once a spartan always a spartan. leopard. yes now i can move on..

[electric007]

:banana:5604756048

[Rcforever27]

I was told venom lipos aren't good for this boat. It pulls too many Amps.... I myself have 4 venoms and stopped using them when i found tht out... Go on hobbyking.com and look for turnigy lipos ... 4000's or 5000's they have like a 40 or 45 c rating.... I have 4 4000's and love them... They are made for boats as they have 10 gauge wiring instead of 14 or 16 gauge..... Good luck ! Keep us posted!;)Also a couple guys on thus forum informed me that venom packs advertise the c ratings as say 40c but supposedly that's not accurate.... Turnigy lipos are rated i'n actual c ratings .....

[Rcforever27]

Also not sure if you're new too eletric boating , but boats pull about the same as a car does but the difference is boats "pull" the amps more continuous than cars.... Thus heating things up more, and quicker .... ;)

[electric007]

ok thanks.. i am new to electric boating.. and i will check out hobbyking..

[Rcforever27]

Good luck ! Check back here tomorrow and see if some other people post ... I kno "dag -nabit " is very informative and might have more answers than myself ... Happy boating and welcome too it....

[electric007]

ok. thanks will do.. and averything still works. motor and esc..

[dag-nabit]

Thanks for the kudos Scott, however I'm not sure they are entirely deserved :smile:

I'm probably not the most informed person for this particular problem, lipo batteries are still pretty new to me as well. Brushless55 or Diesel might be more experienced in this type of failure.

Apart from a dead short only a few things come to mind: 1. what was the C rating on the batteries. 2. Were the batteries balance charged. 3. How old were the batteries. 4. LVC not working or ignored.

Too low of a C rating will result in too much internal resistance under high load and resistance causes heat (should be minimum 30C on 5000mah batts)

If the batteries aren't balance charged one cell could be at a lower voltage than the rest and could become over discharged which can cause a failure.

Resistance increases in the cells as they age, old batteries could fail due to overheating caused by high resistance.

If the LVC isn't cutting in, or if you continue to run longer than it takes to run the boat to shore, you can over discharge the packs and have a failure.

Regardless the reason, it is a shame to see this damage to your boat.

Kevin

[electric007]

20c count. 30c burst. and yes they say they were balance. but one of the times it didnt. one of the cells was at 000. and it was not in the battery the fried. lvc was just under 3.8..
batteries were 2 1/2 weeks old. ran @ least once a day.. i did notice issues. with it. once the new setup was put in. it would not last 1min before it cut off.. new batts on the way. looking for new hull. motor esc still work. but then i think my esc might have a tic in it. probably should get another just incase.. it was a very good setup and very fast.
time to barry this hull.. or fram it.. lol!!

[Savage Skidoo]

Finnally got out on the new up-dated stock replacements for the spartan , 2 3s-5800 30c lipos and all stock waiting for OSE parts to arrive . WOW no isues :) ....yet , Thanks too all the testers here , ran my first two full packs .

[dag-nabit]

20c count. 30c burst. and yes they say they were balance. but one of the times it didnt. one of the cells was at 000. and it was not in the battery the fried. lvc was just under 3.8..
batteries were 2 1/2 weeks old. ran @ least once a day.. i did notice issues. with it. once the new setup was put in. it would not last 1min before it cut off.. new batts on the way. looking for new hull. motor esc still work. but then i think my esc might have a tic in it. probably should get another just incase.. it was a very good setup and very fast.
time to barry this hull.. or fram it.. lol!!

Most likely the source of your problems, too low C rating for this setup.

If the batteries can't discharge fast enough due to internal resistance they will heat up on you. Voltage can also drop which could explain the LVC kicking in early.

Try e-bay for a hull, I picked one up for $99 and it included the hatch. I also saw a couple on there for $230 that included all the hardware and the component tray, not sure how much damage you need to address.

Kevin

[Flame On]

I was told venom lipos aren't good for this boat. It pulls too many Amps.... I myself have 4 venoms and stopped using them when i found tht out... Go on hobbyking.com and look for turnigy lipos ... 4000's or 5000's they have like a 40 or 45 c rating.... I have 4 4000's and love them... They are made for boats as they have 10 gauge wiring instead of 14 or 16 gauge..... Good luck ! Keep us posted!;)Also a couple guys on thus forum informed me that venom packs advertise the c ratings as say 40c but supposedly that's not accurate.... Turnigy lipos are rated i'n actual c ratings .....

I have the Venoms. I've got two 2S and 4 3S but all mine are 50C. Now you've got me concerned about running the Venoms.
Should I sell these off and pick up the Turnigy's?

Also, LHS told me no Lipo's are waterproof except for one brand (can't remember name) but they were SUPER expensive. I'm not going to lie, I get myself into the "nose up death bob" sometimes. As far as the batteries go, how concerned should we be about that?

Anybody ever put styrofoam against the transom to help keep the rear up too?

[Flame On]

If the batteries aren't balance charged one cell could be at a lower voltage than the rest and could become over discharged which can cause a failure.

Kevin

Sorry if dumb question but I'm still kinda a newbie, but.... I've got the Venom Pro Charger. I tried to balance charge my 3S for the first time last week. When I checked on the charger after watching a movie one night... the charger was still running after 2 hours and 40 min. I figured I didn't set it right. Batteries weren't even warm to the touch, but been afraid to do it again. Since, I put it on Balance charge and have it show me the voltage for each cell, I see them even up to about the same within about 30 seconds. Then I cancel that and put it on regular charge. Usually takes 45min to 1:15hr. That about normal?

[dag-nabit]

I have the Venoms. I've got two 2S and 4 3S but all mine are 50C. Now you've got me concerned about running the Venoms.
Should I sell these off and pick up the Turnigy's?

Also, LHS told me no Lipo's are waterproof except for one brand (can't remember name) but they were SUPER expensive. I'm not going to lie, I get myself into the "nose up death bob" sometimes. As far as the batteries go, how concerned should we be about that?

Anybody ever put styrofoam against the transom to help keep the rear up too?

I have never run Venom Lipos but have a stack of Venom nimh batteries at home and they have been decent batteries. If you are running 50C rated batteries, and not having problems with them running hot, I wouldn't worry too much about them being Venom brand. It doesn't matter what product you talk about you can always find someone who says brand X is crap because they have had bad luck with that brand. You can also find someone who will swear that brand X the best brand on the market because they have had nothing but great luck with them.

Most batteries aren't water proof, but don't worry about it too much, simply getting them wet won't hurt them. If they get soaked, you do need to make an effort to drain as much water as possible out of the sleeve and allow them the opportunity to air dry well. If you store them wet or damp the connections will rust/corrode prematurely.

Some pieces of pool noodle, or pipe insulation foam, fitted in along the sides is not a bad idea. it can help keep your batteries in place and provide extra floatation. Taping the hatch also works great, we always tape our hatches and have never had one pop off, and when we flip the boat just floats with very little water getting inside. (note: I modified the back of hatch by removing the two tabs that stick out, this makes it easier to tape securely)

Kevin

[dag-nabit]

Sorry if dumb question but I'm still kinda a newbie, but.... I've got the Venom Pro Charger. I tried to balance charge my 3S for the first time last week. When I checked on the charger after watching a movie one night... the charger was still running after 2 hours and 40 min. I figured I didn't set it right. Batteries weren't even warm to the touch, but been afraid to do it again. Since, I put it on Balance charge and have it show me the voltage for each cell, I see them even up to about the same within about 30 seconds. Then I cancel that and put it on regular charge. Usually takes 45min to 1:15hr. That about normal?

I'm not familiar with that particular charger, but I'm going to assume the basic function of lipo chargers is similar.

First. The time it takes to charge a battery is dependent on many factors, but most notable is the output amperage of the charger. if you have a 5000mah hr (5 amp hr) battery, and your charger outputs at 5 amps charge rate, it will take 1 hr to charge a fully discharged battery. In reality it will take less time because your lipo battery should never be fully discharged if your lvc is working correctly.

So your 45 min to 1:15hr charge time sounds pretty normal, and probably is, but without knowing the size of your batteries and the output of your charger, we can't be certain.

The charger I have can be connected to a computer and you can graph the charge cycle. I have observed, depending on how "off balance" the cells are, that the balance cycle can be fairly quick (only a few minutes) to fairly lengthy (30-45 minutes).

Watching the trend during balancing, if the cells are way off balance, the charger cycles between charge mode and discharge mode as it brings the cells into a balanced voltage state. In other words, it discharges to drop voltage in cells with higher voltage readings, then charges to bring lower voltage cells up to balanced voltage.

It does this slowly over many cycles.

I would say have faith in your charger and give it the time to do it's thing.

Also, I have often seen it recommended that you only have to balance charge every 3 - 5 charge cycles. I balance charge my batteries every cycle. I find if I do the balance cycle usually only takes 3-5 minutes longer (on my charger) and with the way boats draw juice, I think it is good practice to keep the batteries always in close balance.

Kevin

[Flame On]

Dag - Great stuff! Exactly what I need. I appreciate your quick response and expertise.

[bigemike]

venom lipos suck, trinity, gen ace, and tunigy have always served me well and ran true. The problem with the venom is that you will puff them up if you strain them too hard, they are like the b grade tunigy batteries at 4x the price

[Rcforever27]

Agreed bigemike, but venom batteries are ok for cars, not boats, however i'n kevins response it's personal experience , if your not having any heat issues, no puffing , and no fires with your batteries and are happy with run times. Then run those batteries , but when you re pulling high amps , usually with high kv motors and big props and or more pitch , things heat up and could cause problems.... Remember nonthing lower than 30 c , and that might be even too low , but I'm being generous... Just watch temps on everything ESP the lipos.... Good luck guys and happy boating ...;)

[Flame On]

I tend to agree w/ Dag. I think the C rating was too low on Electric007's boat. When I first went out and just grabbed some 6S lipos at my LHS, I didn't pay attn to the C rating or exactly know what it was. Ended up with a 20C. Got puffy and hot. Did some reading, figured out what the C rating actually ment. Called Traxxas and asked what they recommend for the stock boat. They said minimum 35C, and the higher the better. Picked up these newer 50C Venoms at same LHS and have run these HARD as you can see in this video and they come out room temp or a little warm to the touch and no puffiness so far. So I think if you have the right C and even a little higher (in case the mfg is fudging a little on the C rating) you should be good. I still plan on trying some Turnigy's next though. Sounds like everybody likes those. Probably wont be long before I drop more in the lake pulling the boat off the lake into the big boat, like I did last weekend. I hate it when that happens!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIoXnXZd_mE

[dag-nabit]

Flame On, Great video and great choice of tunes to go with it. :thumbup1:

I never thought of chasing the boat with RC, now we have a challenge for next weekend.

I looked up your charger on the web and it appears to be a very good charger, let it work it's way through a balance charge cycle. It has some user settings, and you have the capability to hook up to a computer to trend your charge. If you choose to use a computer, be sure to use a laptop that can be transported to the area you use to safely charge your lipos. It is not safe to charge your lipos in the house next to your desktop computer.

Kevin

[Rcforever27]

Same here right on!!

[Flame On]

Flame On, Great video and great choice of tunes to go with it. :thumbup1:

I never thought of chasing the boat with RC, now we have a challenge for next weekend.

I looked up your charger on the web and it appears to be a very good charger, let it work it's way through a balance charge cycle. It has some user settings, and you have the capability to hook up to a computer to trend your charge. If you choose to use a computer, be sure to use a laptop that can be transported to the area you use to safely charge your lipos. It is not safe to charge your lipos in the house next to your desktop computer.

Kevin

Thanks for the props (no pun intended). Ya, way more fun I think chasing the boat. I like to chase the kids in our cove on their jet-skis too.

Thanks for diggin around on my charger. I've gotten home now and actually tried the balance charge idea again and it went fine this time. Took about 40 min. So it does work. Not sure why it took so long last time. Ya, I'm with ya on where to charge and having the laptop close if I decide to do that. But I'm good there. Got a work bench just inside my garage door with a AC plug, so I plug it up there and stretch the cord out in the driveway. So if it's catches fire, nothing to burn but concrete. Thanks again. Gonna try and get back on the lake one evening this weekend myself. Right now though... got all my PVC parts and gonna try and build myself a stand/carrier. This should be fun...

[electric007]

great stuff... waiting on a new hull!