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ED66677
01-20-2009, 02:09 PM
No politic, no sarcasm, nothing bad in this thread, just a thought... a feeling deep in my heart!
Now that you have a new president, I just wanted to wish to you guys from the other side of the ocean, hand on heart, that he will be man of the situation, I hope for you that he will take the right decisions (if any can be taken), that your economy will get better, that you will all live in happyness in this country of liberty, hopefully this will have a positive impact on other countries!
All the best from France!

RCprince
01-20-2009, 02:45 PM
Yes a new day indeed, I bid him( President Obama) God Speed.

Dr. Jet
01-20-2009, 05:41 PM
:hide: :help: :doh: :confused2: :spy: :zip-up:

Chop
01-20-2009, 05:42 PM
No politic, no sarcasm, nothing bad in this thread, just a thought... a feeling deep in my heart!
Now that you have a new president, I just wanted to wish to you guys from the other side of the ocean, hand on heart, that he will be man of the situation, I hope for you that he will take the right decisions (if any can be taken), that your economy will get better, that you will all live in happyness in this country of liberty, hopefully this will have a positive impact on other countries!
All the best from France!

Thanks, I wish that for "us" too.

Hey Ed, my daughter is leaving tomorrow to spend 4 months in France. If you see her say "Hi!":sarcasm1:

Chop
01-20-2009, 05:44 PM
:hide: :help: :doh: :confused2: :spy: :zip-up:

HA! Isn't there an icon for biting your tongue???

andym
01-21-2009, 05:57 AM
Who realy cares. They are all the same but this one should not look to the rest of the world as stupid as the last one!

Steven Vaccaro
01-21-2009, 08:01 AM
:hide: :help: :doh: :confused2: :spy: :zip-up:

Come on Jet, lets get behind him and wish us all the best of luck. In 2009 we are going to need it!

AndyKunz
01-21-2009, 10:02 AM
Who realy cares. They are all the same but this one should not look to the rest of the world as stupid as the last one!

See how stupid the rest of the world really is?!?!

Andy

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 10:15 AM
It is ironic that it is almost a prideful thing for we Americans to mock the rest of the world and presuppose that we really have no good reason to care what they think. The irony is that this forum, and others like it, demonstrate what a global community we really live in.

So while it is all well and good to adopt the Billy Bad A$$ attitude of "screw the world, nobody tells America what to do", it is just not a realistic way to behave in a world where global communication is virtually instantaneous.

It still amazes me that there is still a baseline of approximately 23% of the adults in the US who think that last 8 years have gone well. The rest of us are enthused about the prospect of improving what we see as a very bad situation.

ED66677
01-21-2009, 10:17 AM
I do care, and I'm certainly not the only one, not only for me (because the way things are going in the United State of America, somehow impacts my day to day life) but also all the good guys, I know over there, that are just trying to live!

lets get behind him If every politics had the same behavior, things would be easier, no matter if you voted for him or not, that's all you have to do!
I can only hope he will be an example for other politics from around the world!

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 10:20 AM
Come on Jet, lets get behind him and wish us all the best of luck. In 2009 we are going to need it!


Everybody is saying they hope BHO succeeds. BHO's stated position is very socialist at best. I hope he does not succeed in taking this country in a socialist direction. I hope what remains of the Elephant Party (worthless political hacks, just like the Donkey Party), can keep him in check, although I doubt they have the political will.

i.e.: "Share the Wealth" Take money from productive working people and give it to non-productive, non working people. :doh: That's a recipe for failure if I ever saw it. Does anybody think the WIC Program (a.k.a. "Welfare") was/is successful in helping people OUT of "poverty". Note that most people at the "poverty level" in this country have a roof over their heads, cars, TVs, cell phones, Ipods, and such. You want to see poverty? Go to Zimbawe where they eat dirt and live in mud huts. That's poverty.

Robin Hood Economics is not the way to grow an economy. It is a guaranteed way to shrink an economy (why work if the government is going to take it all from you?). The way to grow an economy is to allow productive people to prosper, thereby having a need to hire new employees and make capital investments. Those capital investments create the need for yet more employees. When the rich buy more luxury yachts, boat builders can hire more employees.

Lastly, I was offended by the racist remarks from that preacher that gave the invocation yesterday: "When yellow people can be mellow, and when whites adopt what is right." What would the media have done if it was George Bush that said that? That is all you would see/hear for the next two weeks. We don't have a news media anymore, just an extension of Tass and Pravda.

I hope BHO will keep this country safe from attack (doubtful based on his prior statements), and I hope he does not succeed in shoving socialism down my throat.

BHO does not have a mandate. 47% of the people did not vote for him. Of those that did, I suspect some conservatives were disgusted with the worn-out old glue horse that the Elephant Party chose to nominate, and threw their votes to BHO in frustration.

AndyKunz
01-21-2009, 11:00 AM
I'm glad we're back to a two-party system. Remember when Slick was elected with only 35% or so of the popular vote? How'd you like to try to run a country with almost 2/3's saying you're the wrong guy for the job?!

I guess this is good news for talk radio (if they're allowed to stay on the air). They'll definitely have plenty of fodder from the Clinton left-overs that are back in their old jobs, and from Emanuel.

What's going to be interesting is how many lawsuits arise from attempting to stop laws that were already working through the system. There are laws that require things to continue, and now RE thinks he can just write an edict to stop that?!?! Oh boy, we're in for a fun ride :(

Andy

AndyKunz
01-21-2009, 11:04 AM
It still amazes me that there is still a baseline of approximately 23% of the adults in the US who think that last 8 years have gone well.

In the 3 areas I've lived the last 45 years, that number would be closer to 90% approval.


The rest of us are enthused about the prospect of improving what we see as a very bad situation.

I see the previous and current Congress/Senate (you know, the guys who got us into the lending situation we're now recovering from - oh wait, which party is that?) as the problem.

Illinois politics at its worst just went national!

Andy

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 11:37 AM
I'm glad we're back to a two-party system. Remember when Slick was elected with only 35% or so of the popular vote?

In 1992 "slick" got 43% of the popular vote and 69% (370) Electoral College votes. Bush senior got 37% of the popular vote. Clinton got 5.8 million more popular votes.

In 1996 he got 49% of the popular vote to Dole's 41%. He also got 8.2 million more popular votes and 220 more Electoral College votes.

So the answer is, No, I do not recall when "Slick" got elected with only 35% of the popular vote.

And do you recall 2000 when the LOSER got a half a million more popular votes than the guy who "won"? I am curious what your position would have been had it been reversed. How in the world do you get MORE votes and still lose (I know how, but it makes a point).

In 2004 Bush got 3 million more popular votes than Kerry. So in both cases he had slimmer popular vote margins than did Clinton. Well to be accurate he only has one winning margin.

For the record, Obama got 9.5 million more popular votes than McCain, or over 3 times the largest margin of Bush (2004). Obama got 53% to McCain's 46%.

I am not trying to dredge up the past, but if you are going to use voting results to make a point at least let's use the actual numbers and not wrong numbers simply to support an opinion.

RCprince
01-21-2009, 12:42 PM
I hope BHO will keep this country safe from attack (doubtful based on his prior statements), and I hope he does not succeed in shoving socialism down my throat.



We are attacked everyday.

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 12:56 PM
We are attacked everyday.

Not to the extent that the Jihadists did on September 11, 2001.

These guys are all about symbolism. You can bet they want their NEXT attack to be bigger and more spectacular than the last.

:flashfire:

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 12:57 PM
Lastly, I was offended by the racist remarks from that preacher that gave the invocation yesterday: "When yellow people can be mellow, and when whites adopt what is right." What would the media have done if it was George Bush that said that?


Maybe it would help if you knew more about him and the source of the remark. First, he is one of the best known Civil Rights leaders in the US. He worked closely with Martin Luther King, Jr. and has continued King's work since King was murdered. SO he is not just "some old fellow" as Glenn Beck tried to portray him.

The passage you find offensive comes from a song named "Lift Every Voice and Sing" it is also known as the "Black National Anthem" and is recognized as one of the most inspirational messages about the Civil Rights movements in the US. It was set to music in 1900. So it has some history behind it.

Maybe if you took a minute or two to try to understand the background of some of these things you would be less easily offended.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lift_Every_Voice_and_Sing


I understand that you have a near paranoid fear of Obama and what you think he stands for, but can you honestly say that you think the past 8 years have gone well and that we were on the right track??

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 01:03 PM
BHO does not have a mandate. 47% of the people did not vote for him.

I am curious, did you feel the same about Bush in 2000 48% of the people did not vote for him? And I suppose the fact that Bush got 50.7% of the vote in 2004 is a mandate then, right?? Hannity, Limbaugh, O'Reilly all claimed it as such. As did Bush himself.

It is amusing that Obama got 9.5 million votes more than McCain and yet that is not a mandate in your eyes. But you were fine with Bush being appointed as the President after LOSING the popular vote in 2000 and getting a 3 million vote margin in 2004. So Obama get a margin 3 times larger than what was called a mandate by Bush and the right but it is not a mandate?? And he got 7.4 million more popular votes than Bush did in 2004, but that is not a mandate? OK. I think I understand.

AndyKunz
01-21-2009, 01:13 PM
...can you honestly say that you think the past 8 years have gone well and that we were on the right track??

I believe that our former President has been trying to get/keep us on the right track, but that he has been hindered drastically by the Congresses he had to deal with most of his term, or by actions of previous administrations (momentum, so to speak).

Things like requiring loans to people who the banks know will be very unlikely to be able to pay, using quotas to make loans rather than sound financial data, having Senators (one former one in particular, who has now changed office) with ties to the lenders, etc.

Andy

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 01:15 PM
Maybe it would help if you knew more about him and the source of the remark. First, he is one of the best known Civil Rights leaders in the US. He worked closely with Martin Luther King, Jr. and has continued King's work since King was murdered. SO he is not just "some old fellow" as Glenn Beck tried to portray him.

The passage you find offensive comes from a song named "Lift Every Voice and Sing" it is also known as the "Black National Anthem" and is recognized as one of the most inspirational messages about the Civil Rights movements in the US. It was set to music in 1900. So it has some history behind it.

Maybe if you took a minute or two to try to understand the background of some of these things you would be less easily offended.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lift_Every_Voice_and_Sing


I understand that you have a near paranoid fear of Obama and what you think he stands for, but can you honestly say that you think the past 8 years have gone well and that we were on the right track??

We weren't attacked by the Jihadis were we? They want to attack us don't they?


I don't care where that remark came from. I still find it a racist remark and I am offended. Tom Sawyer and Huckelyberry Finn(a novel by Mark Twain) had a character named Nigger Jim, and that book is considered racist too (never mind that Nigger Jim was the hero and voice of sanity and reason in the book). Where a racist remark originates is not the issue; it is the context in which it is used. I have a feeling we are going to hear a lot of "Cracker", "Whitey", "Peckerwood", "Jive-a$$ Honkey" and the like coming from influential people in the news in this country and the media will be silent.

There is one group of people that can be trashed with impunity in this country. They are white, male christians, and blonde (white by default) women.

Am I the only person that sees several layers of double standards?
:sarcasm1:

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 01:42 PM
I am curious, did you feel the same about Bush in 2000 48% of the people did not vote for him? And I suppose the fact that Bush got 50.7% of the vote in 2004 is a mandate then, right??

It is amusing that Obama got 9.5 million votes more than McCain and yet that is not a mandate in your eyes. But you were fine with Bush being appointed as the President after LOSING the popular vote in 2000 and getting a 3 million vote margin in 2004. SO Obama get a margin 3 times larger than what was called a mandate by Bush and the right but it is not a mandate?? OK. I think I understand.

Other than keeping us safe, reducing taxes, a helping Africa, Indonesia, India, several Eastern-European counties, and others; I was as disappointed in George's handling of the Office as I was of Clinton. The 16 years of Clinton-Bush have ruined this country. George's financial bail-out of financial and auto industries was beyond ludicrous; his policy on illegal aliens was a disgrace (I expect BHO to do worse in this area); and so on. No, George was not my hero, but he was the lesser of two evils running in 2000 and 2004.

This brings me back to a statement I made some time ago: When did you last vote FOR somebody rather than against somebody? You know that much of BHO's support was from the crowd that had the mantra "Anybody but Bush". Much of BHO's campaign was: "I'm not George Bush", he never really told us who BHO was, just who he wasn't.

Ronald Reagan had a mandate. No other President since has. I don't give a rat's behind about your stinking statistics. Remember there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. Bush didn't LOSE the election. Yes, he got fewer popular votes (this wasn't the first time this happened). That's why our founding fathers established the Electoral College: To prevent heavily-populated states from controlling elections over the voice of the less-populated states.

Bill, you will never convince me that your Left-wing politics are right, and I will never convince you that my Right-wing politics are right (Right-wing politics = RIGHT :roflol:) Let's discuss this in four years and see who is the real prophet.

I want to end this with a few words about Hope and Change:

Hope:
An excuse for inaction.

Change:
(A verse from "Sympathy for the Devil")
"...I stuck around Saint Petersburg, when I saw it was a time for a CHANGE
I killed the Czar and his Ministers, Anastasia screamed in vain....
...Pleased to meet, don't you know my name?"

That change was your good friend Vladimir, if you recall.

Capt. Crash
01-21-2009, 01:47 PM
Am I the only person that sees several layers of double standards?
:sarcasm1:

You want to see double standards...try working for the State of Alabama! :zip-up:

RCprince
01-21-2009, 01:53 PM
Not to the extent that the Jihadists did on September 11, 2001.

These guys are all about symbolism. You can bet they want their NEXT attack to be bigger and more spectacular than the last.

:flashfire:

"You have nothing to fear, but fear it's self"

Not to lessen the deaths of 911, But more people die from Cigarettes produced by American companies yearly...

More people die from heart disease every year eating foods produced by American companies yearly...

Not to be cynical, but I can go on and on and on. 12,000 deaths per year due to unnecessary surgery.

7000 deaths per year due to medication errors in hospitals.

20,000 deaths per year due to other errors in hospitals.

80,000 deaths per year due to infections in hospitals.

106,000 deaths per year due to negative effects of drugs.

So the Jihadists are the least of my threats, they are just somebodies wet dream. If those who were in charge fulfilled their duty with pride and professionalism like that Us Airways pilot, those who died on 911 would still be alive( Unless it was allowed to happened:zip-up:).

When I wake up in the morning the Jihadists aren't giving that kind of power in my life, But when I go the the super market I wonder what safety inspection exceed the minimal, bordering criminal food safety standards the FDA have in place, Or maybe its the FCC trying to limit my freedom of speech on the airways, the EPA for allowing such egregious standard on pollutants, toxic air, toxic land, toxic water------------------------------------- flat line ,now I'm at the mercy of the Pharmaceutical drug companies,:bowdown: Oh great master please save my heart while I give you my left eye and kidneys, But wait if you throw your spleen in, you get a life time subscription of that wonderful blue pill(Viagra).

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 02:04 PM
Bill, you will never convince me that your Left-wing politics are right,

I am actually not trying to do that. But I am trying to point out that you are internally inconsistent. Bush loses one election in the popular vote and gets 1/3rd fewer votes in the second one and you were fine with that and had no problems with the right wing pundits declaring it a "mandate". But Obama gets more popular votes and wins with a greater percentage of the vote and that is not a "mandate".

All I ever try to do is to have people apply the same logic to both sides of an argument irrespective of their political leanings.

And it is amusing how you want to deny the factual numbers by trying to discount them as "statistics".

Oh and one more thing. First you note that 47% of the people did not vote for Obama that it means something. Then when called out on that you retreat to a discussion of the electoral college. So first the popular vote is meaningful, then it is not. It either is or it is not. But you cannot use it to support both sides of your argument.

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 02:36 PM
I am actually not trying to do that. But I am trying to point out that you are internally inconsistent. Bush loses one election in the popular vote and gets 1/3rd fewer votes in the second one and you were fine with that and had no problems with the right wing pundits declaring it a "mandate".

Find where I ever said GW had a mandate.


Oh and one more thing. First you note that 47% of the people did not vote for Obama that it means something.

That means a lot of people did not think he was the best candidate for the job. That's all. Don't try to read too much between the lines.

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 02:44 PM
7000 deaths per year due to medication errors in hospitals.

20,000 deaths per year due to other errors in hospitals.

80,000 deaths per year due to infections in hospitals.

106,000 deaths per year due to negative effects of drugs.


These are not intentional murders at the hand of individuals with no other goal than to kill as many people as possible. Most hospitals actually try to SAVE lives. Errors, omissions, and corporate greed may account for more deaths across the country of 350 million people, but in a 3-block area of New York City, I doubt any pharmeceutical company or hospital has done that kind of damage.

See what you can do with statistics?

RCprince
01-21-2009, 03:17 PM
Anytime you CHOOSE money over people lives, it's deliberate. Anytime you CHOOSE short cuts over peoples lives it's deliberate. Those stats I post would have been less, if people took pride in what they do.

JimClark
01-21-2009, 03:33 PM
I would like to add that now with the one party rule by the D's that look at their popularity numbers. Last time I looked they were lower than Bushes and they (both D' and R's) are a a big cause of the Doo Doo we are in now.

Jim

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 04:17 PM
Here's something SoCal Bill will find amazing. I actually think BHO did a commendable job today in pulling in the reigns on lobbyists, and his "Transparency in Government" position. I hope he continues in this direction, as this is a welcome change. I haven't followed-up on this, I just read one article; but on the surface it looks like a good start. :thumbup1:

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 04:21 PM
I was just listening to his new policy announcement on NPR. Seems like he is not wasting any time making it clear that there's a new Sheriff in town.

But this is all prelude to the giant public works projects to build the re-education camps to turn you all into good little Socialists. I'm bucking for a top spot at one of the SOCAL centers, so maybe I'll see you there Dr. Jet!!

AndyKunz
01-21-2009, 04:34 PM
When I wake up in the morning the Jihadists aren't giving that kind of power in my life, ...

It's the same logic the Spaniards had to the original Moor (Mohammendan) settlers.

It's probably what the Indians were thinking at Plymouth.

The Mexicans said the same about the whites moving into Texas.

And it's the same logic the European Jews and Christians had in the early 1930's.

If we are to learn from history, what lesson might one gain from only those 4 instances?

Andy

Flying Scotsman
01-21-2009, 04:41 PM
I tell you what the Canadians can come to the rescue! You can have Steven Harper (our Prime Minister) an ultra conservative. He denied that Canada would be affected by the economic crisis and we will take Obama as he suits our more liberal viewpoints. Problem solved :smile:

Douggie

Jeff Wohlt
01-21-2009, 04:43 PM
Dr. Jet, you make very good points. Love the stuff on Mark Twain...I go there often (Hannibal, MO)

HAD their been one more candidate (beside that Hilary woman...gag) that could speak well and stand for something (besides the word change) things may have come out different.

I am postive about our "New World" and it looks as if the world is pleased to get GW out of there as well.

If he gets blown away, he will still go down as the best black president ever. If he get get nothing done at all he will still be seen as the best first black presdident ever.

He wanted to do a 30 minute show and buy prime time on all the major TV networks but they would not let him. How much you think Oprah put in? 100 million??

We will soon see who is going to take it in the shorts. Will he help poverty in our country...not a chance.

Good thread but I hate it in a way.

Bill-SOCAL
01-21-2009, 04:46 PM
Andy, didn't you get the memo? We no longer have to wake up every day and yell "BE AFRAID, BE VERY AFRAID!!!"

That time ended at noon EST yesterday when the Masters of Fear and Ignorance left DC.

RCprince
01-21-2009, 05:14 PM
GWB suffer from what his father told Jimmy Carter, when asked bout UFO's, "Mr president your on a need to know basis and I don't think you need to know" GHWB. His son was ruled by the same hierarchy he(GHWB) left in place while leading the CIA.

Dr. Jet
01-21-2009, 05:18 PM
I was just listening to.....NPR.

Why does that not suprise me at all. :olleyes: