HPR 5009c bulletproof build

[Bradb74]

Hi all

I'm building my first Rc boat, HPR 5009c bulletproof. It should be here (South Africa) in 2 weeks.
I've had loads of fast Rc cars and helicopters but I'm clueless when it comes to boats so I'm hoping to get some advice from those in the know. I'd like her to reach the 120mph ( 200kph) mark.

I was thinking of putting 2 x TP 4050 or 4070 motors, 2x seaking v3 180a ESCs and 2 x 6s lipos. As far as props go, I have no idea.

I'd really appreciate any advice on if the electronics I'm thinking about will do the trick or alternative other component ideas.

I'm sure I'll have a lot more questions as the build progresses, but this is it for now.

Thanks in advance for any ideas thrown my way.

Cheers

Brad

[Prodrvr]

That's a hell of a project and cost for someone who is clueless when it comes to boats. If I were you, I'd google every pic I can find of that boat. You'll find plenty of photo reference which you will need to proceed. The other thing is, your esc and cell count choice will not get you to 120+.

[Bradb74]

Thanks for the info, I'll keep doing homework on it. There's a few guys on the old YouTube with this rig running around the 120 mark but they play their cards close the their chests regarding specific equipment.

[Prodrvr]

I was actually thinking of getting one myself, but I have too many cats as it is lol. I'll snoop around and see if I can be of any help.

[Prodrvr]

Ok, just found a vid of the boat and wow. This guy is running 105.5 mph on two TP 4050 2350Kv, two T180A esc's, two 6s 5000's, two X457 props cut down/modified.

[Bradb74]

Thanks a mill,

I'm really excited to get this build started. From my experience with building helicopters.. the build is half the fun and the more I read up up on these boats its going to all kinds of technical and I love that part the hobby.

Once again, your input is much appreciated.

[Prodrvr]

Sure thing. Post up build pics as you go!

[srislash]

Nice, this will be a fun boat. I have one as well but it has not been completed. I can however attest to TP 4050's. And they should well be up to the task. I have a pair of 1020kv's on 12s in a Fantasm hull that runs 115mph and has for two years.

Shawn

[Bradb74]

Will do.

[Bradb74]

I'll be sure to post pics as I progress.

@ Shawn, what ESCs are you running on the 4050s?

Thanks

Brad

[Bradb74]

Nice, this will be a fun boat. I have one as well but it has not been completed. I can however attest to TP 4050's. And they should well be up to the task. I have a pair of 1020kv's on 12s in a Fantasm hull that runs 115mph and has for two years.

Shawn

Hi Shawn, what ESCs are you running on the 4050s?

Thanks

Brad

[srislash]

Hi Shawn, what ESCs are you running on the 4050s?

Thanks

Brad
Brad, I'm running Etti 220 HV's. It started life with Flier 300's but one of them screwed up so for three years now the Etti's have been awesome. A little jumpy off the start but then fine.

[Bradb74]

Thank you, if I may ask another question?
Are you running 2 x 12s?

[Bradb74]

Thank you, if I may ask another question?
Are you running 2 x 12s?

[golfito]

Wow! Amazing boat.
I await progress ...

[srislash]

Thank you, if I may ask another question?
Are you running 2 x 12s?


Yes 12s x 2, 4400 mah

https://youtu.be/X2LykA7azQA

I'll have a new vid up here pretty quick from my latest attempts

[golfito]

Yes 12s x 2, 4400 mah

Are you Shawn S.?:bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

[srislash]

Are you Shawn S.?:bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

No I am not, but we were battling speed goals back and forth for the longest time. He is a great guy and easy to talk to.

[golfito]

No I am not, but we were battling speed goals back and forth for the longest time. He is a great guy and easy to talk to.


Ok forgive me.

[srislash]

Ok forgive me.

No sweat golfito.

[Bradb74]

Yes 12s x 2, 4400 mah

https://youtu.be/X2LykA7azQA

I'll have a new vid up here pretty quick from my latest attempts

Thanks a million, I'm aiming for the the same approximate speed. Now I now what I have to do.

Cheers

Brad

[srislash]

Bear in mind Brad that a HPR should be way more efficient on water than that Fantasm of mine. Also a crapload better on light chop. I am told if you can keep a HPR light it will handle better.
But, I have 1690kv motors(LMT) and will be going 6s2p on each of those. I may try 1 battery per motor to test the handling theory.

[Bradb74]

Bear in mind Brad that a HPR should be way more efficient on water than that Fantasm of mine. Also a crapload better on light chop. I am told if you can keep a HPR light it will handle better.
But, I have 1690kv motors(LMT) and will be going 6s2p on each of those. I may try 1 battery per motor to test the handling theory.

Thanks, I've been doing loads of reading up and I've noticed the German/Swiss contingent seem to follow that train of thought.
I'll keep you all updated as I go.

Cheers

Brad

[Bradb74]

Thanks for all the advice...I've ordered 2x 180amp ESCs and 2x TP 4050 2350kv motors. They were shipped from OSE yesterday, so everything should be here in a week.

Will post a few pics as soon as my goodies start to arrive.



I can buy Savox servos locally, will a 25 Kg be ok for this application?

[Bradb74]

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[Bradb74]

Just got these pics from the guys at HPR.
My boat is ready and should be delivered
in the next couple of weeks.

[R2315]

Really like that hull! Looking forward to your build. What drives are you using? And are you making all the mounts yourself?

[Bradb74]

Me too, I'm using the HPR drives. Not sure who makes the though. I'll attach a pic. Im not making the mountings, because this is my first boat build I opted to order the mounting kit from HPR. I think I'm way to inexperienced to make all the mounts myself.


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[Bradb74]

My motors and a few more parts arrived this week ( thanks to the guys at OSE) so I got the basics out of the way, soldering the connectors on. The hull was shipped off on Friday so should be in South Africa shortly.
I'll attach some pics of my progress.

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[Beaux]

Won't be long now..

[nata2run]

I make those parts by the way ��

[Bradb74]

Awesome.. what a small world. I'm sure when everything arrives I'll have a few questions for you regarding the installation.

[Bradb74]

Ok, just found a vid of the boat and wow. This guy is running 105.5 mph on two TP 4050 2350Kv, two T180A esc's, two 6s 5000's, two X457 props cut down/modified.

Hi John, I ordered a set of sharpened and balanced x447 octras and a set of x457 octras to cut down.

From what I've read I need to cut them down to a 50mm. Do you have any experience with this?

Thanks

[Prodrvr]

Hi John, I ordered a set of sharpened and balanced x447 octras and a set of x457 octras to cut down.

From what I've read I need to cut them down to a 50mm. Do you have any experience with this?

Thanks

Sorry, I do not.

[Bradb74]

Ok cool, I'll consult the Oracle and see what I can find.

[fweasel]

Hi John, I ordered a set of sharpened and balanced x447 octras and a set of x457 octras to cut down.

From what I've read I need to cut them down to a 50mm. Do you have any experience with this?

Thanks

Contact Chris Hoffmann, member Dasboata

[Bradb74]

Will do, thanks

[srislash]

Contact Chris Hoffmann, member Dasboata

If you are to get some reduced 457’s done detounge them and remove some blade area. Make sure to tell Chris this oryou will draw unecesary amps

[Bradb74]

Hi all

My hull finally arrived today from Switzerland :-)

I'll start the build in a week or two when I have a little time off.

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[fweasel]

Just got my C5009 hull and hardware in as well. I won't be starting my build for a while, so I'll be watching your progress for ideas.

[Bradb74]

Cool, we can compare notes.

[srislash]

Just got my C5009 hull and hardware in as well. I won't be starting my build for a while, so I'll be watching your progress for ideas.

So are we all going to be comparing notes on running come spring? Haha

[dmitry100]

How are the new HPR hulls (the new guys who took over HPR) are they of the similar or same caliber of that of Hans?

[fweasel]

So are we all going to be comparing notes on running come spring? Haha
Mine will be rigged within an inch of its capabilities and my notes may have more to do with aerobatic properties than hydrodynamics! :laugh:


How are the new HPR hulls (the new guys who took over HPR) are they of the similar or same caliber of that of Hans?
My hull is an older, HPR layup. I have not personally seen one of the new ones up close.

[Bradb74]

I'm not sure how the new ones compare. I'll thake some closeup pics this evening.

[Bradb74]

The quality looks good to me. I've never seen an older older one in the flesh though.155352

[Bradb74]

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[nata2run]

Here is one I'm building for a customer
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[fweasel]

Here is one I'm building for a customer
155370Who makes the rudder hydraulic arms?

I also see an uneven transition from the tunnel to the bottom of the rudder stand-off. Perhaps this is one of the differences between old and new C5009's.

[nata2run]

Who makes the rudder hydraulic arms?

I also see an uneven transition from the tunnel to the bottom of the rudder stand-off. Perhaps this is one of the differences between old and new C5009's.

Me, :-)

[nata2run]

@ fweasel, you sure you got a 5009?? ( also see an uneven transition from the tunnel to the bottom of the rudder stand-off)

[nata2run]

the yellow is an original 115 HPR from Hans, and the white the 5009 also from hans, same size but different hull type...
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[srislash]

the yellow is an original 115 HPR from Hans, and the white the 5009 also from hans, same size but different hull type...
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The sides of the pedestal depressions are also different. Any other difference my friend?

[nata2run]

The hulls have not changed they are different hulls

[srislash]

The hulls have not changed they are different hulls
Yes but are the tunnels and such the same? Does one favor handling better or anything Kent? I know we had discussed that a HPR can handle but I’m curious if any are better? I did not actually know the 5009 was any different. I thought maybe the hatch orsomething.

[nata2run]

They are both great, would say the 5009 is more for straight and the 115 handle a bit better

[fweasel]

Me, :-)

Can't find them on the site last I looked, and the site doesn't even load for me now. How much/where?


Here's a shot of the bottom of my hull at the rear. My rudder standoff to tunnel transition is smooth/level. My hull looks exactly like photos of a Bulletproof C5009 that KBB built down to the locations of the hatch bolts and water inlet/outlets.
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[nata2run]

If you need hydraulic or any other parts you can hit me up

[Bradb74]

Hi Kent

I'm going to send you a PM.

Thanks

Brad.

[nata2run]

Brad if easier catch me on FB nata2run

[Bradb74]

Ok cool, thanks

[Bradb74]

Just wanted to say thanks to Kent from customcfparts, its been an absolute pleasure dealing with you while ordering all of my parts for my boat.

[fweasel]

I'm expecting a package from Kent soon as well.

[Bp9145]

Here is one I'm building for a customer
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Kent you make some beautiful looking parts there. . .great workmanship.. I'm impressed.

[nata2run]

Thank you guys for the kind words, we’re trying as hard as we can to bring the best parts to the market. Once in a while we like to think we succeed

[srislash]

Thank you guys for the kind words, we’re trying as hard as we can to bring the best parts to the market. Once in a while we like to think we succeed
Oh you are pal, you are!

[Bradb74]

Hi All

Does anyone have any tips on how to make sure the rudder is installed perfectly straight? I started measuring up today to do the install.

[Bradb74]

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[Bradb74]

Next on the list is the drives...155656

[dmitry100]

I found that to be one of the harder things to do. Actually its a pain in the ass if you've never done it before. I'm assuming using regular drills aren't the way to go... since they make holes not very inaccurate.

[Bradb74]

I'm going to start with a 0.3 mm dremel. Hopefully that'll do the trick.

[fweasel]

These are awesome for getting precision holes started, and cheap too!

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http://offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=dh-gpmr8130

[Bradb74]

Cool, thanks

[Bradb74]

Making the templates for the drives today....
Thanks to Kent for the pointers.

[Bradb74]

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[srislash]

Taking deep breathes yet? Drilling the holes is nerve racking.

[Bradb74]

It is man, my nerves are fried.

[Bradb74]

Templates done, now plucking up the courage to drill... 155812155813

[srislash]

:banana:Go Brad Go!!:banana:

[Bradb74]

Now just to do the BIG one..

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[fweasel]

Wow, beautiful templates!

[Bradb74]

Thanks, they took a bit of time to make but seeings how this is my first try at building a boat I think this way has the least margin for error.

I'll keep the pics coming.

[golfito]

Wow!
:popcorn2:

[nata2run]

Now just to do the BIG one..

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Looks correct buddy, nice work!!

[Bradb74]

Thanks Kent, appreciate all the advice.

[Bradb74]

Finally grew a set and drilled the holes for the drives, was a lot trickier than I thought. I ended up honing the holes to size by hand to get the pefict fit.
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[nata2run]

Looks very very good!!! Nice work

[Bradb74]

Thanks bud.

[Bradb74]

Hi all,

Any tips/advice on how to line up my drives perfectly straight?

Thanks.

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[fweasel]

I was using long straight edge pressed up against the inside of the sponson and took measurements at two points on the drive tube.

[Bradb74]

Thanks, that was my first thought. Now I know I'm on the right track.

[Bradb74]

Quick question....

Should the drives be level? I've attached a pic, please let me know if this looks correct.

Thanks.
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[nata2run]

Brad, you should have the option to be level as its a good starting point for setting up the boat. You may find as you go faster there will likely be a need to put some negative angle into the drive.. It's looking really good! Take your time and it will pay off in the end.

[Bradb74]

Thanks Kent.

[srislash]

Hey Brad, I was just doing some clean up and found the stock HPR motor mounts. You have yours?
Drives look good BTW

[srislash]

I was using long straight edge pressed up against the inside of the sponson and took measurements at two points on the drive tube.and ditto. And if you want to take it a step further run tubes/shafts in places of the prop shafts to extend your reading out further. I think I used 6mm brass 12” long and a 3ft straight edge along sponsons.
Hope I’m not too late on this one

[Bradb74]

Thanks, got all the mounts from Kent.

[R2315]

Hey Brad, how's your build going? You still working on this?

[Bradb74]

Hi Ryan
I'm still working the build. Looking good so far, I've really taken my time getting the hull ready for paint. There were loads of tiny cracks in the gel coat and the one of the sponson tip was damaged in transit from Switzerland so I've had some repair work to do. Its a 100% now though.

Living in South Africa has also made it a bit challenging to find little bits and pieces like washers and screws so I've had to import all that stuff, it took eight LONG weeks for my washers to arrive.

I'll post a few more pics of my progress.

[srislash]

Nice to hear it’s coming along Brad. I hear you on the little bits, I ordered coloured washers from HK during Chinese New Year and I still don’t have them.

[R2315]

Yes, good to hear. I'm planning a hpr115 for my next project, so keeping an eye on how you guys do things :wink:

[Bradb74]

Hi All,

I have finally got the motor mounts and servo holder glued in and and like a true first time boat building novice decided to lay carbon fiber down to strengthen the mounts.
..that was indeed a character building experience. The end result seems to have worked out nicely though.

[Bradb74]

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[Bradb74]

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[fweasel]

Coming along nice. Don't sell yourself short, the build looks really good. 3M Panel Bond is something I see used with great results on servo and motor mounts and the results are often very tidy and neat. I have not used it myself yet, but will on my next project.

[srislash]

Yup, looks good, nice and clean. Nice work Brad

[Bradb74]

Thanks guys

[Bradb74]

Hi Guys,

Quick question, I read in this forum that guys use black silicon to mount their battery trays. Would this be advisable for my boat?

Thanks

[fweasel]

Yep! I use black aquarium silicone sealant, recommended to me by several builders. I wish you could mount everything inside the hull with that stuff because its so easy to keep neat and clean lines.

[Bradb74]

Awesome, thanks Ryan.

[Bradb74]

Hi guys,
I'd like to order my servo today. How many KG's of torque does it need?

Thanks.

[nata2run]

Low profile around 10kg something like savox 1251 will do fine. But there are many servos you can use depending on wallet.

[Bradb74]

Ok cool, thanks Kent.

[Bradb74]

Hi All

I'm sourcing some pipe for the through hull pickups. What should the inside diameter be?

Thanks

[fweasel]

The factory inlets installed on my HPR are made from tubing that measure 0.166" which is a little over 4mm on the inside diameter.

[Bradb74]

Cool,

Thanks Ryan

[Bradb74]

Photo update..
Servo and ESCs are in.

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[fweasel]

Looks awesome

[Bradb74]

Thanks.

[Bradb74]

Quick photo update...finished the water pickups today. Took forever to find 4mm pipe, eventually found some at a hydraulics machine shop.

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[Prodrvr]

Quick photo update...finished the water pickups today. Took forever to find 4mm pipe, eventually found some at a hydraulics machine shop.

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What tool did you use to shape the glass? Looks very clean.

[Bradb74]

What tool did you use to shape the glass? Looks very clean.

I used a Dermal

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[Prodrvr]

I used a Dermal

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Oh I see...used a ball end cutter. Cool, thank you! I'll have to practice on some scrap fiberglass.

[Bradb74]

You're welcome, I practiced on on some scrap wood.
Just make sure you have a firm grip on it. In my practice runs it got away from me few times.

[Prodrvr]

You're welcome, I practiced on on some scrap wood.
Just make sure you have a firm grip on it. In my practice runs it got away from me few times.

Thanks again!

[Bradb74]

Hi all

Its been a while. My flex shafts finally arrived aftre a lengthy delay at our post office....
Does any one know what a good C.O.G. starting point would be on my boat?

Thanks.

[srislash]

I’m still playing with mine but 30% is a good point to start. I have it written down and I’ll get the measurements for you in a few hours when I’m alive, lol

[Bradb74]

Thanks

Got the first flex shaft installed

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[srislash]

Great Brad, you are sooo close. Do you have clear water where you are?

[srislash]

Brad I have 13 3/4” of the wetted surface for CG written down. This is with a 17lb RTR weight.

[Bradb74]

Thanks, I do. There is a good size dam around an hours drive from where I live. There is also a small dam 2 minutes from my house so that's where my first run will be.

[Bradb74]

Hmmm, please bare in mine that this is my first boat so I have absolutely no idea what the wetted part is. Please will you put that into "boat building for dummy's" terms.

Thanks bud.

[srislash]

Hmmm, please bare in mine that this is my first boat so I have absolutely no idea what the wetted part is. Please will you put that into "boat building for dummy's" terms.

Thanks bud.
Sorry I did not get back earlier Brad. So measure the 13 3/4” from the trailing edge of the sponson. Where the stinger mounts underneath.

I was going to mention that make sure you have room to run this one. It’s crap till it’s up on plane and then it is GO

[Bradb74]

Thank Shawn, much appreciated.

[fweasel]

COG, depends on speed goals. If this is a triple digit speed boat, you could be as high as 40%. Lipo sleds will usually provide quite a bit of balance point adjustment with heavy batteries.

[Bradb74]

Ok cool, thanks Ryan.

[Bradb74]

Made some good progress today :-)

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[fweasel]

Too late now, but the white epoxy you used to reinforce the water pickups could have been dyed black to blend it with the rest of the interior. I have not tried it myself, but I know kfxguy has dyed fast setting epoxy (5min or 30min) and used that almost like paint to recover and blackout epoxied joints for purely aesthetic reasons. Your ESC's look nice and neat with that mount, even better once the beauty panel goes over the top. Still messing around with how I'm going to mount mine. Haven't ruled out mounting them to the side of the hull either.

[Bradb74]

Thanks Ryan
Fortunately the white stuff on the water pickups is " Prestik". A removable putty. I like the idea of the dyed epoxy, thank that's what I'll do as the permanent solution.

[Bradb74]

I need some advice on my next few steps please.

1) This is my first twin motor setup, do I use a Y connector and remove one of the positive wires from one ESC?

2) Is there any preparation that needs to be done to the end of the flex shaft before it is clamped into the collet?

3) What grease should I use on the flexshaft?

Thanks in advance.

[fweasel]

Definitely de-pin one of the red wires on a single ESC plug, then use a Y-plug. Don't cut the wire. Assuming they both have a BEC, you'll need that pin back in place when you set up the ESC by itself for the first time.

If I have to cut my flex cables to length, I put a slight bevel on the tip with a bench grinder. I've never found it necessary to solder the ends, but have run some like that because they came that way. I also like to polish the flex cable with some 600 or 800 grit sand paper while the propshaft is chucked in a cordless drill. I run the cable through the sandpaper while I pinch it between my fingers.

I've been using just plain Proboat grease on my cables and wires. Some people use regular marine grease, others gear oil or cocktails of the two mixed together. I've been meaning to try a mixture myself on some of my drier boats that don't need as much grease to keep the water out of the tubes in hopes of creating less friction on the spinning cable.

[Bradb74]

Thanks Ryan
Appreciate all the help.

[srislash]

Ryan I’m going to add to your advice here.

1) if you pull the + wire out of one side of the Y harness and keep the ESC wire intact it will be better for programming at a later date.
2) don’t polish the tip of the flex cable which goes into the collet. I have found that I have HAD to solder to get a snug fit of the cable into the collet. The diameter of cable seems to vary at times.
3) yup, just blue Marine grease(Proboat,Lucas) as it’s all pretty much the same. I will then drip a few drops of Duralube down the flex where the flex goes into the stuffing tube. It’s my habit to do the night before my 100+ runs.
And I don’t generally change out my flexes after every run. The oil helps with that I have found.
But it certainly depends on how much contamination from water occurs.

Ok that’s my 2 cents

[Bradb74]

Thanks Shawn
Won't be long now and she'll on the water.

[srislash]

Thanks Shawn
Won't be long now and she'll on the water.

I’ll check on your nerves prior to running Brad. Haha

[fweasel]

Ryan I’m going to add to your advice here.

1) if you pull the + wire out of one side of the Y harness and keep the ESC wire intact it will be better for programming at a later date.
2) don’t polish the tip of the flex cable which goes into the collet. I have found that I have HAD to solder to get a snug fit of the cable into the collet. The diameter of cable seems to vary at times.

1) Good tip. Not sure why that hadn't occurred to me before. Probably because that's what I did on single ESC's when I added an external BEC for higher servo voltages.
2) Exactly, sorry I didn't mention that. I actually put masking tape over that portion of the flex to server as a visual reminder of where to stop while it's spinning in the drill.

[Tsoltero19]

Awesome build !! Can’t wait to see how it runs!! I jus picked up the tp 4050 cm 2300kv motors for my cat. Going to try them out tomorrow and see how she does

[Bradb74]

Awesome, please let me know how she runs.

[Tsoltero19]

It ran well was able to get 98mph out of the tp motors. Will go back in a couple of weeks with some different props and see if I can get 100mph.

[Bradb74]

Well done, 100 mph is just around the corner.