Leopard Hobby 4-Pole CC/Neu Clones

[supafastsupra2]

Looks like "Leopard Hobby" has copied the CC/Neu line of motors. Might even be from the same factory, who knows? Anyways, Looks like they have a broader/different array of kv's than Castle sells not to mention what seems to be a 56mm OD x 92mm length powerhouse?
Here's (http://www.leopardhobby.com/product/index.asp?functionID=0102) a link to their site. If anyone knows any more info/ finds feedback post it up! :rockon2:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/supafastsupra2/Leopardhobby.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/supafastsupra2/Leopardhobby2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/supafastsupra2/Leopardhobby3.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/supafastsupra2/Leopardhobby4.jpg

[Rumdog]

I feel like HK is more innovative lately than copiers. I'd bet they're from the same manufacturer. A lot ou US companies have been importing lately!

[Brushless55]

Very cool man!
I don't see any prices but they look just like the Castle motors

[supafastsupra2]

http://toyabipro.com/product_188.html
this one is 1515 size priced around $90, surely will become cheaper if HK imports them. The high price leads me to believe its the real deal.
http://toyabipro.com/product_189.html
1512 for $84 availible 1400kv, and the 1800kv and 2700kv that castle offers.

[Brushless55]

What 90 bucks! :w00t:
I'm wanting to build a 45" twin brushless hydro and two of those on 5s should be flippin sick!

[m4a1usr]

More copies of a copy. Remember,.............you get what you pay for..................................http://www.himodel.com/electric/XERUN_4274-2000KV_Brushless_Motor_For_1_8_Cars.html

John

[m4a1usr]

More copies of a copy. Remember,.............you get what you pay for..................................http://www.himodel.com/electric/XERUN_4274-2000KV_Brushless_Motor_For_1_8_Cars.html

:thumbsdown:

John

[Rumdog]

So, in that case, they should be excellent compared to say.... a Feigao? Don't dis it till you try it. My Castle/N eu's are as good as any Neu I've owned. And much more inexpensive.

[ray schrauwen]

I'll wait to see how the Hobby King's Big Mono fairs with one of those 40mm jobs in there.

We will hear in the forums within a few weeks of how well these motors can move a 41" mono.

[ray schrauwen]

BTW, those Turnigy Outrunners are pretty sweet, 1100 KV, 100A @ 25.9V (7S) = 2590 Watts,

Dude, for $35....

[m4a1usr]

So, in that case, they should be excellent compared to say.... a Feigao? Don't dis it till you try it. My Castle/N eu's are as good as any Neu I've owned. And much more inexpensive.

No dis'n. Just warning the obvious. I cant say the same about the castle/neu's. While I only have one castle/ neu 2000kv motor it does not perform the same as any 1515 "Y" series I own. Your mileage may vary but the Neu's are better in my hulls unless I need an LMT. Then again I like to run with every ounce of performance.

John

[supafastsupra2]

I do agree with M4A1 on this. Altough I have different experience in the power of a castle/neu compared to a true neu, and find the castle variant, if anything, have the same if not more power than a Neu. (comparing my castle/neu 1512 to a neu 1512)

I only posted the thread up because they're offering different kv's otherwise not available through Castle (at least not at this point in time) and would surely be usable by us boat guys. Definitely going to be waiting on a review/test of that 41" mono from HK.

[Brushless55]

But who is copying who?

[Rumdog]

There is not a 2000kv Castle/Neu. The 1515 is 2200kv. I own 2 of which in every way perform as well as the 2 Neu 1515 1y's Ive owned. I actually am currentl running them on 5s with x447 props in a twin cat with very little heat. I dont know if we can reall call a motor a copy. I mean, Brushless motors all really have the same design with the obvious variants in windings/poles, etc and quality of the parts. It's like saying that a lipo is a copy of another.

[crabstick]

can someone buy the 730KV model listed here and let me know how it goes :laugh:

4880 watts = 6.5HP

http://www.leopardhobby.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

[m4a1usr]

There is not a 2000kv Castle/Neu. The 1515 is 2200kv. I own 2 of which in every way perform as well as the 2 Neu 1515 1y's Ive owned. I actually am currentl running them on 5s with x447 props in a twin cat with very little heat. I dont know if we can reall call a motor a copy. I mean, Brushless motors all really have the same design with the obvious variants in windings/poles, etc and quality of the parts. It's like saying that a lipo is a copy of another.

Wow. A typo. What a loss to the RC world. The castle/neu 2200kv is not the same as a 1515/1Y. Doesnt matter what you think. Post some empirical data to show your testing. Even OSE states the motors are not the same. Open end bell design for heat removal. No clear statement of what the castle/neu are made of for comparison? Got a chinese factory you would like to list? Like the iron and the magnets? The Neu's are made in the USA. The quality rivals the Europeans at a lesser cost. You got some nerve.

John

[Rumdog]

LOL. Take it easy man. Buy what you want. And yes, I do have some nerve. The data is in the performance. Which I am happy with. They PERFORM in real world testing as well as my Neu's did. Believe it, or don't, I could care less.

[Jeff Wohlt]

Maybe we should not compare the NEU as we know where they are made...right here...we think...but Castle is a different story. It has been well known that they made over there...but with Steve's specs. I doubt they are too close. Steve has his own knowledge of what really is demanded from a motor...sure they could be close.

Guess we will see.

[m4a1usr]

You know,........it took me 5 years pf playing with the cheap chi crap to realize what Jay was saying back then.

The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.

My hat is off to you Jay. You were right and I was wrong. I'm trying to educate them.

John

[Jeff Wohlt]

Yes...but if they are just shy of the same performance then who is right? $ vs $

We all know there are plenty out there ripping designs...we have are own right here in the USA.

[Rumdog]

My boats are full of that "cheap chi crap." Turnigy lipos, Seaking esc's, Castle/Neu motors, Feigao motors. I choose to run components that I have had good results with. I try less expensive things and if results are good, then I have no need to splurge. How do those quality USA Castle Hydra controllers seem to be doing lately? Do we call them cheap US crap?

[supafastsupra2]

Wow. A typo. What a loss to the RC world. The castle/neu 2200kv is not the same as a 1515/1Y. Doesnt matter what you think. Post some empirical data to show your testing. Even OSE states the motors are not the same. Open end bell design for heat removal. No clear statement of what the castle/neu are made of for comparison? Got a chinese factory you would like to list? Like the iron and the magnets? The Neu's are made in the USA. The quality rivals the Europeans at a lesser cost. You got some nerve.

John

I don't mean to offend you, as you seem like you're experienced in the FE world... but there is no appreciable difference in the performance of the Steve Neu Motors to their Castle Neu equivalents. Notice that the Castle's are larger in dimension than the Neu's comparing any Castle equivalent to one (1515 to 1515 etc.). The Neu's are obviously built more efficiently in size to power ratio (probably tighter windings or i could be wrong and the Castles simply made up for lack of cooling holes with a larger cooling surface area).

But comparing motor for motor, they put out just about the same power in my experience. Any difference in performance for the majority of people is neglibible and could only be noticed in a SAWs boat if anything. I have also noted that the Castle motors have a more notchy feel; it is my understanding Mr. Neu did this on purpose on his motors and do not know its effects on the motor's torque. To my knowledge, the only difference between the Castle/Neu rotors is that the Castle's are Kevlar wrapped instead of CF.

[crabstick]

You know,........it took me 5 years pf playing with the cheap chi crap to realize what Jay was saying back then.



Sounds like your minds already made up John, if it comes from china, it must be crap, is what I get from that statement.

5 years ago, I probably would have agreed with you, Now, after racing (and winning) using "cheap chi crap" as you put it, I will quite happily use some of it. While I agree, some is crap, some is not. There good stuff coming out of china now, 5 years ago.... not so much, hating on something because of its manufacturing origin I just don't understand.

as an example I personally would not ever buy a castle ESC, no encourage anyone to buy one, too many of them just burn for no apparent reason.. I have a 120amp Hextronic ( cheap chi crap ) that I just cannot kill, have been abusing it for 4 years now...

[Brushless55]

Funny how some think if they spend 2x or 3x the money they get better products that will outlast and outrun the cheaper priced items :doh:
where do the components of the high dollar items come from?
put together in the US, but...

and why are some already ripping these motors apart when not one person on this site has run one?

[Steven Vaccaro]

One thing, I've been in contact with a distributor on this motor.
They are saying its a 2 pole motor.
But, It could be possible that they just don't know what they have.

[crabstick]

http://www.leopardhobby.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

in the right hand side they have a 2 and a 4 pole category ...:noidea:

[Steven Vaccaro]

http://www.leopardhobby.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

in the right hand side they have a 2 and a 4 pole category ...:noidea:

Thats good news.

[K.R.Joye]

Heres another family of knockoffs (Trinity?) these new 4 poles look interesting.

They come in 39, 43 & 54mm dia cans Nice big hefty motors at a great Great price!

http://www.okhobby.com/category.php?id_category=4&p=4

the specs on this one for a 6S setup look incredible!
http://www.okhobby.com/product.php?id_product=1159

[FighterCat57]

One a side note, one thing China is known for is taking a bid to make a product for another country and using that knowledge to make a better version they sell themselves as their own design. Then once they get market control of that product, they slowly cheapen it up till it's a decoration.

This is not new, it's been going on for decades or more. It's well known in the aerospace industry, especially when working with DOD or any US Proprietary design data, that even talking with a Chinese national regarding any design is considered and ITAR violation. There were actually special red lines drawn on the floors they they had to stay within 10 feet of at all times.

Any and all sensitive government design knowledge has been historically withheld from the Chinese for just this reason. Which is why there have been some major problems with China trying to build Helicopters and parts for Russia. The US won't give up the design info for any Chinese factory to build.

Basically, if a US Company has a Chinese company build something for them, the Chinese government takes that information and has their own version built. Google found this out first hand. There was a search filter software in WA a couple years back that China completely ripped off, even leaving their name in the code and deployed as their own with all new computers... Dell was having a choice of employing the software or leaving the China market. It's just how they do business. Remember, it's a communist country.

Back to the knock off motors... They may be just as good... might even be better at some point... and will most likely have really bad clones mixed in there somewhere unexpectedly...

.... carry on ....
________
DRUZE ADVICE (http://www.religionboard.org/druze/)

[video200]

just tagging this tread.
this is interesting reading :D

[sailr]

Just remember, the Chinese are great at making things look EXACTLY like another product. It's what's inside that counts. The Leopard motors may be good, maybe not but just because they look like a Castle/Neu means absolutely nothing.

[questtek]

One thing, I've been in contact with a distributor on this motor.
They are saying its a 2 pole motor.
But, It could be possible that they just don't know what they have.

About 4 months ago I visited the factory in China and pickled up about 10 of these motors, both 2000KV and 2200KV. They are 4-pole motors and, in my opinion, very well made and have performed exceptional for me in a wide range of FE boats including a Mean Machine and Pursuit mono. I have given a couple motors to several active forum members and they have used them with great success. We have done some of the testing at the lake in front of my house. (They previously have had lots of experience with the Neu 1515 which I have not had.).

Everyone has their opinion on China products. It is a personal thing based on individual experiences both failures and successes. Some products have been disappointments to me but this motor certainly has not. Again, my opinion only based on only 4 months of evaluating these motors.

One of my latest projects included using two of the 2200KV versions in oil filled configuration to run outside the hull of an Advenger Pro Cat. Pics are included of this experimental set up. I will post more details as this project evolves.

Here are some specs on the motor........

Watts 2,664 continuous? (I continue to evaluate this with full Eagle Tree instrumentation on every run)
Current rating 120 A continuous. (I have measured 160 amps via my Eagle Tree on speed runs)
Max V 22.2 vdc
Resistance 0.0062
Max RPM 50,000 with standard NGK Japanese bearings
Shaft dia 5 mm.
Weight 374 grams
Length 73.8 mm
RPM/volt 2200, 4-pole

I have placed a fairly large order for the Leopard 2200KV version of this motor so if anyone would like additional information they can send me a PM. I am not or have absolutely NO plans to compete with Steve or anyone who has a business based on FE boats. However I would be happy to help out any one on a limited basis if they can contribute to aiding my continued evaluation of what I consider to be a pretty remarkable 4-pole brushless motor.

[Xfactor]

Let me say this . The chinese copy yes but thats part of the deal. We want them to manufacture our stuff for next to nothing and all that copying is worked out in the trade agreements so thats on US. Secondly there are usa companies that suck too. Im sitting rite here with a motor with no damn support. They send the motor to folks with no datalogger to test why?????? no logic.The chinese are just as smart as anyone else so if they want to design something nice they could. No one company is god like they all design based on the phiysical properties of the world were all subjected too no matter what the country that should be obvious. If your professor is chinese in a usa school then wat? that kills all that.We need to remember this is a hobby (no one really cares) outside of us. If you find a cheap chinese version that has comparable performance then you buy it for sport and fun or you put that stuff in rtr models to make them cost effective. If you want trophies better go with the european stuff. THE ONE THING THAT IMPRESSES ME ABOUT NEU IS HE BUILDS THEM ONE BY ONE SO YOU KNOW THE FINE DETAILS ARE COVERED AND YOU GET GOOD CUSTOMER SUPPORT AS FAR AS THE OTHER US COMPANIES STUFF THEY SEND IT OVER THERE TO BE MANUFACTURED SO WATS THE DIFFERENCE?I also have to agree with RUM yes I said it I agree that real world data beats numbers on paper anyday.If I put a chineese motor in something and it runs as good as a pletti for example then it does thats that.The only things Id like to see is when members dissagree they can talk numbers and data without getting mad at each other. Its not that serious 4 one it takes away from the fun of it all and lastly who needs a new enemy? I dont.The purpose of a forum is to discuss. I think one could compare whatever motor he wants. If its a bad comparison one thing that wont lie is the water so let people experiment for themselves so when someone with experience tells them it wont work they know for themselves it doesnt.Hard heads make for soft azzes. You guys get along better come on.FYI I dont trust the american companies anymore than anyone else US Americans are greedy and love to cut corners thats why were in the mess were in. Chew on that.

[Xfactor]

If you can keep those motors dry u might have something there.No drag. Y not make them vector thrusters if thats the case . The one problem I see is when the boats up on step are the pods still gonna be dragging in the water? and how will that affect handling?

[Xfactor]

We dont need to bash the chinese we need to put pressure on the USA companies to compete pricewise or give us something sooo much better that it makes sense. As for this motor I got this is my new policy "if you dont have any data or paperwork with your product you can have it I dont want it' that way the next time I buy a motor I wont have to hear about the same damn 460 prop over and over and over again. I hope the company im speaking of is listening. Its the rude arrogance of american companies thats got us behind; just cause you stamp USA on it dont make it special. We need to hold people to a standard to wear that stamp.Now back to the subject those motors look good to me. I want to try the 52 red in a 1/8th scale anyone wanna buy a screamer?I mean leopard has some data I like that for starts.

[ray schrauwen]

Let me say this . The chinese copy yes but thats part of the deal. We want them to manufacture our stuff for next to nothing and all that copying is worked out in the trade agreements so thats on US. Secondly there are usa companies that suck too. Im sitting rite here with a motor with no damn support. They send the motor to folks with no datalogger to test why?????? no logic.The chinese are just as smart as anyone else so if they want to design something nice they could. No one company is god like they all design based on the phiysical properties of the world were all subjected too no matter what the country that should be obvious. If your professor is chinese in a usa school then wat? that kills all that.We need to remember this is a hobby (no one really cares) outside of us. If you find a cheap chinese version that has comparable performance then you buy it for sport and fun or you put that stuff in rtr models to make them cost effective. If you want trophies better go with the european stuff. THE ONE THING THAT IMPRESSES ME ABOUT NEU IS HE BUILDS THEM ONE BY ONE SO YOU KNOW THE FINE DETAILS ARE COVERED AND YOU GET GOOD CUSTOMER SUPPORT AS FAR AS THE OTHER US COMPANIES STUFF THEY SEND IT OVER THERE TO BE MANUFACTURED SO WATS THE DIFFERENCE?I also have to agree with RUM yes I said it I agree that real world data beats numbers on paper anyday.If I put a chineese motor in something and it runs as good as a pletti for example then it does thats that.The only things Id like to see is when members dissagree they can talk numbers and data without getting mad at each other. Its not that serious 4 one it takes away from the fun of it all and lastly who needs a new enemy? I dont.The purpose of a forum is to discuss. I think one could compare whatever motor he wants. If its a bad comparison one thing that wont lie is the water so let people experiment for themselves so when someone with experience tells them it wont work they know for themselves it doesnt.Hard heads make for soft azzes. You guys get along better come on.FYI I dont trust the american companies anymore than anyone else US Americans are greedy and love to cut corners thats why were in the mess were in. Chew on that.

Nice post.

[sailr]

We Americans are such cheap a$$es! We will continue to get what we are now from HobbyKing, etc. I could bring in motors from China that are setting the FE circuit on fire in Europe. They are incredible. BUT they are expensive and I don't believe the majority of US modelers would pay the price for an unknown (in the U.S.) motor at the same price as a NEU motor.

[Brushless55]

We dont need to bash the chinese we need to put pressure on the USA companies to compete pricewise or give us something sooo much better that it makes sense. As for this motor I got this is my new policy "if you dont have any data or paperwork with your product you can have it I dont want it' that way the next time I buy a motor I wont have to hear about the same damn 460 prop over and over and over again. I hope the company im speaking of is listening. Its the rude arrogance of american companies thats got us behind; just cause you stamp USA on it dont make it special. We need to hold people to a standard to wear that stamp.Now back to the subject those motors look good to me. I want to try the 52 red in a 1/8th scale anyone wanna buy a screamer?I mean leopard has some data I like that for starts.

You are pointing out some great things! :iagree:
even our American car companies import cars and put their names on them! :ThumbsDown01:
I'm wanting to find two 1600kv motors to run in my TH (Twin Hydro)

[Xfactor]

Good point salir plus were just scraping the surface as far a BLDC motors are concerned. Like another member told me theres military app stuff that pulls 25000 watts

[Xfactor]

You are pointing out some great things! :iagree:
even our American car companies import cars and put their names on them! :ThumbsDown01:
I'm wanting to find two 1600kv motors to run in my TH (Twin Hydro)
those leopards look good to me for something like that. Lets remember this all the motors are designed to do a certain amount of work. If you ask more out of it thats where you see if a design was redundant or not. They all work like they are supposed too. We abuse all this stuff. Water is very hard on things esp electronics.

[Xfactor]

We Americans are such cheap a$$es! We will continue to get what we are now from HobbyKing, etc. I could bring in motors from China that are setting the FE circuit on fire in Europe. They are incredible. BUT they are expensive and I don't believe the majority of US modelers would pay the price for an unknown (in the U.S.) motor at the same price as a NEU motor.
Theyll buy it if it gurantees some placed finishes.Also Im gonna say it again when people on here start trying closed loop i really think the amp draws will come down and we can extract more out of the sport.

[Xfactor]

Anyway yall let me know when someone gets one If i dont beat you too it. :Peace_Sign:

[Brushless55]

who will be first?

[cybercrxt]

I feel like the Castle/ Neu motors are just as good as the Neu motors..Proof is below:

32" Woodstuff Tunnel, 1515 2200kv Castle/ Neu, 5s1p, 7lbs rtr- World record SAW 64.65mph, and can heat race the same speeds for 1mile

36" Woodstuff Tunnel, 1518 1800kv Castle/ Neu, 5s2p, 9.5lbs rtr- 68.8mph GPS, and can heat race the same speeds for 1mile


Now, I am not saying a Neu version of the above will not do the same, but damn, how much faster does a hull of this size and style need to go!

If these Leopard motors are built the same as the Castle/ Neu's then its a great alternative, if not, the Castle/ Neus are still pretty cheap for what you get! Not to mention you can actually BUY a Castle/ Neu..what about a Neu???haha

Don't even get me started on the Turnigy/ Seaking 180a. That is the best controller made, PERIOD. I have propped a motor up so high that the output wires on the ESC melted off the board..Got home, soldered it back together, and I still run it today. I have had that ESC for well over a year, and its been threw hell.

[Rumdog]

Oh, come on. You mean, it isn't cheap Chinese crap?! At this point I am running ONLY Castle/Neu motors and Seaking 180's in my boats. They all run flawlessly and take some major abuse!

[Xfactor]

The only difference is probably the custom options available but also when u handbuil you can bet that his specs are dead on. With the manufactured stuff its probably +/- 5 %. I run turnigy too love it but ist it better than a benz controller???180 amps is alot so to claim it u better be able to do it. But most manufactures rate thier stuff @ 90 percent of what it will do.For good reason ;we wanna take everything to its limits.One need to also consider this . If you wanna pull 60 amps continuous u better buy a 120 amp continuous esc over estimate always. In this hobby overkill is better.I tell you one thing Id buy turnigy before castle i bet you that cause those guys lied in my opinion on the screamer thread. Any esc maker in the world knows that firmware updates alone will not aways fix a problem .They knew that when they said it.

[Xfactor]

I just want to see the 52 red run.

[questtek]

If you can keep those motors dry u might have something there.No drag. Y not make them vector thrusters if thats the case . The one problem I see is when the boats up on step are the pods still gonna be dragging in the water? and how will that affect handling?

This build or project is totally experimental. The goal is to make it as simple as possible. I have had great success steering large aeromarine avenger cats using such a dual motor set up but only at lower speeds. I want to try to eliminate the complexity of servos or ducted thrusters. I have tried these motors with large jacuzzi jet drives and they work great but the drive is 4 times the cost of the Leopard motor!

One other factor is that the interior of the cat is most important for my specific application since it is loaded with electronic equipment including a small Pentium computer with solid state drive and three independent wireless video systems. Keeping the motor outside means only batteries and the ESC's inside whose location is very flexible.

This a works in progress and it might be best after all to put the motors on the inside of the outer sponsons with a short, direct drive and again do steering by individual motor speed and direction. You certainly are right on the drag and I do not expect this to be any type of SAW record holder!

[questtek]

who will be first?

Here is a Leopard 220O KV with water cooling in the motor mount only and fan cooling on the case. I run a complete Eagle Tree system on it with GPS. The boat is not tuned and in I run almost exclusively carbon props. However Josh gave be a three bladed polished prop and here is the Eagle Tree of the first run. 50 MPH is a non-set up condition is a good first start for this mono with my limited knowledge.

[Rumdog]

I wonder if the OSE water jackets for the castle/Neu motors will fit. I'm guessing that they will.

[Rumdog]

Otherwise, it may have the same can O.D. as a Neu 1515.

[crabstick]

Here is a Leopard 220O KV with water cooling in the motor mount onlyand fan cooling on the case. I run a complete Eagle Tree system on it with GPS. The boat is not tuned and in I run almost exclusively carbon props. However Josh gave be a three bladed polished prop and here is the Eagle Tree of the first run. 50 MPH is a non-set up condition is a good first start for this mono with my limited knowledge.


What boat is that ? the pursuit from Hobbyking?

[Diesel6401]

I'm really interested in the 36-74 1290kv or 1790kv. http://www.leopardhobby.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1278&functionID=01020211

Just can't find a anywhere to place an order for these motors.

[questtek]

What boat is that ? the pursuit from Hobbyking?

Almost....The China factory I deal with makes the Pursuit and Genesis. However the specific ones they sell to Hobby King are different. They actually have 3 or 4 slightly different models on each of the boats. The boat in the picture is one I bought in China in person and hand carried back as a bare hull with drive hardware only.

[questtek]

I wonder if the OSE water jackets for the castle/Neu motors will fit. I'm guessing that they will.

I gave one of these 2200KV Leopard motors to MarkF for testing on the new Insane Hydro. We ran it with NO type of cooling at all, but only for short, fast runs. MarkF said he had a water jacket for it so hopefully he will read this and add his comment as to the specific type of water jacket he was thinking of putting on it. I think he said he got the jacket from OSE.

[Brushless55]

Here is a Leopard 220O KV with water cooling in the motor mount only and fan cooling on the case. I run a complete Eagle Tree system on it with GPS. The boat is not tuned and in I run almost exclusively carbon props. However Josh gave be a three bladed polished prop and here is the Eagle Tree of the first run. 50 MPH is a non-set up condition is a good first start for this mono with my limited knowledge.

Thanks for the pictures!
are those equal to a 1515 in their size?
I'm getting really jazed by the possibilities of these motors :w00t:

[questtek]

Thanks for the pictures!
are those equal to a 1515 in their size?
I'm getting really jazed by the possibilities of these motors :w00t:

Brushless Motors Neu and Leopard:

Neu 1515 1Y
Max V 27 vdc
No load amps 2.5
Resistance 0.006
Max RPM 60,000
Shaft dia 5 mm
Weight 340 grams
Length 68.6 mm
RPM/Volt 2200, 4-pole

The Leopard brushless motors I am currently evaluating
Current rating 120 A continuous. (I have measured 160 amps via my Eagle Tree on speed runs)
Max V 22.2 vdc
Resistance 0.0062
Max RPM 50,000 with standard NGK Japanese bearings
Shaft dia 5 mm.
Weight 374 grams
Length 73.8 mm
RPM/volt 2200, 4-pole
dia 40 mm L=75mm

[Brushless55]

Brushless Motors Neu and Leopard:

Neu 1515 1Y
Max V 27 vdc
No load amps 2.5
Resistance 0.006
Max RPM 60,000
Shaft dia 5 mm
Weight 340 grams
Length 68.6 mm
RPM/Volt 2200, 4-pole

The Leopard brushless motors I am currently evaluating
Current rating 120 A continuous. (I have measured 160 amps via my Eagle Tree on speed runs)
Max V 22.2 vdc
Resistance 0.0062
Max RPM 50,000 with standard NGK Japanese bearings
Shaft dia 5 mm.
Weight 374 grams
Length 73.8 mm
RPM/volt 2200, 4-pole
dia 40 mm L=75mm

How could we go wrong?
looks like I need to order 2 of these bad boys for my Twin powered Hydro :banana:

[sailr]

Closed loop?


Theyll buy it if it gurantees some placed finishes.Also Im gonna say it again when people on here start trying closed loop i really think the amp draws will come down and we can extract more out of the sport.

[old guy]

I have a little of every thing and a made in the USA 240 that is smoked after 3 passes and only got to 90 in temp:thumbsdown: we will see if they will warranty it lol. I would just like to say this if it was not for or knockoffs a lot of poeple would not be able to do FE becouse of the price of the parts just my 2 cents. and I hope they will give me a new 240 ESC or next time I will buy chines.

[Brushless55]

I have a little of every thing and a made in the USA 240 that is smoked after 3 passes and only got to 90 in temp:thumbsdown: we will see if they will warranty it lol. I would just like to say this if it was not for or knockoffs a lot of people would not be able to do FE because of the price of the parts just my 2 cents. and I hope they will give me a new 240 ESC or next time I will buy chines.

:iagree:
and I hope you get a new esc :thumbup1:

[Jeepers]

You know what I notice? its funny how everyone bashes Castle products and as soon as some sharp marketing guy sticks the name "Neu" with "Castle" there products become gold! interesting how that works..........

[crabstick]

You know what I notice? its funny how everyone bashes Castle products and as soon as some sharp marketing guy sticks the name "Neu" with "Castle" there products become gold! interesting how that works..........

Motors don't seem to burn as much.:rofl:

[Rumdog]

You know what I notice? its funny how everyone bashes Castle products and as soon as some sharp marketing guy sticks the name "Neu" with "Castle" there products become gold! interesting how that works..........

We bash the Hydra esc's. The HV series in particular. Why? Because they are over priced and the quality is terrible. The Neu/Castle motors arent a marketing scheme. The design is Steve Neu's own. The quality and power are EXCELLENT! That's why they are recieving praise from a lot of people. Not because of marketing. Seems the stuff Castle makes for land vehicles is of much more quality than the boat stuff. My MMM controller has also been quite abused for over a year and still works flawlessly.

[Blint]

If someone is interested, i have a 4074-2200kv for sale on ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140412786971
Regards!
Balint

[crabstick]

very interested to see how these go in say a whiplash 20 ??

[Blint]

I own a 2000Kv and use it in an E-revo, its a beast!

[ray schrauwen]

If someone is interested, i have a 4074-2200kv for sale on ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140412786971
Regards!
Balint

Why sell it?

[FighterCat57]

We bash the Hydra esc's. The HV series in particular. Why? Because they are over priced and the quality is terrible. The Neu/Castle motors arent a marketing scheme. The design is Steve Neu's own. The quality and power are EXCELLENT! That's why they are recieving praise from a lot of people. Not because of marketing. Seems the stuff Castle makes for land vehicles is of much more quality than the boat stuff. My MMM controller has also been quite abused for over a year and still works flawlessly.

OT: thought of putting that controller in a boat? I have one NIB without a home. Kept it as a spare for the buggy's.

[Blint]

Why sell it?

I have ordered two, a 2000kv and a 2200kv, and decided to use only the 2000kv.

[Brushless55]

Looks at this HOSS!
LB5692
http://www.leopard-model.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

[Diesel6401]

I have ordered two, a 2000kv and a 2200kv, and decided to use only the 2000kv.

Where did you order from?

[supafastsupra2]

Looks at this HOSS!
LB5692
http://www.leopard-model.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

I posted a pic of this motor in the OP :biggrin:

[Brushless55]

I posted a pic of this motor in the OP :biggrin:

Oh right on man!
I was looking through the site and saw that sucker and now I'm looking where to order two of them..
I wonder what Castle/Neu it is equal to?

[supafastsupra2]

looks like its b/t a 1900 and 2200 neu size.

[Xfactor]

Whats the cost on that big red can?

[Brushless55]

The 1600kv version looks like it could be a great 5s2p motor in a 43" Cat..?

[ray schrauwen]

The 1600kv version looks like it could be a great 5s2p motor in a 43" Cat..?

Careful now, take a look at the AMP rating of the lower KV motors...

[Blint]

Where did you order from?

Dont know exactly.
A friend of mine owns a hobby shop, and ordered a few samples for testing.
He asked if I am interested, and I was.

[MarkF]

I just measured the two motors using a set of calipers and this is what I got.
Neu 39 mm
Leopard 40 mm

Mark

[Brushless55]

Careful now, take a look at the AMP rating of the lower KV motors...

now I'm not sure what motor I was looking at??
1600kv :confused2:

[Xfactor]

The amp ratings look good dont they?One of those red models is @ 5000 plus watts thats real good, But whats the cost?

[Brushless55]

The amp ratings look good dont they?One of those red models is @ 5000 plus watts thats real good, But whats the cost?

I have yet to find the cost of the HOSS, but this is for a 4074 :thumbup1:
http://toyabipro.com/product_188.html

[FighterCat57]

I wonder if the clones are related to what Traxxas has built for their new boat? Pure speculation.

I want a link to that HOSS. I have a home for two of them!

[Brushless55]

I wonder if the clones are related to what Traxxas has built for their new boat? Pure speculation.

I want a link to that HOSS. I have a home for two of them!


That would be good if this is what Traxxas is using a leopard motor

the HOSS
http://www.leopard-model.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

[FighterCat57]

That would be good if this is what Traxxas is using a leopard motor

the HOSS
http://www.leopard-model.com/product/product_veiws.asp?id=1256&functionID=01020202

I meant a purchase link. =)

[Brushless55]

I meant a purchase link. =)

That makes two of us.. :popcorn2:

[Jeepers]

Seems the stuff Castle makes for land vehicles is of much more quality than the boat stuff. My MMM controller has also been quite abused for over a year and still works flawlessly.

you forget one important part, land vehicles are NOT DIRECT DRIVE they have transmissions, diffs, silicone filled diffs, slipper clutches, etc. which give and reduce shock loads. thats what they are there for.

I used a hydra120 in a 6xl powered revo 3.3 converted to brushless its still going strong as a matter of fact I have that esc in my Pspec hydro now. 2 years later.

[Rumdog]

Does the hydra 120 have brakes? Or did you use the servo driven disc brakes? I was more referring to the capability to run 6s reliably on the lv MMM esc and not the hydras. I know the amps don't compare in cars/trucks.

[Jeepers]

I used the servo driven brakes the hydra does have reverse but no brakes.

Have you ran the MMM in a boat on 6s? how did it hold up if you did??

[sailr]

How are you gonna find a water jacket for that oddball size?

[Brushless55]

you forget one important part, land vehicles are NOT DIRECT DRIVE they have transmissions, diffs, silicone filled diffs, slipper clutches, etc. which give and reduce shock loads. thats what they are there for.

I used a hydra120 in a 6xl powered revo 3.3 converted to brushless its still going strong as a matter of fact I have that esc in my Pspec hydro now. 2 years later.

Dude!
I have a 6XL MMM in my Revo.. I've gotten 60mph on 4s :rockon2:
not sure if I ever want to try 6s :w00t:

[Brushless55]

Word is, HOTR will have these motors up on his site this Saturday..
and Steven will have them soon! :rockon2:

[supafastsupra2]

Very good news indeed. Anyone else hear word that Shipping lipos overseas from HK is going to stop?

[Jeepers]

Dude!
I have a 6XL MMM in my Revo.. I've gotten 60mph on 4s :rockon2:
not sure if I ever want to try 6s :w00t:


The esc was the toughest part of the truck LOL! I went through tires, driveline parts and countless bodies, its amazing how uncontrollable these trucks are at 60+mph at WOT, especially when the tires grow! had to get MIP drive shafts just to handle high traction launches from a dead stop! Is the E-Revo tougher than the 3.3??

[Brushless55]

The esc was the toughest part of the truck LOL! I went through tires, driveline parts and countless bodies, its amazing how uncontrollable these trucks are at 60+mph at WOT, especially when the tires grow! had to get MIP drive shafts just to handle high traction launches from a dead stop! Is the E-Revo tougher than the 3.3??

My ERevo is Awesome!
the only thing that has broken is the stock drive shafts.. 3 have given way of the massive torque of this 6XL :biggrin:

[FighterCat57]

My ERevo is Awesome!
the only thing that has broken is the stock drive shafts.. 3 have given way of the massive torque of this 6XL :biggrin:

MIP's and you're good to go! I've twisted a few of the stockers.

I get to do some top speed runs at the beach at low tide it's flat for miles!



HOTR will be carrying the Leopard, he says they are overpriced though.

[FighterCat57]

The esc was the toughest part of the truck LOL! I went through tires, driveline parts and countless bodies, its amazing how uncontrollable these trucks are at 60+mph at WOT, especially when the tires grow! had to get MIP drive shafts just to handle high traction launches from a dead stop! Is the E-Revo tougher than the 3.3??

I have 4 of them and yes. The transmission is more durable with bigger gears. Also the differentials in the E-Revo are re-enforced and stronger. The 3.3 diff's won't handle big brushless setups. The rest of the driveline is exactly the same.

[Steven Vaccaro]

Word is, HOTR will have these motors up on his site this Saturday..
and Steven will have them soon! :rockon2:

I only have a few coming in for testing. I rather test instead of customers being beta testers.

Someone said they are expensive. Anyone seen a retail cost yet?

[FighterCat57]

I only have a few coming in for testing. I rather test instead of customers being beta testers.

Someone said they are expensive. Anyone seen a retail cost yet?

I was told the discount cost was in the 80-90 range for the 4074, but not definite yet.

[Steven Vaccaro]

I was told the discount cost was in the 80-90 range for the 4074, but not definite yet.


Thanks for the info.

[Brushless55]

HOTR is starting to get these in his store
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280516847450&fromMakeTrack=true

[m4a1usr]

HOTR is starting to get these in his store
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280516847450&fromMakeTrack=true

He's priced them pretty well. Not too bad. Would like to see the 2200kv version come down to $80 or less. What bugs me about these copies is they come with 4mm bullets, the 3 motor wires are not long 10 ga multi colored leads. It makes you think what else have they changed? I want to see pictures of the rotors and end plates. They can claim anything they want but the proof is in the product. So far they are not equivalents just by the obvious differences and for that reason alone they should be way cheaper.

:popcorn2:

John

[ray schrauwen]

Look at the low amp rating and low Watt rating.... Tell tale sign's.... I'll wait to see someone push one...

Remember Scorpion is coming out with reasonably priced inrunners soon....

[Brushless55]

Look at the low amp rating and low Watt rating.... Tell tale sign's.... I'll wait to see someone push one...

Remember Scorpion is coming out with reasonably priced inrunners soon....

That to me has no real meaning...
I have a outrunner that is rated at 900watts, and I've seen 1850watts with my watt meter for a 3D plane!
Some companies under rate things and others like Castle has over rated some of their items..

[ray schrauwen]

I hear you. We'll see. Could be really nice, Steve will let us know. He will test them soon.

[Brushless55]

I hear you. We'll see. Could be really nice, Steve will let us know. He will test them soon.

I may put in an order in tonight for two, but I have nothing to put them in right now.. :confused1:

[Rumdog]

how about the 2200kv in that ul-1 in your avatar?

[Brushless55]

how about the 2200kv in that ul-1 in your avatar?

:w00t:

[sailr]

I don't believe there has been a total ban on shipping lipos but now they can ship only UP TO but not including 5500mah packs. That means anything bigger, you will have to build up by paralleling smaller packs.

It's a real bummer. We have lost some sales to the guys wanting 6500mAh hyperion packs.

BTW, we now sell the Hyperion G3 lipos. BEST in the world and great prices to our friends here at OSE. Special order only.


Very good news indeed. Anyone else hear word that Shipping lipos overseas from HK is going to stop?

[video200]

I only have a few coming in for testing. I rather test instead of customers being beta testers.

Someone said they are expensive. Anyone seen a retail cost yet?

now thats the way to go.
so hopfully people wil come to OSE to shop rather then to just look at the almighty $$. you cant beat service in the long run.

just my KR 2

[FighterCat57]

I don't believe there has been a total ban on shipping lipos but now they can ship only UP TO but not including 5500mah packs. That means anything bigger, you will have to build up by paralleling smaller packs.

It's a real bummer. We have lost some sales to the guys wanting 6500mAh hyperion packs.

BTW, we now sell the Hyperion G3 lipos. BEST in the world and great prices to our friends here at OSE. Special order only.

I did hear that HK is planning to stock Lipos in their US warehouse. From HK.

Just a question of...... When.

[Make-a-Wake]

now thats the way to go.
so hopfully people wil come to OSE to shop rather then to just look at the almighty $$. you cant beat service in the long run.

just my KR 2

:iagree: Steven has been very helpful to me with products and gladly answers all my general questions, I'd rather keep the money here as well.:bounce:

[bustitup]

My boats are full of that "cheap chi crap." Turnigy lipos, Seaking esc's, Castle/Neu motors, Feigao motors. I choose to run components that I have had good results with. I try less expensive things and if results are good, then I have no need to splurge. How do those quality USA Castle Hydra controllers seem to be doing lately? Do we call them cheap US crap?

LOL is amazing how a few "sparks" can turn your opinion around on castle

:beerchug:

[Brushless55]

I did hear that HK is planning to stock Lipos in their US warehouse. From HK.

Just a question of...... When.

They are stocking some things now.. :thumbup1:

[Blint]

He's priced them pretty well. Not too bad. Would like to see the 2200kv version come down to $80 or less. What bugs me about these copies is they come with 4mm bullets, the 3 motor wires are not long 10 ga multi colored leads. It makes you think what else have they changed? I want to see pictures of the rotors and end plates. They can claim anything they want but the proof is in the product. So far they are not equivalents just by the obvious differences and for that reason alone they should be way cheaper.

:popcorn2:

John

Here are some pictures.
The upper one is a leopard 4074, the other is a tekin t8

http://forum.rcmodell.hu/index.php/topic,72104.0.html

[ray schrauwen]

better with carbon wrap instead of kevlar

[MarkF]

this is the motor I ran in my Insane sport hydro. You can see the video in that thread. This is a good motor and you guys should like them alot.

Mark

[ray schrauwen]

What size prop can you turn with that motor in heat racing setup? P-Sport...

[Brushless55]

this is the motor I ran in my Insane sport hydro. You can see the video in that thread. This is a good motor and you guys should like them alot.

Mark

I see no water cooling, how did the temps read? :smile:

[Brushless55]

I only have a few coming in for testing. I rather test instead of customers being beta testers.

Someone said they are expensive. Anyone seen a retail cost yet?

Any word Steven of when your getting some motors?

[questtek]

I see no water cooling, how did the temps read? :smile:

I put an Eagle Tree system on the boat when Mark ran it. I believe the motor temp was around 110. If you search the site under a thread posted by MarkF I believe you can even find a video I posted of the Eagle Tree data playpack on my laptop from the run with the Leopard 4075.

There seems to be lots of interest and threads on the new Genesis. Here is some additional information that you may find of interest:

1. The stock Genesis set up by HobbyKing uses a 3674 2-pole brushless motor with Seaking 90A ESC turning a P1.4x 38mm Dia nylon prop. Stock speed is 60 kph or 37 MPH
2. The upgraded set up consists of a Leopard LB4074 4-pole brushless motor and Seaking 120A ESC turning a metal prop P1.4 x 40 mm dia. Stock speed with this set up is 75 kph or 47 MPH
3. The ultimate set up consists of two Leopard LB4074 4-pole brushless motors and Seaking 120A or upgrade to Seaking 180A ESC’s. Prop size is experimental. Estimated speed in excess of 60 MPH.

The motor is very efficient however it is easy to use a motor mount with integral water cooling and a factory installed silicon water jacket.

[Brushless55]

I put an Eagle Tree system on the boat when Mark ran it. I believe the motor temp was around 110. If you search the site under a thread posted by MarkF I believe you can even find a video I posted of the Eagle Tree data playpack on my laptop from the run with the Leopard 4075.

There seems to be lots of interest and threads on the new Genesis. Here is some additional information that you may find of interest:

1. The stock Genesis set up by HobbyKing uses a 3674 2-pole brushless motor with Seaking 90A ESC turning a P1.4x 38mm Dia nylon prop. Stock speed is 60 kph or 37 MPH
2. The upgraded set up consists of a Leopard LB4074 4-pole brushless motor and Seaking 120A ESC turning a metal prop P1.4 x 40 mm dia. Stock speed with this set up is 75 kph or 47 MPH
3. The ultimate set up consists of two Leopard LB4074 4-pole brushless motors and Seaking 120A or upgrade to Seaking 180A ESC’s. Prop size is experimental. Estimated speed in excess of 60 MPH.

The motor is very efficient however it is easy to use a motor mount with integral water cooling and a factory installed silicon water jacket.

110* that sounds awesome for no cooling
thanks :beerchug:

[questtek]

110* that sounds awesome for no cooling
thanks :beerchug:

I think it went up to 113F. You can see the vide3o of the Eagle Tree Data at:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4Cpf8CQZxQ

I asked Bill at Eagle Tree about the speed at 75 MPS and not a glitch - He did/could not explain it. Look at the high AMp draw and Watts....almost 3 HP!

[ray schrauwen]

So your Hydro did 75mph with the Leopard motor?

[Brushless55]

I think it went up to 113F. You can see the vide3o of the Eagle Tree Data at:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4Cpf8CQZxQ

I asked Bill at Eagle Tree about the speed at 75 MPS and not a glitch - He did/could not explain it. Look at the high AMp draw and Watts....almost 3 HP!

Very cool stuff, but I did not see the watts that equals 3hp?

[ray schrauwen]

I see a peak of 1782.2 watts, V x A= W
134 amps x 13.3 = 1782.2 divide by 746 = 2.38 HP

[Brushless55]

I see a peak of 1782.2 watts, V x A= W
134 amps x 13.3 = 1782.2 divide by 746 = 2.38 HP

That's what I came up with but he said "almost 3hp" :confused1:
so my math is correct with yours

[m4a1usr]

It appears that HK has a ARTR hull with the Leopard 2200kv motor installed. Not a bad looker either for the bux. http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11892&Product_Name=Osprey_Brushless_V-Hull_R/C_Boat_(1075mm)_Plug-n-Drive


John

[Brushless55]

It appears that HK has a ARTR hull with the Leopard 2200kv motor installed. Not a bad looker either for the bux. http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11892&Product_Name=Osprey_Brushless_V-Hull_R/C_Boat_(1075mm)_Plug-n-Drive


John

Yah, someone on OSE has that boat and has taken out the motor to put something else in it...

[ray schrauwen]

The motor is very efficient however it is easy to use a motor mount with integral water cooling and a factory installed silicon water jacket.

How tight is this motor compared to a Neu, I mean the way the shaft turns?

What does it "feel" like?

[MarkF]

The motor has a lot of cog and is hard to turn. That doesn't means anything when comparring motors though. There's also a reason why this motor cost less than half of a Neu. Only time will tell how well these motors hold up over time. I think this motor is fine for sport boaters looking for a cheap alternative and not wanting the best.

Mark

[ray schrauwen]

Thank you, nice info.

I have bought really cheasy 4 pole chinese motors before that had cogg, not much and were woefully inefficient. It was a $20 motor... I use it to test esc's now.

[focused]

Any news on the Big 5692 series if they are selling them and were ? I sent them a email but did not get a reply on it i want to test 2 of them in my next project , MHZ Drambui on Ice 53"catamaran.

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/5711/dr1y.jpg

[Brushless55]

That looks like a fun project!

[questtek]

That's what I came up with but he said "almost 3hp" :confused1:
so my math is correct with yours

The short video of the Eagle Tree data from the Insane Hydro was only a portion of the run. At the end of the run when the Eagle Tree data is downloaded in the computer it displays MAX values for all the parameters recorded. The attached pic shows this MAX display and you can see the Max WATTS was 2257.

Doing the math with this MAX WATT value yields 2257/746 = 3.025 HP

Hope this clears things up.

[Brushless55]

3hp, that's awesome!

[Xfactor]

The only tru test is to run these motors and you will likely find that this "chinese" stuff isnt quite the garbage some think it is.Hey focused thats a PHAT CAT.

[Xfactor]

I see a peak of 1782.2 watts, V x A= W
134 amps x 13.3 = 1782.2 divide by 746 = 2.38 HP
lets not forget that would be peak not continuous.I reall question if horsepower is relevant. Isnt torque what we should be looking at. KT X AMPS? 1 divided by kv=kt rite? KT x Amps = torque rite?

[Xfactor]

It seems the voltage and amperage are relevant but not necessarily in the name of horse power .Voltage gives me my rpm and the torque lets me Know the strength i have to turn that prop at that rpm. The more torque the less difference between the loaded and unloaded rpm rite?

[focused]

.Hey focused thats a PHAT CAT.


thnx , i hope they sell the big leopards soon i have 2 150 amp 8s modellbau esc and in combination with the 5692/1340 on 8s is just fun.
The drambuie is even bigger than a HPR135.

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/4641/boten.jpg

[m4a1usr]

The short video of the Eagle Tree data from the Insane Hydro was only a portion of the run. At the end of the run when the Eagle Tree data is downloaded in the computer it displays MAX values for all the parameters recorded. The attached pic shows this MAX display and you can see the Max WATTS was 2257.

Doing the math with this MAX WATT value yields 2257/746 = 3.025 HP

Hope this clears things up.

I'm still not buying the data. How can a motor that is a copy produce more power then the original? A Neu only makes 1250 watts continous. 2500 watts surge. The Neu/castle is at rated less. You want us to buy that a motor built with lesser quality components beats an expensive hand made motor? Somethings amiss here. Steve has done a very decent job at NeuMotors to provide empirical data to sell his products. Some of you folks would buy sand if you lived in the desert.

John

[Brushless55]

I'm still not buying the data. How can a motor that is a copy produce more power then the original? A Neu only makes 1250 watts continous. 2500 watts surge. The Neu/castle is at rated less. You want us to buy that a motor built with lesser quality components beats an expensive hand made motor? Somethings amiss here. Steve has done a very decent job at NeuMotors to provide empirical data to sell his products. Some of you folks would buy sand if you lived in the desert.

John

:olleyes:
what is listed from NEU is not what we could actually see out in the water or in any RC
that's what they have posted but just as most any brushless motor they can pull much more than what they are rated to
even the UL-1 and SV motors make much more power than their ratings :Peace_Sign:

[crabstick]

You want us to buy that a motor built with lesser quality components beats an expensive hand made motor? Somethings amiss here.



Have you pulled one apart and inspected the components ?

[m4a1usr]

Have you pulled one apart and inspected the components ?

Do I need to? Lets state the facts right up front. The motor wires are not the same color or gauge or of the same length and do not have the same end connections? The motor face plate has 4 screws and not 3 like the original that its copied from. Do we see a trend here? Now look at the comments from Castle themseves. They saw them at a trade show and they are built with less quality components! Words that that speak volumes if you care to listen.

What do you guys need? A road map? Hoping is not the same as proven. Factual evidence has shown them to be of less quality. Yet you persist? I dont get it. Parts do not interchange! So they are the same? You live in a different world for sure.

John

[MarkF]

Yes we have. Joe has some pics of one he took apart. I'll let him post them if he wants.
John, the Neus are capaple of double the rated watts for short periods. I ran a 1521 in an
F3D pylon plane once on 12s 3850s pulling 110 amps. This plane would make your ears ring the prop noise was so loud. Your also right about the quality but I try not get involved with trying to convince people.

Mark

[Rumdog]

Here is what I need. I need to have one in a boat and have it perform like sh*$ before I dis it. The problem is that people are calling it a clone. Obviously it looks similar to a Neu/Castle, BUT obviously it looks different in many ways. Clone? not so much. questtek has been running the motors, and successfully with data to prove it. He also runs with a lot of guys who know there sh*$. I'll tale his word, that for the money, it's an excellent motor. Seems you just don't like it because its Chinese. Don't buy it then. Barely more money than a Feigao xl motor, and probably better. What's not to like?

[crabstick]

@ John - So you haven't tested one yourself, don't accept the real world testing data, and have not personally inspected the components you call inferior, but you take the word of a potential rival company, who has a very bad history of their ESC's going up in smoke, in a lot of cases for no apparent reason... interesting. :confused2:

So the motor wires are different color, gauge and length.
The Screws on the endplate's are different....
:doh:
As for Castle's comments, Seriously John are they going to come out and say " Wow these leopard hobby motors are not to bad, not quite as good as our castle/neus but not too bad for the money "

I think the core argument here is ARE THEY AN OK MOTOR VALUE FOR MONEY WISE. And are quite possibly based on a castle\neu

:olleyes:

[Brushless55]

Here is what I need. I need to have one in a boat and have it perform like sh*$ before I dis it. The problem is that people are calling it a clone. Obviously it looks similar to a Neu/Castle, BUT obviously it looks different in many ways. Clone? not so much. questtek has been running the motors, and successfully with data to prove it. He also runs with a lot of guys who know there sh*$. I'll tale his word, that for the money, it's an excellent motor. Seems you just don't like it because its Chinese. Don't buy it then. Barely more money than a Feigao xl motor, and probably better. What's not to like?

:iagree:

[m4a1usr]

@ John - So you haven't tested one yourself, don't accept the real world testing data, and have not personally inspected the components you call inferior, but you take the word of a potential rival company, who has a very bad history of their ESC's going up in smoke, in a lot of cases for no apparent reason... interesting. :confused2:

So the motor wires are different color, gauge and length.
The Screws on the endplate's are different....
:doh:
As for Castle's comments, Seriously John are they going to come out and say " Wow these leopard hobby motors are not to bad, not quite as good as our castle/neus but not too bad for the money "

I think the core argument here is ARE THEY AN OK MOTOR VALUE FOR MONEY WISE. And are quite possibly based on a castle\neu

:olleyes:

If your of that attitude that I cannot argue with you. You are polarized upon cost. And that will win everytime. I know. I have been sitting right in the same position you are in my past. Nothing I can say will sway you and until facts present themselves showing the dollar value over time its a case of usable product for a dollar amount thats going to be spent. I cant win with that view point. I'm not trying to show folks its money ill spent. I just want the uninformed to not make a leap of assumption and not waste their money with certain expectations. This is a sales and product moderation topic with less then accurate description definitions.

The consumer should be informed without assumptions or mis representations. But I digress.

John

[Brushless55]

If your of that attitude that I cannot argue with you. You are polarized upon cost. And that will win everytime. I know. I have been sitting right in the same position you are in my past. Nothing I can say will sway you and until facts present themselves showing the dollar value over time its a case of usable product for a dollar amount thats going to be spent. I cant win with that view point. I'm not trying to show folks its money ill spent. I just want the uninformed to not make a leap of assumption and not waste their money with certain expectations. This is a sales and product moderation topic with less then accurate description definitions.

The consumer should be informed without assumptions or mis representations. But I digress.

John

So how can someone dis a motor they have never tried??
and to move others away from this product they have never tried?? :confused2:

[crabstick]

So whats for dinner? :bounce:

Not polarized by cost at all..... Polarized by bang for buck.
I think if its a step up from a Fiegao, and costs not a lot more, its got to be good for the hobby in general, more people racing, and going faster! :rockon2:

We run a few limited spec electric classes at our club, without the chinese motors, they would not exist purely based on cost. Most of the FE racers also have Gas and Nitro boats at our club so they have to stretch funds over a wide range of boats. I think motors like these if they turn out to be as reliable as the trusty Fiegao will really help the hobby, promote FE and get more boats on the water

[Brushless55]

I would love to have Mike build me a JAE 21FE with one of these 4074 2200kv motors and a Turnigy 180 speedo
going fast on a budget :rockon2:

[Himalaya]

Look at the logo, shall we just call it a PUMA Sport motor? :popcorn2:

http://www.saisai.com/attach_img/logo/200811/12269940905534.gif

[ray schrauwen]

ooops, sorry, mis-understood, retract.... dumb canuk...

[Brushless55]

Look at the logo, shall we just call it a PUMA Sport motor? :popcorn2:

http://www.saisai.com/attach_img/logo/200811/12269940905534.gif

the motor that kicks! :banana:

[crabstick]

our n2 spec classes is limited to 2 pole inrunner S Size Fiegao's and clones. ( I got first equal at club champs in N2 hydro running a cheap HK 8s with a modded campbell shovel)

p-restricted is 2 pole inrunner XL size can Fiegao's and clones.

[Himalaya]

Funny here how people say its a clone of Castle/Neu just by its appearance. Was there anyone except Einstein really invented something WITHOUT a previously existing model ?

I saw HUNDREDS of different Leopard Hobby motors on their booth on an RC Expo in early May. dia. from 28mm, 36mm, 40mm... all the way to 56mm mammoth motors, each with multiple length versions. They also provide smooth can/finned can, sensorless/sensored, 2 pole/4 pole, delta/wye, all KV values, stiff leads/silicone wire/solder tab, colors in red/green/gold/grey/black......
...... How many motors does Castle have? Does Castle offer all those different designs? Unsurprisingly some would say they may have copied from multiple manufactures...... Well, Plettenberg also makes multi-pole, multi slot high efficiency motor(like Neu) and has longer history in this industry, so does Neu copied anything from Plett? Medusa as a similarly constructed product of great value, does Medusa copied anything from Neu? Microsoft claims they are the first to offer graphical OS, didn't they "learn" something from Apple? I guess the answer is a crispy NO just because they are American companies ?? :confused2:

Look at the fins in this pic, the design allows more airflow in buggy/truck applications for it meet the direction wind blows. Did Castle design their motor this way ? :popcorn2:

[Himalaya]

Well, some pics of the 4074 motors for you guys if interested. (mine are slightly bigger, 4174 in size). They are going to push my HPR115 to an unknown speed. :tongue_smilie:

[crabstick]

carbon wrapped rotor... nice

I want to test one!

[westbeach]

Where did you get the 4174? What is the rating for that?


Well, some pics of the 4074 motors for you guys if interested. (mine are slightly bigger, 4174 in size). They are going to push my HPR115 to an unknown speed. :tongue_smilie:

[BondoBrushless]

Dont hold your breath with these motors even being as good as a Castle Mill let alone a genuine NEU, but for the hobbiest on a tight budget they might be his only option.
Cant knock a guy with a limited budget ?

This is a post by Patrick from Castle on the RCMonster forum .

""Saw these guys in a Chinese model show about a year ago. It's a clone, but uses cheaper components. There are several Castle/Neu clones on the market right now, but none are nearly as good quality -- most use .35mm laminations, where the Castle/Neu uses .2mm laminations, and every one we've seen so far uses inferior bearings, and inferior magnets. These are the most expensive parts of the motor -- and are the most often "skimped" components.

Just going from a .35mm lamination to a .2mm lamination more than doubles the cost of the stator -- but the performance difference at high RPM is extreme...

So you get what you pay for.""

Thread can be read here;
http://www.rc-monster.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27209

[m4a1usr]

Well, some pics of the 4074 motors for you guys if interested. (mine are slightly bigger, 4174 in size). They are going to push my HPR115 to an unknown speed. :tongue_smilie:

Motor comparison is good stuff! This is a Castle/Neu 1515/1Y motor.

John

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af218/m4a1usr/DSCN4404.jpg

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af218/m4a1usr/DSCN4405-1.jpg

http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af218/m4a1usr/DSCN4406.jpg


http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/af218/m4a1usr/DSCN4407.jpg

[Brushless55]

Dont hold your breath with these motors even being as good as a Castle Mill let alone a genuine NEU, but for the hobbiest on a tight budget they might be his only option.
Cant knock a guy with a limited budget ?

This is a post by Patrick from Castle on the RCMonster forum .

""Saw these guys in a Chinese model show about a year ago. It's a clone, but uses cheaper components. There are several Castle/Neu clones on the market right now, but none are nearly as good quality -- most use .35mm laminations, where the Castle/Neu uses .2mm laminations, and every one we've seen so far uses inferior bearings, and inferior magnets. These are the most expensive parts of the motor -- and are the most often "skimped" components.

Just going from a .35mm lamination to a .2mm lamination more than doubles the cost of the stator -- but the performance difference at high RPM is extreme...

So you get what you pay for.""

Thread can be read here;
http://www.rc-monster.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27209

Just a hint :spy:

[Brushless55]

is it just me or has anyone else noticed the price of the Castle 1515 going down?
Hmmmm... :spy:

[Brushless55]

Any news on the Big 5692 series if they are selling them and were ? I sent them a email but did not get a reply on it i want to test 2 of them in my next project , MHZ Drambui on Ice 53"catamaran.

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/5711/dr1y.jpg

Is this the size of a Neu 2215? :confused2:

[m4a1usr]

is it just me or has anyone else noticed the price of the Castle 1515 going down?
Hmmmm... :spy:

Definately. I can find them regularly for what would have been a steal just 2 months ago. And brand new. But I guess thats what drives the market. Tough business to be in for the store fronts.

John

[BondoBrushless]

Is this the size of a Neu 2215? :confused2:

This is.
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k192/bondonutz/RC%20Pics%20for%20FORUM%20purposes/P5050001.jpg
http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k192/bondonutz/RC%20Pics%20for%20FORUM%20purposes/P5050004.jpg

Borrowed from a fellow RCM members post

[FighterCat57]

I want one.

[Brushless55]

Looks very close to a 5692

[mappo]

Well, some pics of the 4074 motors for you guys if interested. (mine are slightly bigger, 4174 in size). They are going to push my HPR115 to an unknown speed. :tongue_smilie:

http://forum.rcmodell.hu/index.php?PHPSESSID=c08f429331eb285875c0f7d3639843 3b&topic=72104.msg882006#msg882006

[Blint]

http://forum.rcmodell.hu/index.php?PHPSESSID=c08f429331eb285875c0f7d3639843 3b&topic=72104.msg882006#msg882006

This motor on the picture was mine:)

My fellow who own's a hobby shop, also ordered a few 5692 for testing.
If anyone interested please pm me today, I can get some
The price will be around USD200...

[BondoBrushless]

$200.00 american ?

[vasy]

I had a few runs on my Leopard 2200, so far seems good.
On 4s and x440 it pulls nice and stays cool with the stock silicon jacket.
Will be getting Neu 1515 cooling jacket, will see how it fits.

Will see how it compares to the Castle/Neu of the same KV that I have coming.

[Blint]

$200.00 american ?

Yes

[Unsullied_Spy]

Seems to me that people are looking at this in the wrong way. Maybe it is a knock-off and maybe it isn't. I'd rather buy one of these Leopard motors than a Feigao, it's built off a more with-the-times design and from the little I've heard from people that own them they perform quite well. I'm sure a CC Neu will be better quality and for sure backed by better service, and it's up to YOU whether or not that's worth the extra money. Then you have a genuine black can Neu which you cannot deny is a very high quality motor but at a rather steep price. Perhaps these can fill the niche in the market left hollow by Medusa stepping out of the RC motor market?

[crabstick]

Anyone Else been running/testing these motors ?

[MarkF]

Vasy, I suggest you stick a 447 prop on that motor if you want to wake it up.
Crabstick, have you seen all the videos of the leapord motor in the Insane hydro? Consistent 65 mph with a pitched up H6 prop and 4s 1p lipos. Are you still not sold yet?

Mark

[questtek]

Seems to me that people are looking at this in the wrong way. Maybe it is a knock-off and maybe it isn't. I'd rather buy one of these Leopard motors than a Feigao, it's built off a more with-the-times design and from the little I've heard from people that own them they perform quite well. I'm sure a CC Neu will be better quality and for sure backed by better service, and it's up to YOU whether or not that's worth the extra money. Then you have a genuine black can Neu which you cannot deny is a very high quality motor but at a rather steep price. Perhaps these can fill the niche in the market left hollow by Medusa stepping out of the RC motor market?

Very well stated and an opinion shared by many of the FE guys here. One comment was that the Leopard appeared to be "about 90% or so of a Neu and about 1/3rd the cost". Guys have had great success with it in the new Insane Hydro and you can look into that particular post started by Properchopper (Tony) to get more details. Here are pics of a dyno test set up I just finished with a 4074Leopard mounted in the test fixture. I will post more info on it in the forums under a separate thread: "Brushless Motor Comparison Testing"

[crabstick]

Crabstick, have you seen all the videos of the leapord motor in the Insane hydro? Consistent 65 mph with a pitched up H6 prop and 4s 1p lipos. Are you still not sold yet?

Mark


I have seen a few videos, Pretty sold to be honest, Just wondering if anyone else testing other winds etc.

[Brushless55]

Very well stated and an opinion shared by many of the FE guys here. One comment was that the Leopard appeared to be "about 90% or so of a Neu and about 1/3rd the cost". Guys have had great success with it in the new Insane Hydro and you can look into that particular post started by Properchopper (Tony) to get more details. Here are pics of a dyno test set up I just finished with a 4074Leopard mounted in the test fixture. I will post more info on it in the forums under a separate thread.

Looking forward to it :thumbup1:

[mmyska]

Looking forward to it :thumbup1:

Hi all,
some more detailed pics of leopard 4074 1050KV here:

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0105.jpg

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0097.jpg

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0099.jpg

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0100.jpg

And next via links only:
http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0101.jpg

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0103.jpg

http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0104.jpg


http://img2.rajce.idnes.cz/d5/3/3880/3880237_5bba3f344e9f3c9ddc647027cb90c6bf/images/IMG_0094.jpg
:olleyes:

[LiPo Power]

Wicked pictures and great thread....
I had this motor, 2000KV in my hands and trust me it felt good. Well made, heavy jut like 1521, good looking.
Never had a chance to run it but I feel this motor will go fare....
http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=leo-4074
Robert

[mmyska]

The above pictures shows carbon woven rotor. Stator is very similar to NEU-Castle. I have 4 Leopard motors, have tested Only 3 of them yet. Motor runs cool and quite ane perform very well in compparision to my old Feigao 580L

[NativePaul]

Just to clear this up, I have only seen them recently and thought Leopard were Castle clones too, but one of my friends said that leopard have been going for ages and he got a number of 4 pole test samples from them several years ago with a view to importing them, this was well before castle brought out their motors, they may both be copies of NeuMotors but if there is any cloning between CC and Leopard it is the other way round.

[Steven Vaccaro]

they may both be copies of NeuMotors but if there is any cloning between CC and Leopard it is the other way round.

I have to argue the fact that Castle has NOT copied Leopard. Castle has openly stated and prints on their boxes. "Designed by Steve Neu and Castle Creations". Making statements like that is not productive.

[m4a1usr]

How tight is this motor compared to a Neu, I mean the way the shaft turns?

What does it "feel" like?

They definately do not feel the same. The CC/Neu 1515 1Y cogs on parr with the original Neu 1515 design. The Leopard 4074 has a noticably different feel. Much less force is required to turn it by hand. But in defense of the 4074 it runs very well on 4S. I tried a 1515 and a 4074 in the same UL1 hull, using the same prop/esc/batts and there was no noticable speed difference. The Neu consumed less batts so I could run longer. Thats the only measureable I could quantify.

Now on a side note I have to replace the bearings on my 4074. When I was changing out motors I knocked the Leopard off the bench onto the floor!:cursing:

Luckily there was no case damage. It landed on its side where the Neu cooling jacket had been installed! :doh:


John

[norbique]

So, how far did we get from the CCC (Cheap Chinese Crap) statement? Anyone not owning a leopard yet? Anyone not willing to own one? Just my 2c.

[m4a1usr]

So, how far did we get from the CCC (Cheap Chinese Crap) statement? Anyone not owning a leopard yet? Anyone not willing to own one? Just my 2c.

Glad you brought this thread back to life. I saw it just a few days ago doing a search and I wanted to revive it but couldnt think of a reason to.

As far as the CCC statement, personally I think the jury is still out. Its not been all that long since some of us have begun using Leopards or the "other" variation copies. I dont like what I see in some motor versions when it comes to bearings. We have read about a recent bearing failure in the big 5692 series. The motor was hardly used. A fluke? Not enough people running the motor right now in the winter to offer a fair opinion.

With so many folks running one of the various 4074 series I would have thought a consensus would be obvious? Its not. Not that its been disfavorable in any manner but its just been silent. The 4082 series seems to have demonstrated to offer some good power options but not any better then a cheaper $70 CC/Neu 1717 or someone selling a $120 1518 or 1520,..right?

I will still say from personal ownership and experience that when you open up a Neu motor, open up a CC/Neu, open up a Leopard motor, then go to another spin off the quality gets lower at each step. So when you look at a $59 Tacon 4074/2150kv compared to a $110 Castle/Neu 1515 its not all that hard to see why the heck would you buy the Tacon for $59 if there are obvious differences? The quality difference is just plain obvious when you crack open the cans. Performance can only be obtained by buying one and running it. Now the Leopards seem to be close. But they are almost the same price as a CC/Neu. Your not saving all that much money. If your wondering where can you get NIB CC/Neu for $110 look around folks. Its not all that hard.

So again. Why buy a $95 Leopard when you can get a $110 CC/Neu? I have learned my lesson. Not that a Leopard is junk but for $15 difference I will stick to the better made, better quality, better design motor. Besides,... resale will always be better for the motor with a better reputation and user base. Just my 2 cents.

John

[Himalaya]

Good point. I have to agree with you there are differences in workmanship between those similar designed motors. But Leopard has at least one advantage over CC, a huge variation to choose from, D and Y windings, 1.2.3...turns, diff. Lengths...... While CC's 15xx series has only 4, all are 1Y winding, same design, KV varied just by changing the length.

Neu OTOH, also offers all possible variations, but it's lead time is horrible. When I ask for a 2220 they can't even provide an availability schedule. Surely the original Neu has amazing performance but I still think the can make details better. I thank myself very much for I did an inspection before using my brand new 2230, it's strong rigid leads had their shrink wrap cut open by the rear endcap. I can see the endcap is actually touching the copper wire.

Any company that can survive in this market has their reason.

[m4a1usr]

But Leopard has at least one advantage over CC, a huge variation to choose from, D and Y windings, 1.2.3...turns, diff. Lengths......


Yes. The very reason why the Leopard and other motors will compete and survive. Choices with good pricing. No matter what, honest competition will give the user the option he seeks.

I'm happy to see options. Gives the consumer choices. Will we see a SAW record at Legg lake this year powered by a Leopard? I dont know. We will see a Neu and or Lehner set a record? Thats almost garanteed. At Valadosta could the next record in a just a few months be set with a Chinese motor? Maybe. But its almost with certainty a quality motor is going to do it.

So you have to ask yourself. If they are so equal why arent they setting NAMBA or IMPBA records after being on the market now for awhile? Do we need more time to prove their capability? I say yes. But the facts will simply speak for themselves over time and performance.

John

[ray schrauwen]

The CC motors have only recently dropped in price to what was mentioned. Six months ago the prices were quite higher.

That said, I was looking at them and thinking, maybe another green motor...

I've got a 1717 and a 2028 coming from Oz...

The 1717 looks really nice compared to the leopards and further clones.

I still have a few leopards & tacons too.... Less Neu motors.

I'm looking forward to trying the 4082-2200kv in my p-sport when the ice is gone, heck I'm just looking forward to the ice melting!!

[Chris Harris]

Neu OTOH, also offers all possible variations, but it's lead time is horrible. When I ask for a 2220 they can't even provide an availability schedule. Surely the original Neu has amazing performance but I still think the can make details better. I thank myself very much for I did an inspection before using my brand new 2230, it's strong rigid leads had their shrink wrap cut open by the rear endcap. I can see the endcap is actually touching the copper wire.

Any company that can survive in this market has their reason.

Their extended lead time probably has a lot to do with them surviving in this market. It costs a lot of money to have a bunch of overstock, whereas if you only build what has been ordered you are guaranteed a return on the investment in parts. I remember when you could order a Neu and have it in a week or so but obviously something had to change.
My feeling is the best things are worth waiting for anyway.

Chris

[Himalaya]

So you have to ask yourself. If they are so equal why arent they setting NAMBA or IMPBA records after being on the market now for awhile? Do we need more time to prove their capability? I say yes. But the facts will simply speak for themselves over time and performance.

John

You are right. Would anyone think $90 motors "are so equal" to $200 ones? When trying to set a record, would anyone possibly try to save a hundred bucks or 2 using an ecnomical motor? Those guys in Shenzhen are pretty clear about their location in market segments, I guess. Guys at lake bank are also aware of what they paid for.



Their extended lead time probably has a lot to do with them surviving in this market. It costs a lot of money to have a bunch of overstock, whereas if you only build what has been ordered you are guaranteed a return on the investment in parts. I remember when you could order a Neu and have it in a week or so but obviously something had to change.
My feeling is the best things are worth waiting for anyway.

Chris

Based on what I was told they were actually waiting for their magnets made and shipped, from China... Yes, that's the country where the Leopards are from.:laugh:

Fortunately we still have Steven that keep some Neu stock, and better price than Neu and CC's websites. :thumbup: I got my 2230 here in OSE, that's really an amazing motor. and with a deeper look into it i though the wait worthy best is still possible to go one step closer to perfection. :tongue_smilie:

[jamie]

Here in australia i can get a replacement 3674 leopard for $75 bucks... the usa neu equiv. would set me back around $300 :sad:

I wish that i could afford them as i have no doubt about the quality and the performance speaks for themselves, but my 3 leopards are going strong, dont get hot and provide what i need. Hopeing to give one a good run in a fe30 shortly when it arrives:thumbup: