Upgrade motors for King of Shaves

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Good morning fellas, I've decided to join in on the fun. I'm doing a big block upgrade on this boat, I've already machined the motor mounts to accept 540 big bolt pattern.

This upgrade will take a few weeks as I'm waiting for the motors to come from Novak I just ordered yesterday

I will be gutting all electronics as far as radio gear, servo, wire harness etc.
I ran a bone stock one at the saws and trapped her at 50mph.

I like the way this hull runs and not only do I disagree that its scale geometry isnt good for a model, but I believe in the right hands this hull can hit 70plus

My first setup will incorperate 2 Novak 4.5 HV systems..
I will try the 32mm props then see where the 36mm props get me.

My first setup willl not incorperate counter rotating props.

[Brushless55]

I cannot wait to see the video of your Novak EKOS ! :rockon2:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok fellas, I'm gonna' start this upgrade thread..

1) after removing the motor and speedo on both sides, I bent the mount forward to expose the 2 screws that fasten the aluminum mount to the steel anchor which is glassed in.

2) I marked the 540 hole pattern in the mount I simply widened the existing hole by approx 3/16 without making it any longer vertically

3) with a dremel, I clamped it in a vice and went to work

4) I matched up the 540 and used a large conical washer on the stock motor mount screws and voila, she's ready to bolt back in the hull

[Brushless55]

twin bigs! :bowdown:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Well boys, the motor fits, and an octura flex hex fits almost perfectly.
So far, it looks like the boat itself can be converted to accept the big bolt pattern and motors for around 16bux! (the price of the couplers)

[Rumdog]

Bill's boat is going to FLY!!!

[C-Mac]

Bill,

No cooling jackets on those 540's?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Bill,

No cooling jackets on those 540's?

Indeed they will be jacketed, the one pictured was for setup purposes.
I'll be using the new Novak 4.5hv with adjustable timing and removable stator
I'll probably go with ETTI jackets

They're actually 550 bl motors http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ballistic_550/index.html

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I went ahead and upgraded the screws on the motor mount to 3.0 x 6mm countersunk machine screws (hex head) Dubro pn #2285.
The philips head screws were difficult to gain leverage on, and to eliminate the need for maintinence i went with Zap thread lock and cinched them down very snug.

That's one area of vibration that's not easily accessible..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I had to do it..
I got rid of the gorgeous battery tray to open setup options. I chisled the excess epoxy off the belly pan with an exacto it actually came out clean

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I was a bit rough with the mounts and will need to re-glass them in for peace of mind.
Here is where I have cut the cloth and sized it to fit.

I went with great planes fiberglass tape heavy (25mm) and will be using 30 minute epoxy

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok Gents, I impregnated the cloth with epoxy, then carpeted them in with this epoxy brush..

I saturated the areas around the steel mount with resin to get a solid bond..

[forescott]

Indeed they will be jacketed, the one pictured was for setup purposes.
I'll be using the new Novak 4.5hv with adjustable timing and removable stator
I'll probably go with ETTI jackets

They're actually 550 bl motors http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ballistic_550/index.html

Are those motors 4800kv??

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Are those motors 4800kv??


Really close sir, 5,000kv. I've been advised to run either the GTB or kinetic ESC.
Novak has machined an optional marine heat sink for its new kinetic speedo.

I'll be running it on 2s per leg..

[forescott]

What kind of battery setup are you thinkin? I have the 380-9xls in my e.k.o.s. but have always wanted to upgrade to 540's. :thumbup1:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

What kind of battery setup are you thinkin? I have the 380-9xls in my e.k.o.s. but have always wanted to upgrade to 540's. :thumbup1:

My first tug was gonna be with some 50c 5200 2s packs one for each side..

[Jeff Wohlt]

Bill, you staying with the stock cables? I have better ones and better couplers to hold the power.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Bill, you staying with the stock cables? I have better ones and better couplers to hold the power.

I was gonna' PM you about that..
I just went into the strut because it had a failed bearing.

I upgraded to some Boca Bearings, and got to thinking about the cables, and couplers.
I will definitely be using you..

Wait, that didn't come out right, I'm sure you don't appreciate being "used" :laugh:

I'm gonna need some rather short 5mm to 130 aluminum couplers. If you machine 'em especially for the king of shaves, I suggest tapering the motor end to accomidate the output hole in the motor mount. That way it can recess deeper for more support and truer running

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Well, I got 'em in.. 2 Novak HV motors. They're different winds otherwise I'd be runnin' 'em tomorrow. :w00t:
new style adjustable timing HV motors coming soon..

It feels great to have the opportunity for you guys to see how I go about things. This boat is different like me, and I feel we're a fun combo lol!!
I feel good about the glassed in steel motor mount anchor idea. It could eliminate the need for a front support guilatine on longer motors.

[Jeff Wohlt]

I was used for 15 years but she is gone now...LOL

Yes I make them to fit the length they need. Sure I can taper them at that end but never have yet.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

The best way to describe a king of shaves is someone took a gamma ray and shrunk the real boat down to 1/16 scale. Never have I seen a boat with so much detail especially rtr.
Its a concourse winner out of the box

I'm not a product "fluffer" just a serious appreciator of quality models. Anyone who owns one or has really taken a look at the thing would agree..

[Jeff Wohlt]

Bill...pm me a measurement of the space from the motor to the stuffing tube...I may have a better idea for you for a coupler. How long is that motor shaft sticking out ?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Bill...pm me a measurement of the space from the motor to the stuffing tube...I may have a better idea for you for a coupler. How long is that motor shaft sticking out ?


Will do..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok boys, Airtronics wanted me to try a hot new servo in their 2010 line.
Its a low profile job with GOBS of torque for its size, remarkable speed and pinpoint accuracy.

Venom radios are excellent but we will be upgrading this boat to all Airtronics plugs, wiring, and componnents

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I'm now back from Kauai and have been notified that a box comes from Novak today!
Let's see what we've got, we may be running her soon!!

[forescott]

I thought I would post some speed results on my ekos. I ran it today on a new pair of turnigy 5000mah 35-45c 3s lipos. I was replacing my venom 5400mah 20c lipos I originally purchased with the boat. I wanted to run 3s instead of 4s to test out my new cooling and get a little more run-time with less heat. Still using my CF-40's I got her up to 46.2 mph on garmin gps! I thought this was very fast for 3s considering I only got 36mph previously on my ammo 2700's with the same props and old venom packs! :banana:

[C-Mac]

Nice results forescott. what model of garmin are you using?

[forescott]

I use the forerunner 101. I like its small size/low weight

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Thanx for the update Forescott! Yes that IS fast for 3s.
How was the torque? did it launch "snappier', did it hold its speed in the corners?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok boys, back to the project at hand, what I've done here is a procedure I call "carpeting"

After removing the battery tray, and all of its epoxy residue, i wiped the glass center pod down with solvent to get a clean mating surface, then carpeted the whole belly pan with velcro.

I like going this route at first to give me versatility in component placement for CG.

[forescott]

Thanx for the update Forescott! Yes that IS fast for 3s.
How was the torque? did it launch "snappier', did it hold its speed in the corners?
Definetly feels torquier. Not sure about the cornering ability. I take the corners like my grandmother in her 1968 mercury cougar. Slow and easy!

[FighterCat57]

Ok boys, back to the project at hand, what I've done here is a procedure I call "carpeting"

After removing the battery tray, and all of its epoxy residue, i wiped the glass center pod down with solvent to get a clean mating surface, then carpeted the whole belly pan with velcro.

I like going this route at first to give me versatility in component placement for CG.

By carpeting, are you using the loop side of the velcro? I get so much "loop lint" when I do it that way. Mix it with a bit of shaft grease and bilge water and it can get nasty. I've started using the hook side on the boat and putting the loop on the devices. Just curious which way it's going in and why. The "carpeted" loop side does help soak up any water inside though. =)
________
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[BILL OXIDEAN]

By carpeting, are you using the loop side of the velcro? I get so much "loop lint" when I do it that way. Mix it with a bit of shaft grease and bilge water and it can get nasty. I've started using the hook side on the boat and putting the loop on the devices. Just curious which way it's going in and why. The "carpeted" loop side does help soak up any water inside though. =)

Hey Benjamin, I'm trying to upload pics but it wont let me, I use the hook side in the boat and the "fuzzy" side on devices. Yes the fuzzy soaks a little water, but will also retain water in the hull..

It dosen't make a huge difference more one of prefference..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Turns out the box that came from Novak was speedos..
2 newer series GTB speedos.

The new ones have a clear case. I love clear cases..

I want to try to get away with placing the speedos here..

[FighterCat57]

Hey Benjamin, I'm trying to upload pics but it wont let me, I use the hook side in the boat and the "fuzzy" side on devices. Yes the fuzzy soaks a little water, but will also retain water in the hull..

It dosen't make a huge difference more one of preference..

Nice. :thumbup1:
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[forescott]

Turns out the box that came from Novak was speedos..
2 newer series GTB speedos.

The new ones have a clear case. I love clear cases..

I want to try to get away with placing the speedos here..
Where are you gonna put the batteries?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Where are you gonna put the batteries?


Great question sir, I'm going to try and get away with running them in the sponsons just ahead of the motors.

I idealy run cats that way, it keeps the weight low in the hull, the batteries benefit from the modest cooling, and it seems an all around more stable way to run a cat.

Next, I'll "carpet" the sponsons..

[forescott]

Only problem is, that puts your c.o.g. waaaay forward. It'll be hard to get optimum speed/handling. Worth a try! At least the ekos would lose some of its top-heaviness.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Only problem is, that puts your c.o.g. waaaay forward. It'll be hard to get optimum speed/handling. Worth a try! At least the ekos would lose some of its top-heaviness.

I agree, but I'm putting a considerable amount more power. Its basicly a SAW setup, it may work or may not but I'm willing to bet the boat will want a little more weight in the front than with the stock setup..

Its kinda like when we used to run N-1 and N-2 mono with 21 inch hulls and brushed motors, the N-1 setup runs the battery WAY back, then the N-2 setup had the battery way farther forward..

I see the stock setup as very low torque like an N-1 setup but its all yet to be seen.
Your concern is definitely a valid one..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

OK felloe skippers, I carpeted the inside of the sponsons for battery or speedo placement, whatever this boat lets us get away with..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

This morning I got up and decided to make a custom 'Y" harness of Novak plugs since using a conventional y harness will make for too many plugs.

1) I cut 3 leads to equal length

2) Slid shrink wrap over the main input first one big one, then 3 tiny ones to cover each wire

3) Next I pre-tinned the wires.

4) Now its time to solder them together.

5) Next solder the 2 leads together coded by color

6) Now its time to solder the 2 output leads to the input lead color coding the wires again

7) Now you want to shrink the 3 individual leads

8) Slide the larger shrink over the 3 leads and shrink and shrink

Now you've done it pal! you're the man! You wired up a custom harness!

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Well well well look what we have here..

I found a set of gems that will make this upgrade VERY EEnteresting..
Check out these 4mm shafts I found in my ETTI box!

One has an aluminum prop nut, and is of high quality steel, and the other has a 1/8 inch step down!!

Yes, I do have 2 of each as well lol

The 1/8 inch step down opens MANY doors to an assortment of octura props, and will allow me to experiment with some high KV options.

I'm brave enough to try a set of Novak Ballistic 3.5 motors in the sucker!

Rumor has it that Boca Bearings is sending a set of rubber seal ceramic bearings to hold whatever power we throw at this project.. :spy:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Look what have we here.. Two sets of top quality orange rubber seal ceramic bearings came in the mail from Boca Bearings.

Guys, these are ABEC 7 bearings..
Thanx Boca!!

[FighterCat57]

Look what have we here.. Two sets of top quality orange rubber seal ceramic bearings came in the mail from Boca Bearings.

Guys, these are ABEC 7 bearings..
Thanx Boca!!

Bill, what do you think of the Ceramic Ultra Seal bearings?
________
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[BILL OXIDEAN]

Bill, what do you think of the Ceramic Ultra Seal bearings?

I'm not gonna' lie to ya' pal, Boca almost dropped me as a driver because I wasn't using enough product wanna' know why?

Because none of my bearings will fail, gum up, rust out, get "gritty" or end up with play in them.

I ordered a batch and haven't needed to replace any and that was the yellow seal bearings!

These orange seal are kicking out the same relentless reliability, only smoother if you can believe it. This is no "fluffing" or product promotion just the facts.

Read any testimony on these bearings, I haven't but I'm sure its mostly positive..

[FighterCat57]

Bill, I meant the Boca Ultra-Seal Ceramics! The Boca rep said they were better than the orange seal, so am curious if you have tried them.
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[BILL OXIDEAN]

Bill, I meant the Boca Ultra-Seal Ceramics! The Boca rep said they were better than the orange seal, so am curious if you have tried them.

:doh: Sorry bud, I haven't tried those yet, but I DO recommend rubber shielded bearings for marine apps even the fishing guys stay with rubber

I bet they fly though from what I've heard..

[FighterCat57]

:doh: Sorry bud, I haven't tried those yet, but I DO recommend rubber shielded bearings for marine apps even the fishing guys stay with rubber

I bet they fly though from what I've heard..

Since I run in salt water, I wanted to make sure I had a good sealed bearing. The ultra seal bearings are steel over rubber and supposed to have a much "better" seal if you can imagine. I've heard nothing but good about Boca Bearings! =)
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[BILL OXIDEAN]

Since I run in salt water, I wanted to make sure I had a good sealed bearing. The ultra seal bearings are steel over rubber and supposed to have a much "better" seal if you can imagine. I've heard nothing but good about Boca Bearings! =)

Sounds about right!

[NitroVal]

Regardless, with this much power and high CG, the boat will handle like *!***!***!***!**. I've been running mine on 5S with 540's and flipped it numerous times, even with the CG as low as I could get it. This boat is basically only good for SAW runs after any amount of extra weight has been added..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok boys we're gonna' start this strut upgrade and first we will remove the strut from the transom..

figure 2 shows how the transom looks with the strut removed.

The strut is a nice CNC machined unit of high quality.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok fellas, now we've gotta' remove these bearings. When recessed in aluminum, I like to heat whatever the bearings are pressed in for easu removal.

I prefer to use a soldering iron for this procedure.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Next we want to press the bearings out. using a large diameter diver, I press the bearings out from the inside starting with the rear output bearing then the front.

Using a large diameter driver assures you don't damage the bearings in the process..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Now that I've got the bearings out, I noticed this teflon spacer.
A trip to Franciscan hobbies in the morning will yield us a piece of brass tubing for a pro setup.. See you cats manyana..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Before installing anything, I first sprayed out any existing grease with electric motor spray

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Stemming from being an 80's heavy metaller :buttrock: I prefer metal spacers

I went ahead and picked up some K&S aluminum tubing stock#104 3/16x.014

With my tubing cutter I cut and de-burred 2 7/8 inch pieces after measuring the distance between the bearings front and rear.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok, now its time to press the bearings.
Starting with the front bearing, using a large diameter philips screwdriver, I pressed the bearing in.

Next I inserted the spacer, then pressed the rear bearing in and voilla! You've got an Oxidean style Boca Bearing upgraded strut!

[FighterCat57]

Ok, now its time to press the bearings.
Starting with the front bearing, using a large diameter philips screwdriver, I pressed the bearing in.

Next I inserted the spacer, then pressed the rear bearing in and voilla! You've got an Oxidean style Boca Bearing upgraded strut!

viola

Did you cross drill any holes in the spacer tube? I've seen that before, not sure of the purpose other than to help with lubrication of the hard prop shaft.

Curious to hear a racer's take on it.
________
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[BILL OXIDEAN]

viola

Did you cross drill any holes in the spacer tube? I've seen that before, not sure of the purpose other than to help with lubrication of the hard prop shaft.

Curious to hear a racer's take on it.

In the old days when guys made scratch built struts, they used a piece of brass tubing as part of a bushing. The grooves reduced friction, but My method is well lubed and the spacer is frictionless. It spins with the rotating assembly.

Good question!

[forescott]

Is the spacer really necessary? I took mine out when one of the bearings came loose. I didnt see how it really did anything.

[forescott]

You dont happen to have part numbers on those boca bearings do you???

[BILL OXIDEAN]

You dont happen to have part numbers on those boca bearings do you???

Hey Forescott! The main purpose of my spacer is to reduce side load on the bearings as thrust creates resistance to the shaft. They also support the bearing alignment. My spacer is literally sandwiched between bearing races..

Another great question..

[FighterCat57]

Boca Ultra Seal Hybrid Ceramics:

Flanged: SMF74C-YUU NB2
Non: SMR74C-YUUNB2

These are for the stock EKOS stingers.
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[forescott]

Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks guys!

[forescott]

Where is a good place to purchase these? Are they pricey?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Where is a good place to purchase these? Are they pricey?

Theyre not TOO bad, they do cost a bit more than others, but as we've heard a million times its better to by smart once..

Now if we were talkin' cars and bashing, nope save your dime, but we're talkin' boats here. Reliabillity is key as a bearing submerged in water spinning profusely is an extreme situation.

These bearings last a LONG time you'd definitely go through 4-5 sets of regular bearings before noticing anything alarming on these

bottom line yes a considerable initial cost but cost effectiveness you're getting 2-3 times your money's worth

[FighterCat57]

Where is a good place to purchase these? Are they pricey?

www.bocabearings.com

Don't know of anyone that discounts them much if any. Boca Bearings are usually a one time purchase (in my experience) so really don't mind just paying retail for them.

I've been spinning mine over 30k in salt water for a while now... no troubles.
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[Rumdog]

Screw bearings. Run a bushing. When/If it wears out, replace it. Whats the need for a bearing? You're getting resistance in the flex in every little bend. Smooth bearings mean nothing when your prop is ripping through the water. We're not talking about free wheeling here, right?

[Jeff Wohlt]

Boca bearings are cheaper when you buy the 4 pack

[forescott]

Now that I've got the bearings out, I noticed this teflon spacer.
A trip to Franciscan hobbies in the morning will yield us a piece of brass tubing for a pro setup.. See you cats manyana..
Well, I figured out the purpose of the teflon spacer in the stinger today. I noticed one of my prop shafts was really "wiggly" compared to the other. turns out the front bearing slid back towards the end of the stinger. The teflon tube is a spacer between the two bearings that keeps the front bearing from sliding backwards. The front bearing is inserted from the rear, then the spacer, then the rear bearing is pressed in place.(or super-glued like mine because it keeps coming out) :olleyes:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Well, I figured out the purpose of the teflon spacer in the stinger today. I noticed one of my prop shafts was really "wiggly" compared to the other. turns out the front bearing slid back towards the end of the stinger. The teflon tube is a spacer between the two bearings that keeps the front bearing from sliding backwards. The front bearing is inserted from the rear, then the spacer, then the rear bearing is pressed in place.(or super-glued like mine because it keeps coming out) :olleyes:

Precisely, I saw the teflon and realized it won't hold under the power I'm throwing at it..
A metal spacer holds it solid..

Great observation.

[forescott]

Precisely, I saw the teflon and realized it won't hold under the power I'm throwing at it..
A metal spacer holds it solid..

Great observation.

I lost the stock spacer and ended up using a piece of teflon tubing from my thundercat. It works great!

[FighterCat57]

I lost the stock spacer and ended up using a piece of teflon tubing from my thundercat. It works great!

Heh, I did something similar where I had some left over stuffing liner from a 4mm shaft setup that fit right in.

Good bearings are a paramount with these tiny sizes and high RPMs.

[scubasteve95]

bill,nice up-grade on the stingers:sold:
when the time comes that will be the set up i run with.
thanx for a great idea.......

[forescott]

I agree. One thing I realized is you have to be real careful not to leave too much space between the stinger and drive dog because the prop shafts are a little short and too much space will cause the flex cable to ride inside the inner bearing instead of the prop shaft itself.

[scubasteve95]

1 question i do have is,
will the rear bearing hold the rod in place (tight so it spins with the shaft)
mine fits nice and snug (a few taps with a wooden handle sets it)
but do you think i need to glue it too?
or are you holding it in place another way?

[forescott]

I wouldnt glue the inner bearing in fear that it would be too hard to get it out. Thats what the teflon spacer is for. I had to glue one of my outer bearings because it would pop out occasionally. It just isnt a tight enough fit to stay in place on its own.

[FighterCat57]

Precisely, I saw the teflon and realized it won't hold under the power I'm throwing at it..
A metal spacer holds it solid..

Great observation.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but to help reduce friction, the spacer should be as large as possible and still fit in the stinger, leaving the most amount of room for the drive cable. If it spins too much with the cable, it will create more friction, as it has a larger circumference than the smaller drive cable. But, the difference at that level is negligible and probably won't be noticeable either way, with the exception of slightly more heat from the additional friction.


Clean out your PM box. :biggrin:

[scubasteve95]

I wouldnt glue the inner bearing in fear that it would be too hard to get it out. Thats what the teflon spacer is for. I had to glue one of my outer bearings because it would pop out occasionally. It just isnt a tight enough fit to stay in place on its own.

thats what i am asking(outer bearing):doh:
the inner bearing will be set in place and held there by the tube and outer bearing
the outer bearing will still be able to move a very little making the tube loose,
because of the small amount of space left between the
strut and drive dog,even if the outer bearing is snug
would you still glue it?

[scubasteve95]

In the old days when guys made scratch built struts, they used a piece of brass tubing as part of a bushing. The grooves reduced friction, but My method is well lubed and the spacer is frictionless. It spins with the rotating assembly.

Good question!

what do you think bill?
glue outer bearing to be safe or not needed?
outer fits nice and snug in stinger.
80's metal:buttrock:

[Jeff Wohlt]

After designing and building 100+ struts and stingers with bearings I don't get it. No need for a spacer if the strut is machined right. If not and it is just a tube then a spacer would be needed to keep it from moving. Super glue or locitite reatainign compound should hold them fine unless the tube is not machined. I would machine them and move up a size in bearings. My struts are designed to have the bearing pressed in now.

Bill, got youre request....I will consider it but you have to go out and set some records and have my name on your boat. :) I plan to get some decals made so people can use them...had a bunch of reqiests for them.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

what do you think bill?
glue outer bearing to be safe or not needed?
outer fits nice and snug in stinger.
80's metal:buttrock:

Definitely a logical thought, but the outter bearing fits pretty snug and is flanged which prevents it from being sucked into the strut, and the drive dog holds it from popping out.

The inner bearing is the culprit of moving. Glue and other adhesives sound great, but even with a well ballanced prop, the harmony of the shaft spinning will break it free.

The only way to keep these things aligned is through a pressed fit, or a metal spaced retainer..

Answer to the question not needed.. Sometimes if you run a grossly unballanced prop, you'll destroy the fit of the outter bearing making it loose and in those cases I've been able sometines to press the metal to get a snug fit, but in many cases the strut is ruined once that outter bearing loses its fit..

Great question!

[LarrysDrifter]

:thumbup1:
I agree, but I'm putting a considerable amount more power. Its basicly a SAW setup, it may work or may not but I'm willing to bet the boat will want a little more weight in the front than with the stock setup..

Its kinda like when we used to run N-1 and N-2 mono with 21 inch hulls and brushed motors, the N-1 setup runs the battery WAY back, then the N-2 setup had the battery way farther forward..

I see the stock setup as very low torque like an N-1 setup but its all yet to be seen.
Your concern is definitely a valid one..

I keep seeing this SAW.What does it stand for?And your ekos is awesome.Cant wait to see a video.:thumbup1

[scubasteve95]

:thumbup1:

I keep seeing this SAW.What does it stand for?And your ekos is awesome.Cant wait to see a video.:thumbup1

Straight A Way (SAW):thumbup:
FULL/WIDE OPEN STRAIGHT RACE

[scubasteve95]

Thanx jeff & bill for all the quantity and quality
of info on that one..........
Don't need anything now but when i do jeff i will
hit you up for a pair of pro stingers and bearings
thanx again.........

[LarrysDrifter]

Straight A Way (SAW):thumbup:
FULL/WIDE OPEN STRAIGHT RACE

Thank you sir.

[Simon.O.]

Straight A Way (SAW):thumbup:
FULL/WIDE OPEN STRAIGHT RACE

1/2 correct.
A true SAW takes 2 passes. 1 north and 1 south or similar. The passes must be opposite directions.

Either way it is a nuts out full power pass usually with an insanely powered boat. :thumbup1:

Think drags but there and back !

[BILL OXIDEAN]

:thumbup1:

I keep seeing this SAW.What does it stand for?And your ekos is awesome.Cant wait to see a video.:thumbup1

Thanx man! I'm really enjoying this toy boat thing.. :banana:

[forescott]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but to help reduce friction, the spacer should be as large as possible and still fit in the stinger, leaving the most amount of room for the drive cable. If it spins too much with the cable, it will create more friction, as it has a larger circumference than the smaller drive cable. But, the difference at that level is negligible and probably won't be noticeable either way, with the exception of slightly more heat from the additional friction.


Clean out your PM box. :biggrin:

Yeah, the teflon does'nt do anything but keep the inner bearing from slipping backwards. The front and rear stinger bearings support the side load. I think adding anything between the two bearings that touches the prop shaft will just increase friction and heat. Thats why I used a piece of 3/16" prop shaft teflon tubing. Its small enough to fit inside the stinger, but large enough that the prop shaft fits inside it with plenty of slop.

[VIKOS]

I feel like a moron had an extra dog gear in the venom package which does fit the rcraceboat shafts and the screws are actually more flush due to being smaller so before I use any new hardware I'm gona run these parts first...aight off to the marina to test out this bad boy..haven't ran it in months then off the the post office to grab my parts.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

:thumbup1:

I keep seeing this SAW.What does it stand for?And your ekos is awesome.Cant wait to see a video.:thumbup1

Thanx for the compliment, and I believe SAW stands for straight away

[VIKOS]

KInda like WOT being wide open throttle...lol which goes good with SAW...well unless you want to beach your boat lol.

[VIKOS]

After designing and building 100+ struts and stingers with bearings I don't get it. No need for a spacer if the strut is machined right. If not and it is just a tube then a spacer would be needed to keep it from moving. Super glue or locitite reatainign compound should hold them fine unless the tube is not machined. I would machine them and move up a size in bearings. My struts are designed to have the bearing pressed in now.

Bill, got youre request....I will consider it but you have to go out and set some records and have my name on your boat. :) I plan to get some decals made so people can use them...had a bunch of reqiests for them.

What spacer are we talking about that which sits between the dog and your stinger bearing or whats in the stinger after the bearing..that tube with holes. Honestly I don't even run one in there and have no issues at all. Also seeing the price of the bearings doesn't really scare me to much. I just lube and grease them when I remove the shafts back in and keep going. I too would use a bushing on these,I don't see the point in bearings. Grease um up and go.

[Jeff Wohlt]

There must be a bushing between the bearings so they can't float. Seems it must be the bearing close to the hull that is not machined. I press mine in and they stay. This stinger must be different with just a tube so no machined area. Easy to do with just normal tubing.

[VIKOS]

Hey Jeff let me know when the xl's come in. I'm gona order two with water jackets. I feel that the stockys are about done. Even when I lube them with electronic lubricant. Maybe say 5 more full runs.

[Jeff Wohlt]

9 or 10 XLs?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

I'm back gents , and these motors just came in from Novak.
4.5HV Ballistic series PN# 3504

They feature adjustable timing! I'm just waiting for props from venom which should be here any day..

[Darin Jordan]

I'm back gents , and these motors just came in from Novak.
4.5HV Ballistic series PN# 3504

They feature adjustable timing! I'm just waiting for props from venom which should be here any day..


SICK! OK, GET TO IT! Let's get that baby on the water!!

[BILL OXIDEAN]

SICK! OK, GET TO IT! Let's get that baby on the water!!

I agree, I wanna see what she's all about..

[forescott]

Good to have you back! Was wondering what was happening with your build!

[VIKOS]

10xl I want the option of running 3s-5s on a motor. With say 180A esc with rudder cooling along with stock cooling. 5s venom lipos fit especially since I've removed half of the hatch foam but still enough for it to float.

[forescott]

I would think the 180 is a bit overkill. Dont you think the 120 would be more than enough?

[VIKOS]

I guess but what about if I get itchy for 540s. I doubt I will see them though. What if I want to run 6s on some serious motors for that lucky 60-70mph runs. Lol ok maybe it's overkill but so is 120. 60-80 amp esc should work fine on this hull since there's two of everything.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Ok gentlemen, the time is here.. I bet you cats thought I abandoned the project didnt ya'??

Well its done, and its really trick and I ran it on 4s today the thing runs like a BAT OUT OF HELL!!!

I bet its the world's fastest EKOS.
I've unlocked the key to speed on it and I'm gonna; push it harder.

OK boys here's a quick rundown: I went with the Novak 4.5 hv systems. I used 2 traxxas EVX marine cooling kits in series.

I used one pickup to cool both motors, and one to cool both speedos.
I used a jump tube to connect motor to motor.

Used the stock flex shafts and used 2 left hand rotation 32mm Venom red cnc aluminum props.

My girlfriend will be here today to film this sonofagun.. I'll have video for you by this evening.

[Rumdog]

Well, how'd she go Bill?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Rum, it was absolutely ballistic! I did a pass at 70 hit a carp and the thing jumped up into a corkscrew like I've never seen a vessel come into.

sonofa bisquit slapped real hard then sunk to the tips, I saw smoke and was puzzled

Fortunetely, they put enough flotation in from the factory or it would have been wet suit time for me.

She came back with a long split in the hull
Bummer, because not only was it singin' like anita Baker when she came undone, but I had just re-routed the cooling into the trickest custom setup I've ever seen.

I routed the jump those from motor to motor to cool the lower row of fets on the speedo and not a drop of water leaked!

[forescott]

Did you at least have fish for dinner??

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Did you at least have fish for dinner??

I was more interested in laminating the sonofagun, but after payin for the nats, he would have made for an economical meal lol

I'd have to tell my girl its ahi lol

[Boomer]

Bill
I have been reading your build thread with great interest, and was sadden when I learned of the "giant carp" incident. The hull looks repairable, and I hope to see your reports continue once the repairs are completed.

I have one of these boats, which is completely stock at the moment, and only run on little kid batteries, so it all still works. I will be very interested to see how fast your boat will go, once she is "back on her feet". I appreciate your willingnesss to be my R&D facility! Once you get her all dialed in, I can start ordering my new parts. :bounce:

You may consider finding different body of water, "carp free", for the next round of testing. I don't know if you have seen pictures of the real KOS after it flipped or not, but it to suffered damage to the side of the sponson. Which happily, was repaired successfully for the next race. I think their repair costs were higher than yours will be, or at least we can hope that is the case.

I am sorry about the unplanned aerobatics and hard landing.

Boomer

[Simon.O.]

Used the stock flex shafts and used 2 left hand rotation 32mm Venom red cnc aluminum props.
.

How did it handle with 2 same rotation props ?
Some folk tell me that is not a good game to pleay but i know that you know your boats so I'll listen to you too. :thumbup1:

[BILL OXIDEAN]

How did it handle with 2 same rotation props ?
Some folk tell me that is not a good game to pleay but i know that you know your boats so I'll listen to you too. :thumbup1:

Whoever told you that told you the truth. it pulls to the right at takeoff and has a tendancy to hook to the right, but in a straight line once you get going you're fine..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

As I advance through the Novak equipment I'll bolt on a speedo that incorperates reverse rotation..

[Rumdog]

So, being sensored, you can't swap the motor leads to change the rotation?

[BILL OXIDEAN]

With some speedos this is possible, but Novak's sensor data is in the software so onlytheir newer versions are reversing..

[BILL OXIDEAN]

My EKOS is mended and getting prepped for the water again!

[BILL OXIDEAN]

Here's the EKOS in action. I changed to bigger rotors and speeds went down but so did temps DRAMATICLY!!!
It comes in cold, it could run some bigger props and more timing..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DttU_D7CrYo

[kevink]

What about the castle mamba max pro. Should have reverse rotation with sensored motor, but would need some creative cooling. Awesome vid by the way.

[BILL OXIDEAN]

What about the castle mamba max pro. Should have reverse rotation with sensored motor, but would need some creative cooling. Awesome vid by the way.


Thanx man! I'm not familiar with the castle systems, but Novak now has a reversing speedo for me!

I'll get the speeds up for ya' and shoot a new vid..

[BIGBIRD]

any further update with this setup?

[bill1473]

What does cf 40mean??

[kevink]

Graupner CF-40 propellers. carbon 40mm diameter.