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Thread: EKOS C1 Dual Motor Upgrade!

  1. #1
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    Default EKOS C1 Dual Motor Upgrade!

    It's an almost bolt in job.

    Two Turnigy 120A ESC's & Two HXT 36-56 2700kv Inrunners

    The 540 sized motor comes with two different bolt patterns. Which allows for installtion in both 540 and 380 mounts. Leaving the EKOS mounts in-tact.

    Modify the coupler for the 5mm shaft, shorten the drives about 6-8mm and it's a runner!
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:36 PM.

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    Just a base, but I put the GPS on it and with a 2-3" chop hit 38.8 on 3s with 31 minutes of run time... Didn't feel any heat at all when I popped the top afterwards, so I think 4s will do just fine and pick up about 10k RPM. It's rated to 18v, so might even try 5s.

    I haven't calibrated the ESC's yet and was very conservative on the throttle for the first run.

    The wind picked up and there's too much chop now, so will try again in the morning. =)
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:37 PM.

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    Default

    What props are you using?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pmisuinas View Post
    What props are you using?
    Just the stock plastic props.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:38 PM.

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    Wow, sounds like you could pick up a lot of speed going to a larger prop, motor should take it easily--maybe the CF-40s? Anyway, I am on the Hobby King web site and of course the motors are out of stock--can't seem to find upgrade motors anywhere right now...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rumdog View Post
    Helz yeah. The 10xl.

    If I had known I was going to be replacing motors in the EKOS and didn't already have the Inrunners ordered, I would have gone with the 10xl's. They can handle 6s.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:38 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pmisuinas View Post
    Wow, sounds like you could pick up a lot of speed going to a larger prop, motor should take it easily--maybe the CF-40s? Anyway, I am on the Hobby King web site and of course the motors are out of stock--can't seem to find upgrade motors anywhere right now...
    Yeah, it's running really wet, I haven't adjusted anything yet.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:38 PM.

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    Yeah, but I was looking for the 9xl because I have a bunch of decent 4S packs. I also would not want to put the weight of dual 6S packs in this boat. But I guess the Kv difference between the 9xl and the 10xl (10%) is not that big (especially since 10xl are available now), maybe prop selection could overcome that...problem is I would have little to no idea how to pick a prop, as I am new to FE...

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    Just a base, but I put the GPS on it and with a 2-3" chop hit 38.8 on 3s with 31 minutes of run time... Didn't feel any heat at all when I popped the top afterwards, so I think 4s will do just fine and pick up about 10k RPM. It's rated to 18v, so might even try 5s.

    I haven't calibrated the ESC's yet and was very conservative on the throttle for the first run.

    The wind picked up and there's too much chop now, so will try again in the morning. =)
    OK, so it's a windy morning here at the beach, but I was able to find a small oyster bed alcove with 1-2" chop. Best I could find with a 15mph wind.

    51.2 MPH peak on the GPS on two separate 4kMah 4s 20c packs. About 20 min of runtime. I'm thinking if I parallel the cell packs using higher C ratings, it'll do much better. I have some 4kmah 30c packs to try. My bigger 5k 30c's don't fit in the hull holders.

    Still haven't calibrated the ESC's and wasn't able to hold the trigger for more than a 1, 2 count, then had to get off quick as it was jumping the chop against the wind. Not enough room to do speed runs with the wind as it was towards the shallows.

    A little more in line with what is expected of this boat and I'm sure there's a few more MPH by tuning it right.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:41 PM.

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    Default Battery

    I was looking at those Blue lipos you have because they fit great.I know your run times were long,did the battery get hot.I was holding back on those packs because of the 25c rating.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Igoreski View Post
    I was looking at those Blue lipos you have because they fit great.I know your run times were long,did the battery get hot.I was holding back on those packs because of the 25c rating.
    When I ran the 3s 25c packs, I didn't notice much, if any heat.
    When I ran the 4s 20c packs, they did get warm, but not hot to the touch.

    Next time, I'm going to run the 4s 30c packs and put them in parallel. Still haven't made my "X" connector.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    Helz yeah. The 10xl.

    If I had known I was going to be replacing motors in the EKOS and didn't already have the Inrunners ordered, I would have gone with the 10xl's. They can handle 6s.
    You would not want to run 6s on the 10XLs !
    that is ment for the lower kv motors
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    So you find those cheap 540 Turnigy motor work very well on both 3s and 4s?
    Seems venom have a lot of melting lately, maybe a bad batch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brushless55 View Post
    You would not want to run 6s on the 10XLs !
    that is ment for the lower kv motors
    See post #26: https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...ad.php?t=13704
    IDK from experience, just what I read.

    Quote Originally Posted by vasy View Post
    So you find those cheap 540 Turnigy motor work very well on both 3s and 4s?
    Seems venom have a lot of melting lately, maybe a bad batch.
    The HK's seem a bit slow on 3s, but really come alive on 4s.... And so far, much more reliable than the motors that came with it.

    Wait a few days, I'll run a few battery packs through it and tell you more.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    See post #26: https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...ad.php?t=13704
    IDK from experience, just what I read.


    .
    Get some glasses, those are 540s in that cat not 380s..
    big difference!
    Jesus is King .......NAMBA20...Caterpillar UL-1, P-Spec OM29, P-Mono DF33, P-Spec JAE, Aussie 33" Hydro-LSH, Sprintcat CC2028 on 8s, PT SS45 Q Hydro, PS295 UL-1 power, OSE Brothers Outlaw QMono 4-sale, Rio 51z CC2028 on 8s

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    See post #26: https://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/...ad.php?t=13704
    IDK from experience, just what I read.



    The HK's seem a bit slow on 3s, but really come alive on 4s.... And so far, much more reliable than the motors that came with it.

    Wait a few days, I'll run a few battery packs through it and tell you more.
    So far does it look like they are at about the same speed as stock?
    I think stock were rated at almost the same KV.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brushless55 View Post
    Get some glasses, those are 540s in that cat not 380s..
    big difference!
    AH, *SIGH*.

    Thank you for the correction...I'm still learning.

    Quote Originally Posted by vasy View Post
    So far does it look like they are at about the same speed as stock?
    I think stock were rated at almost the same KV.
    I really can't tell you. The stock ones didn't run long enough to get a reading.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vasy View Post
    So far does it look like they are at about the same speed as stock?
    I think stock were rated at almost the same KV.
    I think the stockers are 2850kv and the Feigao 380 10XL motors are 2352kv
    the Feigao motors are much more able to run 4s over the stock motors
    Jesus is King .......NAMBA20...Caterpillar UL-1, P-Spec OM29, P-Mono DF33, P-Spec JAE, Aussie 33" Hydro-LSH, Sprintcat CC2028 on 8s, PT SS45 Q Hydro, PS295 UL-1 power, OSE Brothers Outlaw QMono 4-sale, Rio 51z CC2028 on 8s

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brushless55 View Post
    I think the stockers are 2850kv and the Feigao 380 10XL motors are 2352kv
    the Feigao motors are much more able to run 4s over the stock motors
    Cool. I'd think 540 would have more torque so you would be able to spin larger props, so unlike stock 32/36mm, go with like x438/x440 that would make up for small difference in KV.

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    One of the Turnigy ESC failed and HK is out of stock, so I found a Seaking 120 which should pair up with it as a replacement.

    I put in a pair of Aquastar's, but one of them blew up on the bench.

    Will update more when I'm actually able to get some good runs in, with an ESC that actually works.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:47 PM.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    One of the Turnigy ESC failed and HK is out of stock, so I found a Seaking 120 which should pair up with it as a replacement.

    I put in a pair of Aquastar's, but one of them blew up on the bench.

    Will update more when I'm actually able to get some good runs in, with an ESC that actually works.
    That is just wrong..... check www.hobbyhot.com for good price on seaking esc.
    They sell for less with programming cards then without

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    Quote Originally Posted by vasy View Post
    That is just wrong..... check www.hobbyhot.com for good price on seaking esc.
    They sell for less with programming cards then without
    Yeah, that's the one I picked up. We'll see if it get's here this month.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 10:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BenjaminR View Post
    Yeah, that's the one I picked up. We'll see if it get's here this month.
    Still not here... BUT...


    ...Venom sent my 60a ESC's back! So... I did a little bench testing with the new HK 2700 36-56 motors. I've been using an upside down pepsi bottle with silicone line through a hole in the cap to make good water flow to simulate in water use. Nothing full throttle, but calibrating the ESC's and making sure both props start & stop at the same time.

    The port side motor was barely moving and drawing quite a bit of current. Seems that when I was experimenting with 4s, it killed it. No surprise there.

    Fortunately, when I ordered these, I ordered 4 of them to have extra. I soldered up an "X" connector to combine both battery packs and eliminate the need for more than just two battery connections. The only connections now are at the packs and at the motors.

    So, the setup is Dual 60a ESC, 2700Kv 36-56, 36/3 Props on 3s2p 50c 5k mah about 29k RPM max.

    With any luck, I should have it ready for the water by morning.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:02 PM.

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    Some updates of the build:

    I used a small piece of 3/16 tubing as a splatter guard. A dab of CA is holding it in place on the drive tube mount.

    The couplers have been drilled out and tapped to use 4mm threaded stainless steel set screws and fit on the 5mm motor shaft.

    Notice the holes in the top of the motor mounts? They are water cooled mounts, just not installed. So fittings are on the way to cool the mounts.

    Like my Traxxas Rx? It's literally fully encased in silicone and is completely water proof. The inside is completely packed with silicone, so even if water get's in the connectors, it has nowhere to go as the bottom of the connector space is sealed too. This has worked while completely submerged in salt water in one of my cars. Pretty cool.

    The batteries are older smaller packs, but very light. The whole boat weighs in at 2780 grams, fully loaded. The COG is set at 8 1/4" and stingers are at 1/2 -1 degree positive.

    The ESC's are shrink wrapped together using battery pack wrap and in the nose cowl. I used pieces of cut sponge to fill the aft sponson bellies around the drive tubes. Water seems to leak in through these drives fairly fast.

    The Rx ESC connectors & Y adapter are encased in silicone and shrink wrapped for a good seal.

    Using the stock props with aluminum 4mm cones....
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:03 PM.

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    More photos:

    The bottle is used to flush the system with an MPPL anti-corrosion mix. Good stuff.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:03 PM.

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    Default Good Run this morning!

    The water is choppy and there's a 20mph wind, so had to take it easy against the wind. Fortunately the current was going with the wind, so was able to make some good passes.

    I think I have everything setup right, it's doing full boat skipping across the waves and landing perfectly without skipping a beat! Against the wind it's lifting up a bit but the chop is about 4". I was skeptical about actually letting it out in these conditions.

    Very little water in the boat, sponges were basically dry, but some worrysome splash on the GPS. I think the hull hatch is still leaking through the windows.

    Water conditions were so much nicer yesterday!

    With the Stock 60a ESC, HK 2700Kv Inrunners, 36/3 1.4 Props and dual 3s 20c 4k packs:
    35.1 MPH
    2.2 miles
    11.35 minutes (over 10 mph)
    ~100 degree motor
    ~95 degree ESC
    ~100 degree Batteries

    Didn't get an amp/watt reading as I'll need to setup X connectors on my amp meter. (for dual batteries and dual ESC)

    Easy more run time ending Voltage was still up at 11.25v and these were my cheapie 4k 20c packs.

    Might take a drive out to the pond on mainland later today. it's surrounded by trees, so is almost always fairly calm.

    So to answer your question Rumdog: No, I had to replace the motors to run the boat successfully with the stock setup.
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:03 PM.

  28. #28
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    Run #2 today at the City Center Pond... Same config, except larger 3s 25c 5kmah packs.

    It went well for a change. I ran it for about 16.4 minutes and it was nicely planted and easy to control. I brought it in simply out of fear something else would break on this thing and the run had been going well. It's pathetic to be this paranoid of it breaking again. Still have a full 11.2v when done.

    Temps were good, motor 100, ESC 115, cells 120. Covered 2.77 miles with a whopping top speed of 39.3MPH... Fast enought to literally suck the paint off... or um... let it fall off?
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:06 PM.

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    Decided to push it and get another run in today in the channel. It's a dock that's partially protected and dredged for large ocean charter boats to dock. The mangrove trees provide a good amount of wind protection and the water is fairly shallow by shore, which equals, somewhat stable water conditions. Hard to find today as it is really windy. The current was going against the wind.

    Using the same setup as the one at city center above, I hit 38.2, however covered 4.2 miles with approximately the same run time of 16.2 minutes. Motor, esc, batt were 110, 115 & 130 respectively. With the battery being hot at 130, I'm going to move up to a 30c pack for a 3s2p 60c parallel setup. As soon as my OSE order get's here, I'll break up a 6s pack and get it going.

    I REALLY want to try 4s with this setup, but I am fairly certain it's too much prop for that kind of RPM and only 60a esc...

    I'm considering using the 32/3 1.4 plastic props that venom sells for $3... I'd like to get this boat up in the high 40's, but don't want to kill it to do it.

    I'm changing to 1800Kv/120a on 4s when the parts come in... Perhaps even 5s, if I can fit the packs under the hull.

    PS- the 3/16 vinyl tubing is working excellently as a splatter guard. No more grease splatter!
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:07 PM.

  30. #30
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    Finally!! Here it is! My FIRST full charge run! It came in really dry and everything was cool, except for the battery packs. I think that 25c is just not enough juice for this boat on a full throttle run. Did well at varying speeds, but today I basically just held it wide open and had some fun!

    For the first time, I went out and ran until the LVC kicked in! Sad. Isn't it? But fun none the less. =)

    Top speed: 39.0
    Run time: 15.2
    Miles: 4.2
    ESC Temp: 100
    Motor Temp: 90
    Pack temp: 130

    OSE's package should arrive today and I have a 6s1p 35c battery pack that I'm splitting into two 3s packs, hopefully the good water lasts a few hours today.

    The only thing that broke on this run was the epoxy mount on the front of the battery box!
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    Last edited by FighterCat57; 02-14-2011 at 11:11 PM.

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