Send out more 700SC's

[Doozie870]

Steve the 700 classes are under attack again, I almost backed out of the rr build when I saw "aq27 power only" on the smaller hydros. I realize tackling AQ is a tall order.. please send out more motors to key club people, so they can ramrod how easy and fun they are! :D

[Steven Vaccaro]

LOL, your right! I have tried, but it seems there is some mysterious thing that has taken over their minds.

[SJFE]

Insanity?????????? :D

[GregS]

Yeah, I don't get it. Seems everyone wants to change the spec classes to SV power. The reasons given seem to be about a shortage of good 700 motors and moving forward to the future. The SS1 is no longer made but the 700 SC and Graupner 8.4 are still readily available. Also, I'm not convinced the SV power system outperforms a 700 power system. At one of our races we had P-Spec and SV 27's running together and the SV 27's were not faster. I would like to see a comparison where each power system is tested in the same boat with the same batteries and a prop that's matched to the motor.

Greg

[SJFE]

I am going back to some brushed motors myself. With the twin setups I plan it is more cost effective. It's also much less of a risk. With todays modern brushed motors sporting aluminum endbells and high end bearings you almost cant go wroung.

[Ub Hauled]

Maybe with the new LSO record being held by an SC 700 can (40+mph), people will look at the 700's a bit more respectfully.
The problem I see with the 700's (or brushed motors) is the maintenance that it requires and the lack of efficiency (that can be part of the fun)... the 700 are worst since one cannot change or even open anything in that motor... so once your comm gets marked or dirty, say bye-bye to a competitive motor. Oh, I forgot, once the brushes are gone, there is no replacing it.
On the other hand the brushless systems are virtually maintenance free, out-power the 700's, are lighter, more efficient... the list against it is like my wrap sheet. :D
Maybe it would be nice if we change the LSH rules a bit... juuuuust a bit... allowing people to open the can and clean stuff, change brushes and do basic mods maybe that'll help to keep the 700 cans on life support a bit longer.

[GregS]

The 700's should last a long time and still be competitive if not abused. When they go South they are not expensive to replace. It seems people in my club get up to 3 years use out of them. Only maintenance is to oil the bearings occasionally. The other advantage I see of 700's compared with SV motors is quality. I've read a lot about SV motors being either defective or inconsistent from motor to motor. Also I think the entire power system including speed control is generally more robust with a brushed motor than a brushless system.

I don't mean to be argumentative here. I'm just trying to understand the reasons everyone seems to want to replace 700 motors with SV motors. Interesting discussion.

[Doozie870]

Very good discussion indeed.

Its fascinating to me how people feel that putting the aq system will solve all their woes. If your burning down 700s with your current boat, the problem is not the motor, its your boat/set up. Ive already seen the "aq quick fix" in action, youll be surprised what happens after the motor comes in 150+ a few times, which they will be doing to stay with the 7s. :D

[Jeepers]

at a few of our club races, we had sv 27s up against a 700 powered mono and it pretty much out ran them, all boats were using ib 4200 cells so competition was pretty equal.

as for quality issues we had a few 700s that were also defective, the plastic fans fell off. so i guess it about the same for massed produced motors.

[Doozie870]

Hey Jeeps, long time no see :D

[Quicksilver]

So the spec is now Chinese setups? I find the cheaper brushless motors just as un-serviceable as a 700. yeah, you can get them apart but it's not easy and even harder to get back together.
What's it really matter if it's new and faster, I would find the challenge of using the older setups more exciting than everyone having mass produced clone setups.

morning rant. off to work

[GregS]

What's it really matter if it's new and faster

I'm not sure it is faster. Like I said earlier our p-spec boats with 700's were no slower than the SV 27's when raced together. I wonder if anyone has tried both power setups in the same boat for a direct comparison. Performance does not seem to be one of the main reasons being put forward for changing anyway. Although there is no shortage of 700 motors there maybe a shortage of good brushed controllers with the RC Hydros being discontinued.

Greg

[sjslhill]

Doozie, can you share that 700 power tool part number?

[Doozie870]

Which one do you need. have mild to wild

[Doozie870]

"Performance does not seem to be one of the main reasons being put forward for changing anyway."

Thank you sir,
Lets be generous and say 1-3 mph gain with the aq package, and they last for years, blah, blah. I am just now recovering from the battery and charger change over and now possibly looking at new motors and escs in two of my three boats? I am so close to dropping racing and going back to sport running. Slow down Ramrodders give guys a chance to catch up please.

[sjslhill]

"and they last for years, blah, blah"

LOL, sounds like Dick Crowe when Aveox first was used. He had a tackle box full of them but only needed 1 for 5 classes.

[sjslhill]

Which one do you need. have mild to wild

The best one for $13 as I recall.

[Jeepers]

Hey Jeeps, long time no see :D

HEY Dooze! its been awhile! my son was not doing good for awhile, but he is much better now.

[Doozie870]

Jeepers, thats great news, hope to see you at the next fun run, assuming we dont get snowed out for the year!!

Battlepack, the dewalt part# is 397156-00 its a RS775VC-A09 15 advanced, 77 in stock, the price went up from $13 to $14.84!! those devils. I can still live with it I guess. :D

[SJFE]

Dewalt.com Direct Dooz?

[Doozie870]

dewaltservicenet.com or call your local dewalt repair facility.

[Doozie870]

This motor has the same mags as the 8.4 turbo (not neo) if you are determined to run massive props than go with the SC.

[Ub Hauled]

Dooz,
I just had to go there and buy one of those motors...
I have heard so much about it and finally know your secret...
mooo-hoo-hoo-ahaaa
:D

[SJFE]

I have a motor box full of Doozmans Secrets....lol

[Steven Vaccaro]

Last night I installed a aqua system into a boat for a local customer. Now I have another reason why people are making the switch. Its completely "plug & play". It took no time to install. No connectors to solder, no esc to motor to solder, no diodes and caps to solder, no flat spot to file. It doesn't get much easier than that.

[SJFE]

Very good point. The ProBoat system is just as simple. It's a shame it's a bit over priced. Unless you buy one from me lately....LOL

[Ub Hauled]

I am not against evolution... i like what the 700 signifies to the sport...
It's for the same reason that we still have hot rods (muscle cars) around... can you imagine if people just discharted (spelling?) them? The world would not have been the same. If it was a crappy motor, then sure... but it's not, it is a pretty decent motor and honestly quite easy to setup as well... why are people still building wooden boats and nt buying the ready stuff? In my opinion, for the same reason we should keep the 700 around for a bit longer....

[Doug Smock]

Yes but the writing is on the wall. I would imagine that in 09, brushed motors will be as hard to find as NiMH in organized racing.( At least on the big course.) At the club (sport) level I would guess they may have a future.
Next year we are converting our LSHs into N-2 Sports. The SC 700 no longer meets our needs.
Doug

[jwt]

I'm not sure it is faster. Like I said earlier our p-spec boats with 700's were no slower than the SV 27's when raced together. I wonder if anyone has tried both power setups in the same boat for a direct comparison. Performance does not seem to be one of the main reasons being put forward for changing anyway. Although there is no shortage of 700 motors there maybe a shortage of good brushed controllers with the RC Hydros being discontinued.

Greg

i have a om26 with sc700 motor set up and i have another om26 with a sv27 set up, and i can tell you that the sv27 set up is superior. the sc700 does not have the torque that the sv27 has away from the corners,
since i purchased the sv27 set up 3 months ago, i do not run the sc700 (4 months old) unless it is a special club day, the brushless motor is easier to set up, easy for a water jacket, no caps for the motor, and it is lighter than the sc700 motor.
i will never be buying another sc700 motor, the new bl technology is just better.

John

[Doozie870]

Sounds great. Can somebody refresh my memory again please. Why would I pay $159.95 for the AQ package when I could have a 100 amp esc with either an ammo or an xl motor for less money?