put up with the ESC stink all the way home! My wife almost made me drop a boat hull in the garbage at the gas station one trip!

See ya!
Pete

Attachment 101763

Yes I do sir, she is tops! She even helps me build! I need to make one of those end bell coolers, pretty slick Pete.

[Shooter]

Thanks guys. Yes, I machined it on the mill with a saw cutter. Took 3 stinkin hours! There is a separate thread on it... 'Endbell Heat Sink'. Didn't mean to hijack Tony's thread.....just wanted to mention other ways of addressing the wire insulation issue.

[Brushless55]

just wanted to bump this thread as I lost a UL-1 motor this past weekend during our finals .....
not sure if quality has dipped but the motor had 2 or 3 laps for testing a few weeks ago then Sat. it went up in smoke going into lap 3 during the first heat of the day...

[ray schrauwen]

I'm starting to wonder the same thing. Maybe the 1800kv motor will work better, that's what I might try.

[Doug Smock]

just wanted to bump this thread as I lost a UL-1 motor this past weekend during our finals .....
not sure if quality has dipped but the motor had 2 or 3 laps for testing a few weeks ago then Sat. it went up in smoke going into lap 3 during the first heat of the day...

What class, set up etc?

[ray schrauwen]

For me LSH, I have melted 3 motors in my PTSS and haven't finished a race in a while. Of course I could be guilty of too much prop and not enough setup/pond time. I'm sticking with a 42mm prop from now on.

[photohoward1]

When are we going to admit that those motors suck. I have gone to a nue 1515/1y in all my spec setups. More reliable and better built.

My 20 SGX rigger clicked at 63mph on an H7 and 120 seaking. 85 degrees on the motor.

I think we made a big mistake picking cheap motors. I have burned up too many. We all would have saved money by buying better quality from the start.

[ray schrauwen]

AGREE! That would kinda make it P-sport hydro then sort of but, unless they are handing out spec props for LSH these motors are costing too much imo. A Castle 1515 1Y would be not too bad also. With spec props, all you have to tech is the diameter I mean, nothing over XXmm in diameter and the CD has a Template to check. You can work it any way you want and have any pitch you want just not over a specific diameter, just a thought.

When are we going to admit that those motors suck. I have gone to a nue 1515/1y in all my spec setups. More reliable and better built.

My 20 SGX rigger clicked at 63mph on an H7 and 120 seaking. 85 degrees on the motor.

I think we made a big mistake picking cheap motors. I have burned up too many. We all would have saved money by buying better quality from the start.

[Doby]

Here we go.....

[LuckyDuc]

I replaced a UL-1 motor I had in my LSH for the last 2 yrs with a new one at the beginning of summer. It only lasted 3 runs before frying on the same setup as the 2 yr old motor. I put the 2 yr old UL-1 motor back in and haven't had a problem since doing that.

[LuckyDuc]

Here we go.....

Where's the dead horse emoticon?

[T.S.Davis]

Not my yob.

[Doug Smock]

I replaced a UL-1 motor I had in my LSH for the last 2 yrs with a new one at the beginning of summer. It only lasted 3 runs before frying on the same setup as the 2 yr old motor. I put the 2 yr old UL-1 motor back in and haven't had a problem since doing that.

Hey Sean,
That sucks. Hope that isn't the new norm.

[properchopper]

While I really want to cautiously avoid "stirring the pot" on this topic, I'm sitting on a mountain of shared experience in the P-Ltd realm in which the AQ2030 motor is the bread-and-butter powerplant and there seems that some "discussion" may be warranted regarding the durability of later-model versions of this motor.

[T.S.Davis]

Make sure you let Grim know this.

I hope this isn't the norm too. I just replaced my working LSO motor last night and have a race this Sunday. That would be a season killer for me.

[Brushless55]

What class, set up etc?

Doug, this was in my PSpec Rigger with help from Snowman

When are we going to admit that those motors suck. I have gone to a nue 1515/1y in all my spec setups. More reliable and better built.

My 20 SGX rigger clicked at 63mph on an H7 and 120 seaking. 85 degrees on the motor.

I think we made a big mistake picking cheap motors. I have burned up too many. We all would have saved money by buying better quality from the start.

That is not a PSpec motor that most of us race with..

I replaced a UL-1 motor I had in my LSH for the last 2 yrs with a new one at the beginning of summer. It only lasted 3 runs before frying on the same setup as the 2 yr old motor. I put the 2 yr old UL-1 motor back in and haven't had a problem since doing that.

yep, mine went up in about 5 1/2 laps total... 3 on practice day without any issues and 2 1/2 laps in heat #1 before is smoked..
I did put in a older UL-1 motor before heat #3 and ended up placing 2nd for our finals on Sat.

While I really want to cautiously avoid "stirring the pot" on this topic, I'm sitting on a mountain of shared experience in the P-Ltd realm in which the AQ2030 motor is the bread-and-butter powerplant and there seems that some "discussion" may be warranted regarding the durability of later-model versions of this motor.

I hope this is not what is happening

[Doby]

Where's the dead horse emoticon?

In Peterson's computer somewhere!

[TheShaughnessy]

This could get ugly best not to play with fire.

[TheShaughnessy]

Picture of a monitor so might be a lil fuzzy.

[properchopper]

This could get ugly best not to play with fire.

While I'm not sayin' that these motors are less robust than earlier ones() I have taken some steps

I'll match you One electric computer fan (reversed to extract heat from the motor)
and
raise you One independent pickup for the motor only

DSC04792.JPG

and also raise you

The ProperChopper Labs prototype blue-ice filled in-line KoolStick (pictured during sink test)

DSC04850.JPG





DSC04853.JPG

[TheShaughnessy]

I'll match your independent pick up.

I'll be prototyping a kopper kool keeper here pretty soon.

[Doug Smock]

[photohoward1]

If they had better wire to begin with...We would not need silly wire coolers or separation of wires so they don't touch. We are putting 5.5mm or 6mm connectors on 2 or 3mm wire. It's just stupid.
Maybe we need to statr stirring a little bit. The forum has been boring for a while. I like rays suggestion. But hand out props. All the same pitch!

[LuckyDuc]

Perhaps this is the path that leads back to the revival of the "P" classes.

[Chilli]

LuckyDuc, you posted this as I was composing this message. You hit the nail on the head.

Though I admire all the innovations for trying to get the most out of the UL1 motors, I think if they were run closer to the parameters they were designed for there would be no need for all these modifications. Most in my area run a 42x55 for tunnels and sport hydro's and the H7 for riggers. The result is competitive heats with very few failures which is what I strive for in my district. We may be a couple mph slower than many of you but we have a hell of a good time racing without burning stuff up. This has helped us bring newbies and IC converts into FE racing. I have come to realize the P-Limited classes serve a different purpose in other parts of the country and that's cool. Everyone has to do what ever makes your membership happy. Howard does bring up some good points. For the price of three burned out UL1 motors you can buy a Neu. I'm curious how many clubs and districts only run P-Limited classes?? I'm heard of P-Limted Tunnel, Hydro, Sport Hydro, Mono, Offshore classes and even a few talk about a Q-Limited class. What I want to know is why are we so stuck on the Limited classes?? Why not just P and Q? It's obviously not about money since many are going through a couple motors a year??

[photohoward1]

LuckyDuc, you posted this as I was composing this message. You hit the nail on the head.

Though I admire all the innovations for trying to get the most out of the UL1 motors, I think if they were run closer to the parameters they were designed for there would be no need for all these modifications. Most in my area run a 42x55 for tunnels and sport hydro's and the H7 for riggers. The result is competitive heats with very few failures which is what I strive for in my district. We may be a couple mph slower than many of you but we have a hell of a good time racing without burning stuff up. This has helped us bring newbies and IC converts into FE racing. I have come to realize the P-Limited classes serve a different purpose in other parts of the country and that's cool. Everyone has to do what ever makes your membership happy. Howard does bring up some good points. For the price of three burned out UL1 motors you can buy a Neu. I'm curious how many clubs and districts only run P-Limited classes?? I'm heard of P-Limted Tunnel, Hydro, Sport Hydro, Mono, Offshore classes and even a few talk about a Q-Limited class. What I want to know is why are we so stuck on the Limited classes?? Why not just P and Q? It's obviously not about money since many are going through a couple motors a year??

Human nature on wanting to go faster. I run an H7 on my rigger and it always came back hot. Mine is probably not set-up as well as some others that come back cool. To be competitive I need that H7..on cooler days I ran an H10... "A wise man spends wisely. A fool spends foolishly" I can run my LSO on an M445 (2030/1800kv) all day. One prop tick higher and poof! BTW I put the 1515/1y in my rigger and 63mph..H7, 85 degrees 7 laps and 3000mah... and that motor is 6 years old and been beaten to death..(apparently not death it's still screams). In my club we run a small open class. 4s. New guys usually show up with castle or leopard motor in them. I was the only one with a AQ2030 (because I travel and race). I would smoke a motor and they would wonder what idiot spec'd those motors? (I was in the original discussion group that helped pick them.) Live and learn.

[Steven Vaccaro]

I think that with anything, there are some production runs that are better than others with mass produced items. You guys run them harder than they were intended on and find the limits much faster. I sell the 1415 1y for $165.00 that's twice the cost of a 2030 but one burnt up motor and it your even.

[photohoward1]

I think that with anything, there are some production runs that are better than others with mass produced items. You guys run them harder than they were intended on and find the limits much faster. I sell the 1415 1y for $165.00 that's twice the cost of a 2030 but one burnt up motor and it your even.

My thoughts exactly....

[SirBudman32]

Howard, I have a 1515 2200 in my Jae as well. With the H-7 mine ran 63 mph but came back with everything under 110 degrees. I am running on 5s also. I do run with a 1450 same set up and it runs 75 mph consistently.

[DPeterson]

Brushless55 - A fellow racer of mine had the same thing happen. He returned it back to Tower and received back another one.

It appears the manufactuer of the motor decided to switch the type of varnish used to coat the windings as there is a distinct difference. I too lost a new motor in a tried and true set up. In another proven set up I am seeing higher run temps.

As for cooling - I have been experimenting with all kinds of cooling systems. I am sure there are some positve attributes. However I believe that any and all cooling systems that we apply can not take the heat away as fast as it is generated. Therefore we really can not cool the weak link in the motor (the beginning of the windings).

So far I have not gone through any more UL1 motors than I used to go through with the 700 Brushed motors in the spec classes. Even though I had argued from day one against specing Chinese equipment I am not ready to throw in the towel. We have gotten to this point by making 3 bad decisions 1. allowing 2P, 2. wrong length limits and 3. specing Chinese equipment. Lets be very carefull and more thorough when we are discussing future directions.

Enough for now - got to find my Horse Icon in my computer. :)