Miss Bud Gen 1 Conversion

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have a Proboat Miss bud straight shaft that I am converting to electric and flex drive. I was wondering how you guys got rid of the engine mount that are from the old nitro engine? I am going to be using parts from the Miss Elam to convert it to flex drive. I will be running a Turnigy 120a, Feigao 8XL on 4s with a x440 prop. If you guys could help me out with this I would appreciate it.

Thanks, Chris

(This is not my boat, its just to explain what I mean)

[JimClark]

yank it out

[TRXRUSTLER]

With what? I don't want to break the hull, its pretty thin walled.

Chris

[JimClark]

You don't need it in there electric motor mounts are totally different

[electric]

If it is epoxied in there. Break out the hair dryer and heat it up then pull it loose. Someone else told me about this and I really had my doubts, but I tried it and darn if does not work! It seems that at a certain temp the glue fails and lets loose. I just used a hair dryer(as suggested) and without a lot of time it worked.

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have a mount that I bought on here (OSE) and I need to remove the old one out of there to install the new one.

Thanks for the hair dryer tip will try it when i get home.

[blackcat26]

You gonna cut out the radio box also? Think it's gonna be in the way. If you are carbon fiber the floor from the fron to the transom, those hulls are flimsy compared to the elam/formula.

[forescott]

I'll be watching your thread colesly! I'm doing the same conversion with the same motor/esc. in an old miss llumar!:popcorn2:

[TRXRUSTLER]

The radio box and nitro engine mounts are gone. I have the servo and rudder installed, I am waiting on the flex shaft and stuffing tube. It should be here on thursday. I am going to take some pics tomorrow. Where do you get the carbon fiber mate?

Thanks, Chris

[domwilson]

You can leave them in and use this type of mount..
http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=cen-bj16

[TRXRUSTLER]

Its too late for that, its already ripped out. I bought this one http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=ose-80080


Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

Heres some pics so far.

[blackcat26]

Is your servo rod going over the original hole? Gonna be hard to seal that off. I'd shoot it thru the original hole thats there and slap a good ole rubber boot on her. Also if its not too late try and set the servo where it's pulling the wire for right hand turns and not pushing it.

[TRXRUSTLER]

I will move the rudder to the left side of the boat so I could use the original hole and make the servo pull when it turns right. Thanks for the info.

UPDATE: Heres some pics, I just switched everything over.

Chris

[blackcat26]

That will work much better!

[TRXRUSTLER]

Thanks, For the tip.

Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have the the strut, flex shaft, and motor mount all mocked up and almost ready to be epoxied in. I just have to buy a brass stuffing tube when I get ready to start epoxy-in. I have the motor mount just CA glued in so I could see where I was going put it. I still have to cut the flex cable down a little bit. What is the best way to cut a flex cable? I was wondering what collet I need to buy, it is the Proboat miss elam flex cable? I need a 5mm to (Proboat flex cable diameter). I have my Turnigy 120a marine ESC on its way so that should be here in a week or so.

Thanks, Chris

[blackcat26]

To cut the flex I use a side of "side cutters" meant for wire they work great. Just snap and it's cut! I'd buy the Octura short coupler for it sold on this site (much better than proboat's) Does the bottom of the hull have a recessed square for the top of the strut to go in?

[TRXRUSTLER]

No, this is the first gen with the straight shaft, I was going to take epoxy and smooth the transition from the hull to the strut. Will this one fit the proboat flex cable I'm using? http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=oct-ocfhe5mm15S

Chris

[blackcat26]

Transition-wise that would be fine but you are putting a strut that too deep from the factory even deeper. If you are looking for all out performance this will hurt ya.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Do you think I could take a dremel and make a inset for it to sit in? I could lay fiberglass inside the hull to compensate for the indent.

Chris

[blackcat26]

You need to bolt that strut to something I think. Maybe a pc. of ply inside the hull glassed in and then you could use the 4 screws to hold her on.

[RCKong]

Say, blackcat is right I've built one of these too, and you might want to take a step back and maybe look at putting an adjustible strut on the transom. This has alot to do with how the boat runs in the water. Might want to CF the bottom inside, could save alot of grief later.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Someone told me that the carbon fiber is still going to flex, so he said that it isn't worth doing. Also If I buy an ajustable strut then I have to buy a new flex shaft/ prop shaft.

[blackcat26]

The hull I converted was really flimsy. It does need some support whether it be glass or carbon. Yes you will need a new flex/prop shaft if you go that route. If you are happy with a slightly slower boat then don't even worry about it. I always try to push the limit it seems.

[RCKong]

well say if you wreck, the CF might prevent your motor going thru the bottom of the hull. There is little room inside the boat to move things around, to make it ride better, and there is no way to adjust the strut.

[TRXRUSTLER]

That makes sense with the carbon fiber, I guess I will have to get some, also can I use the Z-poxy PT-40 resin with the CF? I think I am just going to try to make what I have work and see how it does. I am planing on buying a miss elam hull anyway so these parts should just transfer over. I just figured that I got this hull for free and wanted to see if I could make it work. Thanks for all the help guys I will post more pics when I get any further.

Chris

[RCKong]

you can use glass cloth too, with resin/hardener kit that works well for $20 ACE Hdwr. Steven sells a speedmaster sport 20 3/16 strut. That's the one I like, it puts the prop off the strut a little.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Should I buy the flat bottom one? Also what flex cable should I buy?

Thanks, Chris

[RCKong]

I would get the round one. stay away from flat surfaces that can plane out. I even round the lead edge of my rudders. A good flexshaft for that size is .150 3/16. The setup you are going to put in it will be a good one for that boat. I run the same thing in my UL-1, it runs solid and fast.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Correct me if I'm wrong, I thought it was better to get a 1/8 prop shaft because there is more prop varieties. Would this work?
http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=ose-1075

Chris

[RCKong]

No... that set up will pusha Grim Racer 4057( what I recommend) up to a 645 for speed runs, with ease. just keep an eye on your temps with the bigger props. Try and keep all temps (batt,ESC,Motor) around 100*F... and it will fly !!!:thumbup1:

[TRXRUSTLER]

So is it better to get an all 3/16 shaft or am I ok to get the 3/16 stepped to 1/8, Sorry I'm just getting confused.

Chris

[blackcat26]

You want the 3/16 all the way. Straight staft no steps.

[TRXRUSTLER]

ok thanks

[RCKong]

forget the 1/8

[TRXRUSTLER]

Is this prop ok to start with, Grimracer 4057 with my setup? I will just buy this: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXVXS5&P=ML and this http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXVXS9&P=M

Chris

[RCKong]

yep those will work, better be ready when you light that thing up...:rockon2:

[TRXRUSTLER]

I can't wait, but I have to finish paying my layaway for my mamba monster system for my truggy before I spend money on my hydro. Thanks for answer all my questions, you guys have been a real help.

Thanks, Chris

[RCKong]

ya, keep up new pics on the thread if you can and post some video of it rippin up the lake is plenty of payback:cool2:

[TRXRUSTLER]

Will do. :thumbup1:

Thanks, Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

What thickness glass should I use inside my hull?

Thanks, Chris

[izzy7771]

What thickness glass should I use inside my hull?

Thanks, Chris

i really like the carbon fiber idea. i did this to my sv and it looks amazing when finished. its much more rigid. much much more. it has a medusa 3680 (2200kv)and a turingy 180 esc (4s 5s 6s) and has taken several pretty violent crashes without any hint of damage at some pretty decent speeds. it does run great on 4s though. lol. i am also doing the bud that has straight shaft conversion and just stepped back when i got to the nitro motor mounts and thinking of how to get an adj strut on the transom solidly. i also got the flat bottom strut because i have never tried one of those and wanted to see the differences. it may be terrible but its what i am tryin first. lol. think i am gonna try the carbon fiber route througout the bottom though. i would use the heaviest fg cloth you can get to conform to the shape of the hull. good luck and please keep posting pics.
imo this hull is so sweet looking.

izzy

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have been looking at the CF but everywhere I go it is way to expensive to buy and I couldn't find any that were sold in sheets, just strips. I might just fiberglass the whole inside and be done with it. I like this hull a lot I have always wanted a Miss Bud, Im just not happy that I bought all the wrong parts.Now I am going to buy the UL-1 strut and flex/propshaft and will use a Grimracer 4057 prop. I hope everything goes well.

Thanks, Chris

[blackcat26]

Don't sweat it Chris if you can't get the carbon. Glass will work just fine just not as good looking as the carbon.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Well I picked up my Mamba Monster for my truggy yesterday, so now Im broke. Now I have to save up a little more money and I will start ordering parts. hopefully this weekend I could come up with some money to buy some glass. What is the best way to lay the glass in there, it is kinda hard to get all the way to the sides of the boat, cause the hatch cover doesn't open that wide? Also I have never laid glass before but I have used Z-poxy with glass, do I do it the same way or is it different?

Thanks, Chris

[izzy7771]

dont get discouraged. i am positive you will get it all lined out and will be super happy with the boat and all the hard work you put into it when you are finished. not everybody has a bud boat but you will. i am pretty sure they arent even made anymore. if you have bought the wrong parts you could always sell them in the swap shop. a reasonably priced item last every bit of 5 mins there. lol you may also find some really good deals by posting what you want to buy in the swap shop as well. also just fyi i bought the last carbon fiber i used i bought off ebay. it was enough to do 2 boats for under 60 bucks. cf cloth, epoxy resin, gloves, brushes, mixing cups, ect... everything you would need to complete. if i ever get around to finishing my bud i will try to post some pics. but i have had the hull for a while now with no progress. too many other projects.

[izzy7771]

blackcat is right. the regular fiberglass cloth will work fine. i think the cf is mostly cosmetic. plus its a pain to cut and to try to lay without screwing up the weave.

[RCKong]

I found this on FleaBay, Its a 5.7 oz - what I used, reletively inexpensive, and enough to do several boats
http://cgi.ebay.com/Carbon-Fiber-Cloth-Fabric-Graphite-47-1k-purchase-yds-/120587796631?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c1397c097
Oh and a quik little trick with the CF is cut out a paper patteren and trace it out on the CF upsided down, with a silver sharpie, . Then take some scotch tape, the thin stuff,1cm wide, and lay it out on the pattern centering the tape when possible. Next step is to cut out the pattern. The tape will hold the edges together very nicely while you work with it. install it tape side down. there should be very little tape left on the edges, but enough to hold it together. Best way I found to do it.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Thanks for the help guys, I will see how much I need and look for some CF online and will use the Finishing resin that I have to lay it in the hull. Hey izzy7771, if you could find sometime to take some pics of your boat I would appreciate it.

Thanks, Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

Ok, I have been thinking what I am going to do so get ready here it is. I am not changing my mind unless you guys tell me somethings wrong.

Strut: http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=ros-Sport-20-strut

I am going to use this glass inside my hull to reinforce it: http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=dh-hcar5010

Prop: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXVST0&P=OW

==========
Power System
==========
Turnigy 120a Marine ESC
Feigao 8XL on 4s


This is my list and I am sticking to, Thanks everyone for your input I will post some pics when I continue further.

[izzy7771]

chris
i will try to make some progress on the boat this weekend. i will certainly try to post some pics. took me a long time to have the courage to dremel off the straight shaft and all that mess. lol. didnt wanna tear up a near perfect hull. tried to look at the links but they didnt work for me but from what the descriptions are it looks like you are about right on track to me. i think your boat is gonna be really quick with an 8xl on 4s. i actually bought the medusa motor for a hydro and it lifts the turnfin almost completely outta the water and makes is ride on the side on only one sponson. was really fast but not too good. lol. i already have a 9xl i will prob try in mine but if i were buying a new it would be an 8xl i think. i am really glad someone is doing this and posting info that is not a few years old. a lot changes in that amount of time it seems with fe boats. good luck.
izzy

[TRXRUSTLER]

That would be awesome!

Thanks, Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

What is a good .150 3/16 flex/propshaft to get on this site, to use with the Speedmaster Sport 20 Strut.


Thanks, Chris

[izzy7771]

http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=oct-oc150L-24c

i would get this one already assembled by ose. you will have to cut to correct length but its really easy. i always solder the end that goes into motor collet so it doesnt fray. i usually get the hughey flex cables but they are outta stock at the moment. the octura should work fine though. make sure you get one that is for counter clockwise rotating props. that is the one in link.
good luck
izzy

[izzy7771]

i am pretty sure they assemble them with loctite 603 if ya wanted to assemble it yourself. i couldnt find that loctite locally. ose sells it though. i think you gotta scuff up the flex and the id of propshaft and clean both with something like alcohol and then fill propshaft with loctite and assemble. wipe off excess. imo heating it up to solder on propshaft will weaken flexcable. pretty sure if you searched on this there would be several threads with detailed info and pics. if the length of your flexcable needed isnt too long you could get the octura and buy an extra propshaft and use the extra length you cut off to make an extra flex drive.
good luck and hope this helps
izzy

[TRXRUSTLER]

Thanks when I get some extra money I will start to order some stuff. I have bought some fiberglass this weekend and did the inside on the hull last night. I put some flotation foam along the insides of the boat just in case. I will post pics tomorrow.

Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

Here is some pics after the z-poxy has dried. I bought some fiberglass at Walmart and used it with some z-poxy Finishing resin. I think it would of looked better with the CF but the glass was a lot easier and cheaper. I paid $4.95 for an 8sq ft. piece( I will never have to buy anymore fiberglass, this is enough to do a lot of boats) I also put some more flotation foam on the sides of the inside of the hull for extra safety. I have to say that this glass has made the hull a lot stiffer, now I know why people would do this. Thanks everyone so far you've been a great help.

UPDATE: I just thought I would mock-up where my motor mount should go. I took my motor out of my truggy and put it in my mount just to see how much room I have to put my 4s up front, it is very close but it just squeezes buy. Does anyone know what the differences in length between the Feiago 8XL and the mamba 2200 is, because I want to make sure I install the mount in the right spot so when I put the feigao in here it will fit ok with the battery?

Thanks, Chris

[izzy7771]

feigao 8xl is 36mm od x 75mm length approx
1515 1y is 42mm od x 76mm length approx
you may want to consider another layer cloth and resin if still flimsy at all. especially in motor mount and stuffing tube areas. i dont think weight will be an issue. i run my lipos in my elam in the front like that too. i still have to add weight under front wing to prevent blow overs. actually i use zip ties and tie an adj wrench under there. lol. works pretty good.
uuuhhmmm!!! i would have to try that mamba motor in there. lol!!! get a water jacket from ose. you could prob never control it but it would be smokin fast. lol. 8xl would be better for the boat i am sure but i couldnt resist trying it out in there. lol thats really bad advice i am sure of it. lol
great job so far!!

[izzy7771]

I found this on FleaBay, Its a 5.7 oz - what I used, reletively inexpensive, and enough to do several boats
http://cgi.ebay.com/Carbon-Fiber-Cloth-Fabric-Graphite-47-1k-purchase-yds-/120587796631?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c1397c097
Oh and a quik little trick with the CF is cut out a paper patteren and trace it out on the CF upsided down, with a silver sharpie, . Then take some scotch tape, the thin stuff,1cm wide, and lay it out on the pattern centering the tape when possible. Next step is to cut out the pattern. The tape will hold the edges together very nicely while you work with it. install it tape side down. there should be very little tape left on the edges, but enough to hold it together. Best way I found to do it.

great tip man. i am gonna try it next time. :Praying: the hairspray method didn work for me worth _-_-_-_ :thumbsdown:

[TRXRUSTLER]

You know I can't resist tryin the mamba first, you can be sure that I will try it before the Feigao goes in..:rockon2:
I think the hull is strong enough with the one layer, but I could put another piece underneath the motor mount just to be safe.

Thanks, Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

bump

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have made some more progress with the Miss Bud, I'm moving kinda slow because this is my first Nitro to FE conversion so I'm kinda nervous, which is kinda weird because I mostly like to build Outriggers and those are the most challenging to build. I also have a 22" Predator rigger that I am building.(My second one) But that is for another thread. So here is what I have done today. I have built a servo mount from light ply and some balsa square rod, picked up a traxxas rubber boot for the rudder linkage, installed the rudder where I want it, and epoxied the servo mount in and installed the servo. I am using a Hitec (51 oz. of torque and a .15 transit speed).

[izzy7771]

with the mamba your hydro will prob run on one sponson in water and the other lifted in air. but will be a fast mofo. lol. be careful if you try it. could ruin all your work. the 8xl will be very fast also. i would be willing to be the mamba will be uncontrolable in this hull.
wish i had one to try same thing. lol.

i have had nothing but bad luck with feigaos lately with very mild setups!! prob wont get another one. best one i ever had is an 8xl though. seemed perfect on 4s in bout anything i put it in.

keep it up your almost there.

[TRXRUSTLER]

I probably wont try the mamba then. I am having a problem with coming up with some extra money at the moment, because of this job (that I'm in the process of getting) so hopefully if everything goes well I shouldn't have anymore problems with getting extra money.......but enough about my problems..lol. So far I have got the servo mount and servo installed, a 5/16 hole where the linkage comes out of the transom, with a piece of 5/16 brass tubing that I have the boot zip tied to, I have the rudder bolted on with washers on the inside so the bolts won't pull through, I put a piece of 1/4 in. brass tubing for the water outlet and a piece through the transom, for the water cooling lines. Sorry guys, this is going to take a little longer to finish than normal, but you have my word that it will be done.

Thanks, for all your input you've been a great help.


P.S. I have ordered my Turnigy 120a Marine ESC on 6/10/10 and I still haven't got it yet. I emailed hobby king and they told me to check my post office. Ever since they switched to using swiss post its been taking forever. When I track it, it says its in NY but its said that since Monday.

[forescott]

Yup, hobbyking has great prices, but you gotta be prepared to wait sometimes. trxrustler check out my miss llumar build. Almost done! http://forums.offshoreelectrics.com/showthread.php?t=16043

[TRXRUSTLER]

I have been watching it, its looking great can't wait to see some video of that thing at WOT!!!:thumbup1:

I kinda with I had the flex shaft version like you, that would have made my build a lot quicker to finish. I had to tear the bottom of my boat up and lay more fiber glass down after I ripped out the straight shaft strut. O well, all's I know is there both gonna be fast when there done. Good luck, its gonna be fun!

Chris

[TRXRUSTLER]

I had a piece of thin Plexiglas laying around so I figured I would cut out a piece of it to fit the cone. Then I taped it in and used epoxy on the inside to secure it. It is water tight. Now I have to do the front cowling, I was thinking of leaving it open. Do you thing a lot of water would get in? (dumb question)

Thanks, Chris

[blackcat26]

I would not leave the front open. I epoxied a pc. of carbon fiber to seal mine. Works great.

[TRXRUSTLER]

Thanks, Blackcat, I thought I should close it up.


I just found out today, At my LHS, I am good friends with the owner and he said that he has a brand new Miss Elam hull that has never seen water yet or had any parts installed on it. So I had to ask how much he wanted for it and he told me $50 bucks and its yours!:eek: I told him that I was pretty short on money right now but I said I would give him some money so he will hold it for me. I have to find some way to come up with $50 bucks.

Just thought I would share the good news.

Chris

[blackcat26]

Dude, give plasma for that cheap a price!:buttrock:

[TRXRUSTLER]

Anyone want to buy a 22" Predator outrigger hull for $50 bucks shipped? I will defiantly find some way to get it. I will still finish my Miss bud boat and I will do a bigger setup for the Miss Elam because its a much sturdier hull.

Thanks, Chris

[GnrlPatton]

Hey Chris-
I'm in the middle of my Miss Bud Gen 1 mod as well, I have the straight shaft yanked out and am buying parts for it to get it all back together. I purchased a Speedmaster 20 adjustable drive, and am waiting now on the .150 flex cable / prop shaft combo, but looking at the drive against the hull, it looks huge!

I'm not sure that it was meant to go on the original 1/12 PB hydros (without some grinding it down and redrilling of holes). Is that what you ended up getting? Are you using any of the brass tubing for the shaft, if so, is it the 1/4"? I feel like I keep guessing (wrong) at which parts to buy, and could probably build a whole other boat with the stuff I have that doesn't look right.

Kevin

[izzy7771]

i just destroyed one of those elam hulls few weeks ago! got clipped by another hydro. miss vegas. did drive it back to bank with entire back half underwater no wings transom ripped bout all way off. i was not too happy bout gettin clipped but i was kinda proud of the boat limping back to shore after taking a hit like that! kinda looked like an orange and white submarine! prob have over 50$ in bondo, cloth, wood, and resin trying to repair it. lol. i would jump on that hull!!

i have a ul-1 as well as the elam. IMHO elam hull handles better with a little tweaking and an adj strut!!! just sayin from what i have experienced so far it is a decent hull.

guess i am going to finish repairs and turn elam into a demolition derby hull. lol my hull prob not worth repairing but its more of a pride thing i think just to get it back into the water. i race against all nitro and i have only fe boats at my club.