Thermal Issues with the New Traxxas Spartan

[Steven Vaccaro]

How good are these silicon jackets over the aluminium ones that gives more heat disipation with aluminium ones purly through better conductivety of heat. Ive got one of these silicon jackets that was fitted to a leopard 4074 motor, All be it a different make to the Traxxas one. Ive not run this motor or cooler so cant coment on useing it but looking at the design of the internal water ways its very restricted in as much as that it has several quite small water channels molded in to it. Its not just one big open area inside the jacket as aluminium ones are + silicon dosnt disipate heat very well. I definately wouldnt buy a silicon jacket over an alloy one. Thanks Martin.

Silicon used to be the only way, but that's changed. These days the silicon jackets are mostly used for motors that do not have a metal jacket option.

[Diesel6401]

Looks like this may be the trick to keeping the stock components cool...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2FODuwKjIE

Y connectors don't make a big difference with a singe water pickup. Water flows the route of less resistance. If their is the slightest pinch or obstruction water will flow the opposite route meaning their is no true way to verify the water is actually going to both the esc/motor and because the lines meet again at one cooling outlet their will be a sign of positive water outflow but you can't tell that both systems are being properly cooled. The 6s thing is going to kill Traxxas on this boat. They should have stuck with 5s on this boat or a lower KV motor motor. On 6s that's 35k+ on the rpm, starting to get into SAW style rpm ranges after that.

I agree with Martin... Splitting a single supply of water to two components like that isn't helping much. You need to double the supply, not split the existing one, even if it's slightly improved.

Is the MOTOR in these actually getting hot, or is it just the ESC? What kind of temps are people recording?

I've read on other forums people hitting in the 180F range on the motor. Did you hear what the guy in the video said "After ONLY 6 minutes of run time it goes into thermal shut-down" the 20m runtime and 6s claim is KILLING traxxas. They should have let new people know that more then 10 minutes of runtime is a far stretch

[Brushless55]

I've read on other forums people hitting in the 180F range on the motor. Did you hear what the guy in the video said "After ONLY 6 minutes of run time it goes into thermal shut-down" the 20m runtime and 6s claim is KILLING traxxas. They should have let new people know that more then 10 minutes of runtime is a far stretch

It's like Traxxas is nowhere to be found right now

[Steven Vaccaro]

"Cool" idea on the temp senor coupled with the esc. I would like to see that in other speed controls.

I would guestimate that 2 or more times at 180 plus is going to kill those motors. Wonder what the shutdown value is.

[djmaincheese]

It probably doesn't help that the main designer of the boat is no longer with Traxxas and apparently every design and production aspect is kept top secret, like its the CIA or some special ops unit...
I'm sure they would have had pass the torch to someone else there who was also involved in the extensive R&D of this boat and now they are scrambling to come up with solutions to these problems.
There are about 12 boats on the market and half of them have already gone back to Traxxas..

Just seems like there are too many glitches with a lot of their electronics, especially the ESC's when reading all the forum threads.
It must be a nightmare to work in that repair/ replacement department and now this..
We will just have to wait and see.

[pyroM!KE]

I just got my first rc boat 2 weeks ago..Im so glad I got the Miss Geico over this boat..I cant believe there having all the heat problems...Traxxas electrics have never failed me yet on my brushless cars..

[Brushless55]

And this made boat of the year for 2010?

[Diesel6401]

Just my thoughts, but Traxxas marketing maybe the major fault of this boat. If they would just let people know to NOT use that stupid "Training mode" function which heats the esc up fast and keep the run time to around 5 minutes on nimh or 4s/5s and 2 minutes or so on 6s and also allow cooling time in between switching packs a lot of the problems may go away. Also a better balanced rotor.

[Brushless55]

Just my thoughts, but Traxxas marketing maybe the major fault of this boat. If they would just let people know to NOT use that stupid "Training mode" function which heats the esc up fast and keep the run time to around 5 minutes on nimh or 4s/5s and 2 minutes or so on 6s and also allow cooling time in between switching packs a lot of the problems may go away. Also a better balanced rotor.

plus on the Traxxas forums they encouraged people to talk this boat up with the 20min runs going 50+ mph with no issues at all

anytime someone would suggest or say the runtimes would be maybe 5-6min and the motor may not be upto task, they would delete those threads

[Diesel6401]

plus on the Traxxas forums they encouraged people to talk this boat up with the 20min runs going 50+ mph with no issues at all

anytime someone would suggest or say the runtimes would be maybe 5-6min and the motor may not be upto task, they would delete those threads

REALLY, that is mind blowing. I am not a member a traxxas, but things like that would make me not want to become a member. That is really disappointing.

[Steven Vaccaro]

plus on the Traxxas forums they encouraged people to talk this boat up with the 20min runs going 50+ mph with no issues at all

anytime someone would suggest or say the runtimes would be maybe 5-6min and the motor may not be upto task, they would delete those threads

I gave up trying to help on the traxxas forum a while back. Its way to regulated.

[Brushless55]

I gave up trying to help on the traxxas forum a while back. Its way to regulated.

oh it's crazy Steven..
anytime you give good input they knock you on the hand, but now I'm seeing these heat issues and runtimes being posted and many people are now reconsidering not getting this boat, and that was with some Big Hype about this boat months ago
and I think its because of what I posted before about runtimes and what heat issues could be

[GeoVW72]

I would agree on Darin's view on the ruder pick-up theory if we were dealing with standard components. Traxxas designed the system to be restrictive to prevent the silicone water jacket from leaking.

you can watch the outlet on the right side of the boat, it just spurts, and at 0:31 & 0:51 on a slow left turn they quit.

in this vid they turn left and stated that overheating occurred withing 1 to 2 minutes stock and after increasing flow and y-ing the tubing could run 5 to 8

the ESC is also not the bit that is handling the motor shut off, the temp sensor is running to the receiver

[T.S.Davis]

Weren't some chastised right here on this forum for even suggesting that the claims might be exaggerated?

I'll never understand why a company like that didn't seek out an expert to help them through the process. There are so many well reputed racers out there that could have helped them. Probably for cheap too. Most guys that are into it just want to see another reliable RTR hit the water. Look what the SV and UL1 did for us all. Now we have the Geico, the VS, the Stilletto, and hopefully AQ's stray cat that's still kicking around. The Spartan is only a touch to big for Limited Spec.

Has anybody stuffed one on 6s yet? My plastic boats exploded when stuffed at those speeds.

[martin]

I think unless Traxxas get these problems sorted & quick people simply arnt going to buy the Spartan, Their must be a lot that have been waiting for this boat to appear that now will think twice about buying one until they prove they have got over these problems. I also think potential buyers were a bit worried about spending $400 on a plastic boat but were prepared to because of the promised 50mph on 6s. Who is going to spend $400 on a plastic boat that you can only run on 4s or maybe 5s & get say 40mph safely. Thanks Martin.

[LarrysDrifter]

All I can say is,wow.The whole Traxxas forum deleting posts thing really bites me wrong.I have had zero intentions on getting a Spartan,but to advertise the thing the way they do-give me a break.From what Ive been reading on the boat,they are going to drive alot of their customers away.It makes me feel ashamed to own a 2.5 T Maxx that Ive had for the past 10 years-and I dont even play with it.

[Brushless55]

All I can say is,wow.The whole Traxxas forum deleting posts thing really bites me wrong.I have had zero intentions on getting a Spartan,but to advertise the thing the way they do-give me a break.From what Ive been reading on the boat,they are going to drive alot of their customers away.It makes me feel ashamed to own a 2.5 T Maxx that Ive had for the past 10 years-and I dont even play with it.

multiple postings have gone to the big traxxas trash bin

[LarrysDrifter]

What a shame.I hope Traxxas gets things figured out and makes the boat reliable.Id hate to see a new boater get this as his first and have it crap out on him and lose another possible FE boater.

[Diesel6401]

What a shame.I hope Traxxas gets things figured out and makes the boat reliable.Id hate to see a new boater get this as his first and have it crap out on him and lose another possible FE boater.

This boat was suppose to encourage new boaters not push them away. Unless they get off the High 20m run time horse and tell people to calm it down, not much will change sadly.

[JPriami]

Traxxas is nuts lol. I got my Spartan yesterday. I've already looked it over and made a few changes. Made water pickup opening bigger, drilled the nipple on end of rudder out a bit. The damn flex cable wasnt greased! And dry of any oil if it even had any on it. I sharpened the turn fins and rudder too. Added flotation to the cowl. Oiled motor bearings just incase since I had everything out. I may increase the cooling line diameter but I'm going to try it first.

But yeah traxxas is nuts. Because this boat at 35k rpm on 6s in the hands of a noob is a bad idea. And most people are noobs to this boat. The 50mph is what sold them on it from the get go. And what do noobs do? Balls to the walls WOT more than they should. Not saying traxxas hasn't done anything wrong tho. Because they have. This boat should be bullet proof to handle what they advertise. But it's snot. I wonder what they will do to make it right? And what of the ones that already own a new Spartan boat anchor that fried?

[Steven Vaccaro]

I've contacted a couple of the traxxas reps to see if they will comment here.

[anilao]

Traxxas is nuts lol. I got my Spartan yesterday. I've already looked it over and made a few changes. Made water pickup opening bigger, drilled the nipple on end of rudder out a bit. The damn flex cable wasnt greased! And dry of any oil if it even had any on it. I sharpened the turn fins and rudder too. Added flotation to the cowl. Oiled motor bearings just incase since I had everything out. I may increase the cooling line diameter but I'm going to try it first.

But yeah traxxas is nuts. Because this boat at 35k rpm on 6s in the hands of a noob is a bad idea. And most people are noobs to this boat. The 50mph is what sold them on it from the get go. And what do noobs do? Balls to the walls WOT more than they should. Not saying traxxas hasn't done anything wrong tho. Because they have. This boat should be bullet proof to handle what they advertise. But it's snot. I wonder what they will do to make it right? And what of the ones that already own a new Spartan boat anchor that fried?

cAN YOU Please post images of your mods to your Spartan Please?

[GeoVW72]

as far as hull durability.

again going left
Good luck getting a hold of traxxas, I think they went on a cruise
I think the lack of lube in the Spartan vs. UL-1 killed the esc, the sound of it isn't right, not that there are no other problems

[JPriami]

Look at Spartan vs ul-1 video. I'm on my phone and it's hard to tell. Do you see a steady stream of water coming out of the Spartan?

[GeoVW72]

Look at Spartan cd ul-1 video. I'm on my phone and it's hard to tell. Do you see a steady stream of water coming out of the Spartan?

I don't see any, I haven't seen any of the boats with a stream of water off the side.

[Brushless55]

I don't see any, I haven't seen any of the boats with a stream of water off the side.

in the last video you posted you can see a few shots that show a strong stream of water, specially when they ran 6s

[millzee]

So, I have been waiting to buy this boat for sometime now, but with all the issues and talk about ESC and motor upgrades to solve the issues, Im re-thinking what to buy, I like the idea of a rtr as Im new to fe boating and was hoping to simply buy a handfull of lipo's and have everything I need. I also love the size of this boat, Im never going to race, I just want to have some fun on the lake, could someone tell me weather it'd be worth just buying the spartan along with a new esc and motor just for the aspect of getting everything I need or give me a few other options that are similar. If I could pick up a spartan as a "floater/roller"(no esc or motor), would the hull and driveline be worth it? Whats out there the similar size, power and less issues?

[Diesel6401]

So, I have been waiting to buy this boat for sometime now, but with all the issues and talk about ESC and motor upgrades to solve the issues, Im re-thinking what to buy, I like the idea of a rtr as Im new to fe boating and was hoping to simply buy a handfull of lipo's and have everything I need. I also love the size of this boat, Im never going to race, I just want to have some fun on the lake, could someone tell me weather it'd be worth just buying the spartan along with a new esc and motor just for the aspect of getting everything I need or give me a few other options that are similar. If I could pick up a spartan as a "floater/roller"(no esc or motor), would the hull and driveline be worth it? Whats out there the similar size, power and less issues?

By the time you would be done making this boat run right you will have 1 expensive piece of plastic. If you want a better hull, better handling, better motor and a mono in the 30+ range buy a Pursuit http://kintecracing.com/Pursuit.html. Currently the best handling mono that I have.

I'm running the Leopard 4074 2200kv motor, Seaking 180 esc .187 3/16 flexcable. This boat will so small things done to it first though. All the wood trays will need re-inforced you will need a radio system and a servo. After your done you will have a much MUCH better boat then the Spartan. https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...hp?albumid=300

[Brushless55]

By the time you would be done making this boat run right you will have 1 expensive piece of plastic. If you want a better hull, better handling, better motor and a mono in the 30+ range buy a Pursuit http://kintecracing.com/Pursuit.html. Currently the best handling mono that I have.

I'm running the Leopard 4074 2200kv motor, Seaking 180 esc .187 3/16 flexcable. This boat will so small things done to it first though. All the wood trays will need re-inforced you will need a radio system and a servo. After your done you will have a much MUCH better boat then the Spartan. https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...hp?albumid=300

[Rumdog]

Trust me here, the lack of lube on the flex from the factory isnt the reason for the overheating. Lube will not prevent driveline binding in a new stuffing tube with a new flex. Obviously you want to pull the flex and lube it up before maiden runs. (should be done from the factory) The cooling jacket. Also not the problem. A better jacket isn't going to cure the problem. It is a cheap 2 ole motor that is too small and has too much kv for a rtr boat to run 6s reliably. Traxxas needs to recall these boats and offer a different motor free of charge. Good luck with that.

Also, who in the hell gave this plastic un-proven turd boat of the year? Seriously, I don't know who it was but we should flood them with e-mails.
Lastly, who wants to spend 400 bucks on a plastic boat that they know they will have to upgrade just to run properly? Get a real hull. With real hardware. Everything about this boat just looks so damn cheap.