Aquacraft Mini Rio (prop change - cavitation question)

[juelze]

Hi there,

So I'm a complete n00b when it comes to RC boats, in fact, this is my first RC boat. As the subject alludes to, my Rio cavitates quite a bit. I read online to try the Octura x431 prop and I've ordered a couple of them, and they should be in the mail in the coming weeks. My question is what is the right process for removing the prop? I see there is a little nut on the end, but I'm not sure what size wrench/socket I'll need. Any suggestions for making this swap as easy as possible? I'm hoping that once I get the prop swapped I'll minimize the cavitation problems.

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Juelze

[faqcya]

I'm not sure of the exact size of the nut either. I had a 5.5mm wrench that did the job. I haven't changed mine yet but I know it works. Once you remove the nut and the washer just pull off the prop and put on the new one and reassmble and you should be good to go. As fas as whether it helps with cavitation I can't tell you because personally I put in a electrifly T-400 motor and it fixed my problem.

[juelze]

Thanks Faqcya! One question, can I keep everything stock and just remove the old motor and put in the Electrifly T-400? If so, this is the motor you're talking about, correct?

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXWK45&P=FR

Is it a simple swap that maybe requires some basic soldering?

Thanks,
Juelze

[rcdougie]

I put in the Duratrax VR3 and you will have to add your own connectors. I used 3.5mm bullets. Simple, effective and cheap. Noticeable increase in speed and less cavitation and works good with the stock prop. I tried a 32mm prop and it was good but the electronics getting fairly warm.

[juelze]

I put in the Duratrax VR3 and you will have to add your own connectors. I used 3.5mm bullets. Simple, effective and cheap. Noticeable increase in speed and less cavitation and works good with the stock prop. I tried a 32mm prop and it was good but the electronics getting fairly warm.

So what's the easiest way to get this mini Rio up and going? I don't need it to go crazy fast, but I'm looking for the easiest upgrade. I've never owned any other RC devices aside from little toy RCs growing up, so when it comes to modding I'm clueless and looking for help. If I could remove the stock motor and put in another motor it sounds like there is some basic soldering involved and that's it? I've also heard of people using piano wire instead of the flex cable shaft to increase speed.

Juelze

[rcdougie]

All I had to do was solder the bullet connectors and take the metal sleeve off the stock motor to make the motor clamp fit better. Basic soldering is required but not hard at all. I have the stock driveline so not sure about the piano wire upgrade or know if its even necessary.


So what's the easiest way to get this mini Rio up and going? I don't need it to go crazy fast, but I'm looking for the easiest upgrade. I've never owned any other RC devices aside from little toy RCs growing up, so when it comes to modding I'm clueless and looking for help. If I could remove the stock motor and put in another motor it sounds like there is some basic soldering involved and that's it? I've also heard of people using piano wire instead of the flex cable shaft to increase speed.

Juelze

[faqcya]

Yeah just some basic soldering skills are required. Honestly the most difficult part I found was putting the 2 screws that hold the motor in place back in. Thats just because I have large hands and I have a difficult time working them into enclosed places. Its also a little tricky to get the water outlet back in place but nothing to difficult. I did do the piano wire upgrade use a .047 if your going to do it. But to be honest its only necessary if you plan to use a brushless motor. You really don't have to buy anything more then the motor which you can use either electrifly t-400 or the Duratrax VR3. Then just desolder the wires leading to your existing motor and solder the new motor up. I can't remember but make sure you look to see if the motor is marked somehow for your red positive wire so that the motor spins in the right direction and the timing is set correctly. Thats it a $10 motor and you'll notice a huge difference. One more thing once you get it running if it starts to cavitate real bad make sure the prop and rudders aren't dragging anything. Any little thing thats dragged seems to make the MR wanna cavitate. Makes me wonder why Aquacraft never upgraded this boat with a better motor instead of dealing with a lot of unhappy customers.

[rcdougie]

Just a side note here.... I burned up my VR3 today. It had about 5 runs on it and it quit running and was hot. After the motor cooled down it would run, slowly, and feels like a magnet maybe came off the can... Really rough feeling with noticeable drag. In my opinion it needs better cooling than the stock MR cooling. Something that makes direct contact with the motor. Maybe the t400 is better?

[juelze]

So, swapping out the stock motor for a VR3 requires no upgrade to the wiring? I got the Octura X431 installed today so we'll see how it does this weekend. I've heard that a simple battery pack upgrade can definitely help prolong run time and increase speed, but I've heard you need to upgrade the wiring for that as well. I can solder fine, just not sure if I'd need to take the battery pack apart or ESC to get to the wiring. Essentially, I want to do some basic upgrades to make it quicker and last longer in regards to run time without having to do major surgery. Is there a battery upgrade where I can just remove the old one and put in a new one (maybe a NIMH with more oomph and capacity) without having to rewire the thing?

[wparsons]

If you're going to the trouble of upgrading the motor, battery, wiring, prop, etc I would suggest going brushless. You can do it for a reasonable cost, and it will run much faster and cooler.

I upgraded a relatives with a 3600kv 2040 motor, 30a esc, cheap 2.4ghz tx/rx, 2s 1300mah lipos and an x432 metal prop. It's much faster than it was with the VR3 motor (which broke a brush after half a dozen runs, and it had a full cooling jacket on it!) and the motor comes in cool every run. It runs for longer than the stock setup does on a charge as well.

[juelze]

If you're going to the trouble of upgrading the motor, battery, wiring, prop, etc I would suggest going brushless. You can do it for a reasonable cost, and it will run much faster and cooler.

I upgraded a relatives with a 3600kv 2040 motor, 30a esc, cheap 2.4ghz tx/rx, 2s 1300mah lipos and an x432 metal prop. It's much faster than it was with the VR3 motor (which broke a brush after half a dozen runs, and it had a full cooling jacket on it!) and the motor comes in cool every run. It runs for longer than the stock setup does on a charge as well.

That sounds like a good idea; however, I'm a complete n00b when it comes to the world of RC. I spent $100 on this boat and it has the dreaded cavitation problem. I really would like to solve that and possibly get it to go faster and have longer run time but it seems that everyone has their own idea of what to do with the Mini Rio, such as:

* Upgrade motor to Electrifly T400 or VR3
* Use .047" piano wire drive upgrade
* Use Octura x431 prop, Turnigy prop, or SW26 prop
* Use an upgraded NIMH battery or use LIPOS
* Upgrading requires a larger gauge wire
* Upgrading does not require larger gauge wire
* Use one rudder
* Using stock ESC with lipos cause glitching
* etc, etc

If would be one thing if I had someone in town who could show me the ropes, but for me to figure any of this stuff I'm going to need some hand holding. Which sucks for me, because I doubt most of you (and I can't blame you) would want to hand-hold on some of these upgrades. There's about 20+ different ways of upgrading this boat and skill level needed to do the mods varies greatly.

-Juelze

[wparsons]

IMO, stay away from the VR3. The brushless motor replaced one that died after a couple days of running.

He ran 1300mah 2s lipos on the stock motor and the VR3 with the stock ESC/RX and wiring without any issues.

The VR3 ran on a 27mm plastic prop, the stock motor was with a sw26 prop.

x431 and 2s lipo should totally solve your cavitation issue and get you more speed, you'll just have to time your runs since the stock ESC doesn't have a LVC for lipo packs.

[juelze]

I
x431 and 2s lipo should totally solve your cavitation issue and get you more speed, you'll just have to time your runs since the stock ESC doesn't have a LVC for lipo packs.

So is the 2s LIPO completey plug and play? Do I need to upgrade the wiring? If I went the 2s LIPO route, it'd probably be a good idea to install a LVC as well, correct?

-Ryan

[wparsons]

You'll have to change the plug on either the ESC or the lipo, unless you happen to find one that's the right size and comes with the same connector.

My relative's ran on the stock wiring, but there's no harm in upgrading it. It runs bigger wires now, but that's because the brushless ESC had bigger wire stock.

You'll either have to time your runs, or get a lipo shield/LVC. The lipo shield/LVC is the safest bet.

[juelze]

You'll have to change the plug on either the ESC or the lipo, unless you happen to find one that's the right size and comes with the same connector.

My relative's ran on the stock wiring, but there's no harm in upgrading it. It runs bigger wires now, but that's because the brushless ESC had bigger wire stock.

You'll either have to time your runs, or get a lipo shield/LVC. The lipo shield/LVC is the safest bet.

Ok, right now the stock MR uses Tamiya plugs to connect the motor and the battery pack. If I got the 1300ma 2s LIPO and it comes with Tamiya plugs I should cut those off the battery and the motor and solder on some Deans connectors instead? Also, any recommendation on a good 1300ma 2s LIPO and a LIPO shield?

[wparsons]

Tamiya plugs aren't great at all, but at the amperage needs of the stock motor they'll be fine. You'll have a hard time finding a lipo pack with a tamiya plug on it though.

This is the same pack my relative's mini rio runs on, and you'll also need a lipo charger.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9165__Turnigy_1300mAh_2S_20C_Lipo_Pack.html

I've used both these chargers and both work great. The Turnigy one requires a 12v power supply, the other one plugs right into the wall.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__6478__IMAX_B6_AC_Charger_Discharger_1_6_Cells_GE NUINE_.html

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__7028__Turnigy_Accucel_6_50W_6A_Balancer_Charger_ w_accessories.html

[juelze]

Tamiya plugs aren't great at all, but at the amperage needs of the stock motor they'll be fine. You'll have a hard time finding a lipo pack with a tamiya plug on it though.

This is the same pack my relative's mini rio runs on, and you'll also need a lipo charger.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9165__Turnigy_1300mAh_2S_20C_Lipo_Pack.html

I've used both these chargers and both work great. The Turnigy one requires a 12v power supply, the other one plugs right into the wall.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__6478__IMAX_B6_AC_Charger_Discharger_1_6_Cells_GE NUINE_.html

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__7028__Turnigy_Accucel_6_50W_6A_Balancer_Charger_ w_accessories.html


Am I missing something here? Why does that battery pack have 2 connectors?

And thanks SO much for your continuing help with my idiotic questions. It's very much appreciated!

-Juelze

[wparsons]

One connector is for power, the other is for balancing while charging (or discharging with a charger).

[juelze]

One connector is for power, the other is for balancing while charging (or discharging with a charger).

Gotcha. So, put Deans connectors the proper set of wires on that battery pack, then cut of the Tamiya connector on the stock ESN and put a Deans connector on it and connect it up? I imagine the LVC switch would be connected between the stock ESC and the battery pack? Any recommendation on a LVC to use with the battery pack you recommended? As for the chargers you recommended, would the one that requires 12volt work fine with one of these?

http://www.amazon.com/Powerline-Original-Power-0900-56-Enhanced/dp/B000QFIS12/ref=pd_cp_cps_1

Just to reiterate (I'm anal retentive, can't you tell? LOL), to do the LIPO swap I can keep everything stock and do the following:

1. Purchase Deans connectors (Would these be finef? http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=002153375&I=L5KX3903&P=K and hook one up to the ESC and one up to this LIPO battery (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9165__Turnigy_1300mAh_2S_20C_Lipo_Pack.html)

2. Setup some LVC between the stock ESC/RX and the battery.

3. Use one of the chargers you mentioned to charge it.

4. Have fun?

Thanks again!

-Juelze

[wparsons]

That power supply won't have nearly enough juice, you'll want a 12v 10a supply for it to be much use.

This will work as a LVC, but to be honest I think the cutoff voltage is way too low. I like mine to be above 3.7v resting, which usually won't happen if they are at 3.2v under load.

http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=de-liposhld-32

[juelze]

That power supply won't have nearly enough juice, you'll want a 12v 10a supply for it to be much use.

This will work as a LVC, but to be honest I think the cutoff voltage is way too low. I like mine to be above 3.7v resting, which usually won't happen if they are at 3.2v under load.

http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=de-liposhld-32

Crap. That's the power supply I'm using to charge my MR. It seems to do the trick, but I imagine using a proper 12v 10a power supply is what I'll need to purchase. Hmmm, so I should find a LVC that has the cutoff at 3.7v or higher?

[wparsons]

It all depends on the charger's needs to power it. You can get away with a ~5a power supply, but it might get hot.

[juelze]

It all depends on the charger's needs to power it. You can get away with a ~5a power supply, but it might get hot.

Octura x431 TOTALLY solved the cavitation problem!

[wparsons]

IMO, run it as is then!

As long as you're having fun, just keep it as is.

If you decide you want something faster, I'd suggest this: http://www.aquacraftmodels.com/boats/aqub1805-minimono/index.html It handles the power better, and won't require fiddling to get right like an upgraded mini rio will.

[juelze]

IMO, run it as is then!

As long as you're having fun, just keep it as is.

If you decide you want something faster, I'd suggest this: http://www.aquacraftmodels.com/boats/aqub1805-minimono/index.html It handles the power better, and won't require fiddling to get right like an upgraded mini rio will.

Thanks again for all your help! I'm going to keep it as is with the Octura because it gets on plane instantly and runs great. You made this guy and his 3yo son very happy! Only problem I had was that it's pretty easy to flip it over. Thank god for paddle boats!

That Mini Mono looks sweet!

Thanks again for everyones help!

-Juelze

[wparsons]

If you're finding it easy to flip, definitely don't add more power then! It'll just make it much easier to flip :D

[juelze]

BTW, I contacted the group over at www.fastrcboats.com regarding the MR hop-up kit. They want $83 + s/h for the complete kit excluding the battery and battery charger. What a rip-off! You can get a whole new boat with a BL setup for $140 from Aquacraft!

[wparsons]

^^ I don't think their kit includes a new TX/RX either, I think it's just the motor, mount, ESC and prop.

[juelze]

BTW, I contacted the group over at www.fastrcboats.com regarding the MR hop-up kit. They want $83 + s/h for the complete kit excluding the battery and battery charger. What a rip-off! You can get a whole new boat with a BL setup for $140 from Aquacraft!

You're right. Better off buying the Mini Mono for that amount of cash.

Well, today I was going to grease up my flex cable...looks like I'll be buying a new flex cable and coupler. Doh! I put a little loc-tite on one of the grub screws and I can't get it out now. Those dang things are soo easy to round out. I heard someone talking about cap screws I ordered these:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006NAN5S

I'm hoping they'll work. At least I can remove the coupler from the motor. I'll just have to cut the cable and pull it all out after I get my new parts. If those cap screws I listed won't work, any recommendations? I've read about someone else who has used the with great results.

-Juelze