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T.S.Davis
10-18-2016, 02:17 PM
Been sifting through the rule book.

We talked about the "regatta" thing with Randall at the Northern Nats back in 2008. We told him it would be tough to get commitments and even tougher to find a host with the pond and the patience to pull it off. It does have 3 formats but to pull them all off would be a night mere based on my experience. I don't remember there ever being an FE regatta.

So I went to IMPBA to check on the gas and nitro nats from this year. They're not using it either. Is anybody using the regatta formats?

longballlumber
10-19-2016, 08:34 AM
Are you asking about the International Regatta? This would be an event that racers can be awarded a US-1 (National Championship). In order to be awarded a US-1 championship you must participate in heat racing, timed ovals, and SAW events. There is a points formula (percentages) outlined in the rule book.

They haven't ran this format in a few years, but I am told they will be doing this for 2017 in Huntsville, Alabama (assuming this approved by the IMPBA board). There are a few threads on IW centered around a the history and future of a TRUE US-1 "Internats"

Later,
Ball

T.S.Davis
10-19-2016, 11:02 AM
The FE section has its own regatta set. That set includes three formats. Format three doesn't require SAW and oval trials but is a crap ton of racing.

There have been gas and nitro nationals that didn't run the formats. Are those "national" championships illegitimate? I don't have an opinion. Just curious what the culture is.

I'll have to check in on that IW thread.

longballlumber
10-19-2016, 11:20 AM
I will need to read the specific FE Regatta. I don't recall that one off the top of my head.

longballlumber
10-19-2016, 11:50 AM
I only skimmed, but it looks like they took the same general format options that are associated to the fuel US-1 Internats format. From what I can tell, that particular section was revised in 2015. I am unsure what individual or group submitted the revision to that section. I don't recall any FE ONLY IMPBA event in the recent past; let alone a full blown Internats. Not saying there wasn't any, but not that I can remember.

I think the designation you need to keep separate is "National Champion" and "US-1". My understanding is you CAN NOT be awarded a US-1 with out going thru Heat Racing, SAW, and 2-Lap as a collective event.

Doug Smock
10-19-2016, 08:25 PM
The Huntsville Nitro Nationals has been approved by the BOD.

It's been at least 20 years since the last IMPBA FE Nats.

There is room to work on a FE "Nationals". US-1 is a different ball game as Mike stated.

Looking to hold a IMPBA FE Nationals Terry? :wink:

Doby
10-19-2016, 09:55 PM
Regatta = Sailboats

T.S.Davis
10-20-2016, 08:58 AM
I think I'm getting it now. A "nationals" and US1 Regatta aren't the same animal.

There did used to be a "Northern NATS" in London that was 99.9% FE. Those races were sweet.

"Looking to hold a IMPBA FE Nationals Terry?"

Doug........stop it. You know how I'm wired. That's like sprinkling gas on a burning ember.

Somebody actually asked at our season end race "when can we host another nationals?". My response was of course the same as every time I'm asked.................................. "how bout' never"

There has been talk here and there about an FE nats but I was never sure if the regatta was what was considered a nationals. Sounds like different animals.

So is there an official NATS format in the rules? Still learning the book.

T.S.Davis
10-21-2016, 08:43 AM
How cool would this site be for a big race? The pavilion seats 240 people. Real bathrooms. Even has a stainless kitchen counter kind of thing. 28 outlets worth of power under one roof.

147110

This is the greatest potential site I've looked at in..........maybe ever. Completely fenced off water so no locals to float out onto the course out of nowhere. High vegetation all the way around. Pretty geek'd about the potential.

I've been watching it for years but could never figure out who actually owned the rights to the pond. Got it now. I'm closing in on getting permission to use the water. I know all the who's and what's on it. Just need to find out the cost to do so legally.

fweasel
10-21-2016, 08:56 AM
How cool would this site be for a big race? Looks pretty sweet. Come bearing gifts! Hope it works out.

longballlumber
10-21-2016, 02:13 PM
How cool would this site be for a big race? The pavilion seats 240 people. Real bathrooms. Even has a stainless kitchen counter kind of thing. 28 outlets worth of power under one roof.

147110

This is the greatest potential site I've looked at in..........maybe ever. Completely fenced off water so no locals to float out onto the course out of nowhere. High vegetation all the way around. Pretty geek'd about the potential.

I've been watching it for years but could never figure out who actually owned the rights to the pond. Got it now. I'm closing in on getting permission to use the water. I know all the who's and what's on it. Just need to find out the cost to do so legally.

Last time we looked into that place you seemed to think it was owned by the state of MI. Has that changed? Has potential, but will require significant clean up, and clearing. More room for racing would be a welcome addition.

T.S.Davis
10-21-2016, 03:36 PM
It is owned by the state of Michigan. What I couldn't figure out was who was the actual authority having jurisdiction. Saying that it was owned by "the state" was like figuring out which noodle in the spaghetti you need to talk to about the recipe. I've now figured which noodle is in charge of the bowl.

I'm on to my 6th human now in my quest for a permit though. I finally found the real honest to goodness human being that can help us. However, just today I've encountered another road block. They have a directive prohibiting any permit use of UAV on right of way properties. Received that via email. That's darned right sensible........accept.............. we're not aerial so I'm not sure how that applies. I may not have made it clear enough in my inquiry what we want to do. More emails. Still working on it. I'll meet with them given the opportunity.

This kind of digging isn't foreign to me. I go through some of the same gyrations getting water supply data, plan approval, and obtaining permits for the day gig. Passing the buck or simply ignoring what are essentially the customers is pretty typical. I don't that we're being denied yet. It may come down to the cost of the permit. I have no idea what it's based on. There is no permit fee schedule like there is for a mechanical permits. If they don't want us to use it they could just price it accordingly. Haha Bring on the GO FUND ME.

It would require cleanup but I think we actually have the body count to make it work if I can obtain the permit. 10 yard dumpster and a dozen guys for a day. There is a really good access point near the pavilion. That would require cooperation with the Knights of Columbus. SO many if's involved here. I want this one badly so I wont be giving up on it any time soon.

Shadow lake is great but there are a number of issues for me as a host/CD. Hosting is a big deal to me/us/the club.

Some of the issues at Shadow:
The locals that live on the pond have been very patient but are completely out of my control. They could shut us down without any recourse.
The lodge is a distraction. I can't regulate that to my satisfaction. No catastrophe or anything but I'd prefer to never have one.
The shape of the west shore puts the course too far from the drivers stand IMO
Because some of us stay on site I feel we are taken advantage of a bit. Every other race I go to, the water is locked down at time "X". 5:30 maybe at the latest. That was the hosts get a breather. Guys trying to run until dusk and wrench until well after dark is rough on those staying. We can't just walk away and let them run the pond on their own. We're responsible for the event. That's going to stop even if we stay at Shadow.

T.S.Davis
10-21-2016, 03:38 PM
More room for racing would be a welcome addition.

BTW I'm trying to gain access for the club. Not just for an event. This pond is square and much farther across so more comfortable lanes.

T.S.Davis
10-21-2016, 04:03 PM
They have a directive prohibiting any permit use of UAV on right of way properties. Received that via email. That's darned right sensible........accept.............. we're not aerial so I'm not sure how that applies. I may not have made it clear enough in my inquiry what we want to do.

Well that was easy. Cleared that hurdle already. I'll keep ya's posted.

If you look at the aerial view of that site on google earth it's divided by the Wilcox drain. The drain has dumped sediment that divides the pond in two. If we got really ambitious we could clear that out and the pond becomes 1450' long instead of 850'.

That would be a ton of work tough.

Doug Smock
10-21-2016, 08:10 PM
Cool site Terry good luck!

Ok, here you go guys.

I just spoke with the President Chris Rupley and National FE Director Chris Harris. We all agree the current format in the rule book is, well, there's no good way to say it.:wink:

If your club wants to hold a FE Nationals at some point you have clean slate to work with for the most part. (Pending BOD approval.)

If you want to offer P Limited classes, state the motor rules on the race flyer. Same with 10th Scale rules.

If you want to offer off shore and run it the way you have been, do it. State the format on the flyer.

Of course the safety and other class rules must be followed.

Mr. Rupley did state that he'd like to see you run the "shootout" format so you end up racing the best of the best for a win. He has a file to help with that. Contact Chris with any questions but I think ultimately it's up to the club.

A banquet or an onsite meal would be nice. Add the cost to your entry fees if necessary.

The IMPBA will provide the President's Cup and the LeFeber Award.

C. Presidentís Cup Trophy
Best single performance of 2 boats in heat racing only.
In the event of a tie score between contestants, the contestant competing against the most number of
boats (using the contestant's two pre-chosen classes on their entry form) will be determined the
winner. If a tie score still exists, the contestant with the most wins (first places) in these 2 classes will
be judged the winner.

D. William E. LeFeber Award
The LeFeber Award is an award for outstanding sportsmanship and service to the organization. The
award will be voted on and presented at the International Regatta each year. The members will do the voting.

The club is required to submit a proposal to the secretary so it can be put before the BOD.

Zero pressure here. Just wanted to clear up questions and make it as easy as possible should you guys decide to take this on at some point.

BTW The last IMPBA Nationals was in Toronto in 2000.

Hope this helps.

D.

T.S.Davis
10-21-2016, 09:05 PM
Doug.........you suck. Just keep feeding the monster. It's like yer chumming the water for sharks. Hahaha.

I could see us doing it at some point. Not sure when. Can't say enough about the current MMEU gang. They've even talked me off the ledge a couple times.

One of our very active club members owns a restaurant 5 minutes from this location. We're in there all the time. Could work out nice if we wanted to do a banquet.

Doug Smock
10-21-2016, 09:27 PM
Doug.........you suck.

I think that it the nicest thing you have ever said to me Terry.:crying: I am deeply touched.:laugh:

No pressure my brother!

D.

T.S.Davis
10-22-2016, 02:38 PM
I sprinkled some if that magic dust at the pond today. Nobody punched me in the face or anything.

Terry Keeley
10-24-2016, 09:36 AM
Good work Terry, I too know the hard work and patience involved to secure water for us to play on. :Praying:

Also, welcome to the IMPBA! I've been a member for 40 years and I can say it is definitely a "grass roots" organization run from the bottom up. Our strength is our members. :thumbup1:

T.S.Davis
10-24-2016, 10:13 AM
Our strength is our members.

This sounds familiar. I said in an email recently "An organizations character is defined by it's members...........". Both organizations with a few exceptions are the same good people. Those exceptions made a difference to us. Our club still has to vote on it but we've talked it to death prior so I don't see an issue. It's better for us anyway as there are no NAMBA clubs or races near us. We were it. 46% of the D2 members were MMEU club members. So about half the district was us.

Even if this site new falls through we still have our home pond and Shadow Lake for the Michigan Cup. We just like this site better. Ton of work to be done if we can land it. The access reminds me of Thread lake back when it was sketchy down on the flats. Minus the socioeconomic issues. This happens to be a really nice neighborhood.

That site at 50 points must have included some hoop jumping too.

Ken Haines
10-25-2016, 12:30 AM
Even if this site new falls through we still have our home pond and Shadow Lake for the Michigan Cup. We just like this site better. Ton of work to be done if we can land it. The access reminds me of Thread lake back when it was sketchy down on the flats. Minus the socioeconomic issues. This happens to be a really nice neighborhood.

That site at 50 points must have included some hoop jumping too.

The Michigan Cup......are you saying it might not be back at the Elks in Leonard :crying:

T.S.Davis
10-25-2016, 06:52 AM
Not yet but maybe someday. Deffinately will be out there for 2017.

Ken Haines
10-25-2016, 08:56 AM
Not yet but maybe someday. Deffinately will be out there for 2017.


Speaking for me & my Family.....We love the Elks Club & pond in Leonard :bounce:

T.S.Davis
10-25-2016, 09:49 AM
I do too but it has issues. Some I lose sleep over some I don't. It works. Wish we could get a fireworks display like that one year. That was nuts. Best race ever. haha Runs about 10k to do that right though.

This other pond is so close to home for me I wouldn't have to stay on site. I probably would but I can be home in 10 minutes to take a real shower. 5 minute drive for Kenny. 5 minutes from Mr. B's restaurant. Try the wings. So good.

I have a number of State employees researching this other site on our behalf. No word yet. Nothing would be ready for 2017. So no worries Ken.

bzubee
10-25-2016, 09:52 PM
The Huntsville site could also be used for a FE Internats if your interested?

147213

Terry Keeley
10-28-2016, 01:02 AM
That site at 50 points must have included some hoop jumping too.

You have no idea (actually you probably would)! :tongue: