Generator Suggestons

[longballlumber]

Hey Guys,

I am tossing around the idea of getting a Generator to use when going to races. I am not sure I want to try and power my chargers off the battery on my new car. In the past I have used the Honda 1000ei from work and it “seemed” to do everything I needed. This is what I am looking to power simultaneously:

A 25amp power supply that will then power 2X Hyperion Duo3 chargers: worst case I would be charging 2X 6S 5000 packs @ 5 amps on one charger and then 2X 4S 5000 packs @ 5 amps on the other

A heating pad for pre-warming cells.

A small net book (aka mini laptop) to check my eagle tree data and make controller changes.

A small speaker docking station for my Ipod: Come-on I need some Jams while I am wrenching.

Will 900 watts get that or do I need to jump to something bigger? Any thoughts?

thanks for the input
Mike

[longballlumber]

I am not sure if this got moved, but I ment to put it in the general questons forum.... I will see what kind of response I get here....

[HOTWATER]

Good thread starter...i'm interested in what other racers suggest as well.

-Kent

[RandyatBBY]

If you can afford it a Honda all the way. little spendy,

[longballlumber]

I have been looking on this website, but I still don't know which size will meet my above reqirements...

http://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com/

Later,
Mike

[RandyatBBY]

I have been looking on this website, but I still don't know which size will meet my above reqirements...

http://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com/

Later,
Mike

Hi Mike all of the three generators in the add will run quite a bit of equipment but are real loud. I have a 5800 watt like the ones in the add it will run a bout 10 guys at a race but drives us nuts. a 1000 watt Honda will run 1 or 2 guys and barely run a motor home on it own A 2000 watt Honda will take care 3 to 4 guys at a race and run a motor home all alone. Hope this helps. Honda generators are nice and quiet.

[mm123521]

I bought a 900 watt Yamaha inverter generator from electricgeneratorsdirect.com .
They are local to me, so I just went to their store. Very nice, knowledgable people.
Have not tried it at the lake yet. I only need it for charging batteries. It only weighs 27 pounds, and is very compact.

My Yamaha has an 8 amp, 12 volt DC outlet, so I can operate my 12 volt chargers without using a power supply. 8 amps will support one charger only.

2 times 6S at 5 amps is about 250 watts.
2 times 5S at 5 amps is about 200 watts

thats 450 watts total, but there will be inefficency in converting to battery voltages.
I would figure 650 Watts for charging the batteries. That leaves 250 watts left over.
How many watts is your heating pad?

I bought my generator just before a huge snow storm.
Told the wife we needed it for the comming blackout, so she wanted me to run right out and get it!! It just happens it will work at the lake too!! HaHa!

Mark

[bwells]

Honda 2000, real quiet, light weight, reliable, runs all day on a tank and should do the trick. 1000 bucks but it runs the A/C in my camper, a skill saw, haven't tried my compressor on it, and is real handy for when the power goes out, throw an extension cord threw the window and the TV is back on as well as lights. The heating pad may be a problem as I know my wife's blow dryer takes around 1500 watts as well as the coffee maker and both really kick up the RPMs.

[longballlumber]

Thanks for the posts guys! I appreciate you taking time to reply.

Randy - You and many have recommended the Honda's, but your right they are pricey.

At this moment the ONLY reason I am looking to buy a genny is for boat racing. I don’t have a camper or have any other reason to have one, so bang for the buck or good value is what I am looking for. Also it seems that going up to a 2000 watt model might be a better idea than over working a 1000 watt unit. For the cost difference between the two I might as well spend the extra money for the extra wattage.

I will keep shopping and researching.

Thanks,
Mike

[Hydromaniac]

Some of us have been using a small 900 watt from Harbor Frieght,(Chicago Brand) They work well, not loud at all The only thing is they are 2 stroke but they are only $125.00 and sometimes on sale for around $90.00 They have worked out great and for $100.00 its kind of hard to beat. They are also nice small units.

[larryrose11]

Why do you need the inverter -> power supply - 12 DC in for the charger?
You are throwing about half of the power away as heat in the process!
How about a decent solar pannel attached directly to your car battery, and the charger also directly hooked to the battery?
This approach will also be QUIET, and I'm POSITIVE the car battery can handle the transients.

If your concerned about the car battery, then perhaps a solar panel and a marine deep cycle?

Oooo, here is the ticket: Use Ex-Prius modulees!! cheap, and high power. half the weight of lead:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Lot-1...Q5fAccessories
they are 6.5 Ah per cell, and each modules has 6 Cells. you could bolt together a 12S5P pack for a 14.4V nominal, 32.5 Ah battery for $20. That is tough price to beat. 2 of these batterys and a solar panel, your quietly in business! you can also charge them up with the car if they get low.

something like this would work great. Rugged, and doesn't mind the clouds, and you could roll it up!
http://cgi.ebay.com/68-watt-Uni-Sola...item4156df19bb

[mm123521]

larryrose11:

But that solar pannel costs $239 and only kicks out 68 watts.
And thats only if the sun is shinning and the solar panel is aimed correctly.
Mike is looking for 10 times that much power.

Were you thinking to have all the energy you need for the lake stored up in the battery, then just use the solar panel to recharge the battery later?

Besides, those inverter gennerators are cool - they only run fast enough to keep up with the load, not full speed like other gennerators. That makes them Quiet and fuel efficent.

Mark

[larryrose11]

mm123521,
in this application, the battery supplies all the power you would need,
The panned would continuously charge the battery.
Lets do the math
So, lets just say you have a 4S, 5000 mha Lippo to charge.
4s*3.7Vnom*5000mha/1000 = 74 Wh-hrs,
Lets just say your lipo boat charger is 90% efficent...
74 Wh-hrs / 0.9 = 82.2 Wh-hrs, DC input to your charger.

the Pirus battery in this configuration is 12S10P, or 20 modules from the link
12*1.2*6.5*10 = 936 Wh-hrs

So if you dont charge the Priys battery at all,
you will get:
936 Wh-hrs / 82.2 Wh-hrs, = 11.4 times you could be able to charge on the stored energy in the prius battery alone.

Now, lets add a solar pannel:
68W for 1 hr = 68 W-Hr, and lets just say you get 80% of the rated capacity:
68 Wh*.8 = 54.4 W-Hr will be added to the battery every hr it sits in the sun, roughly 3/4 of a charge on this hypo theoretical set up.

For the money, given that 11 modules are $20, + $12 shipping, the cheapest option is order 3 sets of them!
you would have a 12S15P pack!
12*1.2*6.5*15 = 1404 Wh-hrs stored.

1404 Wh-hrs / 82.2 Wh-hrs, = 17 times you could be able to charge on the stored energy in the prius battery alone. Then just jumper it to your car, and let it run for 10 min, turn off your car, and your done!!

$60 bucks, and $12 shipping, and you have a 14.4V, 97 Ah battery!!!

[HOTWATER]

Pretty crazy idea there...pretty cool too!! So tell me...besides hooking it up to your own car battery to charge it...what kind of charger can one use to charge it? Can it be charged at home with a Hyperion Duo II charger and power supply??

[d.a.v.e]

I bought a 2500 watt honda used from home depot's rental dept. Looked like it was used very lightly for $300. At a race we put it about 100 feet away behind some trees and its still annoying. I've never found it underpowered for most tasks & it had no problem with 3 of us charging at once. While I have used it for racing its main job in life is to ensure my salt water fish tank has power It will power a lot but is loud!

One thing to keep in mind is that the honda ones folks are recommending are all rated for computers which means the power fluctuations are not as great and won't damage sensitive electronics. When you get one of these you will be surprised what you want to use it for. Think about spending the extra for the nicer honda!

I'm planning to buy the 2000 watt one in a few months for our boat. Its way smaller then my 2500 and you can have a conversation while your standing by it. Looking forward to having it for the track this summer!

[HOTWATER]

I have a freind that is a retired electrician and he says that those Honda generators (the 2000 watt ones in the above posts) are the best ones to buy. I asked him about the Generac or Honeywell ones and he just shook his head and said "nope, Honda is the best. One pull starts and they're quiet."

[d.a.v.e]

mm123521,
in this application, the battery supplies all the power you would need,
The panned would continuously charge the battery.
Lets do the math
So, lets just say you have a 4S, 5000 mha Lippo to charge.
4s*3.7Vnom*5000mha/1000 = 74 Wh-hrs,
Lets just say your lipo boat charger is 90% efficent...
74 Wh-hrs / 0.9 = 82.2 Wh-hrs, DC input to your charger.

the Pirus battery in this configuration is 12S10P, or 20 modules from the link
12*1.2*6.5*10 = 936 Wh-hrs

So if you dont charge the Priys battery at all,
you will get:
936 Wh-hrs / 82.2 Wh-hrs, = 11.4 times you could be able to charge on the stored energy in the prius battery alone.

Now, lets add a solar pannel:
68W for 1 hr = 68 W-Hr, and lets just say you get 80% of the rated capacity:
68 Wh*.8 = 54.4 W-Hr will be added to the battery every hr it sits in the sun, roughly 3/4 of a charge on this hypo theoretical set up.

For the money, given that 11 modules are $20, + $12 shipping, the cheapest option is order 3 sets of them!
you would have a 12S15P pack!
12*1.2*6.5*15 = 1404 Wh-hrs stored.

1404 Wh-hrs / 82.2 Wh-hrs, = 17 times you could be able to charge on the stored energy in the prius battery alone. Then just jumper it to your car, and let it run for 10 min, turn off your car, and your done!!

$60 bucks, and $12 shipping, and you have a 14.4V, 97 Ah battery!!!

So all the math here sounds good but.. The solution would be heavy & I would guess about half as good as proposed.

We have something similar to what he is recommending set up on our sailboat that is supposed to charge 2xbig marine batts I don't recall the size right now. It sort of works, if we are out it can keep my laptop & other instruments going for about 3 hours before one batt is dead. With just the instruments it can actually charge the batteries but when adding an inverter & med size laptop the solution goes backward.

Your better off with a gen that is portable and you can use in a variety of situations.

[bwells]

Once again, the Honda 2000 is it hands down but the big kicker is the heating pad for the Lipos. What about hanging them in front of the exhaust, they may come out a little stinky though. Just a thought.

[larryrose11]

Pretty crazy idea there...pretty cool too!! So tell me...besides hooking it up to your own car battery to charge it...what kind of charger can one use to charge it? Can it be charged at home with a Hyperion Duo II charger and power supply??

Yes, you could. I was thinking about this earlier! I would NOT use the NiMH setting though. I have lots of personal experience with these Prius modules. you dont ever want to go above 8.3V per module, so 2x = 16.6 V. Just use youer power supply set to 16.6 V open circuit, just don't go over 100A on charging it.

[larryrose11]

So all the math here sounds good but.. The solution would be heavy & I would guess about half as good as proposed.

We have something similar to what he is recommending set up on our sailboat that is supposed to charge 2xbig marine batts I don't recall the size right now. It sort of works, if we are out it can keep my laptop & other instruments going for about 3 hours before one batt is dead. With just the instruments it can actually charge the batteries but when adding an inverter & med size laptop the solution goes backward.

Your better off with a gen that is portable and you can use in a variety of situations.

For flexability, a generator would be better, but the solution I proposed is cheap, and reliable. From personal experience, you will ger 6 AH out of these modules if they are charged to 8.3V, or 16.6V in this case.
As for working half as well, that is because you were charging lead, which can suffer badly if they are left uncharged. Lead batteries are not that good for cyceling at all. Even with a modelt power draw, they will only give up about 75% of their rated energy. This is called the Peukert Effect.

Heavy? well each one is 1050g and has 6 cells in it. A pack 12S15P is 30 modules. 30*1.050*2.204 69.4 lb, about half of what a deep cycle marine battery would be of that capacity.

[mm123521]

larryrose11:

Those do look like interesting batteries, and cheep too.
I wonder if the used ones have much capacity left (they are 10 year old batteries)?
NMH does have advantages over lead acid.

Mark

[larryrose11]

larryrose11:

Those do look like interesting batteries, and cheep too.
I wonder if the used ones have much capacity left (they are 10 year old batteries)?
NMH does have advantages over lead acid.

Mark

That depends on if they were used outside of the OEM application, like we are talking. If they were just used in the OEM application, then th wors thing that happened to them was when they sat idle on the shelf.

BTW, you will need to exercise these batteries if ya get them, just to wake them back up. You would doo this by just cycling them 4-5 times or so, and they will be fine.
These Panasonic batteries are built like tanks.

[Brushless55]

larryrose11:

But that solar pannel costs $239 and only kicks out 68 watts. And thats only if the sun is shinning and the solar panel is aimed correctly.
Mike is looking for 10 times that much power.

Were you thinking to have all the energy you need for the lake stored up in the battery, then just use the solar panel to recharge the battery later?

Besides, those inverter gennerators are cool - they only run fast enough to keep up with the load, not full speed like other gennerators. That makes them Quiet and fuel efficent.

Mark

Yeah I think it says 4.1 amps

[longballlumber]

I have a freind that is a retired electrician and he says that those Honda generators (the 2000 watt ones in the above posts) are the best ones to buy. I asked him about the Generac or Honeywell ones and he just shook his head and said "nope, Honda is the best. One pull starts and they're quiet."

Hot,

You and I are on the same page. I was looking at the Generac and Honeywell models too. The price seems to be more tolerable, but I also understand the Hondas are "best in class". I don't know what is tougher; convincing the wife I need a $1000+ generator for my toy boats, or simply coughing up the dough!!!

Later,
Mike

[RandyatBBY]

Hot,

You and I are on the same page. I was looking at the Generac and Honeywell models too. The price seems to be more tolerable, but I also understand the Hondas are "best in class". I don't know what is tougher; convincing the wife I need a $1000+ generator for my toy boats, or simply coughing up the dough!!!

Later,
Mike

I bought a used 1000 Honda from ebay for $575.00. It took about 3 months to find and get. I used it for 5 years with no problem. I have to have a tune up every two years now. I bought a Sears beast that we use when needed for $675. Good luck

[D. Newland]

You will always have resale value w/the Honda. The 2000's can/will sell used for $700ish.

Keep the box, keep the manual and keep it clean.

[longballlumber]

You will always have resale value w/the Honda. The 2000's can/will sell used for $700ish.

Keep the box, keep the manual and keep it clean.

Hey Dave,

How are you and the boys?

Your not kidding on that one... I have been looking at some of the prices of used EU2000i's. In some cases, you could buy a brand new one for less than a couple hundred dollars.

I found a place that has them for a good price, I just need to wait and see what the verdict is on my getting my car fixed.

Later,
Mike