Miss Geico Help

[koontek]

Hey guys,

Been Into R/C boating since early 2005 but got out for a long time. I'm trying to educate myself on all the newer power systems and what it takes to get positive results. I pick up a used Miss Geico that needs help. It has a blown ESC and what I believe to be a wrong motor/prop combo. Hoping you guys with experience can help me out and guide me in the right direction. Thanks in advance!

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[fweasel]

Hard to say for sure, but that appears to be a Castle 1515, which is a 1Y, 2200kV motor. Good on 4S, screaming on 6S. The Turnigy 180A ESC was a good match for the motor, but those deans connectors are terrible and need to be replaced with something with a much higher current rating. Prop appears to be an Octura x series, no idea on size. Take off the lock nut and see if the model is visible on the end of the prop hub.

What batteries do you plan on running? What are your goals for the boat?

[dasboata]

the prop looks like a 645 which is a bit big,, also the water exit should be directly on top of the motor take the prop off and read the # on the hub spray wd40 threw the hose on the rudder till it comes out the water exit to check for leaks in your plumbing the Jacket looks suspect

[koontek]

Hard to say for sure, but that appears to be a Castle 1515, which is a 1Y, 2200kV motor. Good on 4S, screaming on 6S. The Turnigy 180A ESC was a good match for the motor, but those deans connectors are terrible and need to be replaced with something with a much higher current rating. Prop appears to be an Octura x series, no idea on size. Take off the lock nut and see if the model is visible on the end of the prop hub.

What batteries do you plan on running? What are your goals for the boat?


I dug up the original box for the motor and it looks like it is a Neu/Castle 1518-1Y-1800 KV P/N:" 15181Y-1800CM. Is 1800 KV a little low on the RPM ?

As for the ESC, the one installed in the boat right now is blown. I do however have 2 brand new Turnigy 180 A ESC's and one Castle Hydra 240 laying around. I'm thinking the Hydra might be a little overkill?

The Prop is an Octura X648. It looks pretty huge for this boat, maybe the previous owner thought it might be a good combo with the lower kv motor?

The only matching battery's I have laying around are some 2s packs and 3s packs. Both are pretty old so I'm open to investing in some nice batteries for this setup. Ideally my goal is to reach the highest possible MPH while trying to balance out reliability and stability. Any help in the right direction would be really much appreciated! 168924168925168926

[koontek]

the prop looks like a 645 which is a bit big,, also the water exit should be directly on top of the motor take the prop off and read the # on the hub spray wd40 threw the hose on the rudder till it comes out the water exit to check for leaks in your plumbing the Jacket looks suspect

Pulled off the prop and it was an X648 and I do agree it looks a little big!

You are recommending to rotate the water jacket so the water exit on the jacket is vertical? May I ask why you recommend doing this?

I dug out my prop collection and let me know if you guys think one of these props would work better.

Octura: X631, X438, X442, X437/3, X447, X447R
Grim Racer: 40x52/3, 36X55,38X55, 44X66
Graupner: K45, K51







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[martin]

You rotate the water jacket to have the water exit at the top ( 12 o clock position ), to ensure maximum fill of water inside the jacket. Where you have the water exit the jacket dosn't fill 100% to the top before it exits.

[fweasel]

1800kV will be better suited for 6S, two 3S packs in series. I would use the 180A Turnigy ESC. The Castle is overkill, and I would save it for another build. My V3 Blackjack (very similar hull) ran really fast on a 2000kV motor, 6S, and a 440/3 prop, albeit a little hot. You can start with the Graupner K45 to get the boat dialed in and if it's been sharpened and balanced, step up to the Octura x447 for more speed. If the 447 is raw, I would not run it.

[koontek]

You rotate the water jacket to have the water exit at the top ( 12 o clock position ), to ensure maximum fill of water inside the jacket. Where you have the water exit the jacket dosn't fill 100% to the top before it exits.


Makes perfect logic, thanks for clarifying that up.

[koontek]

1800kV will be better suited for 6S, two 3S packs in series. I would use the 180A Turnigy ESC. The Castle is overkill, and I would save it for another build. My V3 Blackjack (very similar hull) ran really fast on a 2000kV motor, 6S, and a 440/3 prop, albeit a little hot. You can start with the Graupner K45 to get the boat dialed in and if it's been sharpened and balanced, step up to the Octura x447 for more speed. If the 447 is raw, I would not run it.

I believe last time this boat was ran was on 4S with unimpressive results. I will wire in one of the new Turnigy 180A tonight and go over everything before taking her out again. Can you tell me what version hull this is ? And what the differences are ? What kind of speeds did you get on your V3 Blackjack ? The Graupner K45 is a composite prop which i believe you cannot sharpened and balanced correct? One last questions is there somebody offering sharpening and balancing services for props that you know of ? Thanks again for your help!

[fweasel]

That is the original 29" Miss Geico, V1. You can tell by round hatch opening and the wooden trays inside. V2 had composite trays, same round hatch. V3 had a square hatch opening, a much stronger hull layup, and better electronics.

4S on those boats was never all that much fun, but I started there myself. When you wire in the ESC, be sure to calibrate it to match your transmitter throttle. Set timing for 11-15*, and make sure it spins the prop counter clockwise or you'll have to swap two motor wires to change the direction.

Dasboata, Chris Hoffmann, does prop work. He replied to this thread once already. PM him. Yes, those Graupner composite props are shaprened and ready to go. They perform well, but can be fragile. The Octura props can really tear up your driveline bushings if they're run raw because of imbalance. I suggest not using them based on my experience.

[dasboata]

I believe last time this boat was ran was on 4S with unimpressive results. I will wire in one of the new Turnigy 180A tonight and go over everything before taking her out again. Can you tell me what version hull this is ? And what the differences are ? What kind of speeds did you get on your V3 Blackjack ? The Graupner K45 is a composite prop which i believe you cannot sharpened and balanced correct? One last questions is there somebody offering sharpening and balancing services for props that you know of ? Thanks again for your help!

hi wana sell the Castle Hydro ?

[rearwheelin]

I would gut that boat and re do all of it . To me it looks like one bad flip over and it everything comes apart.

[koontek]

hi wana sell the Castle Hydro ?

Hey Dasboata,

Thanks for reaching out, I will send you a PM

[koontek]

I would gut that boat and re do all of it . To me it looks like one bad flip over and it everything comes apart.

I guess compared to the V3, this one is not as reinforce. How would you redo everything? Just gut it out and reinforce the hull?

[fweasel]

I've not had my hands on an original 29" Miss Geico, but I have had an original 29" Mystic, which was the same boat I believe. It was paper thin and would not last long running at 6S speeds in stock form. At the very least, it would require a full interior inlay, or partial inlay plus structural two part foam.

[koontek]

So got the new ESC installed and was setting up the receiver and I notice smoke was already coming out of the motor. Seems like I might have a bad motor? The battery's where not charge (storage voltage) and I didn't even have a prop installed! Here is short video I took. Motor temp got up to over 150 degrees right away, same with the ESC.


https://photos.app.goo.gl/g2jZN5rjjCebEHny8

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With that being said, maybe I should start looking for a different motor?

[fweasel]

150* from both the motor and and ESC on a bench, and that temp was through an empty water jacket... yeah, that's not right. Hopefully your new ESC isn't damaged too.

[koontek]

150* from both the motor and and ESC on a bench, and that temp was through an empty water jacket... yeah, that's not right. Hopefully your new ESC isn't damaged too.

I think the ESC is still okay. What would you guys recommend for a new motor? Should I go with just the stock Dynamite 2000KV or is there a better motor I can get for my money now? It would be paired up to the Turnigy 180Amp ESC.

[fweasel]

The new 36mm 1900kV Dynamite motor from the Shockwave and Miss Geico Twin has proven to be a solid runner, but I'm not sure what they price it out as a replacement part. Might not be competitive with other brands like SSS or Leopard in a similar size. I've run the slightly older DYNM3831 2000kV motor in many of the probat 29" cats and it's pretty good for the price.

[koontek]

The new 36mm 1900kV Dynamite motor from the Shockwave and Miss Geico Twin has proven to be a solid runner, but I'm not sure what they price it out as a replacement part. Might not be competitive with other brands like SSS or Leopard in a similar size. I've run the slightly older DYNM3831 2000kV motor in many of the probat 29" cats and it's pretty good for the price.

The Dynamite Motor 3674 1900Kv 4 Pole Brushless Marine Motor (DYNM3915) is $110.00 but currently backorder.

The A3650-2000Kv, 6-Pole, Water-Cooled, Marine Motor (DYNM3831) has been discontinued but it looks like Steve has a couple of them still in stock @ $65.00

The 3674 looks to be a lot longer can but not sure how much benefit I would feel from the 3650 in this setup. Are you running 6s on the 3650?

[fweasel]

Yes, I've run that motor on 6S in several boats.

[koontek]

I just wanted to update you guys on this project. With COVID 19 going on it was almost impossible to find a replacement motor. I ended finding a Dynamite 3674 1900KV 4 pole (the stock motor that came in the Sonicwake 36") from a seller on eBay. I swear at the time it was the only one available for sale! Got that finally wired in last night and will be looking forward to getting her out on the water!

Just wondering what brand of batteries is everybody running nowadays? The only matching pair of 3s battery's I currently own are some Traxxas 5000mah that I got in a package deal. They are showing some age and I know will not keep up with the demands. I have had some good luck with SMC with my 1/8th race program and was looking into picking up a pair of these https://www.smc-racing.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=67_99&product_id=555

Also, are you guys running xt60 or xt90 connectors? I'm leaning towards switching from my deans to xt60 connectors as I'm thinking xt90 might be a little overkill for this setup? Let me know your thoughts on this guys. Thanks!

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[fweasel]

I use the Turnigy Graphene batteries, both the original and the newer Panther version. They're excellent performers that have been well tested, but a bit larger then most, and certainly cost more. Turnigy's new Rhino batteries are said to be a very similar chemistry to the original Turnigy Graphene, at a much lower price point. Hard to get at the moment. It's also been suggested that the current China Hobby packs are identical to the Turnigy Panthers, again, at a fraction of the price. Not only do they appear to be identical in physical dimensions, there are some good test results on RC Groups that also lead to this correlation.

Twist ties make for better battery connectors than a Deans plug, so you can't do any worse. I think the new XT90 plug has antispark built in, which is a nice feature, but are only rated for 90A. EC5's have a higher rating of about 120A. Personally, I use Castle 6.5mm connectors on my 3S packs, which are rated at 200A. I use a lot of those packs in series for 6S.

[koontek]

Finally got her out to the local casting pond yesterday, the first time she's ran in 3 years...

Ran her with dual 3s batteries wired in series for 6S total power with the K45 prop. got up on plane no problem but the top speed was okay. Wasn't super slow but not super fast either. I would of hope for more speed but the motor and ESC temps were really low. Maybe she has some room for improvement. After about 5 mins of running, something got disconnected. I heard the motor scream but no movement. I for sure thought the prop came off but after getting her back (btw never go out again without a recovery boat!) the prop still attached. Pulled out the flex cable and it didn't break but failed. Not sure what happen? Maybe you guys can let me know what went wrong?

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[koontek]

Here is the running video before the flex shaft failed


https://youtu.be/PH9JQIDtvNE

[fweasel]

It looks like you have a reverse cable installed, and as such, were spinning it the wrong direction. Doing so, causes it to unwind, increase in diameter, and cause massive amounts of friction. You're going to need a new collet, a new flex cable, a new teflon liner, and possibly a new brass stuffing tube if that was damaged.

Think of the flex cable like a spring, it needs to be spun in the direction that tightens the coils.