Chinese hulls, motors, and hardware

[j.m.]

Hey Steven, this place has some really quality looking stuff. And supposedly their motors are excellent, seeing as how they won 1st in the 2009 Germany international comp.

http://www.tenshock.com/Enindex.asp

The y hydros look pretty cool, and the euro style monos are just gorgeous. I can't see a seam line on the boat which means they are almost assuredly wet joined in the mold.

Could you get some pricing for their stuff?

Here's a few videos of the hulls>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bC7Wk2A9MJc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnWyewQNX-Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wd66ofx05I

[Rumdog]

Check out www.minicatracingusa.com He is the only importer in the U.S. for Tenshock products. I have owned 2 micro hydros and they are awesome! I wanna get my hands on a starship rigger someday.

[Steven Vaccaro]

Check out www.minicatracingusa.com (http://www.minicatracingusa.com) He is the only importer in the U.S. for Tenshock products. I have owned 2 micro hydros and they are awesome! I wanna get my hands on a starship rigger someday.


Yup.

[j.m.]

:(

So tenshock won't sell to you?

I think mini cat has the prices WAYYY too high for what his costs are.

[domwilson]

Uh oh...You might want to take this up with him. He is a member of this board.

[egneg]

Open mouth only long enough to insert other foot!

[screwball]

hahahahahaha

[Steven Vaccaro]

He is a member of this board and is open minded. So I say you should ask away.

I can say that I too import things. Its not as clean cut as it seems. I've have received damaged items, wrong items sent and many more problems. Getting this settled with most overseas companies is almost not existent. So its counted as a loss and reflected in the price of our items.

[j.m.]

I could be wrong since tenshock doesn't put prices on their website, but based off other Asian RC distributors, their prices have been extremely low.

[v-spec]

They will sell to whoever places the larger order just like most any other Chinese company. That's just the way it works, like it or not.

[j.m.]

Yep. So the guy over at mini cat is piecing together rtrs. And tenshock sells the individual parts. Following the us trends, we like to buy bare hulls and the individual parts and make the boats ourselves. I think there would be a larger demand for the bare hulls if OSE carried them than the demand for the rtrs minicat sells.

correct?

[v-spec]

He does a nice job with them I've had one myself but the price is a little to much in my opinion. He does not hide what they are though so if you really wanted you could buy one off ebay instead of through him and mod it how you like and save a little money.

[Flying Scotsman]

He is a member of this board and is open minded. So I say you should ask away.

I can say that I too import things. Its not as clean cut as it seems. I've have received damaged items, wrong items sent and many more problems. Getting this settled with most overseas companies is almost not existent. So its counted as a loss and reflected in the price of our items.

Boy, is that the truth. Importing items that are faulty or damaged and trying to get compensation for the real landed cost

Douggie

[j.m.]

It's business. I'd like to say I know, but i'm too young to have experienced that.

But from my experience with one Chinese distributor (hobby city) the shipping was fantastic. Fast as mess and the items were packed in the memory foam stuff and well sealed. Granted these were electronics not boat hulls, not all distributors have bad shipping.

Im just looking for more diversity in the boats we run over here and the brands that ose sells. A euro style mono class would be sweet....

EDIT> So sailr is the mini cat guy? He is fair! And open minded. A very good businessman... So much that I didn't know he was one! xD

[bustitup]

Boy, is that the truth. Importing items that are faulty or damaged and trying to get compensation for the real landed cost

Douggie


Steve and Douggie

there has got to be a way for Steve to buy through eBay sellers which would make it easier to make Chinese suppliers liable...reason being these Chinese eBay sellers rely on the eBay rating system...if they have that hanging over there head they will be more anxious to make things right with the buyer

I see over at RRR...... fuller is already making some kind of deal with them because he is selling products that head of the river sells

the advantage that a US seller of Chinese products would have is faster shipping available to US buyers

[bustitup]

:(

So tenshock won't sell to you?

I think mini cat has the prices WAYYY too high for what his costs are.

:popcorn2:

[6S HYDRO]

me too- cool product but far too overpriced, thats why i dont have one- its been sittin on the shelf of the local hs for over 2 years now

[egneg]

But from my experience with one Chinese distributor (hobby city) the shipping was fantastic. Fast as mess and the items were packed in the memory foam stuff and well sealed. Granted these were electronics not boat hulls, not all distributors have bad shipping.


I ordered a Turnigy 120 amp marine esc on 6/2/09 from hobby city and I am still waiting for it to be sent.

[ray schrauwen]

I ordered a Turnigy 120 amp marine esc on 6/2/09 from hobby city and I am still waiting for it to be sent.

Not only that, they took it off their menu. As well as other Turnigy ESC's.

I bought a pair of 180's on Ebay Ver.2 .... Need the program card now too...

[Steven Vaccaro]

But from my experience with one Chinese distributor (hobby city) the shipping was fantastic. Fast as mess and the items were packed in the memory foam stuff and well sealed. Granted these were electronics not boat hulls, not all distributors have bad shipping.

They are not a distributor. They are a retailer. Their stuff should be delivered perfect.

Ask me about 100 motor mounts that had wrong screws(not a big deal but took 4 hours out of my life repacking them) or water jackets designed by me and made overseas and shipped with the wrong o-ring grove thickness, or rudders that should have had pickups and somehow ended up without them. I have countless other stories that ended up as a loss on my end.

[j.m.]

Ouch. And my b. But that's why we love you Steevie!

Egneg, you probably chose the least expensive shipping option. I got my stuff in three days, but paid for it too.

Do you think it would be possible for you to get a few different models of the etti hulls?

[egneg]

Egneg, you probably chose the least expensive shipping option. I got my stuff in three days, but paid for it too.

I paid for the upgraded shipping but they have been out of stock for a very long time. I think I will cancel my order and get one off ebay. It will cost a bit more but at least I will get it in a reasonable amount of time.

[ray schrauwen]

You can get the esc + programmer Ver.2 for about 115 delivered. Wish I did that, I still need the programmer, Dough!

[ghostofpf1]

I paid for the upgraded shipping but they have been out of stock for a very long time. I think I will cancel my order and get one off ebay. It will cost a bit more but at least I will get it in a reasonable amount of time.

As much as I like HobbyKing I'd cancel if I were you and go elsewhere.
Tip ...don't ever order back ordered or out of stock items :thumbup1:

Steve

[j.m.]

^ +1 for that. Sorry to hear about the slow shipping.

Would anybody here be interested in one of the tenshock monos?

Or an etti mono?

They're both very similar; euro style hulls.

[egneg]

As much as I like HobbyKing I'd cancel if I were you and go elsewhere.
Tip ...don't ever order back ordered or out of stock items :thumbup1:

Steve

I have sent them an email asking them to cancel the order and to refund my paypal account.

[bustitup]

As much as I like HobbyKing I'd cancel if I were you and go elsewhere.
Tip ...don't ever order back ordered or out of stock items :thumbup1:

Steve


yup thats the biggest no no on HC

also the only other thing i dont like is that it taked almost a week for paypal order to just process

[Rumdog]

I bought an esc from them that I needed asap. Payed for the most expensive shipping and crossed my fingers. I had it at my house in Michigan in 5 days! shipping was $20.00 but it was only $55.00 for a 200amp 8s esc which worked great! As far as Sailr's products go, I think they are top notch performers and have excellent quality. I've owned 2 micro hydros and they are super fun and reliable boats!

[sailr]

I am really disappointed by the attitude in this thread. I have to support what Steve says. We do absorb a lot of loss by dealing with imports. We lost over $60,000 from one Chinese company that sent us totally worthless crap on the second shipment and then would not take it back (aircraft motors). There is no legal recourse in China. We take our chances. It was bad enough that we had to shut down our aircraft motor business. We own two other companies in addition to Mini Cat Racing USA.

Remember guys, it's not just the cost of the item. It's also the cost of shipping which is very expensive from mainland china, not like the HK subsidized shipping for one small item. Shipping insurance is useless, a waste of money. They will figure out a way not to pay so we go 'bare', accepting damage and loss as a risk. Second, we have to sign a contract to buy a minimum of product from Tenshock each year in order to have the North American exclusive for their products. That minimum is in the tens of thousands of dollars which we must borrow and pay interest on. There is the cost of advertising. There is the cost to travel to China at least once a year to visit our factories and renew our good relationships with the owners. Without this, you can get in trouble real quick dealing with Chinese companies. (I'm talking about Chinese mainland companies, not Hong Kong companies which generally are pretty honest. Unfortunately, the best products are coming out of the mainland. The products you are buying from HC are made on the mainland, not in Hong Kong.) There is the cost of our warehouse and utilities and maybe, just maybe, a paycheck for us if we are lucky.

We are the importer. We sell to distributors at a large discount and to hobby shops at a slightly lower discount. When we don't sell to you direct, we are getting a much lesser price for our products.

So please, don't bad mouth our pricing. The prices from Tenshock are very high. Much higher than other boats of far lesser quality. But we elected to sell quality and not toys. You are more than welcome to purchase elsewhere and you won't hurt my feelings but please don't trash talk about something you know nothing about.

Steve and I try to run very upstanding and honest businesses and give you the best possible price while making enough to stay in business and give you friendly customer service and advice.

Jim
Suncoast Hobby Imports

[sailr]

Do you KNOW what our costs are? I thought not. So why make such a comment? For your elucidation, our costs from Tenshock are quite high, thus the price of the products. Simple. Did you bother to look at how much we lowered the prices of our boats recently? No, our costs didn't go down but business everywhere is really down because of the economy. We decided to reduce the prices to help you out.

We sell a LOT of product outside the U.S. The prices people have to pay in Europe, Australia, etc. are way above what you in the U.S. have to pay. They are happy to pay our prices and the high cost of shipping. Just like the cost of gasoline, we Americans just don't know how good we have it here yet some people still want cheaper cheaper cheaper. It's not that I don't understand wanting a good deal. I do too! But there is a point at which all of us hobby vendors in the U.S. will go out of business. Sad. I make it a habit to visit my local hobby shops and pay the going price. I want them to be there tomorrow. It would stagger you if you knew how many hobby shops have gone out of business in the last year. Yes, it's mostly the economy but a good share of the blame can be put on people buying direct from Hobby City, etc.


:(

So tenshock won't sell to you?

I think mini cat has the prices WAYYY too high for what his costs are.

[sailr]

I tried bringing in the Tenshock monos last year and ended up eating them. My cost on them is VERY high. So naturally we decided not to carry them. Sorry.


^ +1 for that. Sorry to hear about the slow shipping.

Would anybody here be interested in one of the tenshock monos?

Or an etti mono?

They're both very similar; euro style hulls.

[sailr]

About the motors, yes, they are excellent but I won't carry them because the price would be as much as a NEU motor which is the accepted level of excellence in the U.S. Nobody is carrying NEU in Europe for some reason. If they did, I'm not sure the Tenshock motors would enjoy the same level of success they have now. (I have a personal friend in Europe who wins a lot of races who is thinking about being the European distributor for NEU. I have highly encouraged him. I think he would have a tremendous success with them.) Tenshock also doesn't produce any long can (XL) motors. Just the shorter ones. The reason is that in Europe, most of their classes are smaller boats than we run here and they don't need the extra power.

I have argued strongly with Tenshock about the pricing of their motors but they won't lower them because they sell a ton of them in Europe. So, sadly, I don't carry their high end motors. Wish it was different but it ain't! I have a very close relationship with Tenshock, not just a business relationship. I put them on the map when they were first struggling to get into the hobby industry. I have helped them refine their products and introduced new design concepts to them to make their products more acceptable on the North American market. We are very close 'friends' which is necessary to deal with the Chinese. Believe it or not, the personal relationship is more important to the Chinese than the business end. It is their culture. Anyone anticipating importing that doesn't go to China and personally meet the owners of the companies, go to dinner with them, meet their family, etc. is making a big mistake. You will not get consistent quality in your shipments, etc. They don't feel any allegiance to you whatsoever. They just want your first order and then after that anything is possible. But if you become their 'friend' they will treat you like family and never rip you off.

I'm writing this just to point out that importing is not as simple as most people think. It is tricky and risky and expensive. Steven and I take our chances to provide product for you guys. I just want you to know the real deal so that maybe you will show a little appreciation for our efforts. OK?


Hey Steven, this place has some really quality looking stuff. And supposedly their motors are excellent, seeing as how they won 1st in the 2009 Germany international comp.

http://www.tenshock.com/Enindex.asp

The y hydros look pretty cool, and the euro style monos are just gorgeous. I can't see a seam line on the boat which means they are almost assuredly wet joined in the mold.

Could you get some pricing for their stuff?

Here's a few videos of the hulls>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bC7Wk2A9MJc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnWyewQNX-Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wd66ofx05I

[sailr]

The cost to ship anything back to China is outrageous. Sometimes more than the product is worth, so we normally end up eating the loss. Right Steven?


They are not a distributor. They are a retailer. Their stuff should be delivered perfect.

Ask me about 100 motor mounts that had wrong screws(not a big deal but took 4 hours out of my life repacking them) or water jackets designed by me and made overseas and shipped with the wrong o-ring grove thickness, or rudders that should have had pickups and somehow ended up without them. I have countless other stories that ended up as a loss on my end.

[sailr]

There are a FEW people that would like to have the small monos from Etti, Tenshock, etc. BUT these are not classes that are run in the U.S. so the demand isn't sufficient enough for Steve or I to stock the items. I wish it was otherwise but you'll have to take it up with NAMBA and IMPBA. As a perfect example, several people begged me to bring in some Tenshock Mini-Eco boats. I did and I even gave the guys on this board one hell of a good deal on them. I sold exactly one half of them and now I'm sitting on a few hundred dollars worth of Mini Eco's that I can't sell. If you want one, PM me!

Steven is pretty cautious about what he brings in and for good reason. I, being a sympathetic fool sometimes try to meet the demand. Unfortunately, the 'talk' seems to be bigger than the 'action' and I end up the loser. I'm not whining about it but I doubt seriously that I will fill special requests like that in the future. It's really too bad because I like playing with the new stuff as much as the next guy but my accountant is giving me hell for it!



Ouch. And my b. But that's why we love you Steevie!

Egneg, you probably chose the least expensive shipping option. I got my stuff in three days, but paid for it too.

Do you think it would be possible for you to get a few different models of the etti hulls?

[j.m.]

Sorry, didn't realize Tenshock's prices were so high.