Politics

[domwilson]

Ok. In other threads that have the hint of anything political, the topics have strayed. Here is a thread for people to voice their opinions. Some say that Obama is a tool. That he is going to bankrupt this country. That he is going to turn us to socialism. Despite what the constitution states. So here is your chance to voice your concerns and why. Please don't attack other posters and make it personal. This is just opinions.

[winner]

good idea dom! i really think obama should make jobs instead of give away money... the government should stsrt employing peple to build roads, bridges, buildings, military equipment etc, to give people a chance to try to make a living - just my $0.02

[domwilson]

I believe that was what the Stimulus Act was for. But somehow, monies and good intentions got side tracked.

[Darin Jordan]

I believe that was what the Stimulus Act was for. But somehow, monies and good intentions got side tracked.

Dude... it was "sidetracked" from the start... RIGHT from the beginning, the right was pointing out how only a small portion of the $$$ was directed toward jobs creation... The rest was pork barrelled, pet projects, that the Dems have been sitting on for YEARS... just waiting for some suckers to vote it in...

Cash for clunkers... $24,000 PER CAR processed is what that COST the tax payers.... $24,000... I know I sure feel "stimulated"...

[domwilson]

I'll give you that. I didn't think it was a good idea either. That money would have best been served as tax cuts to the poor and middle class. At least it would have gone further to stimulate the economy.

[Steven Vaccaro]

How much longer can this country consume other countries goods? Beside military/arms and software, what does the world need from us that only we have or have the best of?

[domwilson]

How much longer can this country consume other countries goods? Beside military/arms and software, what does the world need from us that only we have or have the best of?

Wheat, Corn and other agricultural goods. It would be much better if we manufactured and consumed products produced here. Market surplus to other countries. And establish once again that "Made In the U.S.A" means a rugged, high quality product. We'd have much more bargaining power. And if you're a U.S. company who farms out labor to foreign countries only for it to be marketed here, then you should be subject to penalties.
Somehow, we've become the world's keeper.

Edit: Unfortunately there are some metals and raw materials that we don't have an abundance of or would be too environmental unfeaseable for us to produce here.

Edit II: I stand corrected... http://www.trade.gov/press/press_rel...eet_021109.pdf

[calcagno45]

I believe that was what the Stimulus Act was for. But somehow, monies and good intentions got side tracked.

Thats the entire left agenda. Spend tax payers money, tax us some more, and then spend that. Where is the conservative values that our country was founded upon in this?

And how can you lefties say that government subsidizing more and more industries is not socialism? How can you say that government gaining public control over people's lives is not socialism? 30-48% of people's lives will be run by the government. Does the word Socialism not sit right in your stomach? What about all the Czars of Czars for every committee group. That should turn your stomach. Because I cringe every time I hear it and realize that we are headed that way. Or I bet you guys love it when they talk about redistribution of wealth. Cause I'll tag along with those porch-sitting government suckers when he passes that bill next. I'll let you rich gys work hard for your money and redistribute it to me while I sit on the porch or play with my government funded R/C collection. In fact I'll take my welfare paid Cadillac to the pond and dirt track as well. I'll be hard to beat with the extra time on my hands.

Speak of, why is there a need to make more and more government? We have too much government as it is. Wasteful spending!

Here's a fact for you: Since being inaugurated in January, Obama has held 22 campaign fundraisers. Bush held 6 in his entire first year. Sounds like he's working hard to me.



Why is Obama not listening to his appointed General when he's asking for 40,000 more troops to finish the nonsense in the middle east? We need to either go all in and finish the whats going on or get the hell out and tell the world to to us.

What the hell has Obama done to deserve the Nobel peace prize? I'm sure Alfred Nobel is rolling over in his grave just thinking about this...

And, my Lord, what about this never ending, always growing, unread bill of healthcare? A bill so full of contradicting arguments, amendments and earmarks. A bill that will cost taxpayers $20,000 more over the next 10 yrs after it goes into effect. A bill that will raise premiums for senior citizens by 20% or more. A bill that will be so blatantly abused by the public, who will just opt to pay the penalty for now and then buy the premium later because they can't be turned down. A bill that will add trillions to the already growing deficit.

And would you lefties STOP BLAMING BUSH! Nobama has been in office long enough and needs to take responsibility. Well, let me rephrase that. Nobama's Czar's and Delgates need to take responsibility. Nobama hasn't done a thing yet.

Why is the White House so obsessed with attacking the Fox News channel? Answer: because they are the opposition and Liberal's despise opposition.

[Darin Jordan]

That money would have best been served as tax cuts to the poor and middle class. At least it would have gone further to stimulate the economy.

But the "poor" don't PAY any taxes...

[domwilson]

Thats the entire left agenda. Spend tax payers money, tax us some more, and then spend that. Where is the conservative values that our country was founded upon in this?

And how can you lefties say that government subsidizing more and more industries is not socialism? How can you say that government gaining public control over people's lives is not socialism? 30-48% of people's lives will be run by the government. Does the word Socialism not sit right in your stomach? What about all the Czars of Czars for every committee group. That should turn your stomach. Because I cringe every time I hear it and realize that we are headed that way. Or I bet you guys love it when they talk about redistribution of wealth. Cause I'll tag along with those porch-sitting government suckers when he passes that bill next. I'll let you rich gys work hard for your money and redistribute it to me while I sit on the porch or play with my government funded R/C collection. In fact I'll take my welfare paid Cadillac to the pond and dirt track as well. I'll be hard to beat with the extra time on my hands.

Speak of, why is there a need to make more and more government? We have too much government as it is. Wasteful spending!

Here's a fact for you: Since being inaugurated in January, Obama has held 22 campaign fundraisers. Bush held 6 in his entire first year. Sounds like he's working hard to me.



Why is Obama not listening to his appointed General when he's asking for 40,000 more troops to finish the nonsense in the middle east? We need to either go all in and finish the whats going on or get the hell out and tell the world to to us.

What the hell has Obama done to deserve the Nobel peace prize? I'm sure Alfred Nobel is rolling over in his grave just thinking about this...

And, my Lord, what about this never ending, always growing, unread bill of healthcare? A bill so full of contradicting arguments, amendments and earmarks. A bill that will cost taxpayers $20,000 more over the next 10 yrs after it goes into effect. A bill that will raise premiums for senior citizens by 20% or more. A bill that will be so blatantly abused by the public, who will just opt to pay the penalty for now and then buy the premium later because they can't be turned down. A bill that will add trillions to the already growing deficit.

And would you lefties STOP BLAMING BUSH! Nobama has been in office long enough and needs to take responsibility. Well, let me rephrase that. Nobama's Czar's and Delgates need to take responsibility. Nobama hasn't done a thing yet.

Why is the White House so obsessed with attacking the Fox News channel? Answer: because they are the opposition and Liberal's despise opposition.

First. I like to state that I am not one of the "Lefties" that you so passionately referred to me as.

Second. I guess you missed the first post. "Please don't attack other posters and make it personal. This is just opinions"

Third. I didn't read anywhere in this thread that someone was blaming Bush.

The fact of the matter is that government has been growing consistently for many years, regardless of what party is in control. The same can be said for government subsidizing. All these things that people state that Obama is going to control us all, tax us into bankruptcy, etc. etc. etc. Do you think that he acquired these mystical powers since his taking office? It has been a gradual erroding of american liberties for some time. It didn't just start with Obama and it won't end with him. And guess what? We've had "socialist" programs for quite a while. Welfare, Medicare, Social Security are just a few. Take a look at this link... http://www.stutzfamily.com/mrstutz/W...pesofgovt.html

[domwilson]

But the "poor" don't PAY any taxes...

I thought it was the impoverished that didn't pay taxes.

[winner]

I thought it was the impoverished that didn't pay taxes.

the poor have never paid taxes... they expect everyone to whipe there ass for them...

it goes like this
you give a poor person money, they go buy a freakishly huge tv and then complain they don have any food and expect you to give them more money...(only so they can buy sumthing else stupied...

you give a poor person a job and they get fired for never showing up, but still expect to get paid

you give a poor person of a different race a lawyer= you get a law suit for being racism... if you loose the poor person buys a bently then the bank takes it away becuse he didnt pay sh!t on anything and looses all his money and is poor again...

[Rumdog]

How can you categorize all the "poor" people as being the same? That is very ignorant. No such thing as unfortunate circumstances or job losses due to lack of work huh? None of you have obviously ever felt hardship due to the lack of work or failing economy. But by all means stay on your high horses and blame the poor for everything.....illegal immigrants too while you're at it.

[Eodman]

While I don't do politics, back in '72 actually early '73 I was sitting in a bunker riding out a 122mm rocket attack and can you guess what I got in the mail all the way from the USA? Yup my absentee ballot 91 days after the election! So I don't do politics although I do read your arguments!

[Steven Vaccaro]

Who runs the government? People.

Where have the family values, and honesty gone?

[Bill-SOCAL]

I am fully supporting a family values oriented referendum here in California that will ban divorce, which is without question one of the single most anti-family values actions in our society.

Broken homes cause a whole host of negative problems like spousal abuse, murder, child abuse, deep psychological problems for the children, and so on. Divorce also has tremendous negative financial effects on the families that are torn apart by it. Not to mention that divorce is entirely inconsistent with Christian religious beliefs. I do not recall seeing divorce mentioned in the Bible for instance.

If we truly do care about family values then I think this type of law is absolutely required to help maintain the sanctity of marriage and to preserve the two parent nuclear family model that is the crux of any family values argument.

Here's a nice summary from some researchers at Rutgers College:

http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publicat...optenmyths.htm

More: http://consequencesofdivorce.com/

How can we let something as damaging as divorce exist in a society that so strongly supports "family values"??

[domwilson]

Who runs the government? People.

Where have the family values, and honesty gone?

They've been replaced with consumerism and materialism. Parents don't spend as much time with their children as they used to. In many cases both Parents work. We want things because they are new and shiney. Not just because they work. We have become slaves to our wants and not to our needs.

[Steven Vaccaro]

I am fully supporting a family values oriented referendum here in California that will ban divorce, which is without question one of the single most anti-family values actions in our society.

Broken homes cause a whole host of negative problems like spousal abuse, murder, child abuse, deep psychological problems for the children, and so on. Divorce also has tremendous negative financial effects on the families that are torn apart by it. Not to mention that divorce is entirely inconsistent with Christian religious beliefs. I do not recall seeing divorce mentioned in the Bible for instance.

If we truly do care about family values then I think this type of law is absolutely required to help maintain the sanctity of marriage and to preserve the two parent nuclear family model that is the crux of any family values argument.

Here's a nice summary from some researchers at Rutgers College:

http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publicat...optenmyths.htm

More: http://consequencesofdivorce.com/

How can we let something as damaging as divorce exist in a society that so strongly supports "family values"??

Bill what do they suggest those people that want to get divorced do?

[domwilson]

the poor have never paid taxes... they expect everyone to whipe there ass for them...

it goes like this
you give a poor person money, they go buy a freakishly huge tv and then complain they don have any food and expect you to give them more money...(only so they can buy sumthing else stupied...

you give a poor person a job and they get fired for never showing up, but still expect to get paid

you give a poor person of a different race a lawyer= you get a law suit for being racism... if you loose the poor person buys a bently then the bank takes it away becuse he didnt pay sh!t on anything and looses all his money and is poor again...

While I don't agree with your stereotyping of the lower income portion of the population, in some cases, a small percentage, this may be true. However, there are alot of people struggling with just the neccessities of everyday living. They work hard for the small paychecks that they receive and put that money towards putting a roof over their heads. There may be circumstances beyond their control and beyond the stereotype.

[domwilson]

Bill what do they suggest those people that want to get divorced do?

More info. on that.. http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-2...ers-California

[rockwerks]

Cash for clunkers... $24,000 PER CAR processed is what that COST the tax payers.... $24,000... I know I sure feel "stimulated"...

and we want to turn over health care to the government? the same government that paid 10,000 for a toilet seat?

[Bill-SOCAL]

Bill what do they suggest those people that want to get divorced do?

Let me ask you why what is perhaps the single most devastating thing that can happen to a family acceptable to you as a person who holds family values as one of your core beliefs??

[Bill-SOCAL]

and we want to turn over health care to the government?

Well, nobody is advocating "turning over" health care to the government. What is being proposed is to allow the government to offer an alternative for those who cannot otherwise afford health care, or who will willingly choose to participate, access to a government run option. Everyone else is free to do as they choose.

But let me ask you, since you are so vehemently opposed to government run health care what do you plan to do when you become eligible for Medicare?

[RCprince]

Well, nobody is advocating "turning over" health care to the government. What is being proposed is to allow the government to offer an alternative for those who cannot otherwise afford health care, or who will willingly choose to participate, access to a government run option. Everyone else is free to do as they choose.

But let me ask you, since you are so vehemently opposed to government run health care what do you plan to do when you become eligible for Medicare?

To bad we can't take away medicare from those who don't want government health care...silly people I tell you.

[rockwerks]

Well, nobody is advocating "turning over" health care to the government. What is being proposed is to allow the government to offer an alternative for those who cannot otherwise afford health care, or who will willingly choose to participate, access to a government run option. Everyone else is free to do as they choose.

But let me ask you, since you are so vehemently opposed to government run health care what do you plan to do when you become eligible for Medicare?

You do realize that a major portion of funding for this program comes from medicare funds right?

I do know people in the health care insurance field that have told me that if the public option comes to pass many fo their insurance providers will just stop writing insurance in those states who choose to participate. that will leave nothing but the public option which is just what the powers to be are hoping for.

The numbers of insurance profits for health care seem immense but actually on average profit margins are less that 2% for most health care plans. While that might be in the multi millions some years. it only takes a few bad quarters for the companies to be in the red. As baby boomers get older we will see a shift from insurance companies making a profit to a loss.

If the government wishes to decrease health care insurance costs they need to provide some services themselves like the purchase of MRI and other expensive units to provide the services needed. It will save billions in heath care expense.

I dont have all the answers but the plan as it stands is less than a half baked idea

[Darin Jordan]

To bad we can't take away medicare from those who don't want government health care...silly people I tell you.

Oh yah... Medicare is bliss... Aside from the fact that it has over 30 TRILLION Dollars in unpaid liabilities... it's a regular panacia of social responsibility...

Let's definitely do this to the rest of the healthcare system!!

[rockwerks]

To bad we can't take away medicare from those who don't want government health care...silly people I tell you.

I have paid for medicare my entire working life. and I will receive less in benefits than I paid in. NOw with this health care plan I who can not afford my own coverage because I am self employed will be fined 1800.00 per year if I dont buy insurance. Damned if I do and Damned if I dont

[rockwerks]

If the Government really wishes to help with Health care costs they should give every American a tax deduction for the COST of health care coverage. And businesses a deduction for providing coverage to their employees. That would provide a massive infusion of capitol into the markets.

That would increase money available for people to spend and save which would spur the economy 1,000 percent more than the worthless stimulus package did

[Darin Jordan]

If the Government really wishes to help with Health care costs they should give every American a tax deduction for the COST of health care coverage. And businesses a deduction for providing coverage to their employees. That would provide a massive infusion of capitol into the markets.

That would increase money available for people to spend and save which would spur the economy 1,000 percent more than the worthless stimulus package did

Wouldn't hurt if they'd attack the regulation and TORT stystems to get the actual costs down, as well...

[Steven Vaccaro]

Let me ask you why what is perhaps the single most devastating thing that can happen to a family acceptable to you as a person who holds family values as one of your core beliefs??

It amazes me how people are willing to trade away rights.

I'm totally against divorce, but how can the government tell us what we can or can not do in our lives? Where does it stop? These values need to be taught, not pushed on us. All that would do is push people to not get married in the first place. Ca and the gay rights marriage laws have diluted the meaning of marriage enough, now CA (the leader of the gay rights parade) is further trying to ruin the meaning of it. Whats next?