Eagle Tree

[R2315]

Hi all,

I'm looking into the Eagle Tree Elogger V4 150a. My question is I'm running a 2200kv Neu with a 180A Seaking on 4s in a 30" mono, do you think its safe to use the 150A version or am I pushing it?

Thanks,

[oscarel]

Time a run and use the estimated amp draw calculator https://www.offshoreelectrics.com/conversion.php

[CraigP]

It won't hurt it, just show a maxed out reading...

[oscarel]

How do you know how much amps he's pulling? A 180A seaking can take way more than what it's rated for.

[R2315]

Thanks, I wasn't sure how accurate that was but if it is close on a 5000mah pack using 20% (4000) over 150sec it puts me at 96amps. Thanks CraigP for the RMRC find!

[oscarel]

Just remember that's an average. If you did a lot of on and off you're going to have some larger spikes. What prop are you running?

[R2315]

usually m400 or x440 when I want a little more punch off the start. Hey saw that link to modding it to a 300amp, will it actually log that?

[R2315]

sorry M440

[oscarel]

yes it will. with that small of a prop you should be safe with 150 amp. most of our race boats that size we're using in the x445 range. and also more mah.

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[R2315]

Ya I'm worried worried about tearing up the .150 flex with the 445 so for now until I feel the need it will be the M440 for the most part. Thanks oscarel!

[R2315]

I'm just sport running right now so the Eagle Tree will give me the chance to experiment :)

[CraigP]

The currents spikes that I'm seeing on my ET on my hydro are prop jumps, you know, hitting small waves and jumping out of the water then hooking back up, happens very quickly. No hydro runs hooked up 100%, it would be running way too wet. From what I see, as I increase the prop size, these current spikes really jump up in magnitude. So the larger props pull much more momentary power hooking back up in the water. Not much you can do about the prop coming out of the water, but it seems the prop size needs consideration based on this. These current spikes are hard on the capacitors as well, creating lots of heat. So far, on my boat, it looks like a smaller prop spinning faster is easier on the electrical system. That's what I really like about this system! I don't go over the 150A level, so it's working good for me. I run about 90-100a hooked up with spikes to 130-140a.

[oscarel]

ive seen your posts, but not which boat you're running.. for the amp calc, if you make a run for say 60 secs (or shorter) wide open and then check what u put back into the lipos that would give a better estimate.

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[CraigP]

Yes, average amp draw, but not spikes! You have to data log to see that, either with an external unit like ET or use a ESC that has the feature. It's those spikes that probably give people some problems..

I haven't posted running pics of my boat, only some construction pics. I'm trying to get thru final paint. I'll try and find someone to take pics or get a vid on it. It's a DF Vortex34 with heavily modified sponsons. I've posted specs all over the place on the forum, so I'll skip that here.

[R2315]

Toysport Syncron 28" mono. I went ahead a pulled the trigger on one anyway from RMRC good deal at $39.99. I'm up north now with not so good weather so my next run will likely be at my local pond but I'll give that a shot and see what I get oscarel.. Thanks again guys!

[CraigP]

Here's a pic of the bottom, after final white coat. Taken today...

[oscarel]

The type of boat was for R2315, you seem to have a handle on the amps.

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[CraigP]

Is R2315 the deep V outboard, pictured at top?

[R2315]

Yes, I'm hoping to get into a little more advanced building but for now this thing is lots of fun! With the ET I should be able to take things a little further.

153456

[CraigP]

That will run much more hooked up. Being a mono, it will pull more amps, so keeping an eye on current seems to be a good play. I just got a DF29 mono! Hasn't seen the water yet, but looking forward to learning too. Hydros are a different animal all together... not easy to tune..

[R2315]

This hobby is addictive, I just got this one in the water and I'm thinking about what's next.

[oscarel]

It's all in how you prop and set up the boat. Monos pull no more amps than cats or hydros. My 4s cat and mono share the same mah lipos during races and they come back drained pretty close. Hydros aren't that difficult either, COG around the middle of the turn fin and adjust from there.

[oscarel]

This hobby is addictive, I just got this one in the water and I'm thinking about what's next.

Addictive is an understatement.

[CraigP]

It's all in how you prop and set up the boat. Monos pull no more amps than cats or hydros. My 4s cat and mono share the same mah lipos during races and they come back drained pretty close. Hydros aren't that difficult either, COG around the middle of the turn fin and adjust from there.

How can that be? There's more boat in the water with a mono, thus more friction. Achieving 60mph in a 30" mono has to take more power than similar speed and sized hydro. What you're saying defies the laws of physics. There's a reason a little knee outboard hydro can go as fast as an SK runabout.

[CraigP]

These monos look like fun! Here's my DF29, getting rigged for 6s. It's got a 30V, 1400kv motor. We got close to the same ESC, a Turnigy 180a. It won't come even close to that amperage, but it should be very reliable. It came with the boat, running 4s before. Can't wait to run it, need the radio, it's in the mail...

[CraigP]

Ya I'm worried worried about tearing up the .150 flex with the 445 so for now until I feel the need it will be the M440 for the most part. Thanks oscarel!

I agree with you, you got the right prop for reliable sport boating.. Your rpm's look good too. Your using the same setup I'm shooting for. I got a Grim 38X57 3-blade to try on it's first trip in the water. It should be pretty close to the M440, which is a 2-blade, right?

[R2315]

That's looking great! 1400kv on 6s should be cooler and more efficient too not to mention lots of room for prop options, I was going to do a 6s setup then changed my mind last min.. I have a flood chamber so less room in there. Let me know how it turns out, should be awasome though! The mono's handle nice and are good fun!

[R2315]

Yes, both m440 and x440 are two blades I really like the m440 though, still haven't put the GPS on it but maybe I'll add that on to the ET ;)

[CraigP]

My favorite prop on the hydro is the M445. I think I'll get a M440, pretty sure it will work good on this. Checking the calculator...

Yeah, it says 44mph, perfect cruising speed!

[Mxkid261]

These monos look like fun! Here's my DF29, getting rigged for 6s. It's got a 30V, 1400kv motor. We got close to the same ESC, a Turnigy 180a. It won't come even close to that amperage, but it should be very reliable. It came with the boat, running 4s before. Can't wait to run it, need the radio, it's in the mail...

I just built one of these with a 4074 1400kv. Nothing got over 100* F on a 85* day last weekend, ran real efficient great run times too. Here's some half throttle running on my buddies pond.

https://youtu.be/xK11eYPv7Y8

[oscarel]

How can that be? There's more boat in the water with a mono, thus more friction. Achieving 60mph in a 30" mono has to take more power than similar speed and sized hydro. What you're saying defies the laws of physics. There's a reason a little knee outboard hydro can go as fast as an SK runabout.

Monos run on the last 1" or so. I didn't say anything about them being the same speed.

[Tamelesstgr]

I have the 150 amp EagleTree system, it is a valuable tool. I was running a leopard 4082 - 1450kv motor on 6s with a Turnigy 180 ESC and up to an M645 prop on a 32" Deep-V hull. The highest MAX amp draw I saw was 150-160 (during takeoff usually) and then the amps hovered around 125. My temp range for ESC was 115-125 degrees, motor temp range was 85-100 degrees. Best MPH on this heavy boat was 55.

Here are some images of the data I captured

My main dashboard when I download the logger
153461

AMP chart, this helps to see your spikes
153460

AMPS, RPMS, Watts, Volts. This helps show me the effects different props have on the setup
153462

RPM
153463

Temp (Blue = Motor / Gray + ESC)
153464

[CraigP]

No, you didn't, which was a failure on your part. If you're going to compare hull technology, then you need a central point of comparison. That's why I'm pushing back on you... FE stands for "fast electric", not "free energy".

The same is true on the DF Vortex comments you made. You have no idea about the changes to hydrodynamic and aerodynamic forces Ive made, all huge components of a hydro's charactersitic. So you seem to shoot out statements fast, but have little contemplation behind the statements. You may have 25 years experience, but your statements are not reflecting that. To me, it comes across that you just don't like the hull. I saw the things the hull IS, not what it ISN'T. And I have the experience (longer than you) to fix it. Those sponsons came from teachings I got in the 80's and 90's from a guy named Ron Jones, the most prolific hydro designer/builder of all time. Not looking for your approval. I know Ron would smile, and he's the one I look up to!

[CraigP]

I have the 150 amp EagleTree system, it is a valuable tool. I was running a leopard 4082 - 1450kv motor on 6s with a Turnigy 180 ESC and up to an M645 prop on a 32" Deep-V hull. The highest MAX amp draw I saw was 150-160 (during takeoff usually) and then the amps hovered around 125. My temp range for ESC was 115-125 degrees, motor temp range was 85-100 degrees. Best MPH on this heavy boat was 55.

Here are some images of the data I captured

My main dashboard when I download the logger
153461

AMP chart, this helps to see your spikes
153460

AMPS, RPMS, Watts, Volts. This helps show me the effects different props have on the setup
153462

RPM
153463

Temp (Blue = Motor / Gray + ESC)
153464

Excellent usage of the system! Shows it all, doesn't it? Allows you to learn, and make intelligent predictions on what prop changes will do! Thanks for posting... PS looks like my dashboard, it's good software!

[oscarel]

No, you didn't, which was a failure on your part. If you're going to compare hull technology, then you need a central point of comparison. That's why I'm pushing back on you... FE stands for "fast electric", not "free energy".

The same is true on the DF Vortex comments you made. You have no idea about the changes to hydrodynamic and aerodynamic forces Ive made, all huge components of a hydro's charactersitic. So you seem to shoot out statements fast, but have little contemplation behind the statements. You may have 25 years experience, but your statements are not reflecting that. To me, it comes across that you just don't like the hull. I saw the things the hull IS, not what it ISN'T. And I have the experience (longer than you) to fix it. Those sponsons came from teachings I got in the 80's and 90's from a guy named Ron Jones, the most prolific hydro designer/builder of all time. Not looking for your approval. I know Ron would smile, and he's the one I look up to!

Can you point me to where I made a comment about your boat?? And maybe take a chill pill or two...

[CraigP]

Tiny pond, you drive good! What's your battery configuration? My boat has a little 3674 in it. I'm going to try that out first, and log how hot it gets... great video!

[CraigP]

Can you point me to where I made a comment about your boat?? And maybe take a chill pill or two...

Your right, it was somebody on another post, I apologize for that. I try a lot of new things, and frequently get attacked from others, especially members with many years experience. Although I haven't been in your club, that doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm sorry that frustration was focused at you, you didn't deserve that... I don't and will not race, so racers need to understand that their needs and experiences, as well as goals and priorities, are different from sport boaters.

[Mxkid261]

Tiny pond, you drive good! What's your battery configuration? My boat has a little 3674 in it. I'm going to try that out first, and log how hot it gets... great video!

Ya it could be bigger haha, that's on my buddies land though so when I go out there to drink beer its hard NOT to bring a boat to play with even if his pond is a little small Lol. I was running two 3s 7200 SPC packs in series. Its a little more tricky with something faster!!

https://youtu.be/PTeSFhPY5Pw

[Mxkid261]

On a side note, how are these wired? Just + and - to the speedo? I've been contemplating one of these and should just pony up and get one.

[CraigP]

There two sets of power leads:

1) +/- from the batteries. The black should go to the minus side of the battery pack and the red to the plus.
2) +/- to the ESC. The black goes to the minus of the ESC and the red to the plus.

Note: the two minus leads (black) are essentially just tied at the ET, forming a continuous run from the battery to the ESC. You need this on the ET so it can properly read the pack voltage. The red comes in from the battery and passes thru a metal conductor out to the power input lead of the ESC. This is NOT a current sense resistor. There really is no loss with this circuit. The metal conductor is surrounded by a non-contacting Hall effect device that senses the magnetic field eminating from the metal conductor. It's pretty slick!

[Tamelesstgr]

I'm going t obe selling my last EagleTree setup soon I think, I switched over to GAS!

[oscarel]

Your right, it was somebody on another post, I apologize for that. I try a lot of new things, and frequently get attacked from others, especially members with many years experience. Although I haven't been in your club, that doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm sorry that frustration was focused at you, you didn't deserve that... I don't and will not race, so racers need to understand that their needs and experiences, as well as goals and priorities, are different from sport boaters.

No worries. Take a sec before hitting the enter key. Most of us racers also sport boat so we know both sides of it. Pushing the limits when you have restraints can help a lot with those not doing it. Give us racers some credit too.

[CraigP]

Will do and again, I'll use more patience in the future... going to run the DF29 mono for the first time this weekend since picking it up from a guy on the forum. Have you seen that carbon mono for sale? Dang, it's such a sweeeet boat! The DF is really thin... I had the put some reinforcements in it down thru the vee. Here's a pic and if you see something, please let me know! I will take your advice constructively.

I made a plate from T6061-T6, 0.050" thick the mount the center battery and ESC, as well as reinforce the bottom. You can just make out the feet glassed to the bottom. I just put in a thru hull, dual water pickup and will cool ESC and motor on their own circuits. There's a T-180 ESC with added caps I put on. I got a Leopard 3674 1400kv motor in it to run 6s. Got a M440 to start... it's a .150 flex shaft running a liner. It came that way, thought I would run it that way. Thanks for looking and understanding..

[MadProps]

good job, wish I could buy you two a beer... :beerchug:

[CraigP]

You makin' me thirsty!

[oscarel]

I'd go out for a beer! Where in OK are you located Craig? I'm just north of DFW in McKinney. And the mono looks good.

[CraigP]

I'm in a Tulsa, we used to have our company meeting in an office in Legacy Park, pretty close to McKinney. Our Web Developer lives in McKinney! We now meet in Midland, where our operations are located. Are you in Telcomm? I thought I saw that on your bio...

[oscarel]

I'm in a Tulsa, we used to have our company meeting in an office in Legacy Park, pretty close to McKinney. Our Web Developer lives in McKinney! We now meet in Midland, where our operations are located. Are you in Telcomm? I thought I saw that on your bio...
I am in telecom. I did most of the phone conversions in Tulsa for sw bell in the 90s. I have some friends in Tulsa that run for sport. Im actually looking to head that way Saturday if they're going out.

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[CraigP]

Can I PM you?

[oscarel]

Can I PM you?

No :-)

[R2315]

Are you guys using this RPM sensor? https://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=dh-rpm-kit-brs-v2

[CraigP]

Yes, that's the BLDC sensor, good unit! Don't use the magnetic version, we spin the shaft too fast, they could come off to easily for my liking...

[R2315]

Got my ET in the mail today :) I'm looking to swap the 12 awg wires to 10 awg. Anyone done this successfully? Any tips? I don't want to cook my new unit any suggestions would be appreciated! And any idea where to get the clear heat shrink?

[CraigP]

You need a soldering iron with a big chisel point. Get the old wires off the ET first. I just cut the clear heat shrink off in a box in front of the four wires. I tinned the #10 wire first, making sure I got 100% solder penetration in the wire weave. I put solder on the ET pad, flow it and bring the #10 wire onto it. You need gloves! It gets hot!! You do need to watch how much heating time you put on the PCB. On a scale of 1-10, this soldering project is an 8 in difficulty, especially the two #10 ground wires. You need your A game for this one... if you have an inadequate solder iron, then I don't recommend it. I have a Weller Digital 75W unit. The key is to use the large chisel point. You will never get it hot enough with a small point tip. Good luck and remember those gloves!

[R2315]

Thanks Craig! So my $20 40watt is not going to cut it.... I'll go shopping. Kester 60/40 good for this? Do you have any pics for reference? Thanks again!

[oscarel]

if youre looking to do the 300amp mod, best to leave the 12ga. itll be hard to get the extra wire soldered on.

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[R2315]

Good point oscarel, maybe I'll wait and do a few runs first. All my wire is 10awg with 6.5mm castles, I was just concerned the ET 12awg might bottle neck the current or create extra heat.

[CraigP]

Here's a pic of the 10 gauge wire on the ET. I wrapped the ET with Kapton tape, a specialty high voltage, high temperature tape used in electronic manufacturing. You can tell that it wasn't easy! It's soldered to my Cap Board. This is for my hydro, down right now for final paint. So note this hasn't been tested... I hope to run this weekend, maybe you should wait and I'll report if it still works.

Hey Oscar, glad you got home all right. Oscar came up to Tulsa to run his boats with some Tulsa guys he's known for years. He invited me to come run my DF29 Mono, it's first time in the water since I bought it used from a guy on this site. Oscar helped me work it out, and the little boat screams!

[CraigP]

Thanks Craig! So my $20 40watt is not going to cut it.... I'll go shopping. Kester 60/40 good for this? Do you have any pics for reference? Thanks again!

No, 60W minimum! The solder is fine. I have another ET to modify and I'm not looking forward to it! Was going to put it in the DF29, put its running pretty sweet. I'm thinking I'll leave it alone for now.

[oscarel]

Craig, yes we made it home safe. It was great meeting you and your wife. We'll have to get together agaon soon!

Ryan, also you want to make sure the ET works before modding, may void your warranty.

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[R2315]

Alright thanks guys, I'm going to run it a few times and go from there! See what needs to be done if anything. I got a little over excited... haven't tinkered for a couple days ;)

[Tamelesstgr]

Just so you are aware, if you are planning on doing the 300 amp modification the datalogger needs to be recalibrated.

[CraigP]

Update: I ran the ET data logger that I modified with the 10awg wire. It works just fine and the data logger showed a higher voltage level at max amps, so the wire is reducing voltage loss. I'm going to proceed to my second ET now.

[R2315]

Thanks Craig! Good to know it worked out!

[R2315]

Hi All,

Has anyone experienced the Eagle Tree not recording all the temps properly? Every time I run it at least one temp is missing and its not always the same one.

154102

Thanks!

[CraigP]

I've had mine not data log at all, when I changed laptops. I had to set up everything from scratch. If it's showing in the live mode, then it should be there... I don't run two temps, so no experience with this specific issue. It's only the temps that are missing? Oh, one other thing, make sure your connectors are solid on the sensor. I think it will not lg if the data logger doesn't see a connection when it turns on. I had that happen on the tach sensor...

[R2315]

Thanks Craig, ya it's weird because in live mode it all checks out.... I'll check the connectors next time.

[Tamelesstgr]

Hi All,

Has anyone experienced the Eagle Tree not recording all the temps properly? Every time I run it at least one temp is missing and its not always the same one.

154102

Thanks!

For my units I was not able to record (3) temps, I was only able to accurately record on Temp sensor A and Temp sensor C (1st temp slot and 3rd temp slot)
Are you using ET temp sensors?

[R2315]

Strainge..Yes, all Eagle Tree sensors. 1 motor loop and two standard.
Thanks