26 Twin Cat

[SJFE]

This is my last build of the year. I have 90 days untill my son is born & everying thing I'm running this year has to be done before that. All my parts are in transit. This is going to be a 2s-2p boat. Powered by a set of X-power 380 6turn XL's @ 3860kv (28x68mm). I opted for small 70amp aircraft esc's. A set of proboat outdrives will be placed behind the tunnel. I found some other neet stuff that will be pictured later. The hull was provided by Diegoboy and the hatch & hull clean up was done by Mich Maniac. I will have pictures later on today. I will start the drive line when my OSE order arives this comming week. I am going to attempt to have fun with this one. Wish me luck.

[goldendesign04]

good luck! sounds like a fun one

-Wayne

[Mich. Maniac]

WHAT??? ALL that time and work and he isnt even gonna use it! Aint that a B. Nothing against you Tom, Im glad its getting built but just would have liked to seen hiis adjustable strut system on the M5 build. Maybe he found something to suit the boat a little better.

sorry, just a shocker, GOODLUCK MAN! CANT WAIT TO SEE IT FLY!

[Stealth Assassin]

What hull Is It Tom? Any pics?

[Diegoboy]

WHAT??? ALL that time and work and he isnt even gonna use it! Aint that a B. Nothing against you Tom, Im glad its getting built but just would have liked to seen hiis adjustable strut system on the M5 build. Maybe he found something to suit the boat a little better.

sorry, just a shocker, GOODLUCK MAN! CANT WAIT TO SEE IT FLY!

I'm sorry Mike. All the recent events in my life have forced me to shuffle projects around. I still have unfinished projects sitting on the shelf that have been waiting for a year or more.

Police Boat
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2148-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2148.jpg)

Hydrofoil
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_1445-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_1445.jpg)

Vegas Convert
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2149-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2149.jpg)

BL Kyosho Surfer
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2150-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2150.jpg)

[Diegoboy]

Bangka Boat
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2151-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2151.jpg)

The H&M M1 supercat S
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2152-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2152.jpg)

...and of course the Mini-V for Ira
http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2153-sm.jpg (http://www.diegoboy.com/misc/100_2153.jpg)

Tom also traded me parts to get the M1 closer to completion too.
I told Tom that I felt like a heel for trading the M5:(

Sorry again Mike

[Mich. Maniac]

Oh, dont take it wrong, like im said im glad it will be built and built well at that. Im glad I have been able to meet you guys even just over forum. It has brought me deeper into this hobby at a very fast rate. Tom will make it kewl and CRAZY COOL it sounds like!:rockon2:

[SJFE]

Thanks for your faith in my ability Sir :smile: . I am now on day 5 of walking by my desk, pausing, looking @ the Rio, shaking my head and heading back out to this infernal machine. 82 days and counting and I have JACK done.

[SJFE]

I did a quicky windshield for the pictures. The final product will have the twin canopy hatch. Nothing wrong with this one Strictly preference. She's a clean slate just waiting for a bunch of holes:rockon2:.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02053.jpg

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[Stealth Assassin]

What hull Is that? I like It... :spy:

[Diegoboy]

It's the Blackjack BL hull with a custom hatch. The stuffing tube hole and trasnsom holes have been filled in. She is SWEET!

[Stealth Assassin]

Ah... I knew I noticed the hull but, the hatch threw me off.

[Avanti]

the hatch is all wrong for that hull Tom is smart to change it, no offense to who ever spent the time to make it.

[Mich. Maniac]

the hatch is all wrong for that hull Tom is smart to change it, no offense to who ever spent the time to make it.

guess i wont be purchasing another SV!:thumbsdown: Perhaps you could explain since you do run some fast real speed boats:tongue_smilie:

[Avanti]

guess i wont be purchasing another SV!:thumbsdown: Perhaps you could explain since you do run some fast real speed boats:tongue_smilie:
he hull is based on a skater and that hatch is based on an mti. it's just not a match. The craftsmanship looks nice it just doesn't mate with that hull well

[SJFE]

I received the last delivery for this project today. I am heading out to the shop to work in this and the Rio in a bit. I hope to get the esc's cooled and water proofed tonight. I am impressed with the little 380xl's. The are about 20 grams lighter than feigao s motors. I am hoping the longer rotor will provide a little more torque along with the higher rpm. Note the clear water jackets on them inthe boxes. I am ordering heatsynk & fan setups for the exposed end of the motors. Not unlike what I ran in the jolly with the Feigao motors. I'm hoping to get started on the twin motor mount tonight . This is all while I fab the reverse gill bracket for the Rio. Wish me luck.

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[calcagno45]

Thats some long little motors. You plan on running 7.4V to each right?

Nice setup. How far apart did you plan to mount the drivetrains? I notice you said something about a double motor mount so I assume fairly close together??

[SJFE]

The drives will be behind the tunnel as close together as I can get them with 40mm props on for spacing. Yes each system will run on 2s-1p 25c polly rc packs. I will be cutting those props down a bit for the first couple test runs. I want to run K40s but I dont know if I will be able to.

[calcagno45]

Shouldnt double the torque allow you to be able to run more thrust, ie the larger props?

[SJFE]

I am not sure of anything with this one. No one has used any of these parts or install twins in this hull yet. I have quite a few bucks invested so I am taking no chances.

[Mich. Maniac]

This is gonna be a rocket! The transom should be plenty strong with the torque. I would be more worried about the hull bottom where the motors mount, it seemed pretty thin and weak. I imagine with the twins it might even corner well.

[SJFE]

Yeah it may turn well we will see. I am putting down some suport under the mounts. I did get the mount drilled tonight. Tomorrow I will get it installed.

[SJFE]

I had a good morning/afternoon. I got the motor mount done & started the outdrive's mount. The tunnel got reinforced with some medium cloth & 1/8th ply. I attempted to bend the O/D mount so that the O/D's would line up on center with the rotor out put shafts. As you can see in the pictures I'm close. I started slotting the lower mount holes for drive ajustment. The wifey woke up and It's break time untill she leaves for work. By the end of the night I'd like to have the motor mount, drives mounted , stuffing tubes bent, drilled & every thing set to cure. I'll have my hand full.

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[kahnen]

The Traxxas motor plate was a great idea! Nice, neat, and uniform.:rockon2:

[Eyekandyboats]

shoulda coulda woulda run the motors in the sponons

[Avanti]

shoulda coulda woulda run the motors in the sponons

yup thats what I was thinking last night when I saw this

[SJFE]

Spread your props out to far on a small hull and she will turn like a pile of s_ _ t.:wink: The drives should be as close to the inside corners of the tunnel on any cat on order to handel correclty. How would one do this if the motors are down in the tunnels?

[Avanti]

I use to build race cats; never in my life saw a full size cat with props in the tunnel.

[SJFE]

I didn't get as far as I would have liked tonight but I'm not complaing. I have allot of domestic work to do around here tomorrow. I should be able to get the stuffing tubes in and assemble the cables.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02113.jpg

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[SJFE]

We are not discussing a full size cat :smile:. Not much translates from full scale cats to electric models. This hull handles like crap to begin with. I bet this corrects some of the handeling issues.

[Mich. Maniac]

I use to build race cats; never in my life saw a full size cat with props in the tunnel.

Now you have!!!:tongue_smilie: Nice work SJFE. I am gonna try to take my camera down to the marina tomorrow and take a shot of a cat with twins mounted right next to eachother in the tunnel. Its been there for a week and I suspect they are open on sundays.

[SJFE]

Thanks Mike. I bet I will still need some type of turn fins. if I do I have diffrent place I wana try them. :smile: I'd like to see that picture for some reference.

[robby76]

nice work.
i think the skegs on the drives should keep you from putting any type of fin.

a suggestion here; on the left drive name it a boy and on the right drive name it a girl then when your child is born name the cat after him/her.

[Avanti]

looks good I hope it works out for you

wasn't there another guy that try the in the tunnel deal with a mean machine hull?

[SJFE]

Yes John I and I believe with the MM hull that configuration works out well. If I am not mistaken Steven is working on one. Maybe he has some pictures to post. On a side note I'm sorry of I came off a little harsh with my first couple reply's last night. I was a little cranky.. It was late, my hands where & are covered with cuts from aluminum shavings & I got epoxy on my couch. I very well may be wrong here. If I am and the setup is undrivable (god knows it won't be the first time) I'll cut out my HW buy a new hull and start over. ( don't forget stomping it) But I had to give it a shot.

[Doby]

Hi Tom;
I,m really lloking forward to this one being finished, I had the crazy idea of a triple SV powered blackjack about a year ago,,,so this will be close to my insanity:w00t:

Just one question though and I'm surprisd that no-one else mentioned this before,,,,but,,,,where is all the Carbon Fiber that graced your previous builds :confused2: :confused2:

[SJFE]

John I have it but reserve it for for build's I'm sure arent going to need major mod's. It's to expensive to be grinding back out. Not to mention all the saftey issues involved in cutting it in the house. I may do one last boat before I quit building. That one will get some nice CF work :wink:.

[Eodman]

Yeah I tried on the group 44 Jaguar with dual EP1's and it went pretty well stock!! Over the winter I went to 19t motors and moved them out on the sponsons just to see the difference! Haven't run it yet .... but I can tell you I don't like the look with the motors spread! We'll see soon!

[kal1b3r]

that is one hell of a project. nice mount by the way. i cant wait to see it put all together.

[SJFE]

I got the stuffing tubes done and set to cure. The pictures say it all. If I'm lucky I can get the cables assembled tomorrow & maybe start work on the ESC's. Oh and I had to raise the drives up about 3/16ths. The prop shafts would have been completely below the the bottom of the sponsens. Not a very good surface drive when it's submerged.

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[Mich. Maniac]

like im said im glad it will be built and built well at that. Tom will make it kewl and CRAZY COOL it sounds like!:rockon2:

TOLD YOU~~!!!:w00t: IN FRIKIN SANE MAN! Ha Ha Wonderfull work. Sorry havent got those pics of that boat. Its back to being cold and worthless outside. I see no need now anywho. Again man That IS AWESOME.

[SJFE]

Thanks man the positive comments keep me motivated :wink:. I wish I had more time to work on them. I am back logged like a moefoe. For once it's not lack of parts holding me up.

[Diegoboy]

SJFE,
Will the props counter rotate? I noticed that the flex cables are wound the same direction. Just curious.

[SJFE]

They where just threaded in there for alinment. I will spin one around before assembley. :wink:

[Flying Scotsman]

Looking good Tom, listen to your heart.

Douggie

[Steven Vaccaro]

This is a cool build! Out of the box thinking. I can't wait to see it run.

[SJFE]

Out of the box thinking.

I am so far out of the box I'd need GPS to find my way back:rofl: . I seem to remember a speach I typed not to long ago about not trying to reinvent the wheel...Yeah sureeeeeeee..lol As always thanks gentelman :smile:.

[justneedspeed]

I am so far out of the box I'd need GPS to find my way back:rofl: . I seem to remember a speach I typed not to long ago about not trying to reinvent the wheel...Yeah sureeeeeeee..lol As always thanks gentelman :smile:.

Like most of us here. We dont use GPS for maps we use it to measure speed. Then the boat flips (as men we laugh, then cry after seeing damage to wallet) which leaves us with no GPS to get back. LOL:spy:

[SJFE]

The pictures pretty much say it all. As you will see what I am attempting is straight foward. The DP270 is a heat transfering epoxy. I am counting on it to move heat into the copper tubing for removal by the water flow. I'm not expecting mu heat out of this power system but who knows where these esc's will wind up. After the cure I may have to pour in another layer. I was losing a little through the tape around the wires but not a a real lot.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02129.jpg

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[SJFE]

Next four pictures

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[SJFE]

there are quite a few

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02136.jpg

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[SJFE]

That wraping took about 20 minutes

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02141.jpg

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As you can see it's completely encapsulated. I shouldent have any issues with getting a little water on it....I Hope.

[robby76]

SJFE, thanks for sharing this project.
you learn something everyday here @ OSE.

? did you pour in a second coat to set the heat-sink on to make it one?
i am guessing you poured some thermal epoxy done before setting boards in; is that correct?
is one tube enough to do two ESCs?

[SJFE]

No problem Robet. This is a test really. If it works we all win :smile:
I got it all done in a single pour. I set the heat sink on top and let it settle. When I set the board in it was elevated enough to allow some clearence. I will snap a couple pictures of the finished product this evening. I may set the second one also. I'll use hatch tap next time. I want to try to limit the leakage just a bit. I lost about 15% of the epoxy.

[3434]

Tom,

after your tape job, pack the ends and around the wires with Play-Doh. that should help stop the leaks.

[SJFE]

finished off the esc's this evening. I used a devcon bulkhead to keep the DP from running all over. It took about an hour to build it up before it cleared the wires and I was able to tape it off. I remembered some one saying that when it comes to cooling mass has plays a large part. The more metal you have to absorb the heat is better. So this is what I am doing. I found some brass 3/16th ID tubing. I used it in the esc I worked today. This tubing is much larger that what I used in esc # 1. Now I am going to stack them. I'll use thermal tape between the heat sink on the bottom unit 2 to the top of # 1. The top unit (#2) will have the larger tubing to move more heat. The last steps will be to thermal epoxy a set of plates connecting them on both the sides & mount a fan to blow through the open ends. I'll feed them independently. The exhaust water from the bottom unit will go off to the motors before exiting the system. I'll do a "T" fitting between the two motors so both get equally heated water. There was some left over DP270 so I topped off unit 1. Thats why it's pictured. Tonight I am going to lay out steering & trim the stuffing tubes to match exactly before I assemble the cables.

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[SJFE]

Not to much to picture tonight. I laid out the steering then pulled everything out of the hull. The final coat of devcon was brushed in all the way back to the stern and on the transom plate to seel it up. In the process of pulling the cables I found out one of my drive pivot hubs is cracked and there for junk. I will need to order another entire drive from horizon to replace the part. It's good enough to set the boat up but will snap off during testing. I placed everything in the hull and it look like a good fit. I hae to decide weather I want through hull pickps or not. I am on the fence because I'd like the packs to side all the way back to the transom. They will fall a good half inch short if I put pickups in the bottom. After everything cures tonight I'll spray in a fresh coat of paint.

[SJFE]

I pulled her out of the shed this morning to find a nice cured paint job. I had to let go of the stacked esc idea. It caused to many problems. High center of gravity and steering lay out issues to name a couple. I will be placing the packs across the back of tunnel. I am cutting a nice plate for them in a few minutes. I will now have room for my pickups. I may install some rails in the sponsens that I can velcrow the esc's to and move them front to back for a little added CG ajustment. They have a little weight to them since the mods.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02169.jpg

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[SJFE]

Making some progress today. Taking a bit of a break for lunch before I hit it again untill Rach gets home. As you can see I have the battery plate in along with the servo & mount in. The steering is also getting some attention. I hope to get the pickups installed and start the plumbing after lunch. If I keep up this pace I may have it done by Wednesday.

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[Doby]

I knew it was just a matter of time before the CF made an apperance.:banana:

[Stealth Assassin]

That's coming together pretty sweet! :tiphat:

[SJFE]

Thanks fellas. I had a minor tragidy last night. I had to pull one of the water pickups back out and pretty good size chip came out of the inside left corner of the right sponsen with it. Nothing some 2-T DC didnt fix after a night of curing. I'll sand it down today and set an inside coat to reinforce it before bed tonight.

[SJFE]

My first order of business today was the repair. 5 minutes of sanding and she's good as new. I needed to repaint the tunnel anyway so no big deal. It was a little tricky wiring this system. I switched the UBEC over to 6v because the power drain on a single side of the system was bothering me. So wiring it in parallel to both systems was the way I went. I took the time to add a power switch also. Everything is soldered no but connectors. Personally I find them sloppy unreliable and hard to hide. I could have used some 3.5 bullets in the system but chose to keep the resistance and possible electrical noise factor to a minimum. Hiding all this will be a challenge but I have an idea. As you can see in the picture the system is quite busy. I may trim down the RX splitter some. I only spooled them up to 3/4 throttle. They are going rip:rockon2: Oh and yes I will be trimming those cooling tubes even...lol




Power Up Test (http://s42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/?action=view&current=Poweuptest.flv)





http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02193.jpg

[H&MWill]

I cant wait to see this thing go! Lookin great SJFE.

[SJFE]

Thanks Will :smile:

It looks like I have takin one for the team here. I wanted to test these cute little clear jackets from China. On the third piolet hole(yes 3!!!) it cut loose. I was even BABYING he drill down. Now warning just this mess all @ once. Now I either buy 4 silicone jackets to cover the entire can or go with air cooled heatsynks. I have to think on it. Sorry for the blury pictures my camera has been taking crap pictures up close latley.

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[Mich. Maniac]

Thanks fellas. I had a minor tragidy last night. I had to pull one of the water pickups back out and pretty good size chip came out of the inside left corner of the right sponsen with it. Nothing some 2-T DC didnt fix after a night of curing. I'll sand it down today and set an inside coat to reinforce it before bed tonight.

Hope it had nothing to do with the re-work the hull had. I also hope the cracked drive wasnt from me as well. Your doing a kick a$$ job with the build keeping it nice and simple and clean, This is the part im at with the twin cat and just keeping the esc wires and placement is the tricky part for me. making it practical and still clean looking. good luck

[SJFE]

Keeping the wires hidden is a real PIA on this one. I don't know which drive came from who but it took me 2 weeks to notice it. Just a hair line crack & "it" happens. The hull chip was purley my doing. When you stick a screw driver in a pick up tube in a pick up, which devcon as alread sat around and wrench it sidways....Bad things always happen. Temper Temper :wink:. I may ad some bullets to the system in order to run wires under the plate and motor mount. Shoulda done it first but oh well.

[crazzy maxx]

your crusin on this one...
it sounds great and sounds pretty fast.
keep the updates comming.

[SJFE]

I am @ 90% now. Just some trimming on the cables, paint and thats about it. I figured a video clip of the inside would give a better idea of the layout then a bunch of staked pictures.

Setup Clip (http://s42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/?action=view&current=SetupFlyby.flv)

[SJFE]

Ready for water. I just have to get the motors spinning in the proper rotation in the morning. I moved up the drag link. I didn’t like how it was placed out on the end of the pickups. The vinyl is just for some color. I haven’t decided on a graphic layout. I may just leave it and let how ever buys it picks their own.

Run Test (http://s42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/?action=view&current=Finaltest.flv)

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[Avanti]

can't wait to see video of it running

[ace028]

SJFE, this boat is looking sweet!!! I can't wait to see a vid of it on the water. I wish I had as much time to do all the cool stuff you do. I know that your time will soon be spent with your baby on the way, congrats by the way!:rockon2:

[SJFE]

Thanks guys. I will be out to the lake this evening. Look for video tonight.

[SJFE]

I really have to start taping the first 30-second runs up to the temp check. It seems to be all I get now a days. Long story short I believe the CCW shaft pumped some water up into the hull. The wiring for the bec got wet and melted. It held up long enough to get back in before it shorted. Upon returning home I cut out the toasted wires & pulled the esc's. I tested the BEC it was ok. Then I hooked an Rx pack to the bec and tested both Esc's & both where ok. I will need a tub test to verify the source of the water. I was sure the shrink-wrap along with the tubing would be plenty to keep water out. I used the proboat cable lube next time I will go back to the Prather.

As for the 20 or seconds of running I was impressed. It jumped right up on plane and ran straight. It looked to be running just a little wet on the first pass. It did turn on a dime the 3 laps I got out of it. I noticed it started tracking funny just before the system went into failsafe. When I scooped it up out of the water the left prop fell off. I'll need a jam nut or lock tight on that side. The battery was dead in the gps when I tried to turn it on. It looked about as fast as the jolly on the 2 or 3 passes I got. High 30s low 40s I guess. I'll get it sorted back out for this coming weekend.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e343/STOAK/DSC02248.jpg

[lonewolf]

Hate it when that happens. Water and elec = bad day. Skip the bec and run a rx pack. jm2c Next run will better. Live and learn I did alot of that this weekend lol. Dave

[calcagno45]

Sounds like you had a blast running her. kidding!!

Good luck on the water test.

No video I'm guessing. I can't wait to see.

How did you like those 380 motors?? Thats what I'm curious on.

[SJFE]

They where still only 50F after 20 to 30 seconds of wot with no cooling. To earley to tell but I think they will be able to be propped bigger.

[robby76]

on the clear jackets , since you have shatered 3, using one already shatered try heating up a drill bit or piece of brass tubing with a torch and see if maybe burning a hole into the jacket would work better.

on the water coming into the hull thru the cable, have you placed a silicon sleeve over the stuffing tube to cable inside hull just in front of motors?

your boat looks great.

one other thing, are the motors braced on backside opposite the mounting holes? with so much power if the motor was to shift due to cable torque pushing it, it could put a bind on the prop shaft. just a thought.

[SJFE]

Robert I covered both ends of the shaftes with shrink on the lowers and silicon tubing on the uppers. The motor mount is solid no torque flex. Ill pull the props and tub test it this week. The jackets are junk IMO. Silicon jackets are the way to go here.

[robby76]

on this forum i saw this in someones hull and i believe this could be the answer to the water slinging.
a picture is worth...ahhh i forget.

this is why i enjoy this OSE forum. people post pictures of their set ups and we all benefit from that. thanks to all.

[calcagno45]

Thats in txboatpilot's 10s Insane Cat. Good Idea

[txboatpilot]

on this forum i saw this in someones hull and i believe this could be the answer to the water slinging.
a picture is worth...ahhh i forget.

this is why i enjoy this OSE forum. people post pictures of their set ups and we all benefit from that. thanks to all.


That is a "plash sheild" for grease coming out of the f/shaft tube!!
Made out of a small piece of lexan, heated up and shaped..... Keeps the inside of the hull nice and clean... There is a piece of fuel tube over the f/shaft to keep out water...

Here are some close up pictures...

[Mich. Maniac]

I was thinking of building something like that for my cat. cept I was gonna use a sponge cause I know water will be a coming!

[Flying Scotsman]

Tom, a first class build and some unique ideas. How does it handle?

Douggie

[robby76]

txboatpilot thanks for your input on the "plash shield". had been wondering how to make a shield like that. now i know how to.

[blastoff]

Is there any way to see the pictures on this build ??? They all seemed to have been removed ???

[SJFE]

Sorry I maxed my photobucket account out and had to delete a bunch of images.