HPR C5009 Build - Nor Cal

[lavigna]

Hey all,

I have been on the boards for about 2 years now. I have gotten a lot of useful information about builds, and wanted to share mine as well. I got my HPR hull last year, but have not done much with it yet. I am finally getting underway on it now. I am hoping that my own build thread will keep me motivated to get her finished and in the water.

She is a HPR C5009 - I ordered her in CKF but got CKF/Kevlar instead. I am not thrilled with the appearance of the kevlar interior, but it is not too bad. I also have all of the HPR hardware that you can get - drives, rudder, motor mounts, servo mount, etc. I want her to look as clean and tidy on the inside as the outside. I am blown away by the work I have seen on here by Christian and others. She will be my first cat build, as well as my first FE build. I am still undecided on the motors or electronics, but I am going to need to get that sorted soon so I can begin to get my mounts laid out.

I dont have much to show yet, but I hope to soon. So far I have reinforced the transom area where the drives will pass, as well as filled and reinforced with cf the inside of the rudder mount (not pictured). I just ordered some black tint for my epoxy, as it looks very white in the photos (pretty clear in person). I am using West System epoxy and have been very happy so far. I have also done some slight rudder mods that I will post up later.

[nata2run]

Nice dude, will follow for sure Along with building my own 115 good luck with the build

[lavigna]

8982789828Thanks Nata. I have been following your builds very closely, and have gotten a lot of great info from them.

I just ordered myself some cf panels for interior work. In the meantime, I cut out some section of the cf bulkhead, and cut the scrap into squares to reinforce the top of the arneson drives, inside the hull. I have seen others do this, and am assuming it is not essential that the bulkhead seal the front of the hull from water, etc?

For the rudder, I wanted to add a little detail work by adding some small socket bolt heads on top of the rudder bracket. I also polished the rudder and added matching crown nuts to each side. Nothing too much, but I think it looks nice.

[twissted]

Nice start. I hope that it runs as well as that hull looks.

[ManuelW]

Will follow that as well - already any decisions made about the setup?

regards,
Manuel

[lavigna]

As for setup, I have nothing planned yet. I would love to get a set of Lehners, but I know they are quite expensive. As for speed, I would like to get to the 80mph range. I am not interested in outrageous speeds. I would think that some leopard motors will work for me, but I love the look and quality of Lehners. If anyone has any motor/esc/battery/prop setup info they think would fit this hull for my intended speed goal, I would appreciate it.

898658986689867Here is a shot of my filled and reinforced rudder mount, from the interior.

[nata2run]

Manuel had a nice setup in that hull with the TP motors and t180 esc's may I suggest you drill the holes in motor mounts for future lehners before u mount them.

[lavigna]

Rudder Mount - Holy crap this was a pain for me. I broke 3 drill bits while drilling the 4 holes, and all 3 were stuck in 40mm thickness of the hull+epoxy fill+c fplate. The first bit to break was a small bit as I was drilling a pilot hole (mistake) and the next 2 must have been crappy bits. I was trying to go slow and take my time drilling, but they still broke. It was a nightmare getting them out, and then getting my holes aligned correctly after. I ended up with 2 holes that are not real clean, but it wont matter now. I made a new piece of cf plate for the inside for the 3M screws to butt against, and got the mount exactly how I wanted it in the end.

Drive Holes - These are next on the list, and after what happened with the rudder mount, I am real nervous to drill them. I measured for about an hour and then put a small punch mark on each side where I think I want them. I am being a little conservative and not putting them as close to the botttom pads or inside tunnel as possible, just so I have a little more room for the large nut to moung them inside and the water cooling line. Does anyone know what size bit to use for the drives? None of my bits seem to be the correct size?
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[Chrisg81983]

I believe the standard conversion will be 15/32 if u need more info on how to mount drives please ask I definitely wil recommend using a thick template that will work for both sided just by turning it over this way they end up in the identical spot

[Chrisg81983]

Oh and in metric the bit size will be 12 mm

[nata2run]

Put a bright torch inside the hull and shine through, that way you can clealy see how much room you have. Mark it on the outside so you know you wont go past it.

[Chrisg81983]

That would work kent but I think he will have trouble doing that now that there is cf plate on the sponsons tronsom

[nata2run]

If you have the same drives as Chris, talk to him about it, as his is running real nice. Mounting drives wrong can have a really bad effect!!

[nata2run]

That would work kent but I think he will have trouble doing that now that there is cf plate on the sponsons tronsom

Umm, YES! didnt even look at that LOL
NOPE wont work

[Chrisg81983]

Yeah by the way lavigna what drives do u have ? The one nut type or the origional ones with the 4 bolt flange

[lavigna]

Chris - I have the 1 nut type. I am showing a picture with my punch mark for my drive location. I just laid out the drive nut around that mark so show the location of the hole. The drive diameter is just shy of the tips of the nut. I know this is not the greatest way to show this, and the picture sucks, but it is all I could think of for now. Again, I think the location is conservative in that it is a little high and outside? What do you guys think?

Thanks for all the help!90305

[Chrisg81983]

Its hard to judge like that from the pic they look a little high. My drives are mounted low enough so the flat part of the nut sits rite on the bottom of ridepad I will post pics and give u some measurements if I can email u a scanned image of my template if u would like

[lavigna]

Chris, that would be awesome if you could. Then I am not just guessing. Thanks again!

Email - aclavigna@comcast.net

[Chrisg81983]

Ok cool I would love to help out but if u could please shoot me a reminder email tomorrow around 6 pm its 2 am here now and need to be up in 4 hours for work. Or if kent still has the one I sent him maybe he can post it here if its not too much trouble. Oh and my email is in a pm sent your way

[lavigna]

I drilled them! I got inpatient and brought everything to a friend who is very good at this type of work and has a lot of tools, including a CNC. My drive placement is still a little conservative in relation to the bottom pad, but I like it.

The drives are just loosely placed in the below pictures. I am going to have the upper support piece (4 bolt holes) plained down a little to get the drives exactly parallel to the hull(I am assuming this is ok to do). As they are now. they are still at a slight angle. Please let me know how the placement looks to you guys.

Chris - thanks again for the template offer!

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[Chrisg81983]

Looking good buddy sorry I couldn't get u the template in time

[nata2run]

Maybe a little high for my liking, I don't know the hull but people tend to install them a fair bit lower. One would think it's importent to get it close to spot on. I guess we'll know when it's in the water

[lavigna]

Damn you Nata! lol - All day the location of my drives has been bugging me. I decided to elongate my holes and bring the drives closer to the bottom ride pad. I know this is not ideal, but the end result was actually really good. Both holes are real clean and uniform still. Now, I will actually have some adjustability in the drives that I didnt before.

The transom for the drives is not 90 degrees, as I am sure is the same on your boats. However, on this boat the left side transom is a much greater angle than the right. As you can see from the side pictures, when the long end of the drive is parallel to the hull, the shorter secton that mounts perpendicular to the transom is at quite an angle. Plus, since the left and right side are different, those angle vary from one another. I am not thrilled about this. Has anyone else noticed this defect in their hull? It is very visible on the inside of the transom where I mounted the cf plates, as they cannot sit equal distances from the tunnel wall. I dont know if any of this will make sense just from these pictures and this info, but it kind of sucks. I dont think it will effect the way the boat runs, but it sure not ideal, lol.

As always, and comments/help you guys may have to offer are appreciated. Thanks!904069040790408

[nata2run]

Did you use the slow of fast epoxy?
for the CF inside the hull?

[lavigna]

I used West System 24 hour slow cure epoxy. The epoxy did not warp the hull at all. I noticed the 2 sides were different when I was test fitting the cf plates, but I just did my best to mount them symetrical.

[Chrisg81983]

Well I would wait until u speak to Manuel to see if that's how the mold is or there is a defect. Right now u or I know how it's really supposed to be. You have the 5009 model while kent and I have the 06. I wish I could be of more help, and hoping there is nothing wrong with the hull. You would imagine the hulls go through a detailed inspection before leaving Hanspeters hands.

[lavigna]

Chris - How is the transom angle on your 5009? Is it anything like the angle of mine in that last profile picture?

[Chrisg81983]

Hey buddy I wish I can answer that for u but I have the 06 so just realized that my template might not of worked anyways. The bottoms do look very similar.

[nata2run]

I didn't think you would have used something wrong, but some times things do go wrong! In your case you have used what we all been using. So I would say its safe. I'm with Chris though, Speak to Manuel as he deals with the boats all the time and may know what to do in this case.

[nata2run]

On a side note, the placement of the drives look good!! after you lowered them..

[ManuelW]

The new drive position looks way better. Its not possible to see on the picture but maybe you can make a more detailed one. The right drive definitely looks a little "wrong" but I'm pretty sure the mistake comes from somewhere else.
Can you take a detail picture, I already had a similar issue and the reason simply was that the rear part of the drive didn't touch the transom over the whole surface. So it was not really reactangular to the transom, caused by the nut inside. So in your case is there a little gap on top of that drive part to the transom?

regards,
Manuel

[lavigna]

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Manuel - Thanks for looking at it. The drive is sitting dead straight up against the transom. Because the transom is so crooked, the small part of the drive is at quite an angle, compared to the long end of the drive which is about parallel to the hull. Will this angle cause binding of the flex in the drive? Should I try and get a correct hull from HPR?

Thanks!

[ManuelW]

Ah okay and its on both sides the same? Basically just the side where you posted pictures of in the last post looks fine. The transom of the HPR C5009 is not 90° to the running surface but that was already the intention when CAD designing the boat.
If mounting is fine, it should be the exact same thing on the other side. And also the binding of the flex is not an issue as on the picture you have the drive in the highest possible position and you'll have to lower it anyway.
Make sure you run the stuffing tube right to the transom and cut it off even. The teflon liner itself goes roughly 1" inside the drive till the front bearing.

I've built a few C5009's, these things are a little nasty when it comes to corners but on straights they are dead stable.

regards,
Manuel

[lavigna]

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Happy New Year all! Hope everyone had fun and all the best over this next year.

I am still waiting on some parts, so I have not been able to get much work done. However, I did finally mount the steering hydraulics. Everything seems lined up just right, and went smoothly enough. I need to order some M2 bolts/nuts for the permanent connection to the rudder. Sorry for the crap pictures in this thread, but my Nikon has been getting a new lens suitable for macro shots.

[Chrisg81983]

Looking good man

[nata2run]

Looking good Adam, did you sort out the drives??

[lavigna]

Thanks. Well, as for the drives, as Manuel states above, I must assume the angle of the hull transom, and therefore the forward section of the drives is ok. I have found some photos of other C5009 hulls and they seem to have an angle as well, although it does not seem as severe as mine. The transom on the right side of the boat is more severe than the left, but the difference is not huge. Still, I am not thrilled about this, and did not expect this from this hull, but I think it will be just fine in the end.

I am still waiting on some cf plates to arrive so I can cut out reinforcements for the upper mount of the drives, and finally be done with them, lol.

[lavigna]

Update on the build: I had been waiting on some material, so I had not got a lot done.

Drives: I got the drives fully installed. I noticed that HPR sent me (1) 16mm nut and (1) 17mm nut for my drives. They both had the same inner diameter and threads, but the 16mm obviously fit better because it had better clearance to the bottom of the hull. I could not find another 16mm nut in the same threads, so I ended up cutting down the 17mm nut to match. I also drilled my holes for my upper drive supports, and got them torqued down. Drives are complete!

Rudder: The rudder is already done, but I cut out a piece of cf in a circle and secured it inside the circle area of the rudder support. I figured this would help waterproof, and looked kinda cool.

Water Pickups: After much thought, I decided to go with the flush mount water pickups from Kintec Racing (awesome site and fast shipping). I think they will flow more water than using a piece of bent brass tube. I really took my time cutting out the hull for the pickups. I want it to be very clean, and it is so easy to mess up. I have also spent a lot of time hand honing out the inside of the water pickups with a dremel tool. I want them to flow maximum water, so I have bored out the inlet and insides to make everything as smooth as possible. I dont have pictures of them yet, but will post once I do.

Electronics: I need to send Manuel a note and have him put together and order me an electronics package that will fit my goals for this boat. I also want to order some items from Nata for the interior layout. 9206092061920629206392064

[Chrisg81983]

Looks real good man what r your plans for electronics ? Kent is a great at making cf parts and vinyl. I alo wanted to let you know that a single brass tube flows amazingly well if installed correctly. It actually works better than most of the prefabricated aluminum ones that I tried.

[twissted]

looking good!

[lavigna]

Chris - I hear you on the brass tubes flowing better than the stock flush mounts. However, I have spent a ridiculous amount of time boring out and smoothing the insides of my 2 flush mounts so they will flow maximum water. The scoop and radius they now have just inside them should provide a lot of water flow. I Have compared them to some brass tubing, and with the limited thickness of the hull, I dont think I could get the same flow with brass tubing. Of course, this is all to be determined, lol. Plus, I like the look of the fush mounts when they are installed cleanly. It looks more scale to me. Here is a pic of a stock vs. modified flush mount. This does not show the work inside, but gives an idea of the increase in opening.

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[Chrisg81983]

Wow there is a big difference between the inlet holes. What you did should make a big diffence in water flow. Did you also bore the brass barb/water nipple on the other end (inside) ? I got much bettetr water flow by drilling them out. Looks great and thanks

[lavigna]

Got my water pickups finished, nearly. From the bottom they do not look as clean as I had hoped, but I can fix that a little by filling in the small seams around the perimeter. The important part is that they sit flush, and when I run my finger over them I cant feel anything. I had just enough clearance inside between the pickup barb and tunnel wall, to attach my water lines later.

This must be the worlds slowest build, but I am having fun with it.

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[twissted]

I hope that your system doesn't need this amount of cooling to keep the esc and motor in check. If it fails your out a bunch of money. I like the brass tubes for max cooling but found that I was pushing the motors to hard even with good cooling. I learned alot also that some motors just run hot and are better as paper weights than being a boat motor. All said, you have a great boat and it's nice to look at.

[lavigna]

I dont plan on running a very 'hot' system. I want a reliable system that get me to the 80mph range max. I dont know much about electronics setup, and will likely have Manuel order me a system that he recommends. However, I want my cooling system to be as efficient as possible, just like everything else on my boat. Thanks Twissted!

[ManuelW]

Hi,

water intake looks pretty decent. To improve it remove the litte edge at the front when the aluminium part ends. Try to smoothen that and extend the grove a little to the hull (just 2-3mm are enough). There should be no step or edge from the bottom surface of the boat to the inner surface of the water inlet.

regards,
Manuel